New Job Advice

[Pain Applicant1]

Had a couple more questions about this post if you don't mind sharing.

1) What was the specific set up between you and the hospital? Ex: Who paid for rent, staff, and build out?

They paid for nearly everything so pretty much all of my overhead. The only things they would not pay for were my big-ticket items like my fluoro, table, and ultrasound machine.

2) How were you able to only do procedures in ASC for a few months and then bring it in-house? The hospital loses out on facility fee, so I'd imagine it would be a difficult negotiating factor. Also, when you brought procedures in-house, did you pay for the C-Arm, US, and RFA machines yourself?

The surgical center was not included in the negotiations. That probably would be illegal. They cannot legally expect anything in return with my income guarantee and loan forgiveness other than improving the quality of care for the community. Otherwise, they would be violating anti-kickback statutes. I purchased those big-ticket items myself as my practice was profitable somewhere between month 2-3. I also had an income guarantee so I literally made the same amount regardless of how much my practice brought in.

I signed a separate letter of intent that I would buy into the surgical center but once I crunched the numbers I discovered it wasn't worth it to me.


3) You said you "broke the contract" with the hospital. What does this exactly mean and how were you able to do this without repercussions?

I didn't break the contract per se, I terminated it early. I broke through the contract meaning I started to net more after 10 months that what the income guarantee was. If I did not terminate the contract, any net amount above the guarantee would mean I would have to start paying it back so it wouldn't make sense for me to keep the contract going at that time.

4) How were you able to find the specific pain medicine downstream valuations? I would assume CEOs want to know this.

lm not exactly sure what you mean by this but I'm assuming you mean how much will the hospital make from me downstream. I looked into what the hospital owned and it was mainly PT, an MRI, and the surgical center. I mentioned these in my presentation but they did their own calculations of how much return they can expect from me being in town.

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[TeslaCoil]

Okay guys so the outcome of the negotiation was as follows:

Year One: $450k fixed salary, Year 2: $500k fixed, Year 3+: $60 per RVU. RVU goal is 6500 and salary cannot be adjusted as long as Im working toward this goal.
$15K sign on bonus, $100k up-front student loan reimbursement (for a three year commitment), another $25k in year 4 and another in year 5 toward student loans. This is a non-profit hospital and therefore also qualifies for public service loan forgiveness (huge deal for me, as I have a massive burden and am already halfway to forgiveness). $4000/yr CME allowance, $1600/yr dues/memberships allowance, full benefits package with 5% 403b match. 6 weeks vacay plus one week CME (although I realize vacation can be somewhat of a farse on production-based pay).

They are buying me a dedicated c-arm, ultrasound and hiring a rad tech to start. Will have a PA and a scribe when things pick up.

What do you guys think? It sounded like a pretty decent offer coming straight out of training...

 

[lobelsteve]

Okay guys so the outcome of the negotiation was as follows:

Year One: $450k fixed salary, Year 2: $500k fixed, Year 3+: $60 per RVU. RVU goal is 6500 and salary cannot be adjusted as long as Im working toward this goal.
$15K sign on bonus, $100k up-front student loan reimbursement (for a three year commitment), another $25k in year 4 and another in year 5 toward student loans. This is a non-profit hospital and therefore also qualifies for public service loan forgiveness (huge deal for me, as I have a massive burden and am already halfway to forgiveness). $4000/yr CME allowance, $1600/yr dues/memberships allowance, full benefits package with 5% 403b match. 6 weeks vacay plus one week CME (although I realize vacation can be somewhat of a farse on production-based pay).

They are buying me a dedicated c-arm, ultrasound and hiring a rad tech to start. Will have a PA and a scribe when things pick up.

What do you guys think? It sounded like a pretty decent offer coming straight out of training...

Deal is amazing. No risk.

More importantly: do you like the area? Schools, housing, recreation?

Have you met the docs that will refer to you?
Is there a significant other and if so what do they think.

