New Pharm Schools: how have they or will they affect profession?

[oshie]

My concern is with all these new pharm schools opening is Pharmacy going the way of law. with so many more students flooding the job market how will this affect the profession? will it be like the flood of law schools that saturated the market with lawyers to the point where there are tons of law students graduating with 100k + in debt and no job.?

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[GamecockPharmD]

Don't go into pharmacy because....

And you will need this to cope with your depression of being $120,000 in debt with no job...

Seriously, it's like anything else. Companies are cutting back in these hard economic times. If no one is hiring and there are a ton of new graduates, people will be looking for jobs. This dead horse has been beaten enough already. We can't look into the future. If the economy bounces back, there may be jobs for these new graduates. And there are supposed to be 1 million plus more people insured with health care reform, so that may create jobs. Pharmacy job growth was expected to be robust before the recession. If you like pharmacy, go into it. If you don't, find something else. You have a better chance of finding a job with a PharmD than someone with a BA in history.

 

[spacecowgirl]

There are many other threads on this already.

 

[Ackj]

Don't go into pharmacy because....

You stole my Admiral Ackbar post from the other day!

Oh well, I'll see your Fukitol and raise you FML (which we actually filled yesterday)...

 

[njac]

You stole my Admiral Ackbar post from the other day!

Oh well, I'll see your Fukitol and raise you FML (which we actually filled yesterday)...

All I know is that I'm at one of the largest and most established pharmacy residencies in the country, and we don't have a single person from a "new" school. I take that back - there's one PGY2 who went to UCSD.

 

[tungsten87]

You stole my Admiral Ackbar post from the other day!

Oh well, I'll see your Fukitol and raise you FML (which we actually filled yesterday)...

total absolute pwnage. excellent job my friend.

 

[rxforlife2004]

My concern is with all these new pharm schools opening is Pharmacy going the way of law. with so many more students flooding the job market how will this affect the profession? will it be like the flood of law schools that saturated the market with lawyers to the point where there are tons of law students graduating with 100k + in debt and no job.?

No ! because:

1. Omaba healthcare plan creates plenty of jobs in healthcare.
2. Baby boomers increase prescription volume
3. There is always a demand for pharmacists


......

 

[aussiepharmer]

It's up to you which side you want to believe: http://www.indeed.com/forum/job/pharmacist/Lies-about-pharmacist-job-market/t264349

 

[aboveliquidice]

All I know is that I'm at one of the largest and most established pharmacy residencies in the country, and we don't have a single person from a "new" school. I take that back - there's one PGY2 who went to UCSD.

26 of 86 (87) of us are doing residencies... They may not be the "top" in the country, but we have several that placed with the best in Oregon and Wa state. We took a top 10 position at ashp clinical skills the first time we competed as well.

The argument that the new skills suck because they are new is a generalization. A school blows because of faculty / or students.

If we sucked as much as this board would make you believe, we wouldn't have been able to match this many. At the very least, we were able to go toe to toe with our peers at Midyear.

 

[SamwisetheBrave]

With all due respect to those people on this board who attended/are attending a newer pharmacy school, here are my $0.02 on this matter.

1. This growth of pharmacy schools was inevitable given the salary that pharmacists (in any traditional practice setting) can earn.
2. In an enviormnet of a shortage, everybody stands to gain. The new (mostly) private pharmacy schools can charge a high tuition and the graduates from the program will (in a shortage) get high-paying jobs.
3. If there is not a shortage, I predict that the market will dictate how many of these new schools will survive. Whether it is a fair characterization or not, employers will probably be more likely to hire students from an established pharmacy school, thus if graduates from new programs struggle to find work, potential students ought to be less likely to attend those programs, and the school my be fored to close.

I do not necessarily think that graduates from new schools are less qualified or receive a substandard education. I can tell you that two residency program directors that I have worked with have told me that they tend not to recruit candidates from new pharmacy schools.

I'm sure all of these points have been made several times in the multiple threads on this topic so take it for what it's worth.

 

[tungsten87]

If there is not a shortage, I predict that the market will dictate how many of these new schools will survive. Whether it is a fair characterization or not, employers will probably be more likely to hire students from an established pharmacy school, thus if graduates from new programs struggle to find work, potential students ought to be less likely to attend those programs, and the school my be fored to close.

this is one possibility. another is that employers will let oversupply dictate the market and hire who will work for less. i'd say the latter is more feasible in a chain retail setting.

 

[Its Z]

this is one possibility. another is that employers will let oversupply dictate the market and hire who will work for less. i'd say the latter is more feasible in a chain retail setting.

yup

 

[StevePerry]

Honestly as Tungstens post showed, I think the most realistic possiblity is that the hospitals/chains will let Chuck Norris dictate the market for pharmacists.

 

[quartel]

If there is no shortage, I predict that the market will dictate how many of these new schools will survive. Whether it is a fair characterization or not, employers will probably be more likely to hire students from an established pharmacy school, thus if graduates from new programs struggle to find work, potential students ought to be less likely to attend those programs, and the school my be fored to close.

If there is no shortage, regardless of the market schools will continue to pour out new graduates and schools will continue to pop up - the same way with law schools. Schools will charge more and more regardless of whether the market is saturated or not. This is due to the fact that everyone is guaranteed student loans by the government. Therefore school can afford to raise tuition each year despite the scores of unemployed graduate numbers. Just look at law schools, their graduates are unemployed but the schools keep raising tuitions and none are closing down.

