NYU vs Maryland

[JohnnieBlue]

Sorry to bug you all with one of these "VS" threads. I'm down to 10 days and don't know where to go. Maryland is my state school and I think I have a good chance to do well there. Of course its much much cheaper. NYU on the other hand has more of a national reputation and would probably be better to get into some competitve residencies. Also it's in NY which is really cool. Help! Ah!!!! 10 days left!!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Benjo]

UMd has a really poor reputation, but I don't know much about NYU. It isn't a powerhouse, for sure, but it has to be better than MD. You'll have to work extremely hard to distingish yourself enough there (UMD) to land a high-powered residency. Whether this is important to you decision depends on what kind of medicine you want to practice (how competitive the residency is), and whther you care about such things. Plus, Baltimore sucks (born and raised).

 

[kiwicat]

I have always heard that Maryland has a VERY strong reputation, actually. It has a high ranking and I"ve heard that students are very happy there. It absolutely is NOT true that you will get a better residency if you go to a 'better' school. I work for an orthopaedic surgeon (one of the most competitive residencies) and she said that where you go to med school is really not important in getting a residency -- it's your class rank and board scores. So, I would choose based on money and location.

 

[MGHMD2B]

I have quite a few friends from undergrad who are from MD and are now residents at MGH. I also met a bunch through my visits over the last few months, two of them are neurosurgery residents in the #1 Neurosurgery program in the world!!

They all worked with a well known surgeon/researcher, Dr. Simard
http://neuroscience.umaryland.edu/faculty.asp?FacultyID=40

Trust me I went to a bigtime NY school and I think it hurt some of my classmates because its harder to shine. Plus if you are instate you will so have a mercedes sooner than us in major debt.

 

[Benjo]

Funny you should mention neurosurgery, because a lot of my information comes from a neurosurgery faculty member at Hopkins who said they hadn't even interviewed a UMd applicant in years. So, I guess both our anecdotal info is biased. But, I would still go for NYU--UMd suffers from a massive ineriority complex with its big brother down the road.

 

[labangel]

Funny you should mention neurosurgery, because a lot of my information comes from a neurosurgery faculty member at Hopkins who said they hadn't even interviewed a UMd applicant in years. So, I guess both our anecdotal info is biased. But, I would still go for NYU--UMd suffers from a massive ineriority complex with its big brother down the road.

If you don't go to MD, then you are only speculating that MD has an inferiority complex...MD is a very strong school is its own right...it just tends to be overshadowed the name JHU. 1/4 physicians practicing in MD graduated from here, so it obviously can't be all bad. Also, I can speak from experience that the students are really great. But, on the other hand, I have friends at NYU who really enjoy it. There's no reason that you cannot get a competitive residency coming out of MD and you won't have as much debt. And trust me, this becomes more of a factor later than you can realize now...

 

[LetMeFixYou]

I think hopkins bein down the road is for the better. In NY there are so many schools and in MD?... TWO

That means that there are more opportunities for MD students and also your chances of getting a competitive residency are much much better since there is a geographic component to residency selection. Just think about it, could they take all NYers, NO, so being from MD will make you more unique and add a competitive component.

I also was a summer researcher in a URM program at the NIH and it seemed like a big chunk of students would go to do research and rotations at the NIH and Walter Reede something you could never do in NYC.

Both seem so great but as someone who had the option to apply early to nyu and didn't trust me, go where you can save money. Now im trying to figure out this AMCAS so I can apply to the good old SUNYs.

 

[terpgirl]

If it were me, and this is coming from a girl who lives in Maryland and attends Maryland (College Park), I'd go for NYU. I like DC and the whole area and convience, and I love NY as well.

My orthopedic surgeon went to Maryland and she's a genious at Hopkins. I never even knew there was a MD school of medicine even though I drove by it every time I drive home from Hopkins... just thought it was a state funded hospital and nothing else. If you're looking for emergency medicine, that's the ONLY reason I'd ever attend Maryland.

I have major beefs aout how Maryland's system in general handles problems. B eprpared for a lot of BS and garbage if anything goes wrong.

DONT' WORRY ABOUT THE MONEY. Go where you're gonna be happy. My parents told me the same with undergrad (and I didn't listen so now I'm in my own personal hell). A few thousand dollars is worth the happiness.

