PhD/PsyD New Tax Bill Issues

Discussion in 'Psychology [Psy.D. / Ph.D.]' started by SallyStudent, Dec 16, 2017.

  1. SallyStudent

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    Has anyone heard anything about this tax bill that is being worked out right now? As we all know, it initially intended to tax graduate student tuition waivers, but word got out, people spoke up, and that has been taken out. However, I did some digging and there are still some major issues for students. I do not see the media talking about this and I am worried that there will be no voice for us since we do not know what is going on. From what I can tell, this is what could change:

    -Lowering of the aggregate loan amount
    At first glance, this seems like a great idea and going forward, it probably is. However, for students who are already financially invested in their programs, I am worried they'll suddenly hit their aggregates before they expected and will not be able to finish their programs. Then what do they do? Graduate with a ton of debt but no degree?

    -Elimination of PSLF
    A lot of students, such as myself, decided to go back to graduate school with the understanding that PSLF was there and that upon graduation, if we worked for qualifying employers, we would be able to have our loans forgiven after 10 years of repayment, tax-free. It was a determining factor for me, but I am not enrolled yet because I am still in school. So does this mean I'd have to either quit my program, leaving in debt but without a degree, or finish and not have the PSLF option? What about my husband, who is currently paying on his federal loans under PSLF, but is also taking out loans for his PhD? So as of June 2018, the rest of his loans won't qualify for PSLF? And since he chose to go back to graduate school under these rules, how is it fair for them to change when he has invested so much financially?

    -Elimination of payment options such as REPAYE
    Same issue as PSLF. And how are loans going to be repaid if they are astronomical and a person's income is not taken into consideration?

    I am deeply concerned about this. I feel like we need to speak up or alert the media or something because if all of this goes through, some of us are going to be in trouble.

    Can anyone better clarify my understanding? I realize I could be wrong about anything.
     
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  3. sb247

    sb247 Doer of things

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    There will still be an income based payment plan, and the govt shouldn’t make tax payers pay off our loans for us so the pslf ending is good
     
  4. str63

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    When you take out loans, you sign a commitment that you will pay them back. You should not ever trust that they will be paid back for you. Many people, even those who have taken out loans (like myself), believe that PSLF ending is a good thing. Tax payers shouldn't have to pay my loans back for me. I chose to further my education and take out loans, I should have to pay them back. This is also why I only would go to grad school if I had a funded program - so that I could minimize my debt. I've even known of people who have taken out additional loans to live in expensive places and say that they won't have to pay for it because of PSLF. It's shocking to me that people will go to grad school and take out loans under the belief that they will be paid off after ten years for them. If you find a job that will pay off some of your loans (some positions you can negotiate this), then great, but I do not believe it should be the responsibility of the taxpayers.
     
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  5. erg923

    erg923 Regional Clinical Officer, Cenpatico National

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    Sarcastic insight from Ronnie Reagan; "I am from the government, and I am here to help."

    Seriously though:

    1. You signed a promisory note attesting the opposite of this.

    2. Entitlement programs are always subject to change at anytime. Your thought/decision process here was naive, at best.

    3. IBR will still allow forgiveness after 25 years
     
    #4 erg923, Dec 17, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2017
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  6. SallyStudent

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    I made commitments to those loans based on the rules at the time. I cannot change my end of the deal, so it's wrong that the government can change theirs after I have signed on the dotted line. I guess it's okay with you to not have to pay taxes on your tuition waivers, but to hell with everyone else who cannot quit their lives to go through funded programs. So basically, we should only care about what benefits us and not others. Got it!
     
  7. PSYDR

    PSYDR Psychologist

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    Another issue:

    Your retirement is screwed. The big trading houses have put out internal memos about this. If you contribute to a retirement account, when you retire you have to sell these assets periodically. Currently, you can identify which stocks you want to sell. The new plan says you have to sell the stocks you bought first.

    Example: every year you buy one share of a mutual fund for $100. The stock goes up 10% every year. When you retire, you’re required to sell off a percentage. By identifying which stock you are selling, you can reduce your capital gains tax. Currently you could say “that mutual fund is now $1000/share. I want to sell the share I bought when it was $900. So my tax rate is based on $100 profit”. Under the new tax bill you can ONLY sell the share you bought when it was $100/share or $900 profit.

    Same for taxable accounts.
     
