Need some advice for my friend becoming a therapist

[pretzels]

There is someone close to me that is graduating with her bachelors in psychology this spring with plans of becoming a therapist for children. I believe she only intends for a Masters but she has also expressed interest in owning / running her own private practice.

First -- do you need a PhD/PsyD to have your own PP? I had heard anecdotes of other people in administrative positions in pp that only had an MA.

Second, shes graduating from University of Phoenix (non-trad student, early thirties), which i know won't look as great for applications to some grad schools, and definitely not to any decent, non-FSPS doctoral level programs.

I'm pretty informed on clinical psych doctoral programs but i've never looked into masters-level programs for therapists/counselors so i dont know what to suggest to her. This board has been invaluable in teaching me the lay of the land for grad school at the doctoral level so i thought the MH/SW board would be filled with informed masters-level clinicians and people otherwise 'in the know' that could offer some great insight.

She hasn't taken the GREs yet and historically has never been a great standardized test taker.

She may be bound out of California somewhat permanently for several reasons, which im fully aware makes her circumstances even more difficult given the saturation of California with psychologists. But ignoring that for a moment, lets say she could move across the country anyway -- What schools or programs out there would any of you recommend for someone in her position who simply wants to be a counselor for children?

I know for clin psych phds, research experience is the name of the game for improving your app, but what general advice would you give this person to improve their chances in this situation?

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[Figment]

A person only need a master's degree to become licensed as a therapist. The license comes from the state. With a M.A. she can get either an LPCC (Licensed Professional Counselor) license or a MFT (Marriage and Family Therapist) license. In addition to the master's degree, she will have to complete a certain number of practice hours and also take an exam in order to become licensed. The regulations vary by state. In California the MFT license is generally more favorably looked at.

Here is California's MFT information: http://www.bbs.ca.gov/app-reg/mft_requirement.shtml
LPCC information: http://www.bbs.ca.gov/lpcc_program/index.shtml

As far as getting accepted into one of these masters degree programs, research experience helps, but counseling experience looks even better from what I understand. She should find some type of position (even volunteering) that is relevant to counseling. For example, working on a suicide prevention phone line, working at a mental health clinic or facility...

The GRE is NOT required for all M.A. counseling psychology programs, only some. I'm not sure how an undergrad degree from University of Phoenix impacts her chances. A high GRE score and a bunch of experience could make up for that.

Hope this helps.

 

[MBellows]

From what I've heard around (mostly on this board) the LCSW can be a good way to go if you're bound to California. They don't tend to require the GRE (but that may be changing).

If money isn't really a major concern she can look into USC if she doesn't get in anywhere else.

 

[Figment]

The CA BBS website also lists the requirements for the LCSW license: http://www.bbs.ca.gov/app-reg/lcs_requirement.shtml
That's another option.

 

[pretzels]

Thank you for the advice. Ill relay this to her soon. Money isn't a huge issue for her but i know it would be significant in her life if she succeeded in this goal.

 

[pretzels]

So I have an update: she seems to be insisting that a doctoral program is what she wants to do. She'll be finishing her b.a. in a week with a ~3.3 gpa from u of Phoenix. She does a lot of moving around vacationing across the world, frequently and for long durations, and when she's not she is still California-bound and bent on staying. Also she is trying to get pregnant. I don't think she grasps what it takes to get into a real phd program, let alone what it will require of her in time. I don't know what to tell her to dissuade her from this path.

In a clinical setting, what if anything can a phd do that a masters cannot?

 

[bcliff]

Typically psychological assessment is one of the biggest services that psychologists offer that LCSW/LPC/MFT's do not. In certain states clinical psychologists can prescribe with additional post graduate training, but currently this is only allowed in Louisiana & New Mexico.

I cannot emphasize enough that a doctoral program is NOT suited for someone who wants to work 100% in a clinical setting. Plus, I highly doubt that any reputable program would offer her acceptance with a degree from U. of Phoenix. Funded PhD programs have an approximate acceptance rate of < 10% and get between 300 & 500 applicants. FSPS programs like Alliant & Argosy, which are incredibly expensive, offer lackluster training (to put it gently), and have horrible internship match rates would likely be the only doctoral programs that would offer your friend a spot - You don't have to do much digging to figure out what the general consensus is on SDN in regards to FSPS programs.

 

[pretzels]

Yeah I had a feeling a fsps was going to be her only option from u of Phoenix but I don't want to make her feel bad about her choice, so im trying to convince her she doesn't want or need a phd now. Trying to do this as tactfully as possible.

 

[MCParent]

Yeah I had a feeling a fsps was going to be her only option from u of Phoenix but I don't want to make her feel bad about her choice, so im trying to convince her she doesn't want or need a phd now. Trying to do this as tactfully as possible.

You might direct here here

http://psychologygradschool.weebly.com/

 

[Therapist4Chnge]

So I have an update: she seems to be insisting that a doctoral program is what she wants to do. She'll be finishing her b.a. in a week with a ~3.3 gpa from u of Phoenix. She does a lot of moving around vacationing across the world, frequently and for long durations, and when she's not she is still California-bound and bent on staying. Also she is trying to get pregnant. I don't think she grasps what it takes to get into a real phd program, let alone what it will require of her in time. I don't know what to tell her to dissuade her from this path.

In a clinical setting, what if anything can a phd do that a masters cannot?

I'm not sure I could pick a worse fit for a doctoral program in psychology. I think you are in a tough position because her lifestyle doesn't sound like it will work with a program, but most people (not just those looking to go back to school) are wiling to make significant changes to their lifestyle to accommodate academic training.

 

[psych844]

I'm specifically talking about a Bachelor education here. I agree with most that distance learning is not sufficent for graduate work. But would U of Phoenix be considered legitimate if they were a comprehensive research Uni?

 

[thewesternsky]

I'm specifically talking about a Bachelor education here. I agree with most that distance learning is not sufficent for graduate work. But would U of Phoenix be considered legitimate if they were a comprehensive research Uni?

...But University of Phoenix is NOT a comprehensive research university.

If you're asking if someone who did a distance education B.A. at a reputable institution would be considered for Ph.D. programs, the answer is maybe. Their grades and the things that they learned in their classes would be interpreted similarly to an on-campus B.A. That likely wouldn't hurt them. However, it would be quite difficult to get quality research experience or solid letters of recommendation while a DE student. If that could be accomplished (e.g., taking DE classes as a full time student at reputable state institution out of town while also volunteering as a research assistant at a hospital or university in your home town, for example), then that would probably be just fine.

I have a friend who did her first two years of undergrad as a psych major using distance education. She got fantastic grades and worked quite hard. After these two years, she then commuted to campus and did her last two years (including a thesis and RAing) on campus. She was accepted to a great clinical Ph.D. program after her 4th year.

 

[cara susanna]

she is still California-bound and bent on staying.

Of course she is!

 

[pretzels]

Thanks for the tips, i'll try and get her to read through some of that info linked... hopefully she figures it out.