And despite unemployment, schools will put up misrepresenting stats to fool everyone to go to pharmacy school (just like law school) and people will continue to attend pharmacy school. For example, law schools frequently boast a 90% employment statistic, but this does not necessarily reflect that the graduate is employed in the LAW field... Because of the ongoing recession, people will hide it out in pharmacy school. It's quite counter-intuitive isn't it?

 

[dgroulx]

You get jobs by being hired by other pharmacists. My boss went to UF, they only have UF students there on rotations, I got hired because I already showed my work ethic to them while on rotations.

My last job, the DOP got her PharmD from FAMU. She hired mainly FAMU students.

If you go to a new school there won't be any alumnus out there who is a DOP. I'm not saying that it works like that everywhere, but it sure seems that way here.

 

[Zrchrn]

My concern is with all these new pharm schools opening is Pharmacy going the way of law. with so many more students flooding the job market how will this affect the profession? will it be like the flood of law schools that saturated the market with lawyers to the point where there are tons of law students graduating with 100k + in debt and no job.?

Either there is a problem and we are screwed or chain pharmacies are spreading the rumor that there is a problem so that they don't have to pay 120k/year + 20k sign-on bonuses. The BLS disagrees with the latter as we are no longer as in demand as we used to be. The fact is more and more pharm. schools are opening. It's going to be kind of hard to close a pharmacy school since they paid so much to open them. For some reason people keep jumping headlong into pharmacy because they keep ignoring this "trend" then they come on here and ask this very same question. They'd heard the concerns before but didn't believe them since it would force them to alter their plan.

 

[confettiflyer]

I could be doing worse things for less money.

 

[RxWildcat]

I could be doing worse things for less money.

I'm never going back to stripping again!! NEVER!!

 

[pharm B]

No ! because:

1. Omaba healthcare plan creates plenty of jobs in healthcare.
2. Baby boomers increase prescription volume
3. There is always a demand for pharmacists


......

Gomaba!

I could be doing worse things for less money.

Seriously. This has been debated to death in other threads, but I feel confident that even with more schools and more pharmacists, we'll still be able to find jobs. Maybe not where you want them, and maybe not with a sign-on bonus.

Of course, I'm a little biased and optimistic, since my school was only accredited fully this Spring.

If all else fails, I'll just stay in school until I die and pass on my debt to my kids. Suckers!

 

[Humper]

Gomaba!



Seriously. This has been debated to death in other threads, but I feel confident that even with more schools and more pharmacists, we'll still be able to find jobs. Maybe not where you want them, and maybe not with a sign-on bonus.

Of course, I'm a little biased and optimistic, since my school was only accredited fully this Spring.

If all else fails, I'll just stay in school until I die and pass on my debt to my kids. Suckers!

...This is the most thoughtful decision I'd ever seen.

 

[rxlea]

Gomaba!



Seriously. This has been debated to death in other threads, but I feel confident that even with more schools and more pharmacists, we'll still be able to find jobs. Maybe not where you want them, and maybe not with a sign-on bonus.

Of course, I'm a little biased and optimistic, since my school was only accredited fully this Spring.

If all else fails, I'll just stay in school until I die and pass on my debt to my kids. Suckers!

Why not? The boomers shafted all of us.

 

[confettiflyer]

If all else fails, I'll just stay in school until I die and pass on my debt to my kids. Suckers!

I'll do you one better...student loans are forgiven upon death, woohoo! So are credit cards/etc... you can't pass debt on to your kids, creditors can generally only claim collateral or file a claim w/ your estate.

Me? I'm hoping for massive inflation to reduce my debts, haha.

 

[BavarianMWE46]

Me? I'm hoping for massive inflation to reduce my debts, haha.

I hope inflation takes off to about 10% for the next few years, as long as wages inflate to match. I also hope real estate crashes even more and deflates back to ~1990 levels.

 

[confettiflyer]

I hope inflation takes off to about 10% for the next few years, as long as wages inflate to match. I also hope real estate crashes even more and deflates back to ~1990 levels.

you kidding me? 1990 was near the top of a bubble. i'll take 1995 prices.

a nice thing about inflation is, if you're a cash buyer, prices will tank as mortgage rates rise and reduce buying power.

sadly, looks like we're headed toward deflationary times, we'll see.

 

[BavarianMWE46]

Yeah, mid 90s sounds good, I wasn't thinking of the Bush I bubble. It does look like we are headed towards deflation. There aren't any bubbles going on to pump up with credit to increase the money supply. Well there is, the student loan credit bubble that is currently inflating and causing tuition to increase at twice the rate of inflation, which is obviously unsustainable.

My generation is so screwed, increased educational requirements with enormous student loans and unafforable housing, with no jobs to pay for any of it. Open up the printing presses and get inflation up to 20%! Luls

 

[confettiflyer]

Yeah, mid 90s sounds good, I wasn't thinking of the Bush I bubble. It does look like we are headed towards deflation. There aren't any bubbles going on to pump up with credit to increase the money supply. Well there is, the student loan credit bubble that is currently inflating and causing tuition to increase at twice the rate of inflation, which is obviously unsustainable.

My generation is so screwed, increased educational requirements with enormous student loans and unafforable housing, with no jobs to pay for any of it. Open up the printing presses and get inflation up to 20%! Luls

thank the baby boomers for all the runaway entitlement spending on them with nothing left for us, oh well