  8. str63

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    Did the government give you a signed document that they would pay your loans back? Taxes change all the time. And what you signed didn't say that the government would forgive your loans after 10 years; what you signed said you would pay them back.
     
  9. MAClinician

    MAClinician Masters level clinician

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    If you can't afford it, don't buy it. Basic financial literacy here. Loans, credit cards...they work under the expectations that they will be paid back. It's not free money. Sucks you got hood-winked into attending an expensive school (for profit maybe?) and hopefully you will learn from this.
     
  10. erg923

    erg923 Regional Clinical Officer, Cenpatico National

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    Your government made no such "rule." This was an "entitlement program." Hence why PSLF was not in your promissory note.
     
    #9 erg923, Dec 17, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2017
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  11. DynamicDidactic

    DynamicDidactic Ass of Prof

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    Are any of these changes actually in the tax bill? I can't find anything about it by googling.
    If the total amount of loans that are subsidized by the federal gov't is decreased (is that the issue?) then the likely effect is a reduction in tuition. The evidence indicates the availability of federal subsidized loans most accounts for increasing tuition. There may be a bumpy transition but if a program relies on tuition for survival and a large portion of their students can no longer afford the tuition, the likely effect is that programs will have a strong incentive to reduce tuition.

    Re: Elimination of PSLF

    I think you wont find too much support for loan forgiveness programs on this board. I think whenever the topic comes up on the board people have often mentioned that its not guaranteed to be around forever. I bet a search of the forums will confirm my experience. I do agree that is sucks for those that were relying on them. However, I always found the program overly inclusive of the type of agency that counted. I think it would be wiser to narrow the scope of what qualifies for loan forgiveness.

    As a socially liberal person that often aligns with the democratic party, I am fully in support of these changes. As mentioned before, the increase in easy credit (loans for college) has increased access but also has made tuition skyrocket and lead to burdensome debt and proliferation of poor universities.
     
  12. Pragma

    Pragma Neuropsychologist
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    PSLF has always had in the fine print that it is was not guaranteed to be around and that the borrower takes out anything at their own risk. That said, they also provided a lot of financial advice - to maximize the benefit to try to pay as little as possible (e.g., IBR). All indications seem to suggest that they will honor PSLF after a certain date and then it will be eliminated. Thus, there is some degree of "grandathering" that seems to be in the proposals, unless I am missing something. But that should help some students that are in the middle of a program. Who knows what the final version of the bill will look like.
     
  13. psych.meout

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    And how does this not apply to you as well? You want PSLF to stay in place, because it benefits you and your husband, but it is paid for on the backs of everyone else?

    What about people like me who spent several years working to get the experience necessary to be competitive for fully-funded programs and deferring the instant gratification and fulfillment that would have been provided by unfunded programs?

    Why should we have to pay for you and your husband who made the decision to attend unfunded grad programs?

    You made the decisions to not "quit your lives to go through funded programs." You didn't feel like making the sacrifices early on like the rest of us, so, guess what, you're going to have to make much larger sacrifices later on. It's almost like actions have consequences and you were hoping that everyone else would shoulder them so you wouldn't have to.
     
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  14. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    I am no fan of unfunded programs and opposed to the FSPS model in general. I have shared on here that while I did not take on an enormous amount of debt for my funded program, it was still enough to impact my quality of life and I am forever grateful for EDRP. That being said, I think at times this forum is simplistic about the debt issue. There are so many problems with higher education. I don't believe that astronomical debt is the answer, but I fear that if it's a straight go if you can afford it model, we will end up with only wealthy, advantaged people in positions to treat mental health from a psychologist perspective.
     
  15. psych.meout

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    Isn't ironic that you're chastising us for being 'simplistic" about debt, yet phrase this issue as a false choice between the status quo EDRP/PSLF remaining and "only wealthy, advantaged people in positions to treat mental health from a psychologist perspective" if they end or are reformed?
     
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  17. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    Did you read my post at all or just become reactionary? There is absolutely no indication in it of the "false choice" you cite.
    These issues are complex. That is the point I was making. It is not an issue of PSLF, debt, or the poorer get shut out. What it is, in my opinion, is a problem that starts in early childhood with advantage vs. disadvantage. We are one of the most difficult wealthy countries in the world for class mobility.
    And pray tell, what is wrong with EDRP? If it is offered as a job incentive, what on earth problem would you have with it?
     
