Non-Trad MD/JD/MBA contemplating Military Medicine Route

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Rutinni

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Here's where I am:

Former attorney (with several years work experience) went to med school as a dual MD/MBA. Interested in practicing clinical medicine and medical/hospital administration. Still deciding between EM and Crit Care, and looking to the future. Already have a family (two young kids), but they're flexible and willing to consider military family life. No prior military experience and would like to serve. Have a preference for Navy, but willing to consider other branches depending on circumstances. Would be looking at FAP or post-residency commissioning (assuming my application was accepted).

Aside from the general pros and cons of military medicine, is this worth considering? What does the path to military medical administration look like? Do I get any credit (rank, time in service, or billet) for either of my other degrees? Is this something the military would value, or is an MD an MD only?

I'm also aware that civilian medicine is pretty hierarchical as well... For those of you who have separated, does military medicine's leadership training/experience translate into the civilian world, or do you have to start at the bottom of the chain again?

Appreciate your thoughts!

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Rutinni
Your precisely the person the military is looking for. If I were you I would apply for the military match. Go transitional or Flight surgery practice a few years then try to go back to milmed residency, then advance and pick up greater collateral duties . You have all the synthetic knowledge with your MBA/JD background. The military is full of instructions and antequeted policies that need a critical eye like yours going over them and determining usefullness from a business/legal/medical perspective.
Those who have transitioned out usually have no issues going to the civillian world besides the pace. In my field(anesthesia) 90% get out and do just fine in the civillian world. Wish you the best of luck. BTW military medicine is the pinnacle of heirarchichal medicine.
 
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caveat emptor.

it would make sense with your background and desire for them to utilize you as you would like-- however just because you have a JD/MBA does not mean you will get to use those talents. the issue comes down to rank-- you'll be low man on the totem pole as an O-3, and you could have experience as a CEO at a fortune 500 company and you will never be "in charge" or get ahead of a lesser qualified O-4 or O-5. you may be sent to the hinterlands like other GMO's or have a duty station that is all clinical. later in your career (O4 and above) after you get some time under your belt though i think you'd have a good time of it-- most people are not going to be actively looking at the career path you are, and you won't have much in the way of competition. *then* your other degrees will definitely hold weight-- especially for OIC, DCCS type positions.

good luck

--your friendly neighborhood latin using caveman
 
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missed your "post residency" comment. you may be able to come in as an O4 in that case. but early on the deck is still stacked against you due to the other people with longer military resumes.

--your friendly neighborhood reading comprehension needs improvement caveman
 
caveat emptor.

it would make sense with your background and desire for them to utilize you as you would like-- however just because you have a JD/MBA does not mean you will get to use those talents. the issue comes down to rank-- you'll be low man on the totem pole as an O-3, and you could have experience as a CEO at a fortune 500 company and you will never be "in charge" or get ahead of a lesser qualified O-4 or O-5. you may be sent to the hinterlands like other GMO's or have a duty station that is all clinical. later in your career (O4 and above) after you get some time under your belt though i think you'd have a good time of it-- most people are not going to be actively looking at the career path you are, and you won't have much in the way of competition. *then* your other degrees will definitely hold weight-- especially for OIC, DCCS type positions.

good luck

--your friendly neighborhood latin using caveman

He really needs to be at least a 05 (LTC) and above to get into the leadership or command in a hospital administrative settings. Most DCCS or 04s and above. He could be clinic or section chief as an 04 in smaller MEDDACs but his JD/MBA experience would be greatly underutilized in that role.
 
Rutinni
Your precisely the person the military is looking for. If I were you I would apply for the military match. Go transitional or Flight surgery practice a few years then try to go back to milmed residency, then advance and pick up greater collateral duties.

You can only go into the military match if you are an HPSP student. FAP is for civilian residencies beginning with PGY-2.



missed your "post residency" comment. you may be able to come in as an O4 in that case.

This is not the case. You cannot enter as an O4. You either enter as an O-1 as an HPSP student, then promotion to O-3 upon graduation, or you receive a direct commission to O-3 in PGY-2 with FAP, or you receive a direct commission to O-3 post residency.
 
You can only go into the military match if you are an HPSP student. FAP is for civilian residencies beginning with PGY-2.


This is not the case. You cannot enter as an O4. You either enter as an O-1 as an HPSP student, then promotion to O-3 upon graduation, or you receive a direct commission to O-3 in PGY-2 with FAP, or you receive a direct commission to O-3 post residency.

