One step closer to the edge...I'm about to break

[Loki]

Well, that about all I can take. I just got off the phone with an admission official who shall remain nameless at a school that shall remain nameless, he basically told me that the system is screwed this year and they are punting. They are offering interviews based on numbers and in many cases they offered interviews before sending out a secondary.

I guess those with big numbers are the lucky ones this year.

Tell me, am I going crazy or will more interviews come later on down the road? I admit that I am freaking a little as I have NOT received ONE interview invitation.

I guess the fact that I don't have any rejection letters is my last thread of hope at this point.

Guys...help me to stay calm!

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[md2be06]

Is this UPitt? Anyway, I wouldn't worry about it too much. A lot of people haven't received any interviews. You have to realize that SDN probably represents a significant portion of the top 2-3% of applicants nationwide. So of course when so many people with high gpa's and MCAT's are on here, it only makes sense they will have many interviews. I honestly think that schools rank applicants in tiers. That is, the top students (based on numbers, and of course date of file completion) will always get the first set of interviews. The reality is that interviews will be going on for many months to come. This process sucks, but there's not much we can do about AMCAS. In the end, if you have just 1 acceptance, you have succeeded. That's my philosphy anyways.

 

[elle]

Please don't worry too much at this point! I know that I've felt that way, but it definitely helped me to realize that it's still September -- there are months and months ahead where interviews will be offered.


Hope this helps! Isn't it great to have somewhere to vent?

 

[gooloogooloo]

thi-thi-thi-thi-this SDN board repre-pre-pre-pre-present the to-to-to-to-top 2~3% of premed applicants??? Are you serious? I guess I don't belong here then! I am those people at the bottom 2~3%!!!

gosh, what am I supposed to do????

Gary

 

[Scooby Doo]

No no silly Gary...that's not what was meant by that post...

If you read it again, it says a portion of the top 2 to 3 percent are on this board. It is not all inclusive of the board...it is saying that there are many top applicants who post on here. While that is true, the converse is not true.

So it's not saying that everyone who posts is in the top 2 to 3 percent...
okay...time for work now...hope that made sense!

 

[jdub]

hey loki,

every program is different. some go more off numbers than other schools, i seriously doubt that the acceptance pool is going to change that much overall with respect to years in the past just because of the amcas debacle.

besides, many people will not know for sure until next july or august. for a good deal of people, this process is a big waiting game. so please try not to get too stressed, especially since it is only september.

 

[Gotrob]

My question is...why must the school remain nameless? Who are you protecting? Did they swear you to secrecy before telling you? Come on...please let us know which school it was.

 

[Scooby Doo]

Who really cares what school it is??
Does it really matter???
I don't think there is any purpose to say what school it was.
I think it's obvious that schools ALWAYS have an emphasis on numbers....
When I took an MCAT prep course..they said:
1/3 is your GPA, 1/3 is your MCAT, and 1/3 is your Personal Statement....
Now, I disagree with a 1/3 being your personal statement...but I DEFINITELY AGREE with 2/3 being your grades and MCATs.

 

[kutastha]

Originally posted by ScoobyDoo:
•Who really cares what school it is??
Does it really matter???
I don't think there is any purpose to say what school it was.•

I think it's very helpful for everyone on this board to know what it is certain schools are looking for. I care greatly what schools do what or place emphasis on a certain part of your application. It's part of the whole process and I think SDN provides a great source of info for everyone. I personally don't understand why people say, "I go to a state school", or "I had an interview at a nameless school today." Perhaps it's premed jitters that cause people to have such secrecy about such things, but I feel any specific information you can provide to help others is invaluable.

Andrew

 

[Loki]

Originally posted by ScoobyDoo:
•Who really cares what school it is??
Does it really matter???
I don't think there is any purpose to say what school it was.
I think it's obvious that schools ALWAYS have an emphasis on numbers....
When I took an MCAT prep course..they said:
1/3 is your GPA, 1/3 is your MCAT, and 1/3 is your Personal Statement....
Now, I disagree with a 1/3 being your personal statement...but I DEFINITELY AGREE with 2/3 being your grades and MCATs.•

Scoob, what I am saying is that some schools are not even looking at the rest of the primary app (or the secondary for that matter) Thus I think it more like 1/2 MCAT and 1/2 GPA. I think if you make this years interview at these schools, the numbers match up to the 1/3, 1/3, 1/3 ratio. I realize that this to a certain extent has always been the case. This year, however, things have changed and the schools do not, in many cases, have the entire application package. Thus, they are going off the numbers only. Something is definetly wrong with the screening process this year (due to the obvious AMCRAP stuff).