  18. foreverbull

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    I've tried to argue similarly when student loans come up and it's met with "should've pulled yourself up by your bootstraps." For any folks who took Sociology of Wealth, Power, and Privilege in undergrad, you'd know how difficult it is in this country to be upwardly mobile. Education is one of the only viable ways to cross class lines, but there are several issues that disadvantage poor and/or minority students in the U.S., starting with things as simple as adequate childhood nutrition, knowledge of types of funding/scholarships/deadlines, exposure to different careers, to to understanding how to be competitive in interviews...all the way up to knowing how much your graduate education will cost you beforehand by calculating all possible costs and calculating on your own how much your loans will capitalize as you sit in school unable to pay them off. People often forget how low SES or being an ethnic/racial minority can mean lack of information/support in how to succeed in all walks of white middle class Western educational settings/career settings, not just financial poverty for low SES folks, but poverty of information/resources for low SES folks and minorities. Of course this won't apply to everyone's experience, but are factors that are often overlooked in these discussions.

    I would also suggest that factors like constantly rising tuition, rising cost of living, and stagnant wages/less secure job futures contribute to the issue.

    I agree that it's too simplistic to reduce student loan discussions to poor choices and no other possible factors, especially when it serves to maintain the status quo.
     
  19. sb247

    sb247 Doer of things

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    It is not difficult in terms of odds to be upwardly mobile, those with parents in the lower two quartiles of income in this country are more than 50% likely to move up a quartile
     
  20. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    I have had a similar experience on these forums. I used the word "simplistic" in my post because I have also found that debate points (as illustrated above) are boiled down to a single, often twisted, interpretation and then this twisted version is argued against. Easily, I might add, because the twisted version is a poor argument that was not actually posited. In one forum, I argued something as you noted in your post and was told that I was condescending toward people of lower SES or ethnic/racial minority status by suggesting that they were unable to make sound financial decisions! The nuance is stripped by a negatively twisted Occam's razor approach to debate. Student loans, debt, class mobility... these are complicated issues. If they weren't, there wouldn't be so much discussion about them. There are no easy answers. Just like in weight loss, it's not calories in/calories out.
     
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  21. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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  22. sb247

    sb247 Doer of things

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  23. foreverbull

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    It's all relative. Multiple studies show Canada and Western European nations have greater rates of upward mobility and lower range in income (less income inequality) than the U.S.; can't recall authors offhand.

    More interestingly, Chetty et al found that absolute mobility decreased by 40% since the 1940s (1 in 10 born in the 1940s could expect to make the same or less than parents at the same age, and for those born in the 1980s, fully half made less or the same as their parent's cohort).
    https://scholar.harvard.edu/files/hendren/files/abs_mobility_paper.pdf

    When you consider that housing prices/rent inflated far higher than general inflation over the past few decades (Here’s how much housing prices have skyrocketed over the last 50 years) and
    same for medical costs and tuition, it's no longer impressive or as hopeful that only 50% made at least somewhat more than their parent at the same age.
     
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  24. erg923

    erg923 Regional Clinical Officer, Cenpatico National

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    I'll be honest, I dont care about any of this stuff within the specific thread. It can be done, and life isn't as easy for some as it is for others. This is just the bell curve. I am willing give help along the way, of course (food stamps, subsidized housing, grants, community volunteering/outreach programs, etc)...but this was not really what the OP question was reflecting. It was really about naive and uninformed financial decision making, not about academic debates about what race/ethnicity is more likely to be 'upwardly mobile."
     
  25. sb247

    sb247 Doer of things

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    You’re all over the place, I showed you you were wrong about mobility as more than half the lowest quintile figures it out

    Now you want to talk about income inequality which isn’t even a bad thing and kid spending power relative to parents (which I would propose is largely caused by govt intervention to begin with). We can continue if you want but it might be easier to let the thread continue on the main topic
     
  26. foreverbull

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    I countered your statistic with a separate study about upward mobility rates and discussed it; I briefly mentioned the US lower mobility rates and inflation....and you seem to have gotten overwhelmed by the information..."all over the place" when I was shown to be "wrong!"

    How dare I offer different studies and different views and consider multiple factors all at one time! The nerve!
     
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  27. WisNeuro

    WisNeuro Board Certified Neuropsychologist
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    You guys could always take a social mobility thread over to the SPF, where it belongs.
     
  28. Pragma

    Pragma Neuropsychologist
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    I would argue that one should think about what their income is going to be after they complete a degree program before making a decision about what kind of debt to take on. But maybe that is too outlandish of an idea?
     