-Liz

 

[bigbaubdi]

Sorry to bug you all with one of these "VS" threads. I'm down to 10 days and don't know where to go. Maryland is my state school and I think I have a good chance to do well there. Of course its much much cheaper. NYU on the other hand has more of a national reputation and would probably be better to get into some competitve residencies. Also it's in NY which is really cool. Help! Ah!!!! 10 days left!!

I actually withdrew my application to NYU when I got accepted to UMD. Residency positions are slanted towards particular regions. The fact that UMD is so close to Johns Hopkins is a big plus for UMD students. If you do well at UMD, then you stand a decent shot at getting a residency spot at Johns Hopkins Hospital.

Also there is a tremendous amount of research going on at UMD - UMD and NYU have virtually the same amount of NIH funding. UMD also has the added advantage of being close to NIH and Hopkins.

 

[bigbaubdi]

Plus, Baltimore sucks (born and raised).

Couldn't disagree more. Baltimore has a number of different wonderful neighborhoods - Fells Point, Canton, Hamden, Inner Harbor, Federal Hill, etc...

Baltimore is not NYC or SF but it can be a wonderful, liveable city if you are willing to give it a chance

 

[Benjo]

Couldn't disagree more. Baltimore has a number of different wonderful neighborhoods - Fells Point, Canton, Hamden, Inner Harbor, Federal Hill, etc...

Baltimore is not NYC or SF but it can be a wonderful, liveable city if you are willing to give it a chance

That is true--but, I am coming from a completely different perspective. Have you ever lived in Baltimore? I doubt it. Having lived in Baltimroe throughout my childhood, high school, and now one year after college, I can honestly say, the only thing that would have kept me here is Hopkins, and their love of me did not match mine of them. ANyway, Baltimore can be good for med school, you're right, but mainly because of all the crack/heroin addicts you get that contribute to many secondary (and primary) pathologies--good learning. Wonderful is hyperbolic--liveable is more accurate (at least at our financial level).

 

[bigbaubdi]

That is true--but, I am coming from a completely different perspective. Have you ever lived in Baltimore? I doubt it.

Nope, I have been living in Mount Washington since I was 2, went to school in Pikesville, went to Hopkins undergrad, and am now working at Hopkins hospital.

ANyway, Baltimore can be good for med school, you're right, but mainly because of all the crack/heroin addicts you get that contribute to many secondary (and primary) pathologies--good learning. Wonderful is hyperbolic--liveable is more accurate (at least at our financial level).

Does Baltimore have its share of social problems? Of course it does. Do other cities have their share of social problems? Of course, they do.

But as a future med doctor, I would like to do my part in alleviating the health problems of the community that has been so generous to me.

 

[Kalel]

Go to Maryland! NYU is too expensive for most people, especially when you add the cost of living in NYC. It's a good school, but it's rep isn't that much greater then Maryland's. I'd describe it as equivalent in some departments. Baltimore is a pretty bad city when you compare it to NYC, but you can get a pretty decent apartment in the city within walking distance of the med school for the same price of some tiny studio apartment in NYC.

 

[Benjo]

bigbaubdi-I could have spared myself that embarassment by just checking your profile. Well, that is your opinion. Of course all cities have their problems, but you have to admit (this is not opinion), that Baltimore's drug problems exceed all other cities of comparable size. Anyway, I give up.

 

[CUEMS-MD]

Go to Maryland! NYU is too expensive for most people, especially when you add the cost of living in NYC. It's a good school, but it's rep isn't that much greater then Maryland's. I'd describe it as equivalent in some departments. Baltimore is a pretty bad city when you compare it to NYC, but you can get a pretty decent apartment in the city within walking distance of the med school for the same price of some tiny studio apartment in NYC.

AMEN!! come to Maryland, I'll be there too. not only do we have the best crab cakes in the world, we are no time from DC, and have to be the greatest spring/summer/fall city.