I will find these number oriented schools and smoke them out, I will get them on the run, I will not tolerate attending a school that relies on numbers only. Unless, of course, they take me

 

[Loki]

Sorry folks, I did not mean to fan the flames of mystery regarding the school's name. After I got off the phone, I was very pissed about the whole ordeal and I did not want to post the name until I cooled off.

The school is Vandy. I originally called them as I had written a note that said something about needing official trancripts. I did not remember why I wrote this down so I gave them a call. The person answering the phone and I had a major communication breakdown. I thought she was saying that they needed the official transcrips from all schools attended before they consider the app complete. What she was actually saying was that they needed the transcripts only after an interview invitation.

She forwarded my concern to some Dr. on the admissions staff and the guy called me (perhaps the dean of admissions). He was very helpful and basically said that they usually screen before sending secondaries. This year things are different so they gave everybody a secondary. The first interviews, however, were only offered from the initial information provided from AMCAS. Read between the lines, a numbers game. This does not mean that they will not evaluate the rest of the application for the final decision, it just means that if an applicant has a slightly weak MCAT or GPA, their letters of rec/personal statment/the rest of their app, will not be enough to pull them over the top to get an interview.

Bottom line, a big numbers game...I can only admire those schools who are taking their time and will only operate off the entire application package...Truly, a case of evolution as the environment will select the traits of the students in each class at each school. I think alot of this year's number screeners are going to have an interesting class next fall.

 

[C U in MD school]

Loki i hope this helps. i in no way have a great gpa or mcat. trust me, you would laugh at my numbers. i have an interview. don't give up hope. just realize that becoming a doctor is not about your gpa or mcat, but rather who you are. the schools know that. good luck and let us know the minute you get an interviw letter bec i want to be the first to tell you "i told you so"

 

[Scooby Doo]

Okay...Now I have a problem with this issue. Vanderbilt originally would give interviews based only off the primary (via a secondary notification - this is previous years plan of action). Vanderbilt, from what I know and experienced, has done the same thing this year! People who sent in their paper amcas, could receive and interview invite without having to send in the secondary. This is what happened to many people. Thus, here the system did not fail.

From what I understand, Vandy is not doing it off just the numbers...however, they might be. Okay, so now assume that with a few people they are giving them interviews based off of numbers. I think this year is very similar to the past. Top schools ALWAYS will screen MOST of their applicants by numbers!!!!!! Damn, I am gonna lose my fan club on this post haha....
But it's true! I have said it before and I will say it again! I will say that if your numbers are somewhat high (let's say 35 or so on MCAT or around there and higher...and a 3.8 or higher GPA...) you will be in very good shape when schools pick you for interviews. MOST people with these good scores will have decent volunteer/research/clinical/ or one of the above or all the above....Are they good people? Well, probably so...but that's where the interviews come in to weed people out.
So here we go...My guestimate is that:

50% of the people interview on STATS ALONE at almost every top tier school!!!
70% of the total interviews are on STATS AND PERSONAL STATEMENT!!
The other 30% make it off of EXPERIENCES ALONG with EVERYTHING else!

Now, just b/c schools like Vandy are giving out interviews early to people with stats...that just means that later on they will be scrutinizing their "EXPERIENCE" people....and they will lay off trying to get all the people with the numbers in there....
This is my expectation..and I do not see it failing!!

After actually going to Vandy for an interview and meeting many of the interviewees and they were VERY VERY cool people! They had super experiences and I am assuming good numbers.

 

[Scooby Doo]

Oh yea..to revise something...I agree that you should post the school...sorry about that...I thought about it and I agree we should post pretty much everything about med school...that's my bad on a hasty post..i wasn't thinking it through...

