Official 2015-2016 Help Me Rank Megathread

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Braindrayn

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I need your guys' opinion as I am having a serious dilemma. I know the following are both great programs but I am having a real hard time deciding whether or not to rank MGH over UMich. Be aware I interviewed for a research track at both places with thoughts of doing either nephrology or rheumatology. Here are my thoughts.

MGH
+'s:
- If I have to live in the cold, I think Boston would be a pretty "cool" place to live as there seems like there is more to do
- Excellent place to do research
- reputation of the IM program is fantastic and thought the morning reports and other lectures I attended were top notch

-'s:
- Boston is an expensive city to live in
- While I didn't get a malignant vibe at all, I'm worried about the east coast culture in general having never lived on the east coast
- Felt a little less supported by the institution in terms of helping me achieve my career goals, (i.e. the institutional support at the end of training seemed a bit more nebulous and that I'd have to "prove" myself to get help instead of getting help so that I could prove myself if that makes any sense)

UMich
+'s:
- Really felt like I would fit in here as I enjoyed the personalities of both the administration and residents
- Ann Arbor is much cheaper to live in
- felt like they really supported and were truly interested in fostering physician-scientists, even going so far as to provide institutional support at the end of my training to support a lab

-'s:
- Ann arbor is a smaller town
- not as prestigious as MGH (I know I'm splitting hairs here)
- research opportunities are a bit less than MGH

I know I'd get great training at either program which is why this decision is so hard. I'm also in a fairly stable relationship with another person and in either case it would end up becoming a long distance one with Michigan being a bit more accessible to travel to/from. Any thoughts or advice?

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rd31

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I need your guys' opinion as I am having a serious dilemma. I know the following are both great programs but I am having a real hard time deciding whether or not to rank MGH over UMich. Be aware I interviewed for a research track at both places with thoughts of doing either nephrology or rheumatology. Here are my thoughts.

MGH
+'s:
- If I have to live in the cold, I think Boston would be a pretty "cool" place to live as there seems like there is more to do
- Excellent place to do research
- reputation of the IM program is fantastic and thought the morning reports and other lectures I attended were top notch

-'s:
- Boston is an expensive city to live in
- While I didn't get a malignant vibe at all, I'm worried about the east coast culture in general having never lived on the east coast
- Felt a little less supported by the institution in terms of helping me achieve my career goals, (i.e. the institutional support at the end of training seemed a bit more nebulous and that I'd have to "prove" myself to get help instead of getting help so that I could prove myself if that makes any sense)

UMich
+'s:
- Really felt like I would fit in here as I enjoyed the personalities of both the administration and residents
- Ann Arbor is much cheaper to live in
- felt like they really supported and were truly interested in fostering physician-scientists, even going so far as to provide institutional support at the end of my training to support a lab

-'s:
- Ann arbor is a smaller town
- not as prestigious as MGH (I know I'm splitting hairs here)
- research opportunities are a bit less than MGH

I know I'd get great training at either program which is why this decision is so hard. I'm also in a fairly stable relationship with another person and in either case it would end up becoming a long distance one with Michigan being a bit more accessible to travel to/from. Any thoughts or advice?

You're going into Academia. MGH.
 
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gutonc

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Please help me make sure I'm not making a major mistake. Interested in competitive fellowship (CV,GI,H/O) but doesn't have to be super academic. Would rather stay on east coast but are any of the bottom programs that much better than the first 2 on my list? Thank you.

BU
Brown
OHSU
Dartmouth
Tufts
UCSD
Maryland
Wisconsin
Case Western
With the exception of Case and Tufts, every program on your list is "that much better" than your top 2.

...and Case and Tufts are at least as good as your top 2.
 

gutonc

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You're going into Academia. MGH.
Crazyflakes.

While it may seem like MGH is "so much better", your academic options coming from somewhere outside of an echo chamber like MGH (or Boston in general...or NYC...or any of the other Top X big city programs) will be greater than you (or your grandma) can imagine.
 

tantacles

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Please help me make sure I'm not making a major mistake. Interested in competitive fellowship (CV,GI,H/O) but doesn't have to be super academic. Would rather stay on east coast but are any of the bottom programs that much better than the first 2 on my list? Thank you.

