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O-Chem National Final?

Discussion in 'Pre-Pharmacy' started by pharmel, Apr 26, 2004.

  1. pharmel

    pharmel Senior Member
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    Is anyone taking the o-chem national final in a couple of weeks? We are aloud to have a cheat sheet with general reactions only. What are other schools doing? I'm interested in finding out from others who have already taken the test too... What is it like? What is the emphasis? Come on guys, what's the scoop! :D
     
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  3. shal

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    I'll be taking it in the first week of June. We won't be able to use a cheat sheet though. Do you know what is the average percentage your school expects after this exam?
     
  4. pharmel

    pharmel Senior Member
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    Our school grades out of 50 (there are aparently 70 questions on the exam) so 50 questions correct = 100%. We are taking the new version of the test though, so that number may change.
     
  5. imperial frog

    imperial frog Pharm.D
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    Taking it next week. :oops:
     
  6. Leah27

    Leah27 Senior Member
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    What is a national O-chem final? Is that some kind of standardized exam in orgo? I've never heard of such a thing! Why does it exist?
     
  7. illusions

    illusions Believe & U Can Succeed
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    i think they are talking about o-chem final in general
     
  8. TCB

    TCB live and let live
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    I am taking the test at my Community College in one week, however we are not allowed to have cheat sheet. The test is mostly about all you have learned in Orgo I & II.
     
  9. dgroulx

    dgroulx Night Pharmacist
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    There is a national exam. Our general chemistry final was the national exam. It allows your school to see how well their students do compared to the rest of the country. You can see where your weaknesses are and get a good evaluation on how well your faculty are doing.

    For orgo we didn't use the national test. The gen chem test was multiple choice and I'm not sure how you could have an orgo multiple choice test. Let us know after you take it. I'm curious.
     
  10. pharmel

    pharmel Senior Member
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    Yes, it is a standardized national organic chemistry exam. It exists (I guess) so schools can prove two things: 1) that their program is as good (or better) than the next school, and 2) that their students have reached predetermined goals set by the department. It is used as an assessment tool not only for students but departments. I don't know how, if at all, it is used on a national level. I don't know if our scores go to some supercomputer for statistical analysis at Harvard (or Ivy League school of your choice).
     
  11. off2skl

    off2skl Senior Member
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    I took it last semester. Not sure how it was graded and we were not allowed a formula sheet or anything. However, there is a studyguide through ACS. It cost $16 or so if I remember correctly.
     
  12. shal

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    Dana,
    A large part of our O Chem exams are multiple choice to get us used to the format for the national exam. They are also easier for professors to grade. Some synthesis problems are written. Its not too bad, for a synthesis problem you may be given 4 choices for the end product. They can be tricky at times! I just got my first midterm back yesterday and a large majority of the class made similar mistakes.
     
  13. sweetcalie08

    sweetcalie08 Senior Member
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    Niice. Our exams are 100% free-response. Writing out full mechanisms, giving reagents, deriving end products...all from memory and rarely is partial credit even given (even if one little itty bitty mistake is made). I am under the impression that most ochem courses are like this. Am I right? Or do many of you have some MC questions for ochem? Boy, I wish we had multiple choice. :cool: If most of you have MC questions, it's no wonder I'm having a lil trouble pulling that B!
     
  14. emogrrrrl

    emogrrrrl I like my freedom
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    Ours are also non-multiple choice. I like it better that way, b/c in our department they give partial credit which is so much better than getting counted off completely on a multiple choice exam. I love the written exam and am annoyed by the MC exam...although it is MUCH! easier than my orgo written exams. I am weird, I like how hard the class is. I specifically chose my prof b/c she's super hard rather than taking the other prof who takes questions right out of the book for exams. She's hard, but not impossible.
    I take the exam next week...our final is worth 2/3 the ACS and 1/3 written by our prof.
    I have that ACS book. It's helpful to review everything, rather than going back and reworking all of the book problems.
     