 

[SommeRiver]

First year out!?!? Take that immediately, and if it doesn't work out you've not taken a step backwards.

If you're truly on PSLF that extra cash going to your loan is wasted money. Consider that...

 

[TeslaCoil]

Deal is amazing. No risk.

More importantly: do you like the area? Schools, housing, recreation?

Have you met the docs that will refer to you?
Is there a significant other and if so what do they think.

It is pretty rural. The public schools aren't great, but there are a couple decent private schools that are decently priced.

I did get a chance to meet the referring docs. They are willing to feed me patients. There is only one other pain practice in the area, and the catchment is 300K people. I think this should be more than sufficient to keep the practice fed. There is one pain doc in the hospital currently but hes only doing procedures 1/2 day a week and the rest is med mgmt. Im planning on flipping that schedule- 3 days/week procedures, 1-2 clinic days, 0-1 OR day.

There is a significant other- we both love the place. We like quiet living.

 

[TeslaCoil]

First year out!?!? Take that immediately, and if it doesn't work out you've not taken a step backwards.

If you're truly on PSLF that extra cash going to your loan is wasted money. Consider that...

I know right? I was pretty stoked.

Thats true about PSLF, but it does lower my monthly payment significantly, and Im a little wary of the PSLF program. I dont want to put all my eggs in that basket and then have something happen to the program that would prevent it from being forgiven in the end.

 

[SommeRiver]

I know right? I was pretty stoked.

Thats true about PSLF, but it does lower my monthly payment significantly, and Im a little wary of the PSLF program. I dont want to put all my eggs in that basket and then have something happen to the program that would prevent it from being forgiven in the end.

Truth about PSLF. Good for you as it seems like you're on top of it, while most docs are not.

You will find rural pts are far easier to treat than what you may be used to...I trained in Atlanta and then the Bay Area...Those pts ARE NOT AT ALL like my current rural pts.

 

[au bon pain]

Okay guys so the outcome of the negotiation was as follows:

Year One: $450k fixed salary, Year 2: $500k fixed, Year 3+: $60 per RVU. RVU goal is 6500 and salary cannot be adjusted as long as Im working toward this goal.
$15K sign on bonus, $100k up-front student loan reimbursement (for a three year commitment), another $25k in year 4 and another in year 5 toward student loans. This is a non-profit hospital and therefore also qualifies for public service loan forgiveness (huge deal for me, as I have a massive burden and am already halfway to forgiveness). $4000/yr CME allowance, $1600/yr dues/memberships allowance, full benefits package with 5% 403b match. 6 weeks vacay plus one week CME (although I realize vacation can be somewhat of a farse on production-based pay).

They are buying me a dedicated c-arm, ultrasound and hiring a rad tech to start. Will have a PA and a scribe when things pick up.

What do you guys think? It sounded like a pretty decent offer coming straight out of training...

I'm a fellow interviewing now too and this is a great offer. Excellent find!

Only question is for year 3 and thereafter -- is it purely production based? If so, then $60/rvu actually seems a bit low relative to all their other numbers. If you exactly hit your rvu goal in both year 2 and 3 then you're taking a 100k loss in year 3 for the same amount of work as year 2. May not make sense to push that issue right now (unless you feel like there's still some wiggle room), but definitely something you want to be able to renegotiate on when you shift to productivity only.

 

[TeslaCoil]

I'm a fellow interviewing now too and this is a great offer. Excellent find!

Only question is for year 3 and thereafter -- is it purely production based? If so, then $60/rvu actually seems a bit low relative to all their other numbers. If you exactly hit your rvu goal in both year 2 and 3 then you're taking a 100k loss in year 3 for the same amount of work as year 2. May not make sense to push that issue right now (unless you feel like there's still some wiggle room), but definitely something you want to be able to renegotiate on when you shift to productivity only.