BU
Brown
OHSU
Dartmouth
Tufts
UCSD
Maryland
Wisconsin
Case Western

I'm in a slightly different situation, but I probably would have put Brown above BU even though BU has a better fellowship match. The residents at BU are definitely a bit overworked, though it's absolutely a great program.
 

Sole Survivor

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Hey everyone, could you please help me rank these programs. I have a preference for the northeast, and am thinking of critical care fellowship afterwards. Thanks!

SUNY Upstate
U Conn
Rutgers-NJMS
Albany Med Center
Norwalk Hospital
William Beaumont
Medstar/Washington Hospital Center
Case Western/Metrohealth
Winthrop Uni Hosp
Rochester Gen Hosp
Morristown Med Center
 

Animalcules

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Crazyflakes.

While it may seem like MGH is "so much better", your academic options coming from somewhere outside of an echo chamber like MGH (or Boston in general...or NYC...or any of the other Top X big city programs) will be greater than you (or your grandma) can imagine.

I would agree with this to some degree. It is important what kind of research they do at these places if you are interested in a career as a physician-scientist. With that I mean, research in your field of interest. The transition to faculty will likely be much easier at UM than MGH where you may idle as instructor for 10 years and assistant professor for another 20. There is no good answer, but think about the big picture as well.
 
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DRHEON1

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Hey guys, using a temp account but was wondering if anyone could help me rank my programs. DO interested in fellowship (cards, GI, or Hem/onc)

Any suggestions?

Current list:
RWJ
Stony Brook
Winthrop
Greenwich Hospital
NS Staten Island
Albany Medical
Saint Barnabas NJ
NYP Queens
Lutheran
SUNY Downstate
Anyone?
 

DrElliotReid

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@Braindrayn to me it seems like your gut is telling you UMich. Go with your gut. Just because MGH may seem "more prestigious" I think you'd probably perform better somewhere you feel like supports you and that you feel like you fit in better. Oh and the east coast mentality thing is real. Not that it's a good or bad thing, but I personally prefer the midwest/westcoast vibe over the east coast one but I grew up in the Midwest (and went to medical school on the east coast).
 

gutonc

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I would agree with this to some degree. It is important what kind of research they do at these places if you are interested in a career as a physician-scientist. With that I mean, research in your field of interest. The transition to faculty will likely be much easier at UM than MGH where you may idle as instructor for 10 years and assistant professor for another 20. There is no good answer, but think about the big picture as well.
If you can't find someone who aligns with your research interests at a place like Michigan or MGH/HMS, you're doing it wrong. But this is otherwise very good advice.

And as the Lasker Award winning director of our Cancer Center (who trained at MGH/DFCI and then spent 3 years as an instructor there before permanent academic indentured servitude was cool) once told me when I was a fellow, if you want to wind up at a place like MGH or Stanford (he said DFCI and MSKCC), train somewhere else.
 

retro

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I'm a middle of the road DO student here. Still having trouble with two programs: St. Elizabeth's Med Center (Boston, MA) and NYU Lutheran (Brooklyn). Can anyone enlighten me with which one to rank on top? Thank you in advance.
 
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gutonc

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I'm a middle of the road DO student here. Still having trouble with two programs: St. Elizabeth's Med Center (Boston, MA) and NYU Lutheran (Brooklyn). Can anyone enlighten me with which one to rank on top? Thank you in advance.
I know absolutely nothing about St. Elizabeth's but I can categorically state that, unless orientation includes waterboarding and daily rounds include a game of Intern Russian Roulette, it should be ranked higher than Lutheran.
 

retro

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I know absolutely nothing about St. Elizabeth's but I can categorically state that, unless orientation includes waterboarding and daily rounds include a game of Intern Russian Roulette, it should be ranked higher than Lutheran.

Thank you gutonc. Wow I had no idea Lutheran was that bad...Lol It sounded like the merger with NYU was going to bring up the program to next level. Would you rank LIJ-Forest Hills and Sinai Hospital (Baltimore) higher than Lutheran as well?
 

tantacles

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I'm fairly comfortable with the groupings but I am struggling with my ranks within these groupings. I'm leaning towards cards for fellowship so I am trying to keep that in mind.

1: UPMC - loved the program and the city. I am very confident in placing UPMC #1.