  15. shal

    7+ Year Member

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    Actually the first 2 quarters of O Chem were 1/3 mc 2/3 written. I took those last year. This year there are 100+ students in the class so they prefer to use mc. Luckily we do get partial credit.. I would hate to lose points just because I forgot one reagent. I have to say that mc is definately easier than the previous exams I took. I had a lot of time left to review in the end. On the other hand, you end up losing more points in mc.
     
  16. dgroulx

    dgroulx Night Pharmacist
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    Thanks for the explanation.

    For my orgo tests we were given a stack of white paper. The exam itself would have 5 mechanisms listed and we could choose any 3 to draw. We lost points for not putting in charges, or drawing full arrows when it should have been half arrows, etc.

    When it came to synthesis, we were given a starting product and an ending product. We had to draw all the intermediates with reagents used. If it could be done in 3 steps and it took you 7, you were marked off because you would be losing product in each additional step.

    We did have one easy section on each test for nomenclature. You had to write out the correct name of each compound. Some of those could get pretty long!
     
  17. jdpharmd?

    jdpharmd? Turning lead into gold
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    And I can pee farther than you and you and...

    Oh wait, isn't that what this thread has degenerated into? :confused:
     
  18. docmoogoo

    docmoogoo New Member

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    Has thou insulted your superior intellect? get a grip man, don't be so insulting and if you don't like the conversation-don't post.
     
  19. Roxicet

    Roxicet warning: I'm addictive!
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    :confused: "Has thou insulted your superior intellect?" = "have you insulted you superior intellect?" I think it's impossible for JD to insult himself. Try to figure out what the big words mean before you try to use them. :laugh: :thumbup: get a grip man, take things a little more lightly, and if you don't like the conversation-don't post. Hello pot, meet kettle.
     
  20. dgroulx

    dgroulx Night Pharmacist
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    No, I thought it was about seeing how different schools test you. I'm curious as to formats used at various schools. Personally, I find multiple choice tests much more difficult than essay tests. I'd rather get some partial credit then none at all.

    The worst of all are multiple item mulitiple choice, where your choices are 1) A & C 2) B & D 3) A, B & C, 4) D only 5) all of the above. You can concievably know 75% of the material but still end up with zero points.
     
  21. goheel

    goheel Senior Member
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    Do all the schools participate in this national test? I think my school, North Carolina State, doesn't.
     
  22. imperial frog

    imperial frog Pharm.D
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    I don't know...you can't get much smaller than "thou".
     
  23. 28657

    28657 Smile like you mean it
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    I agree with JDpharmd?, the thread (in my opinion) was turning into a "My class was harder than yours because yada yada yada". O-chem is a challenging class, independent of the test format.
     
  24. pmkinzero

    pmkinzero Junior Member

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    Does anyone know the exact study guide that is used for this test and where it can be found to buy? I have the test in june and would really like to study up a little because it will be graded, and is worth 1/2 of a test in my class, so it is weighted pretty heavily. Any help would be greatly appreciated
     
  25. imperial frog

    imperial frog Pharm.D
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    Oh...my...god!!!

    It was only 70 questions, but there were about 25 that I had absolutely no clue about. I will admit that I didn't study for it though...I needed only to get 2 right to get an A for the course.

    What does it cover? Everything from Org I and II.

    I imagine I scored about 50%
     
  26. pharmel

    pharmel Senior Member
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    What type of questions stumped you? I need a 50% to retain my A. I'm a little worried. Let us know when your grades are posted what the high score and average were. Thanks!
     
  27. nguyenkd

    nguyenkd Alone with my insanity.
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    i took the acs exam on weds and it wasn't that bad. it was a lot easier than the acs study guide. the hardest questions for me, off the top of my head, were quesions dealing with energy graphs and a few questions relating to biochem. i also had trouble with the time limit because i also had a written final and i wanted to be sure i finished both (which i didn't...$#&%$).

    i've heard that students tend to think the test was easy because they never go to pick up their failing grade. =/ i have a few friends who were on their way to making an A (90+ on on their tests) and got killed by the acs. i get my grade in a few hours so i'll let yall know!
     