True but Im setting a 9000 RVU/yr goal for myself. I know lots of guys making 9k RVU's/yr and its relatively easily doable. If it means I get loan forgiveness in 5 years its all worth it, big time.

 

[au bon pain]

True but Im setting a 9000 RVU/yr goal for myself. I know lots of guys making 9k RVU's/yr and its relatively easily doable. If it means I get loan forgiveness in 5 years its all worth it, big time.

To be clear I'm not throwing shade and this job sounds like a sweet opportunity. They're paying you well and putting a large up-front investment in you and that's awesome. Just offering some friendly input--I know 2 guys recently out of my fellowing in similar sounding gigs to yours. One makes $68/rvu and the other makes 70. And if you look at MGMA data that's not at all unreasonable. At 9k rvu you'll be making the hospital a ton of cash.

FWIW I also don't trust PSLF and agree their loan repayment has value.

 

[chudat]

True but Im setting a 9000 RVU/yr goal for myself. I know lots of guys making 9k RVU's/yr and its relatively easily doable. If it means I get loan forgiveness in 5 years its all worth it, big time.

Is year 3 on all production or base plus production?

How did you approach negotiation talks?

Also, if you dont mind me asking, is this west coast, east, or middle country job?

 

[paindoc007]

60/wrvu is ehh for rural America. I negotiated significantly more than that. In a nice city I’d take that in a heartbeat however

 

[chudat]

How to you guys approach negotiations? During the interview or after they offered you the position?

 

[drusso]

Okay guys so the outcome of the negotiation was as follows:

Year One: $450k fixed salary, Year 2: $500k fixed, Year 3+: $60 per RVU. RVU goal is 6500 and salary cannot be adjusted as long as Im working toward this goal.
$15K sign on bonus, $100k up-front student loan reimbursement (for a three year commitment), another $25k in year 4 and another in year 5 toward student loans. This is a non-profit hospital and therefore also qualifies for public service loan forgiveness (huge deal for me, as I have a massive burden and am already halfway to forgiveness). $4000/yr CME allowance, $1600/yr dues/memberships allowance, full benefits package with 5% 403b match. 6 weeks vacay plus one week CME (although I realize vacation can be somewhat of a farse on production-based pay).

They are buying me a dedicated c-arm, ultrasound and hiring a rad tech to start. Will have a PA and a scribe when things pick up.

What do you guys think? It sounded like a pretty decent offer coming straight out of training...

Congratulations!

How much of that compensation is W-2? It could be a very hefty gift to Uncle Sam unless you find some ways to shelter it.

 

[TeslaCoil]

To be clear I'm not throwing shade -- this job sounds like a sweet opportunity. They're paying you well and putting a large up-front investment in you and that's awesome. Just offering some friendly input--I know 2 guys recently out of my fellowing in similar sounding gigs to yours. One makes $68/rvu and the other makes 70. And if you look at MGMA data that's not at all unreasonable. At 9k rvu you'll be making the hospital a ton of cash.

FWIW I also don't trust PSLF and agree their loan repayment has value.

Congratulations!

How much of that compensation is W-2? It could be a very hefty gift to Uncle Sam unless you find some ways to shelter it.

Thanks! And true that. Will get myself a solid accountant.

 

[TeslaCoil]

How to you guys approach negotiations? During the interview or after they offered you the position?

Before anything I asked for a sample contract just to cut to the chase. If there were any major red flags or if the contract was just crap altogether, I politely declined. Saves everyone a lot of time.

 

[TeslaCoil]

60/wrvu is ehh for rural America. I negotiated significantly more than that. In a nice city I’d take that in a heartbeat however

Thanks but the total package is quite competitive for me. I imagine I will renegotiate the pay per RVU after about 5 years when I have more negotiating power.

 

[stsa84]

Before anything I asked for a sample contract just to cut to the chase. If there were any major red flags or if the contract was just crap altogether, I politely declined. Saves everyone a lot of time.