2-3: Wisconsin and Ohio State - this is where I am really struggling. I liked Wisconsin a little bit better but I am from Ohio and want to remain close to family. OSU is clearly a better fit for that. Is there a difference in the perception of these two programs? Not trying to sound like a braggart but based on conversations at both programs I don't think I will slip beyond whichever place I decide to rank #2 so I am agonizing over the order of these 2.

4-8: Wash U, Vandy, Case, BID, Colorado - not too stressed with these rankings but I want to make sure they are in an order that I am comfortable with.

BID- Liked the program but cost of living would be a tough pill to swallow.

Vandy- I liked the program and was very impressed by their fellowship match results. Seems like a fun place but I am not sure I want to move to the south.

Wash U- exact same thing as Vandy just replace "the south" with "St Louis".

Case- Seemed like a good place that would keep me in Ohio but I am worried that it will make fellowships harder than some of the other options.

Colorado- Definitely the place that I think would be the most fun out of my 4-8. Only thing that scares me is everybody here talked about the mountains being the reason they chose Colorado. The residents I spoke with seemed to think of the program as an afterthought that allowed them access to a cool location.

As a native Bostonian, I have to say that you can find an affordable place in Brookline that is 1-2 train stops away from BIDMC, so don't let the cost of living sway you away from BIDMC too much.
 

xxhopefulmdxx

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Can you guys help me rank the following programs? Potentially interested in hem/onc or rheumatology for fellowship.

- Temple
- NSLIJ Hofstra (Manhasset)
- Cleveland Clinic

Thanks!
 

one&done1123

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Hey sorry to repost but was wondering how ppl would rank the following programs based on its reputation & clinical training ( interested in GI, Hem/onc)
1. Maryland
2. USC
3. Minnesota
4. Indiana
5. Montefiore
6. Bayview

Is it a mistake to rank USC above those ranked 3-5?

Thanks a bunch! (@gutonc would appreciate your thoughts on this as well)
 
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HarryGary

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I'm writing this as a PGY6 at arguably the top cardiology fellowship in the country.

None of you have any idea what the hell you are talking about.

Go where you think you will be happy.

All the rest is noise.
 
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piaisthemater

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I am deciding between Georgetown and UPMC for my #1 choice.
I know that UPMC's reputation and fellowship match are superior, but my gut is telling me Georgetown. I have an outgoing personality, and I felt like I fit in much better at Georgetown which seemed to have a work hard play hard mentality vs UPMC which seemed to attract quiet bookish residents.
Am I crazy not to rank UPMC #1?

Thanks!
 

gutonc

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I am deciding between Georgetown and UPMC for my #1 choice.
I know that UPMC's reputation and fellowship match are superior, but my gut is telling me Georgetown. I have an outgoing personality, and I felt like I fit in much better at Georgetown which seemed to have a work hard play hard mentality vs UPMC which seemed to attract quiet bookish residents.
Am I crazy not to rank UPMC #1?

Thanks!
You're not crazy to not rank UPMC #1, but you're crazy to rank GT above it.
 
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Animalcules

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I am deciding between Georgetown and UPMC for my #1 choice.
I know that UPMC's reputation and fellowship match are superior, but my gut is telling me Georgetown. I have an outgoing personality, and I felt like I fit in much better at Georgetown which seemed to have a work hard play hard mentality vs UPMC which seemed to attract quiet bookish residents.
Am I crazy not to rank UPMC #1?

Thanks!

I believe in gut feeling. You want to be happy first and foremost. But UPMC is the stronger program as you know.
 

LTheanine

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Would love some help with my rank list...am going back and forth between all of them and really struggling...interested in pulm/cc probably. I would be happiest in a program with fun, chill residents that are still smart and work hard.

UCLA - Program seems compelling, but didn't LOVE the residents, seemed less down-to-earth than other programs. Also slightly concerned about patient population, definitely love the underserved pop the most and time at olive / harbor seems limited.
UCSD - Nice program, friendly PD. Concerned about time at VA however, 40% seems like a lot...lack of training in handling the more complex / high acuity patients?
BIDMC - Strong program and friendly residents. Negative for weather / being far from family/friends though I think I could handle it. Concerned about things like their EMR -- would never pick a program for their EMR but seems to show a lack of willingness to adapt / change which could be concerning?
UC Davis - Less "prestigious", though pro for being closer to friends in bay. PD and residents seemed relaxed and friendly.