I actually turned down nyu for family reasons since i want to be back close to home. but when i started crunching numbres i realized how nuts i would be to go there. it is so much money to get the EXACT same degree, MD. i dont understand how people turn down uc's or any state schools for overpriced privates.

but i dont think you can go wrong with either but i think MD offers the same if not more. and please come i want new friends

 

[priyapriya]

and please come i want new friends

No worries CUEMS-MD, I'll be at UMD this Fall

 

[elias514]

How important is prestige to you? NYU is more prestigious than UMaryland.

Does this fact mean that NYU offers a superior education? Probably not.

Does NYU's prestige mean that a medical degree from NYU will land you a more prestigious residency? Probably, but NOT necessarily so. If you look at the U Maryland's match list for 2004, you'll see some very impressive matches and, of course, not everyone at NYU matches at top-notch programs. Something else to keep in mind is that more prestigious residency programs do not always translate into superior training--there are several threads in the graduate medical forums regarding this very issue. For instance, community general surgery programs tend to produce more technically skilled surgeons than academic ones (do a search in graduate residency forums if you don't believe me); however, graduates of academic programs are much more likely to become academics, which is more prestigious than private practice (but surprisingly, the income of academics is considerably lower than their colleagues in private practice).

The bottom line is that NYU has a stronger national reputation, but you will pay dearly for this prestige (perhaps 100K more in debt). This prestige may not benefit you in any significant way, esp. if you're exceptionally bright. Gifted students with a solid work ethic will probably land a top residency out of any good state school and they will do so with considerably less debt than their private school peers. Overall, the quality of education at both institutions is equivalent--I just don't buy the argument that the education at prestigious insitutions is significantly better than that of average med schools. I've been told by physicians, both academic and private practice, that med school is what you make of it. You can get a stellar education at an unranked school or a crappy education at a top school; further, great docs come out of no-name schools and crappy docs come out of great schools.


For me, prestige is fairly important, so I'm willing to pay the extra bucks for it. But that's just my personal preference (it just makes me feel good, that's all). Just ask yourself how important prestige is to you? Is it worth an additional $100,000 of debt? Do you need the prestige boost to meet your goals, or can you reach them without it?

 

[CUEMS-MD]

No worries CUEMS-MD, I'll be at UMD this Fall

who else is going to be friends with me and priyapriya?

im going to be in baltimore this summer, we should have a get together with all us who are going

 

[bjolly]

who else is going to be friends with me and priyapriya?

im going to be in baltimore this summer, we should have a get together with all us who are going

Me, me! I'm in Baltimore already, so I'd be up for a get together.

 

[biffbuddy]

I am up for a get together as well - i just got my apartment the other day - moving in june 5th!

ahhhhhhhhh!!!!

 

[priyapriya]

Count me in too for a get together!! Movin to Baltimore mid-June

 

[JohnnieBlue]

Thanks everyone for your input. I'm still weighing my options but now have a more clear head in the process. I'm in Baltimore this weekend to take a second look at Maryland, so we'll see how that goes. I'll probably go to class on Monday to check it out (although a first year friend of mine told me that they're in the middle of some pretty boring endocrine lectures). So, if you see someone in the back of the room just half paying attention, come on over and say hi!

 

[Mirror Form]

I'm a med student at U of MD right now and I'd suggest you come down here instead of NYU. The only good reason I can think of to go to NYU over MD is location. If I could spend my 20's at any city in the world, it would definitely be NYC! Baltimore, if fun too, but it just doesn't compare to how much fun I have in New York. Of course, it's also 10x cheaper to go out in baltimore and to live in baltimore. So tuition is only part of what you'll be saving money on. Girls are another big plus of going to NYC. When I hang out there and tell girls I'm a med student at bars, they get all excited and I fell like some big stud. Whereas in Baltimore, the girls are like "well I'm joining the fire dept, pansy."

 

[JohnnieBlue]

Girls are another big plus of going to NYC. When I hang out there and tell girls I'm a med student at bars, they get all excited and I fell like some big stud. Whereas in Baltimore, the girls are like "well I'm joining the fire dept, pansy."

I definately hear what your saying there, but when I tried to explain this to my wife as a plus to living in NYC, she didn't quite go for it. Oh well...