How'd you phrase that request? Did you really ask during the first conversation? My first convos have ended up being pretty vague regarding compensation details.

 

[TeslaCoil]

How'd you phrase that request? Did you really ask during the first conversation? My first convos have ended up being pretty vague regarding compensation details.

Maybe not the very first conversation but before any in-person interviews for sure, and before spending too much time dilly-dallying. Dont be afraid to cut to the chase. Once I got the contract, I would then ask "is such and such negotiable"? If I didnt like what I was hearing I would say "thank you for your time" and walk away. I was pretty aggressive, honestly. My best advice is dont get emotional. Dont go with the first offer you come across. Cast a big net and don't be afraid to tell people no. It took me two months to go through probably 10 potential employers until I came across the one. Also, a given setup may not work for just anyone. The one I landed on was the one that was perfect for me. I know that sounds cliche, but its true.

 

[TeslaCoil]

Also, gaswork jobs are mostly garbage. Not saying they all are, but most are. There are even some scams on there.

 

[Asclepius186]

Also, gaswork jobs are mostly garbage. Not saying they all are, but most are. There are even some scams on there.

maybe this was in the thread already, but what method of finding jobs and contacting practices/hospitals did you use? Recruiter? Cold calls? Personal contacts that “know someone”?

 

[TeslaCoil]

maybe this was in the thread already, but what method of finding jobs and contacting practices/hospitals did you use? Recruiter? Cold calls? Personal contacts that “know someone”?

Little bit of everything. In the end a talented recruiter wound up hooking me up with a unique opportunity.

 

[Ducttape]

a couple of minor points
1. make sure the non-compete clause is appropriate. (ie 1 year, 5 miles or something reasonable like that)
2. see if there is a tail on insurance.
3. as noted previously, you will probably take a pay cut in year 3. getting to 9000 wRVU is not impossible but in a rural area wont necessarily be easy. procedures are not generally what patients in these rural areas want.
4. make sure an attorney looks at the contract. I met with the attorney before I got my contracts (I looked at 3 separate offers), and she knew what I was expecting. for more expense, she critiqued them all. it was definitely worth the cost, however.

 

[TeslaCoil]

a couple of minor points
1. make sure the non-compete clause is appropriate. (ie 1 year, 5 miles or something reasonable like that)
2. see if there is a tail on insurance.
3. as noted previously, you will probably take a pay cut in year 3. getting to 9000 wRVU is not impossible but in a rural area wont necessarily be easy. procedures are not generally what patients in these rural areas want.
4. make sure an attorney looks at the contract. I met with the attorney before I got my contracts (I looked at 3 separate offers), and she knew what I was expecting. for more expense, she critiqued them all. it was definitely worth the cost, however.

1. I did not care so much about the non-compete, because if I left this practice it would be to move far away.
2. Tail insurance is covered by the hospital and is explicitly in the contract.
3. Ive been told with a catchment area of 300,000 this should not be a problem.
4. I do have an attorney and he has reviewed the contract.

 

[thiswonthurtabit]

Okay guys so the outcome of the negotiation was as follows:

Year One: $450k fixed salary, Year 2: $500k fixed, Year 3+: $60 per RVU. RVU goal is 6500 and salary cannot be adjusted as long as Im working toward this goal.
$15K sign on bonus, $100k up-front student loan reimbursement (for a three year commitment), another $25k in year 4 and another in year 5 toward student loans. This is a non-profit hospital and therefore also qualifies for public service loan forgiveness (huge deal for me, as I have a massive burden and am already halfway to forgiveness). $4000/yr CME allowance, $1600/yr dues/memberships allowance, full benefits package with 5% 403b match. 6 weeks vacay plus one week CME (although I realize vacation can be somewhat of a farse on production-based pay).

They are buying me a dedicated c-arm, ultrasound and hiring a rad tech to start. Will have a PA and a scribe when things pick up.