Appreciate any advice and help, thanks!
 

fasteddie911

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Would love some help with my rank list...am going back and forth between all of them and really struggling...interested in pulm/cc probably. I would be happiest in a program with fun, chill residents that are still smart and work hard.

UCLA - Program seems compelling, but didn't LOVE the residents, seemed less down-to-earth than other programs. Also slightly concerned about patient population, definitely love the underserved pop the most and time at olive / harbor seems limited.
UCSD - Nice program, friendly PD. Concerned about time at VA however, 40% seems like a lot...lack of training in handling the more complex / high acuity patients?
BIDMC - Strong program and friendly residents. Negative for weather / being far from family/friends though I think I could handle it. Concerned about things like their EMR -- would never pick a program for their EMR but seems to show a lack of willingness to adapt / change which could be concerning?
UC Davis - Less "prestigious", though pro for being closer to friends in bay. PD and residents seemed relaxed and friendly.

Appreciate any advice and help, thanks!

I'd do BIDMC, followed by UCLA, UCSD then Davis. The EMR thing is a non-issue, it has no bearing on your training and the program itself, as the EMR is for an entire hospital and there can be multiple reasons for why they do things a certain way.
 

IMreshopeful

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I am deciding between Georgetown and UPMC for my #1 choice.
I know that UPMC's reputation and fellowship match are superior, but my gut is telling me Georgetown. I have an outgoing personality, and I felt like I fit in much better at Georgetown which seemed to have a work hard play hard mentality vs UPMC which seemed to attract quiet bookish residents.
Am I crazy not to rank UPMC #1?

Thanks!

Georgetown is a nice program and DC is a nice city. But having met residents from Pitt I can tell you it's a much more rigorous program which sets you up better for fellowship. The residents there are also pretty cool. As for the work hard play hard bit, you can do well with that personality pretty much anywhere.
 

NotoriousB

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Wondering about my top five currently, and really top 2- GI hopeful and interested in academic medicine, looking to stay in Northeast.

1/2 Brown - loved the Chiefs and residents, providence is a great city, but smaller than NYC which I'm used to. PD seems awesome, and overall got a great feeling. Ivy league name helps, and they have some great resources - refugee health, advocacy, school of public health, etc.
1/2 Jefferson - fell in love with this place, residents and chiefs are people I can really see myself hanging out with, and they offer great research and solid GI. location is def a plus. Dont know how they compare to brown though. they offer masters of clinical research that you can complete alongside your residency.
3. Dartmouth - phenomenal program, only reason it's 3 is because of how far it is
4. Temple - shady neighborhood, good program, probably best PD i've met on trail
5. Montefiore - they work very very hard. But they also have a solid resident profile, good community outreach, and amazing match. dont seem too happy though
 
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criznazy53

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Would you rather, University Southern California or UCSD? interested in GI, Hem/onc But also looking for diverse clinical training
 

Yona33

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Would you rather, University Southern California or UCSD? interested in GI, Hem/onc But also looking for diverse clinical training
UCSD is a significantly better program. Unless you must live in LA, I would rank it higher. Good luck!
 

Archi101

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Hi,

wondering how to rank these low-tier university programs vs these following community programs (interested in cards-fellowship):
KUMC vs Creighton vs Henry Ford vs Hennepin vs Yale-Bridgeport. Thank you!
 

ready2rumble101

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Hey guys what are your opinions on ranking NYU Lutheran VS Downstate

Lutheran- happy residents, now merged with NYU able to do rotations there
Downstate- malignant program, but well known, and in-house fellowships

Thanks all and any opinions would be greatly appreciated...good luck in the match
 

bigwerm

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Cardiology hopeful - Cornell vs. Mt Sinai vs. Northwestern. I know I can't go wrong, but I gotta rank them somehow. Help me differentiate.
 

Animalcules

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Cardiology hopeful - Cornell vs. Mt Sinai vs. Northwestern. I know I can't go wrong, but I gotta rank them somehow. Help me differentiate.

Agree, great options. Mt Sinai for cards, but any if these will do.
 