 

[mcwmark]

Hi everyone -

I just wanted to chime in regarding the whole reputation vs money debate. I would say if you're dead set on entering one of the hypercompetitive specialties, i.e. Dermatology, Radiation Oncology, Plastics, you will have a leg up with your school's reputation -- only because when you come around applying for residency, there will be 3 applicants to 1 spot, and when everyone's numbers look the same, pedigree will influence where you match.

All other specialties will depend much more on your board scores, grades, letters of recommendation -- all of which depend on you and your own motivation to do well. Of course, that's the $100k question, but if I were the original poster, I'd head to Maryland.

On that note, I'm headed to maryland too this summer to start neurosurg residency. If you guys need advice with med school (or buy me a drink) look me up.

 

[JohnnieBlue]

I know plenty of people would love to be in my situation and I know how lucky I am, but I need some more input. I went to visit Maryland and NYU again this week and was starting to formulate things in my mind more clearly. Then I get home and find an acceptance to Einstein in my mailbox and an offer for a $10g a year scholarship! It's so exciting, but more headache!! Please help!!!

 

[kaos]

Really, a $10g scholarship will barely make up for living expenses in NYC. It's not about the money, unless u'd be considered an out-of-stater coming to Maryland. In that case, go to NYU, cuz I heard a high dissatisfaction rate w/ people going to Einstein. Otherwise, come to B-more w/ us!

 

[Super Rob]

Ha ha ha! They always get you last minute with acceptances and scholarships. That's how the game is played.

Maybe I can be of some help: I'm also considering NYU and feeling awfully strong about it. I went back to visit about a week ago and am very curious how you felt and what you thought while you were there. Maybe we can bounce thoughts off one another. Did you stay with students? How was your experience?

Congrats on your recent acceptance. Let us know what you thought about NYU upon 2nd look.

 

[JohnnieBlue]

Maybe I can be of some help: I'm also considering NYU and feeling awfully strong about it. I went back to visit about a week ago and am very curious how you felt and what you thought while you were there. Maybe we can bounce thoughts off one another. Did you stay with students? How was your experience?

Since I'm married, i didn't stay overnight. I knew what the facilities were like, but I wanted to talk to more students and get some honest opinions. Here's what i gathered:

1) Everyone is very chilled out, almost too much so. The pass/fail gets rid of competition and is really great. Even for 3rd and 4th year, everyone gets a B+, A- or A. Two things about this concerns me: I'm not sure how anyone can stand out from the crowd when applying for residency. If everyone gets a pass, that pretty much leaves you with your board scores to distinguish yourself. Secondly, at this point I am still dreaming of getting AOA. I don't plan on being a gunner and walking over people, but I want to work hard and do well. NYU says that they don't take grades from the first two years into account, but I find this VERY hard to believe. There is no way that they can award such an honor based on some inflated clinical grades. On this point, most students agreed with me that they probably do look at your scores from the first two years. So much for pass/fail.

2) NYU does very well in the match. I saw this years match list and they placed in a lot of competitive residencies. What struck me more is how much they placed people in New York. I would enjoy med school in Maryland for 4 years, but I'm pretty sure I'd like to come back here for residency. Even further than the high NY placement was how many of their own students NYU hospital accepted. For neurosurgery for example, NYU hospital had 2 spots, both of which went to NYU med students.

3) As an offshoot of the last point, I found out that NYU students do very well on the boards. However, a 4th year student pointed out to me that NYU is known for taking "good test takers" since their average MCAT is higher than almost every other school outside of the top 10. This in turn may lead to students who do well merely because they are good at taking exams. I'm not sure how much I buy this argument, but its food for thought. Another thing is that NYU recently swapped microbiology to second year and Neuroscience to first year. The logic behind this is that there is 5 times more microbio on the boards than neuroscience, so they wanted to keep the info fresher in students' minds.

Those are some of the things on my mind from NYU. How about you Rob?

 

[Super Rob]

Excellent points!

*The students were very laid back, I agree. They also seemed to take a lot of the initiative in finding research and clinical opportunities, probably because the faculty and staff aren't there to hold your hands as they do at some other schools. It seems like the sort of place where if you want something, you've got to fight for it because nothing will happen on its own.