What do you guys think? It sounded like a pretty decent offer coming straight out of training...

FML, I'm getting hosed. year 1: 250K, no bonus, no incentive, no sign on bonus (now 200k because I'm only at 4 days a week because of COVID slowing anticipated growth), year 2: 300k, no bonus no incentive. Year 3: TBD, contract renegotiation.

So far for the year I've generated 3600 RVUs on 4 days a week (and was down to 3 days a week with no procedures for 6 weeks due to Corona) and, assuming average RVU production for the next 4 months is the same as the average for the last 8 I'll be at 5400 RVU for the year (roughly at that 6500 goal they have for you if I were 5 days a week).

 

[Ronin1]

FML, I'm getting hosed. year 1: 250K, no bonus, no incentive, no sign on bonus (now 200k because I'm only at 4 days a week because of COVID slowing anticipated growth), year 2: 300k, no bonus no incentive. Year 3: TBD, contract renegotiation.

So far for the year I've generated 3600 RVUs on 4 days a week (and was down to 3 days a week with no procedures for 6 weeks due to Corona) and, assuming average RVU production for the next 4 months is the same as the average for the last 8 I'll be at 5400 RVU for the year (roughly at that 6500 goal they have for you if I were 5 days a week).

What does an average day look like for you if you are only generating 5400 a year. Should be easy to blow that away if you are busy

 

[thiswonthurtabit]

What does an average day look like for you if you are only generating 5400 a year. Should be easy to blow that away if you are busy

TBH I'm just bitching and should be happy to have a job. Practice growth didn't meet expectations and I've been having to bounce between offices so I can't really set up a great flow. Right now I'm only getting ~5 hours of injections per week (out of my 32 'working' hours) on average the rest are new consults, follow-ups, and EMGs. I also am responsible for generally 2+ midlevels per day but I don't think I get credit from my employer for their billing.

 

[Laryngospasm]

You are getting hosed. Get some experience and then get a better job.

 

[cowboydoc]

1. I did not care so much about the non-compete, because if I left this practice it would be to move far away.
2. Tail insurance is covered by the hospital and is explicitly in the contract.
3. Ive been told with a catchment area of 300,000 this should not be a problem.
4. I do have an attorney and he has reviewed the contract.

Re: 3. That’s only a part of it. Do you have competent help, functional EMR, reasonable turn-over time where you do procedures? Good luck pulling 9000 RVU if the ASC can only handle a cesi/hour, e.g. If most procedures are in clinic, and you have some control of workflow, not that hard (Particularly a few years into practice)

 

[TeslaCoil]

Re: 3. That’s only a part of it. Do you have competent help, functional EMR, reasonable turn-over time where you do procedures? Good luck pulling 9000 RVU if the ASC can only handle a cesi/hour, e.g. If most procedures are in clinic, and you have some control of workflow, not that hard (Particularly a few years into practice)

Aside from implants, procedures will be entirely in clinic. As far as the other things, well, hopefully it works out.

 

[chudat]

TBH I'm just bitching and should be happy to have a job. Practice growth didn't meet expectations and I've been having to bounce between offices so I can't really set up a great flow. Right now I'm only getting ~5 hours of injections per week (out of my 32 'working' hours) on average the rest are new consults, follow-ups, and EMGs. I also am responsible for generally 2+ midlevels per day but I don't think I get credit from my employer for their billing.

Honestly, i just interviewed at a rural place in western PA. They offered very similar pay as the OP. But mann...driving thru western PA with my spouse, its no wonder why they need to pay so high. Trump and pence flyers everywhere, confederate flags (in western PA?!!!), run down housing, the list goes on. Coming from the city, it was definitely shock for me.

 

[thiswonthurtabit]

Honestly, i just interviewed at a rural place in western PA. They offered very similar pay as the OP. But mann...driving thru western PA with my spouse, its no wonder why they need to pay so high. Trump and pence flyers everywhere, confederate flags (in western PA?!!!), run down housing, the list goes on. Coming from the city, it was definitely shock for me.