DIMC

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General ROL question.

I want to peruse a fellowship, Cards or Pul/CC.

How should I rank a combined 5 yr (IM-psych) university program compared to a 3 year community programs that is relatively new and doesnt have any graduates yet.

I have multiple programs on each side and keep going back and forth. I keep thinking it's only 3 yrs and if I dont get a fellowship I'll just do hospitalist work
5 year's is a long time, not sure if I would still want to do a fellowship after that many years of working so hard.

Is the 2 extra year's of doing psych worth it?

I would definitely get better training at the 5 year program but the extra two years just seem daunting. The location is also making it harder. It's 5 years in a small city vs. community programs at major cities on the east and west coast.
 

gutonc

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General ROL question.

I want to peruse a fellowship, Cards or Pul/CC.

How should I rank a combined 5 yr (IM-psych) university program compared to a 3 year community programs that is relatively new and doesnt have any graduates yet.

I have multiple programs on each side and keep going back and forth. I keep thinking it's only 3 yrs and if I dont get a fellowship I'll just do hospitalist work
5 year's is a long time, not sure if I would still want to do a fellowship after that many years of working so hard.

Is the 2 extra year's of doing psych worth it?

I would definitely get better training at the 5 year program but the extra two years just seem daunting. The location is also making it harder. It's 5 years in a small city vs. community programs at major cities on the east and west coast.
Nowhere in here does it say that you want to do anything related to psych. So I'm not clear why you would rank an IM/Psych program (or why you even applied to it). If your goal is to do fellowship or hospitalist work, the 2 extra years are a waste of time.
 

one&done1123

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Hey sorry to repost but was wondering how ppl would rank the following programs based on its reputation & clinical training ( interested in GI, Hem/onc)
1. Maryland
2. USC
3. Minnesota
4. Indiana
5. Montefiore
6. Bayview

Is it a mistake to rank USC above those ranked 3-5?

Thanks a bunch! (@gutonc would appreciate your thoughts on this as well)

Any takers ?
 

NNH

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Interested in academic cardiology, maybe EP. I'm confused about a handful of programs. The differences in "gut feeling" were kind of small for me, location a minor factor for me, mainly curious about relative differences in cardiology match and research opportunities. I'm from a small city, thus I don't think I'll be unhappy in some of the smaller city "undesirable" locations. I know all of these programs are good, just wondering which ones optimize academic cardiology chances.

1. Duke: Great cardiology program, lots of research opportunities, block schedule is nice. I think the best cardiology match list of all the programs here.
2. Michigan: Great program, lack of block schedule negative for me, but good research opportunities. Hard to get more than 6 wks of research time (every other program gives 3 months pretty much). Probably a top 2-3 EP program. Minor concern is that outside of Michigan, people often don't go to "top" cardiology programs.

Most confused about these 6, I have them in a tentative order but really amenable to moving around:
3.Yale: Despite the dislike this program receives here, I don't think it was any worse than the others. Nice research opportunities, good connections to go to academic programs.
4. Mayo: I really liked this program. I liked the 4+4 schedule, good clinical research opportunities. I have some concerns about the match list and because some advisors have told me that Mayo is not a top program and is not as good as WashU, Northwestern or Vandy. Is it a mistake to rank Mayo this highly?
5. WashU: I liked the program, but got a real sense of car-salesmen like feel to the interview day. Block schedule is nice. The C-STAR program would be a plus.
6. Pitt: 4+4 great, a little concerned that some of the caps seem to be 6-8 patients (which is lighter than other places) and that you don't run codes unless you do a special rotation. I like the Clinical Scientist Track.
7. Northwestern: I liked the people and leadership a lot, non-block schedules, good cardiology program.
8. Vandy: Didn't really connect with the city, really liked the program though, the synthetic derivative is a great research opportunity. Cost of living is going up pretty quickly too, and salaries haven't kept up in my opinion.
 

imhopeful33

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Trying to rank programs. I feel like I would be happy anywhere, and I have very little geographic preference. I'm strongly interested in pursuing a competitive fellowship. I would appreciate any feedback regarding the reputation of these programs. Thank you for the help!