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  29. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    Of course it's not too outlandish of an idea. But there are people who have no template for that. Blame their parents, or the absence of their parents, or whatever you want, but they don't have that knowledge. I was fortunate. I played my cards right, and when I returned to undergraduate I had an amazing adviser who laid all of this out for me and I did not make a disastrous financial decision. I give myself credit for that; I went back to school, I sought out mentors, I took advice and did not become narrowly focused on one goal. So my personal merit was part of it. But I also was in a position to take advantage of that resource, so there was that factor in it as well. The issue I have with how we talk about debt is the conflation of taking personal responsibility with blame. I agree with the posters who have expressed that the OP's statement about not being able to sacrifice for grad school, or whatever it was he/she said, is difficult to stomach for those of us who did make that sacrifice (I did). But I also think there is context to these choices, and that needs to be talked about as well. The discussion of class mobility is, in my opinion, related to the topic because that's a huge part of why people take on enormous debt for education. In my father's day, they joined the military. My father joining the military and getting the GI Bill is probably why I am financially stable today (knock on wood, it can always be lost).
     
  30. WisNeuro

    WisNeuro Board Certified Neuropsychologist
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    I don't really but into the whole ignorance of consequences argument, personally. It's not really an excuse for a poor outcome. Maybe it takes something from intentional malfeasance to simple negligence, but personal responsibility has to be part of the discussion if we're going to include social mobility as part of the discussion. I'm also not as sold on the social mobility issue as a explanation as to why people take out enormous loads of debt that they cannot possibly pay back. There are dozens, if not hundreds, of other occupations, or routes to an occupation, that can increase someone's financial mobility over and above that of their parents (assuming that are <middle class). It's not as if this is the only path that a person can take, even within the mental health field. It's that single-mindedness "I need to be a doctor" that drives people to diploma mills and waters down what it actually means to be a doctor.
     
  31. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    Again, I don't see it as a binary: personal responsibility vs. no blame at all, social mobility vs. wanting to be called doctor. I think these are all factors in the horrible financial situation that can result from graduating from certain programs, and all should be discussed. I think this forum can serve - and has served - as a warning to those considering taking out these levels of debt, which is great. I also think that at times the conversation isn't constructive when it's limited to only blaming bad choices. It's more complicated than that.
     
  32. WisNeuro

    WisNeuro Board Certified Neuropsychologist
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    I don't think it's all that much more complicated than that in many of the situations. Getting into reputable programs takes a lot of hard work, and many sacrifices. Some people are not willing to do one, or both, in many cases and know that they can simply give their money to a mill. I'll grant that some people are simply misinformed and get bad advice, but they still have to take much of the blame there. It's part of our own responsibility to look at the options, crunch the numbers, and make a sound decision. If someone does not wish to make a sound decision, I'm fine with them doing so, I would just rather not subsidize that decision. Granted, there are plenty of things I would rather not subsidize politically, looking at you bloated military budget, but that's a different can of worms.
     
  33. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    I guess we'll have to disagree, which is fine. I don't think it's a matter of simply being misinformed. I also think it's difficult for people who have grown up with a basic sense of money to understand how foreign of a concept that can be to people who did not grow up with that. I count myself as one of the people who had little to no concept of how to manage money, or what interest meant, or how difficult it is to get out from under the interest on a loan. I went to an informational session of a FSPS and was given a handout about loan payoff public service options, and also told that no graduate of the program was having trouble paying off his or her debt. Something smelled funny to me, as did the heavy recruitment I started to get from another FSPS. No one, I thought at the time, could want me that bad, all self-flattery aside. So I looked into it further, got research experience, got some posters, made myself a good applicant and got into a funded program. But while I grew up with no real framework for money, I also grew up with enough of a leg up that I could seek out and find resources to help me. These programs, in my opinion, should also be held accountable for what they tell students in terms of debt. I don't want to subsidize them, either. But I know what it's like to be given the big sell.
     
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  34. WisNeuro

    WisNeuro Board Certified Neuropsychologist
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    I'm all about holding these programs accountable. Which is why many of want them either eliminated, capped, or held to some number that actually corresponds to a median salary for any given profession. most of us had to deal with the hard sell on certain things. And many of us were able to also get grad school done with minimal or no debt, despite coming from a lower than middle class SES background and little to no financial help from family.