Personally I'd be fine with that for 2-3x my salary but my wife...not so much.

 

[cowboydoc]

Personally I'd be fine with that for 2-3x my salary but my wife...not so much.

Happy wife...

I could live like a resident (+$2k/month) easily. If you keep both yourself and your spouse living like you’re still a resident for several years out, you’ll be in great shape!

 

[TeslaCoil]

Honestly, i just interviewed at a rural place in western PA. They offered very similar pay as the OP. But mann...driving thru western PA with my spouse, its no wonder why they need to pay so high. Trump and pence flyers everywhere, confederate flags (in western PA?!!!), run down housing, the list goes on. Coming from the city, it was definitely shock for me.

yea... for me the Trump/Pence signs are a strong perk. no offense.

 

[thiswonthurtabit]

Happy wife...

I could live like a resident (+$2k/month) easily. If you keep both yourself and your spouse living like you’re still a resident for several years out, you’ll be in great shape!

Yeah, happy wife is the most important thing and fortunately she makes quite a bit more than me . Unfortunately for us rent/utilities alone is like 2.4k/month because we're in high to very high COL city and a state with very high income tax.

 

[TeslaCoil]

Yeah, happy wife is the most important thing and fortunately she makes quite a bit more than me . Unfortunately for us rent/utilities alone is like 2.4k/month because we're in high to very high COL city and a state with very high income tax.

So, not texas but probably new york or cali.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

Honestly, i just interviewed at a rural place in western PA. They offered very similar pay as the OP. But mann...driving thru western PA with my spouse, its no wonder why they need to pay so high. Trump and pence flyers everywhere, confederate flags (in western PA?!!!), run down housing, the list goes on. Coming from the city, it was definitely shock for me.

I bet violent crime is virtually non-existent though. Funny how that works. I bet there is no run-down housing in the city, especially in Baltimore city where I trained. Your perception is stemming from your own bias and you're not used to rural America so you fear it. I know because I used to be like you. Right or wrong, the confederate flag symbolizes one thing to city dwellers, especially those from northern cities, and something else to many rural southerners. There is far more miscegenation and racial integration in my small southern town than there is in NYC yet the perception would be the complete opposite. NYC is completely divided based on income, religion, and race. I know, I was born and bred and still own a coop there. In my high-rise building in the heart of the city, one must apply and be thoroughly vetted before being accepted for residence. In other words, they discriminate against who can purchase a unit in the building. It is a completely legal form of housing discrimination and they do not have to give the reasons why an application was rejected. Try doing that in any other form of housing other than a coop. Most rural southerners are kind, unassuming people who are usually the first to step up in times of trouble. I believe percentage-wise, they constitute the majority of our armed forces.

 

[clubdeac]

Your first two years are pretty sweet. Year three sucks though. You're going to be moving along a pretty fast clip seeing 25+ patients a day to break 9000 wRVUs and make only $540k.

 

[chudat]

I bet violent crime is virtually non-existent though. Funny how that works. I bet there is no run-down housing in the city, especially in Baltimore city where I trained. Your perception is stemming from your own bias and you're not used to rural America so you fear it. I know because I used to be like you. Right or wrong, the confederate flag symbolizes one thing to city dwellers, especially those from northern cities, and something else to many rural southerners. There is far more miscegenation and racial integration in my small southern town then there is in NYC yet the perception would be the complete opposite. NYC is completely divided based on income, religion, and race. I know, I was born and bred and still own a coop there. In my high-rise building in the heart of the city, one must apply and be thoroughly vetted before being accepted for residence. In other words, they discriminate against who can purchase a unit in the building. It is a completely legal form of housing discrimination and they do not have to give the reasons why an application was rejected. Try doing that in any other form of housing other than a coop. Most rural southerners are kind, unassuming people who are usually the first to step up in times of trouble. I believe percentage-wise, they constitute the majority of our armed forces.
View attachment 317452

Not for nothing but driving by endless rows of these buildings^ is visually unappealing and exudes aura of abandonment, rampant drug use and violence.