*I think the dorm is fine for a young, single guy like me

(for those contemplating on campus housing) Rubin is attached to the school, the kitchens are functional, and the bathrooms are small but clean by dormroom standards. Besides, the rent is cheap for Manhattan.

*I noticed the same trend with the NYU matchlist. Very impressive resutls, however, most of the graduates remain in New York City. I have talked to a few who matched with their first choice programs elsewhere (Boston and Colorado) and they didn't feel that coming from NYU put them at any sort of disadvantage. A lot of the first years I hung around with were originally from the city and talked like they wanted to remain there. The NYC/NYU-centric match list may very well reflect preference, as many graduates have no reason to go elsewhere.

*I too am worried about the Pass/Fail curriculum. If you are shooting for a non competitive residency, then it's just another plus. But every student I have talked to claims that number scores ARE taken into consideration when it comes down to the deans letter and AOA. They have to be. Moreso are the 3rd and 4th year "grades," even if there is some inflation. I think the school's aim is to facilitate a non-competitve atmosphere (as you put it) But I get the feeling that pass/fail was the students' idea and although the faculty okay'd it, they still have every intention of keeping track of grades. I would feel more comfortable if that WERE the case. I don't want to have to worry about getting all As in my classes (I'd rather see pass-pass-pass-pass on my report card, and rather than tell the truth, I'd like to tell my pals I "passed" when I get 100 and they get a 73... and vice versa) but I want to do my best and have that count for something.

*I think the NYU students would destroy the USMLE whether you put them through the NYU SOM curriculum or you gave them two years to party and have fun. These guys after all did very well on the MCAT and many of them went to hard-to-get-into undergraduate colleges. Someone who got into Harvard for undergrad and NYU for med school usually has standardized exams figured out. The MCAT was the first standardized exam I actually prepared for and did well on, so I'm a bit concerned if (hypothetically) all NYU students were evaluated on was a board score and a transcript that reads pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-A-A-A-A-A.

 

[BioMedResearch]

I'm a bit concerned if (hypothetically) all NYU students were evaluated on was a board score and a transcript that reads pass-pass-pass-pass-pass-A-A-A-A-A.

Good point!

 

[CUEMS-MD]

and look the day it's all come to a head, it's tied 50/50.

WOW

 

[godmode]

no doubt, definitely NYU!

 

[reSet]

i had a chance to interview at NYU and maryland and i would definitely choose nyu over maryland. plus its in NY ;-)

 

[MtsByondMts]

So, JohnnieBlue, what did you choose? I hope it's Maryland! I am really happy with my decision to go there. My older brother is a doc who has become jaded b/c he has poured so much $$$ into his training. Even before talking to his colleagues and getting nothing but positive comments about Maryland, he told me to withdraw from all my other schools and go to there. Not only am I going to be happier in the long run without all the debt, it's also a great school. Baltimore may seem ghetto, but its location and colorful (in terms of both ethnic diversity and personality) is exactly what makes it a great place to train. I know it may not be different from most inner city schools in that respect, but I think Baltimore is one of those cities that you learn to love if you give it a chance. It has its hidden gems.

Plus, the students AND faculty are really down-to-earth, humble, and not impressed with themselves (which is one of my big pet peeves).

Good luck with your decision!

 

[kito]

Girls are another big plus of going to NYC. When I hang out there and tell girls I'm a med student at bars, they get all excited and I fell like some big stud. Whereas in Baltimore, the girls are like "well I'm joining the fire dept, pansy."

This is awesome.

 

[JohnnieBlue]

MARYLAND IT IS!!!! I feel so happy so have this off of my head aleady. I'm gonna hold my waitlist spot in Columbia, but I'm not holding my breath on that one. It feels so good to finally be able to relax knowing where I'm going! See you all next year!

 

[Chirurgien]

MARYLAND IT IS!!!! I feel so happy so have this off of my head aleady. I'm gonna hold my waitlist spot in Columbia, but I'm not holding my breath on that one. It feels so good to finally be able to relax knowing where I'm going! See you all next year!

Yay! Congrats Johnnie! Glad you made your decision. Now that's one more spot open at NYU - come on folks, keep 'em comin'. (I'm anxiously waiting on that darn WL)

 

[MtsByondMts]

Yayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy! Congratulations! Great decision!