    So, let's make some societal changes. Maybe mandate some financial literacy education in K-12 schooling. But, also hold people accountable for their actions/decisions as well. Far too often we blame the "system" without actually taking any of the blame ourselves for the decisions we make.
     
  35. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    I would like them capped or eliminated.
    Of course a lot of us have been given a big sell, but there are factors that make a person vulnerable to the big sell - diathesis stress. I am from a lower than middle class SES and I completed school with some, but not crippling, debt. More than I should have had if I had made a few better choices. That is my responsibility and my problem. I also think I am luckier than most in terms of background.
    I agree that financial literacy should be taught in school, with examples. Not just some dry lecture, but a real economy with privileges, etc. I plan on doing that with my kids, and if they squander their resources, I will not bail them out.
    I dislike blaming ourselves or others for choices. I see it more as taking personal responsibility.
    Blame I reserve for those with nefarious intent, like many of the FSPS.
     
  36. WisNeuro

    WisNeuro Board Certified Neuropsychologist
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    It becomes blame when someone refuses to take personal responsibility and blames everyone/thing else in the situation.
     
  37. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    Yeah, I can see that. Still, I think it's important to discuss all the factors, and to try to preserve SES, racial and other diversity in our field - without ruining people's financial lives. To me, that starts in early childhood.
     
  38. WisNeuro

    WisNeuro Board Certified Neuropsychologist
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    I don't see how saddling people with astronomical levels of debt and promoting the proliferation of diploma mills helps to foster diversity in our field. I've seen this argument used before, but no one has ever actually shown how this is accomplished with the systems in question. It seems like just some talking point that is thrown around that no one actually understands.
     
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  39. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    To be clear: that is NOT my argument.
     
  40. Pragma

    Pragma Neuropsychologist
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    Sure there are other factors. But, presumably, with a 4 year undergraduate degree, one could have a basic understanding of the economy and financial literacy? One would hope? Being in your 20's or older and deciding that a $250,000 education sounds like a good plan when median salaries aren't above 6 figures?

    If we're going to blame anyone aside from the person themselves, I'd lay the blame to the government for making access to these substantial amounts of debt so attainable. There should be a tougher screening process that involves identifying compound interest figures, etc. to ensure that people are making an informed decision. It'd be great if they were dischargeable in bankruptcy too, because then the lenders wouldn't be backing loans that aren't going to yield a sustainable financial outcome.

    What I hear now in this thread are people saying that someone should blame society or their parents for not preparing them to read the fine print, and asking for advice if they don't understand the fine print. At some point, you are an adult and you make decisions as an adult.
     
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  41. sb247

    sb247 Doer of things

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    Just make the debt dischargeable with market rates of interest, then the lender shares the risk
     
  42. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    I'm just going to go ahead and paste what I wrote above in another comment:

    I used the word "simplistic" in my post because I have also found that debate points (as illustrated above) are boiled down to a single, often twisted, interpretation and then this twisted version is argued against. Easily, I might add, because the twisted version is a poor argument that was not actually posited.

    Please stop dumbing down what I say and then responding to it like that was my point.
     
  43. Pragma

    Pragma Neuropsychologist
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    First of all, I wasn't just talking about you. Second, what did I dumb down? You said that some people "have no template" for financial literacy and that you could blame certain entities (parents or "whatever you want" was how you phrased it). I disagree with the premise that people "have no template" when it comes to making a decision about taking out loans - particularly at the graduate school level because if you've got a bachelor's degree, you should have all sorts of "templates" when it comes to being an adult. I think that some people might choose to ignore the long-term implications or choose to not think about those things because they are not fun things to think about. But they are not passive - they have to take actions in order to obtain financial aid. This involves things like filling out a FAFSA, taking some entrance counseling, deciding on amounts, etc. In that process, they are presented with information about the financial implications of taking loans, and they actively make the decision to take them. It's similar to taking actions to make other types of purchases.

    I say that as someone who was once a 20-something that took out loans to help with cost-of-living during graduate school. No one in my family had ever taken out loans for education (blue collar), let alone gone to graduate school before. So did I have "no template"? Because I am pretty sure I had a brain and had to sign some paperwork saying that I was going to pay all of that money back. I'm not a fan of the monthly payment I make, but you won't hear me complaining about it.

    Are there other factors? Sure. I'm all for eliminating/litigating predatory programs and practices, beefing up the literacy hoops you have to jump through to get a loan, and making loans dischargeable in bankruptcy so that ridiculous amounts that make zero financial sense can't be easily taken. But personal responsibility is the biggest and most relevant factor in my view.
     