 

[TeslaCoil]

Your first two years are pretty sweet. Year three sucks though. You're going to be moving along a pretty fast clip seeing 25+ patients a day to break 9000 wRVUs and make only $540k.

Again, when you consider the total compensation, its worth it. In year 5 my loans are expected to be forgiven. I calculated the forgiveness amount- its ~$450k. So thats an extra 50-60 grand per year. Also, again- I will attempt to re-negotiate if/when I have more negotiating leverage.

 

[thiswonthurtabit]

Again, when you consider the total compensation, its worth it. In year 5 my loans are expected to be forgiven. I calculated the forgiveness amount- its ~$450k. So thats an extra 50-60 grand per year. Also, again- I will attempt to re-negotiate if/when I have more negotiating leverage.

IIRC loan forgiveness like that is a taxable event so stash away some cash to pay taxes on that.

 

[SommeRiver]

I bet violent crime is virtually non-existent though. Funny how that works. I bet there is no run-down housing in the city, especially in Baltimore city where I trained. Your perception is stemming from your own bias and you're not used to rural America so you fear it. I know because I used to be like you. Right or wrong, the confederate flag symbolizes one thing to city dwellers, especially those from northern cities, and something else to many rural southerners. There is far more miscegenation and racial integration in my small southern town then there is in NYC yet the perception would be the complete opposite. NYC is completely divided based on income, religion, and race. I know, I was born and bred and still own a coop there. In my high-rise building in the heart of the city, one must apply and be thoroughly vetted before being accepted for residence. In other words, they discriminate against who can purchase a unit in the building. It is a completely legal form of housing discrimination and they do not have to give the reasons why an application was rejected. Try doing that in any other form of housing other than a coop. Most rural southerners are kind, unassuming people who are usually the first to step up in times of trouble. I believe percentage-wise, they constitute the majority of our armed forces.
View attachment 317452

Fantastic post.

Rural Americans TRULY care about people, and they will go out of their way to help you and expect nothing in return.

 

[TeslaCoil]

IIRC loan forgiveness like that is a taxable event so stash away some cash to pay taxes on that.

Actually, I looked into that as well, and under the PSLF program you dont pay taxes on the forgiven amount.

 

[TeslaCoil]

Fantastic post.

Rural Americans TRULY care about people, and they will go out of their way to help you and expect nothing in return.

This. Plus you dont spend hours per week in a bumper to bumper rat race.

 

[thiswonthurtabit]

Actually, I looked into that as well, and under the PSLF program you dont pay taxes on the forgiven amount.

Ah, I misunderstood, I thought the year 5 forgiveness was coming from the hospital not PSLF.

 

[TeslaCoil]

Ah, I misunderstood, I thought the year 5 forgiveness was coming from the hospital not PSLF.

The hospital has to qualify. Its a non-profit.

 

[chudat]

Fantastic post.

Rural Americans TRULY care about people, and they will go out of their way to help you and expect nothing in return.

Yeah easy for you caucasians to say tho.

Being a colored minority is much different.

 

[SommeRiver]

Yeah easy for you caucasians to say tho.

Being a colored minority is much different.

Especially given the fact whites are the new target as of 2020...

 

[Pain Applicant1]

Yeah easy for you caucasians to say tho.

Being a colored minority is much different.

That picture I posted is of course of Baltimore. I'm white but grew up as the minority and I can tell you that it wasn't always easy so it definitely goes all the way around. Nonetheless, your comment is uninformed and naive at best but I don't really feel like getting into it right now. However, I am more than happy to debate you if you wish to continue.

 

[SommeRiver]

Did someone say absurd racism debate on an internet forum?