MSU-Kalamazoo Med/Peds

[cilfaz]

I interviewed there last week. The residents seem happy and had nothing but good things to say about the program. My interviews went well. I saw no flaws during my interview day and I would say it is my favorite program so far. Great hospital, faculty and residents, best combined clinic I've seen. Excellent track record. I want to do international health and that is available there too. I will probably be back for a second look next month.

My one concern is that I was the one of only two US grads out of 10 inteviewees for med-peds that day. This is the only place I have had that experience. I have no problem with this personally but do you think there is a problem in the program that is causing difficulty getting US Grads? Everything seems so good. What am I missing and why is everyone else ignoring it?

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[Doconthego]

I interviewed there last week. The residents seem happy and had nothing but good things to say about the program. My interviews went well. I saw no flaws during my interview day and I would say it is my favorite program so far. Great hospital, faculty and residents, best combined clinic I've seen. Excellent track record. I want to do international health and that is available there too. I will probably be back for a second look next month.

My one concern is that I was the one of only two US grads out of 10 inteviewees for med-peds that day. This is the only place I have had that experience. I have no problem with this personally but do you think there is a problem in the program that is causing difficulty getting US Grads? Everything seems so good. What am I missing and why is everyone else ignoring it?

I used this list in the past and was just checking back and thought I should jump in here and make a plug for my old program. I trained in the med-peds program in Kalamazoo and graduated a few years ago. I was back for a brief visit two years ago. I was very happy with the program. I do not recall any significant weaknesses and felt well prepared for practice. I was not interested in fellowships but my classmates were and they got great fellowship positions.

There are definitely more international graduates than there used to be but they were excellent and I am guessing they still are. Most were in IM when I was there and almost all were well adjusted to American culture, great English skills, had done residencies in their home country and they were brilliant with USMLE scores in the 99 range. Some of these people were among the best teachers I had. Still I had the same concern that you had about IM.

I don't remember how it came up but the IM program director once told me that he "never wants the program to be all US or all international grads." That they take the most qualified candidates and want diversity. I don't know if that is true or not. I suspect they are at least having some difficulty getting US grads because of the area and because it is not a "University Program". It is actually a great place to live but not quite so exciting as Chicago or New York would be. I was able to buy a nice affordable house which we sold for a cool profit when I graduated. I looked at it like this. In New York or Chicago you can go out everynight but you don't have really have that much time to do that in residency. For the amount of time you will have Kalamazoo has plenty to do. When you do want to do something in a city you can get to Chicago in about 2 hours. There are lots of things to do outside including great beaches nearby on Lake Michigan, biking trails, hiking, boating. I had time to play on a resident indoor and outdoor soccer team and a softball team. I had spent a year in Chicago and hated the traffic and lack of outdoors. Kalamazoo was a huge relief.

For some insane reason like a lot of other people I ranked two University Programs higher than Kalamazoo. I had a pretty good academic record, top quarter of my class and scores in the mid nineties but thankfully I did not get into those programs. Some of my classmates went there. Two got into my first choice and hated it. They called me frequently usually crying and one tried to transfer to my program but there were no spaces left so she ended up staying where she was but hates medicine now and is bitter. Neither one of them ended up doing fellowships because they were too burnt out. I am not sure my second choice would have been any better. On the other hand most of the people in my med-peds program who applied got their first choice of their fellowship.

I am not going to rewrite everything I just wrote on the medicine thread but you can check that out if you want. I won't go into all the details about med-peds either since you just interviewed there so you already know a lot. I think you can't go wrong by going there. I will say that as residents we had a big say in making the rank list. e-mail me if you want more information. [email protected]

 

[cilfaz]

Doconthego. Thanks for your help. I will not be able to return for a second interview No $$$, no time. I interviewed in 11 places and I am broke. I didn't find any program I didn't like enough to be happy there but I liked the Kalamazoo program a lot and will probably rank it number 1 or 2 depending on how thngs gel over the next few weeks as I go over my notes. Part of this is the university v community thing.
CL

 

[RobbingReality]

This has very little to do with the OP except can you two or anyone for that matter tell me more about MSU-Kalamazoo? I have a rotation coming up in the next couple of months in their Trauma Surg (really excited) and would like to know a little more on the hospital, physcians, and town other than what I find on their websites.

 

[peppy]

If none of the residents see this post, you might want to try to track down some of the students attending Michigan State's MD school since it sends a portion of its class to Kalamazoo for 3rd yr/4th yr every year.
If you're coming from out of state, as a MI native here's what I can say about Kalamazoo as a town: It's a pretty unique place in west Michigan (most of west Michigan has a reputation for being quiet and conservative but K-zoo is more artsy and has a large youth population due to the several colleges in town). The north and east side of town are a bit run down but the west and south side of town are nice. If you like microbrewery beers I understand that Bell's Brewery is a bit of a tourist destination that most people enjoy (I'm a nondrinker myself so I can't give a personal testimonial). K-zoo is as already noted at the halfway point between Chicago and Detroit and there is a train that runs to both cities regularly. However, Grand Rapids (about an hour's drive to the north of Kalamazoo) is closer than either of those other cities and (as the 2nd largest city in Michigan) should have pretty much anything you need if you can't find it in K-zoo.
Hope you have a good experience there!

 

[spyyder]

Why would you be worried about the number of US Grads? I would be worried if I didn't see any IMG's. I wouldn't want to attend a program that discriminated right out the door. You accept the best students (many of which are IMG/US-IMG). You can actually learn a ton from international students that you would never learn in an all US program. Embrace the diversity.

 

[The Med-Peds Dude]

Why would you be worried about the number of US Grads? I would be worried if I didn't see any IMG's. I wouldn't want to attend a program that discriminated right out the door. You accept the best students (many of which are IMG/US-IMG). You can actually learn a ton from international students that you would never learn in an all US program. Embrace the diversity.

There are a lot more FMG's applying than USMG's. There are not nearly enough USMG for the number of positions offered. Med-Peds programs once had a very high USMG fill rate, but the world has changed.

 

[trp2006]

There are a lot more FMG's applying than USMG's. There are not nearly enough USMG for the number of positions offered. Med-Peds programs once had a very high USMG fill rate, but the world has changed.

Why are less AMG's applying to Med-Peds then before?

 

[EXPD]

Why are less AMG's applying to Med-Peds then before?

It is hard to say but exponential growth in medical school debt makes it hard for students to choose specialties that are primary care based. Although from a med-peds program you can do lots of subspecialty fellowships (all of IM fellowships, all of Peds fellowships and combined fellowships) it is still an 7-8 year path as opposed to radiology and other specialties where people can earn very large salaries after only 3-4 years of training and much less work.

The good news is that in spite of this lots of really good medical students still choose primary care. The country should not take this commitment and dedication of our students for granted and should include something in healthcare reform to reward those who enter primary care specialties.

 

[trp2006]

It is hard to say but exponential growth in medical school debt makes it hard for students to choose specialties that are primary care based. Although from a med-peds program you can do lots of subspecialty fellowships (all of IM fellowships, all of Peds fellowships and combined fellowships) it is still an 7-8 year path as opposed to radiology and other specialties where people can earn very large salaries after only 3-4 years of training and much less work.

The good news is that in spite of this lots of really good medical students still choose primary care. The country should not take this commitment and dedication of our students for granted and should include something in healthcare reform to reward those who enter primary care specialties.

Thanks for your honest and well-versed answer! Do you see a change in the in the salary in Med-Peds or in primary care in the future? What can one realistically expect as a starting salary in Med-Peds (I know it can vary with location etc), but just for a typical round about number?