  44. str63

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    I also grew up no money (first generation college student) and I also knew to research something prior to committing to it. If someone is going into a doctorate program, I would argue that, like us, they should also be able to find resources to help them look into it. If someone can't do something as simple as find resources or ask someone for help, then perhaps they shouldn't be in a doctorate program to begin with. I think it's fine if someone chooses to take on that debt, but that's a choice.

    I do agree with you that these programs should be held accountable. I don't know what students are being told because I looked at the cost of an unfunded program and instantly decided that I was only going to graduate school if I was in a funded program because I didn't want to even entertain the idea of that much debt. So, if programs are being deceptive, something should be done. However, it doesn't take much to look online and figure out the costs. If someone wasn't able to do this ahead of time, then that's on them.
     
  45. darknecrosforte

    darknecrosforte SDN Lifetime Donor
    Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved

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    LOL
     
  46. erg923

    erg923 Regional Clinical Officer, Cenpatico National

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    Even as adults, we can all fall victim to doing/buying things that we want, whether they make financial sense at the time or not. However, I have found this to be the case with a new item (for myself, wive, children, house) where the downside is simply unwise/unnecessary credit card debt for a short while while.

    The magnitude of $ figures of we are talking about in this thread should, in and of themselves, make the decision quite obvious to even younger adults. And if it doesn't, I am apt to blame impulsivity and or emotional desperation rather than lack of rudimentary understanding of mathematics.
     
    #44 erg923, Dec 18, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2017
  47. smalltownpsych

    Psychologist

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    If you don't bail those kids out when they make poor financial decisions, how are they ever going to learn to be wealthy bankers and wall street financiers?
    :cool:
     
  48. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    To respond:
    It makes no difference if you were talking just to me or talking to a group; you are addressing me so you are simplifying my argument.
    You dumbed down what I was saying when you stated this: "What I hear now in this thread are people saying that someone should blame society or their parents for not preparing them to read the fine print, and asking for advice if they don't understand the fine print. At some point, you are an adult and you make decisions as an adult." I am in no way, shape or form stating that society and/or parents are to blame for these decisions. What I am saying is that people do not always have the background to understand concepts like interest or compounding interest. I am saying this loan issue is more complex than it is painted on this forum. I am also saying that large loans for this degree are problematic.

    Have you filled out the FAFSA and taken the entrance counseling? Do you really think that going through that explains the concept of interest?
     
    #46 Psycycle, Dec 18, 2017
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2017
  49. Pragma

    Pragma Neuropsychologist
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    It is not rocket science. What background do you need to understand it? Your point is exceedingly vague when you try to argue that some people don’t have the “background” to have the financial literacy to decide about taking out loans for school. Can you describe what said background is? Many of us did not grow up with bankers for parents, but somehow have managed to understand the concept.
     
  50. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    Understanding how loans work requires more than a "rudimentary understanding of mathematics." I had far, far more than this when I considered the FSPS route and severe debt. I was, in fact, a licensed stockbroker at that time although I did not work as one. But I did not understand what interest really meant, and how it worked, until I faced it in loan repayment. It's not simple.
     
  51. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    Interest and compounding interest, as an example. These are not easy concepts to understand. I passed the series 7 and I did not understand how that would affect loan repayment until I was in loan repayment. I did not fully understand what a 6.8% interest rate does on paying principle until I went through it. Also, foreverbull explained quite a bit of the concept of this background earlier in the thread. I quote:

    "Education is one of the only viable ways to cross class lines, but there are several issues that disadvantage poor and/or minority students in the U.S., starting with things as simple as adequate childhood nutrition, knowledge of types of funding/scholarships/deadlines, exposure to different careers, to understanding how to be competitive in interviews...all the way up to knowing how much your graduate education will cost you beforehand by calculating all possible costs and calculating on your own how much your loans will capitalize as you sit in school unable to pay them off. People often forget how low SES or being an ethnic/racial minority can mean lack of information/support in how to succeed in all walks of white middle class Western educational settings/career settings, not just financial poverty for low SES folks, but poverty of information/resources for low SES folks and minorities. Of course this won't apply to everyone's experience, but are factors that are often overlooked in these discussions."
     
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  52. Psycycle

    Psycycle Psychologist

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    I worked with Wall Street stockbrokers... don't get me started. I'd like to preserve my own outrage for them.
     

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