  28. jwnduke

    jwnduke Senior Member
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    Well, how did it go? I have the test tomorrow, any suggestions?
     
  29. WVUPharm2007

    WVUPharm2007 imagine sisyphus happy
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    I took it last year and got a 61/70 - the test didn't count on our final grade because most of the class got below 45.
    My class average was 84% (no curve) for a "B" on my report card (nobody in the class received an "A" that semester because the teacher is clinically insane.)

    The test itself is pretty tough, I got most of my educated guesses right, so my score is probably inflated a little. They went heavily into SN1/2 and E1/2. Knowing the reation rules is important, too (i.e. NBS prefers: benzylic, allylic>tert>sec>primary>methyl)
     
  30. WVUPharm2007

    WVUPharm2007 imagine sisyphus happy
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  31. Betty'sBeast

    Betty'sBeast Senior Member
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    Has anyone taken the ACS exam lately? If so what did you get? I have to take it on wed. Any advice on what to focus on for a review?
     
  32. exliontamer

    exliontamer Member
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    Our school give the ACS final, which covers OCHem I and OChem II. We are not allowed a cheat sheet, nor is the test score curved in any way. 70 questions taken out of 70 questions. 30% of final grade. I bought the official study guide-it looks pretty good. Good luck to everyone.
     
  33. skp

    skp free to highest bidder
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    this sucks when the national average is 63%
    [mean score 44/70]
     
  34. ryche22

    ryche22 Member
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    im at a cal state currently taking ochem I, and will be taking ochem II with the same professor next semester.

    we will be taking the national ACS exam as our final for ochem II and it is 35% of our grade. no cheat sheets, no nothin'. :(
     
  35. TMVegas

    TMVegas SDN Angel
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    I will be taking the ACS exam in May. It counts as our final, but we only have to get 50/70 to get 100% for the final...anything over 50 is extra credit
     
  36. ethyl

    ethyl Go suck on a Zoloft.
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    I'm at the University of Central Florida and all Organic II students take the ACS exam. I took it last semester and managed a B after a curve. :( It definitely put the spotlight on the A students in the class. The top scorer in the class got a 69/70 and the rest of the A students missed only a few questions. Yes, these people made me sick since I was insanely jealous. :oops:
     
  37. freshbeatschris

    freshbeatschris New Phuture
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    It's called the ACS exam.
     
  38. rxgal8

    rxgal8 Senior Member
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    I took the ACS last spring semester. I thought it was actually easier than any of the exams the professor had given us previously so I did pretty good on it (68 I think). It was cummulative, we weren't allowed any notes/cheat-sheets, etc. I studied from my O-Chem textbook and lecture notes. Sorry I can't remember any specific exam questions. Goodluck :thumbup:
     
  39. fairyofsong

    fairyofsong Senior Member
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    My college also administers the standardized test as our final. I found the link to where you can order the official study guide, which I will be doing. Has anyone used it/have any input on if it helped you?

    http://www3.uwm.edu/dept/chemexams/order/SG_2005_form.pdf

    Any input is appreciated! :thumbup:
     
  40. freshbeatschris

    freshbeatschris New Phuture
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    Just a heads up, you save A LOT of money on shipping if you order a larger amount of the study guides. I think you pay 1 or 2 buck per book instead of the 8 dollars per book if you buy them individually. I just made a sign up sheet for all the O. Chem courses here and then ordered a bunch all at once. If you can organize that at your school, you'll make a lot of people happy.

    The study guide is really thorough and very succinct. It also helps you get used to the way they word the questions.

    Chris
     
  41. Betty'sBeast

    Betty'sBeast Senior Member
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    I just took it. I don't know how I did yet, but it was pretty damn hard. We didn't get any cheat sheets or study guides or anything. I guess I'll find out how I did next week.
     
  42. DrSassyPants

    DrSassyPants Member
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    I took it this morning. Made an 84%, or 59/70. Hard? Depends on how much you learned the past 2 semesters. I didn't study much for it, but I learned a hell of a lot the past year and it stuck.
     

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