Actually you can apply to mil GME as a civilian, but you wouldn't get it except in the very rarest of situations, as in powerball lotto odds.

The other statement is also incorrect. Direct accessions can be granted advance credit/promotion.


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Actually you can apply to mil GME as a civilian, but you wouldn't get it except in the very rarest of situations, as in powerball lotto odds.

The other statement is also incorrect. Direct accessions can be granted advance credit/promotion.


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Can you provide a link of sorts that states that? I've never found anything that explicitly says it (maybe that's why I didn't catch it?).
 
He's right. The civilian to GME rules are in the bumednote for GME selection (1524 I think).

Constructive credit for school requires a health care related degree. ~1 year for every 2 years of school. You can also get credit for time spent practicing before joining but you'd have to contact pers to find that ref.
 
I've never seen or heard of anyone commissioning at O-4 or higher, which is why I'm curious. I'm a service member myself who has searched various options and have never found that or seen that in the last 8 years. Bachelors = O1, masters = O2, doctorate = O3. Doctorate plus 10 years practice is still O3 to begin with, just like a PA with 10 years practice is an O2 to begin with.

I've spoke to multiple healthcare recruiters for all branches at various locations due to a move, and have yet to hear that before just now.

So if there is information regarding that published anywhere, please share. If this is your experience, as in you commissioned at O4 yourself, please let me know who to speak with.

And constructive credit isn't specific to healthcare though. Other professional fields receive it too.
 
A pulm/cc doc commissioned as an O5 while I was a resident ( got passed over for O6 and got out). A current AD o6 cardiologist commissioned as an O4. I can think of a couple others. Neither were prior service.

You want a reference, call the detailing shop at PERS. Oh and you're welcome for the other ref cause it's right.

I'm not going to give their names out on the internet but it's reflected in their bios.
 
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I went to officer basic with a direct commission triple boarded EM/IM/CCM doc who had been in practice for years before deciding to join. He came in as an O4, and I believe he said he was going to the next O5 selection board the next year.

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A pulm/cc doc commissioned as an O5 while I was a resident ( got passed over for O6 and got out). A current AD o6 cardiologist commissioned as an O4. I can think of a couple others. Neither were prior service.

You want a reference, call the detailing shop at PERS. Oh and you're welcome for the other ref cause it's right.

I'm not going to give their names out on the internet but it's reflected in their bios.

I went to officer basic with a direct commission triple boarded EM/IM/CCM doc who had been in practice for years before deciding to join. He came in as an O4, and I believe he said he was going to the next O5 selection board the next year.

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I'm glad this thread was started. Like I said, I just hadn't come across these cases. I'll keep this in mind and look into it a bit. Thanks!
 
Oh and you're welcome for the other ref cause it's right.

Never said anything particularly was wrong. Simply stated it wasn't my experience and hadn't come across anything of the such, hence why I was asking where you came across these instances/info.

So thanks for the info
 
Never said anything particularly was wrong. Simply stated it wasn't my experience and hadn't come across anything of the such, hence why I was asking where you came across these instances/info.

So thanks for the info

I have met a few practicing docs who commissioned as O4 or higher. In fact, one of the founders for sdn who's a family medicine doc commissioned as an O4 at the height of the wars in the Middle East.
 
I've never seen or heard of anyone commissioning at O-4 or higher, which is why I'm curious. I'm a service member myself who has searched various options and have never found that or seen that in the last 8 years. Bachelors = O1, masters = O2, doctorate = O3. Doctorate plus 10 years practice is still O3 to begin with, just like a PA with 10 years practice is an O2 to begin with.

I've spoke to multiple healthcare recruiters for all branches at various locations due to a move, and have yet to hear that before just now.

So if there is information regarding that published anywhere, please share. If this is your experience, as in you commissioned at O4 yourself, please let me know who to speak with.

And constructive credit isn't specific to healthcare though. Other professional fields receive it too.

A final note to this thing. It doesn't happen in other fields. In fact, I haven't seen this occurrence in other medical fields. However, when it comes to physician, it's a different ballgame.
 
I have met a few practicing docs who commissioned as O4 or higher. In fact, one of the founders for sdn who's a family medicine doc commissioned as an O4 at the height of the wars in the Middle East.

A final note to this thing. It doesn't happen in other fields. In fact, I haven't seen this occurrence in other medical fields. However, when it comes to physician, it's a different ballgame.


Thanks everyone - I was under the wrong impression. I appreciate the additional info and the links!
 
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