1. Iowa
2. Indiana
3. Rush
4. USC
5. Rutgers RWJ
6. UIC
7. Loyola
8. UC Davis
9. Utah
10. Henry Ford
11. SUNY Upstate
 

DIMC

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Nowhere in here does it say that you want to do anything related to psych. So I'm not clear why you would rank an IM/Psych program (or why you even applied to it). If your goal is to do fellowship or hospitalist work, the 2 extra years are a waste of time.

Graduates of the combined program get excellent fellowships and are given preference for in-house fellowships. I initially had a desire to peruse Psych but now I'd rather not. I have a better chance of Medicine fellowships via the combined route then the regular community program route.
 

ilikesports

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OK US Senior from Med School in North East
so I'm having a hard time with my number 2,3,and 4. I loved Yale PC (I want to do academic general medicine) so that's my number 1.

2) NYU (I really feel that Bellevue offers amazing clinical experiences, NYC sounds exciting, not too far from home) but I JUST read that they are switching to 6+2 for interns? That seems kind of scary, and overwhelming, now I'm not so sure.

3) UPMC: I was originally very excited about this program (very good general medicine experiences, and fair amount of autonomy for a big program), I just feel a little isolated in PIttsburgh. Not too far from home.

4 or 5) UCalifornia Irvine: I have family in Orange Co. I feel that the clinical opportunities would be somewhat Lacking but I loved PD and residents.
4 or 5) BU: Loved the residents, but it seems that they are way overworked and never have time to get a break. Similarly good clinical opps to NYU?, Boston's nice, close ish to home.
 

gutonc

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Graduates of the combined program get excellent fellowships and are given preference for in-house fellowships. I initially had a desire to peruse Psych but now I'd rather not. I have a better chance of Medicine fellowships via the combined route then the regular community program route.
2 extra years of something you don't really want to do is a bad idea.
 
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gutonc

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Trying to rank programs. I feel like I would be happy anywhere, and I have very little geographic preference. I'm strongly interested in pursuing a competitive fellowship. I would appreciate any feedback regarding the reputation of these programs. Thank you for the help!

1. Iowa
2. Indiana
3. Rush
4. USC
5. Rutgers RWJ
6. UIC
7. Loyola
8. UC Davis
9. Utah
10. Henry Ford
11. SUNY Upstate
Utah should be top 3 (I'd personally put it #1 in that list) but otherwise I think it's fine.
 

lakeofirefun

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OK US Senior from Med School in North East
so I'm having a hard time with my number 2,3,and 4. I loved Yale PC (I want to do academic general medicine) so that's my number 1.

2) NYU (I really feel that Bellevue offers amazing clinical experiences, NYC sounds exciting, not too far from home) but I JUST read that they are switching to 6+2 for interns? That seems kind of scary, and overwhelming, now I'm not so sure.

3) UPMC: I was originally very excited about this program (very good general medicine experiences, and fair amount of autonomy for a big program), I just feel a little isolated in PIttsburgh. Not too far from home.

4 or 5) UCalifornia Irvine: I have family in Orange Co. I feel that the clinical opportunities would be somewhat Lacking but I loved PD and residents.
4 or 5) BU: Loved the residents, but it seems that they are way overworked and never have time to get a break. Similarly good clinical opps to NYU?, Boston's nice, close ish to home.

@ilikesports, could you elaborate on Yale PC? I'm having trouble slotting this one in and you seemed to have come away with a strong impression. Thanks!
 

jbaez9

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How would you rank these programs? Open to location but leaning midwest. Hoping for GI or Heme/Onc fellowship.

Indiana
Iowa
Ohio State
Wisconsin
Minnesota
UIC
Rush
Loyola
Medical College of Wisconsin
Utah
Colorado
Louisville
Cincinnati

Appreciate the help! Thank you all!
 

buonassezia

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Am I crazy? I don't think so, but just in case, I'm going to ask a bunch of anonymous people on the internet (only half kidding)… Much appreciated!! In the order that I liked them, with educational culture being paramount:

Wisconsin v UPMC
Mount Sinai
NYU
Yale
Brown*
Mayo**
Colorado
Emory
UTSW

(*Loved this program on par with my 1-3, but unsure whether to bump it up the list given its slightly lower reputation?
**I realize they have great emphasis on education and a phenomenal program, but I really do not envision myself living there)
 
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