New MS-1, Cold Feet

[DocLove06]

OK so I'm a new MS-1. I was talking to a MS-4 and she was telling me that 'things are going to be tough in 4 years' because DO schools are opening up like crazy, but residencies are not opening up at the same rate. In 4 years we will be indirectly forced into primary care (not that there's anything wrong with primary) SDN please advise...

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[Chocolate Bear]

OK so I'm a new MS-1. I was talking to a MS-4 and she was telling me that 'things are going to be tough in 4 years' because DO schools are opening up like crazy, but residencies are not opening up at the same rate. In 4 years we will be indirectly forced into primary care (not that there's anything wrong with primary) SDN please advise...

This thread is ridiculous, and based on your post history...:troll:

**Edit: It's not that the number of students outpacing new residency slots isn't a concern. But "...forced into primary care...SDN please advise..." Come on!

 

[DrMidlife]

OK so I'm a new MS-1. I was talking to a MS-4 and she was telling me that 'things are going to be tough in 4 years' because DO schools are opening up like crazy, but residencies are not opening up at the same rate. In 4 years we will be indirectly forced into primary care (not that there's anything wrong with primary) SDN please advise...

I don't smell a troll, and whatever, let's catch folks up.

1. Lack of AOA residencies in competitive specialties, in competitive locales, was a problem well before the new schools started opening. There are loads of AOA primary care residencies in less popular locales, and a lot of these go unfilled. If you want a competitive residency, ie ROADE, in a non-midwestern location, AOA hasn't ever provided much. That said, if you don't care where you do residency, there's a nice selection of ROADE et al AOA residencies that you can compete for, only against DOs.

2. 60% of DOs do ACGME residencies. These are the residencies that the MDs do. You have to compete against not just MDs but IMGs to get into competitive residencies. Most ACGME residencies are in primary care, lots of these spots go unfilled, and most DOs doing ACGME residencies are in primary care. But there are always plenty of extremely hard working DOs who match competitive ACGME - even ortho. About 30% of DOs who try, fail to match in ACGME.

3. Look for posts by TooHotinVegas with updates on new AOA residencies that seem to be opening up pretty often.

4. Rough numbers: there are going to be 17,500 MD grads in 2012, and now there are about 25,000 ACGME spots. There are going to be about 4,500 DO grads in 2012, and now there are about 5800 DO residency positions (and 2800 internship positions that are not strictly additive to the 5800). You can find statistical papers on acgme.org and do-online.org.

This would be a GREAT time for you to pick up Iserson's Guide to Getting a Residency.

Best of luck to you.

 

[p30doc]

This thread is ridiculous, and based on your post history...:troll:

It is ridiculous to say that everyone is going to be forced into primary care. Regardless of his troll status, won't the competitive residences get more competitive if there is an increase in the number of students vying for them? Unless the number of residency spots in each specialty have proportionally increased to match the increase of med students.

 

[Chocolate Bear]

won't the competitive residences get more competitive if there is an increase in the number of students vying for them?

Of course I agree with this.

 

[scpod]

It's awfully funny how so many people automatically assume that darned near every med student on the face of the Earth is competing for all those wonderful road residencies and that no one actuially wants to do primary care. That's waaaaaay off the mark. Wait until you're in med school and you'll meet lots of students who actually want to do Peds and FP, etc.

Another big myth is that new residencies aren't being created. They are, but not necessarily all the specialtuies that some people are clamoring for, and there's not a new one opening for evey new student. Why? We already have more residencies than students to fill them out there. That's why many thousands of residencies are going to foreign students every year. The increasing number of students will only change the makeup of who is getting them.

Consider this, too: The numbers are nowhere near this for ACGME residencies, but in AOA residencies, over 90% of students are matching to their first choice. Yes, first choice. Obviously, there are some satisfied people around these days.

 

[cliquesh]

Although the poster maybe a troll, there is probably some merit to his statement. My DO mentor, who is a residency director at a community hospital, warned me that if I go the DO route, I should anticipate a shortage of 'good' residency positions. *his definition of good is spots at well established hospitals, not really ROADS*

 

[mastamark]

I hate these "The End is Nigh" posts.

Some of these new DO schools will also lead to newer residency posistions by the time most of us graduate. When they get their full accredidation they will most likely start some programs as well.

 

[DocLove06]

i am not a troll-I just care about the future of my profession. A couple of senior med students were telling me that residencies were only opening at the same rate at which new DO schools were opening. I was wanted to start a constructive conversation.

 

[DocLove06]

I hate these "The End is Nigh" posts.

Some of these new DO schools will also lead to newer residency posistions by the time most of us graduate. When they get their full accredidation they will most likely start some programs as well.

what makes you so sure?

 

[Chocolate Bear]

A couple of senior med students were telling me that residencies were only opening at the same rate at which new DO schools were opening.

To clarify, you mean not opening, right?

 

[mastamark]

what makes you so sure?

I'm not, but I am also not insecure about my future. Osteopathic Medicine and its practitioners will be fine. The best thing is that most of us are pretty optimistic about things to come. The profession has done fine despite the nay-sayers, now and in the past.

If you are so insecure about your future, and you plan on taking this pessimism with you into a class of over 100+ OMS-1s, don't go. Apply to MD school. You won't be missed.

Good Luck

 

[GreenShirt]

There's something like 26 new schools (DO & MD) slated to open in the next ten years as part of the AMAs goal of increasing medical school enrollment by 13% to combat the physician shortage problem. I'm not sure what the current student:residency ratio is and by how much the increase is going to cramp future students, but things may change a little if new spots aren't opened up. Most likely this'll push some FMGs out and make some specialties a little more competitive. Although, it technically behooves the US to force more med students into those vacant PC spots since that's were the physician shortage is felt the most rather than produce more uber-specialists.

 

[LADoc84]

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[Nasem]

i am not a troll-I just care about the future of my profession. A couple of senior med students were telling me that residencies were only opening at the same rate at which new DO schools were opening. I was wanted to start a constructive conversation.

well, to be honest with you, there is NOTHING you can do about it, cause if you don't like the silly possibility of "maybe being forced into primary care" then you can simply quit the DO program and try to earn an MD degree or go to some other profession....

Simplying complaing about something that MIGHT happen based on future predictions that have no solid base what-so-ever does not serves the primary goal of these forums...... these are PRE-MED FORUMS, designed to help the pre-meds become MEDS (period).

 

[scpod]

....if you don't like the silly possibility of "maybe being forced into primary care" then you can simply quit the DO program and try to earn an MD degree or go to some other profession...

Note, that becoming an MD means you are just as likely to be "forced" into primary care as you are being a DO. There are more MD family medicine doctors in the US than there are total practicing DOs.