 

[Trek]

Actually, Vandy *~IS~* going by numbers. I know a few people, myself included, that haven't sent a thing to vandy, havne't been verified, and all they know about me is GPA is X and MCAT is Y. From this stuff we've all gotten interviews. Just b/c you like the school don't become blind to their stats-based practices, Scoob, they're just like the rest of the guys you've been bashing for weeks. --Trek

 

[Loki]

Originally posted by Trek_OCLV:
•Actually, Vandy *~IS~* going by numbers. I know a few people, myself included, that haven't sent a thing to vandy, havne't been verified, and all they know about me is GPA is X and MCAT is Y. From this stuff we've all gotten interviews. Just b/c you like the school don't become blind to their stats-based practices, Scoob, they're just like the rest of the guys you've been bashing for weeks. --Trek•

This confirms what they told me on the phone. Numbers

 

[pyra]

I love that Linkin Park song...its so funny...especially the "shut up" part

 

[Scooby Doo]

Well I HAVEN'T been "bashing" any school for practicing a numbers game. That must be another scooby ...

HOWEVER, I do NOT deny that schools go by numbers! (for SOME of their applicants...NOT ALL!!!) If you reread my post..you will notice that I explicitly stated this. I said that many schools DO give interviews off mostly numbers (and I guess sometimes it's ALL numbers!)...and I do not doubt that they do this EVERY YEAR! However, like I said before....most people with such good numbers...are going to have great experiences as well...it kind of goes hand in hand for the most part. Don't you think?
This is where the scrutiny comes in...
Someone with high numbers is likely to have good experiences...
Someone with "lower" numbers will be scrutinized a little more...
fair?? I don't know...
Damn..someone just tried to break into my apartment...I had to call 911 and chase his as$ away..sorry...I totally lost my train of thought...ok..it's ending here...

 

[Loki]

Originally posted by ScoobyDoo:
•Well I HAVEN'T been "bashing" any school for practicing a numbers game. That must be another scooby ...
However, like I said before....most people with such good numbers...are going to have great experiences as well...it kind of goes hand in hand for the most part. Don't you think?
This is where the scrutiny comes in...
Someone with high numbers is likely to have good experiences...
•

I dont know Scoob...I mean how else can you explain why so many people with good numbers are rejected in a normal year? If you are right, then it must be the interview itself that sinks some high number folks. God, I wish I could stop thinking about this stuff and get back in touch with reality. This premed life is not real, it is a simulation

 

[Trek]

Scoob,
my sincere apologies, I had you and watcha confused on the 'bashing schools' part. IIRC he's not the biggest fan of Pitt

 

[praying4MD]

Originally posted by ScoobyDoo:
•...most people with such good numbers...are going to have great experiences as well...it kind of goes hand in hand for the most part. Don't you think?... Someone with high numbers is likely to have good experiences...
•

As cool as you are Scooby, I've got to disagree with you here. Good numbers doesn't necessarily mean good experiences too. In fact, maybe because the people were so busy getting stellar numbers, they lost out on a lot of experiences. Some people who have incredible numbers have those numbers beceause they do not have to work or have other "real life" responsibilities. Not all, but some. I don't think my numbers are my defining selling point. They're good, but not stellar. At some schools, they won't keep me out, but my real selling point is my extracurric's & life experience. So I have about average numbers (maybe a little above average on the GPA), but I do have to say that my experiences are really, really great. They form the foundation of my character, which probably comes through on my personal statement (not bragging, just telling the truth.) I'm hoping that counts for something in this chaotic process.

I will agree, however, that this year, more than before, is definitely a numbers game for many schools due to the time constraints.

 

[Hopkins2010]

Keep in mind that I just got done interviewing at Vandy, and I only have a 31 MCAT.

Of course, I might be the exception here. The other people in my interview group were from Princeton, Hopkins, Dartmouth, etc so they seem to place some deal of emphasis on your undergraduate institution.

I also noticed that there was only one female in the interview group and the only students that did the tour (about 5 total) were male. That might not represent the whole student body accurately, I'm just saying it was noticeable from my experience.

That being said, Vandy is a great school. Its probably one of my top choices right now, but I would prefer a PBL curriculum.

 

[Scooby Doo]

praying4md...while i love you to death!!!....
You just said pretty much what I was saying!
I personally know a few people with GREAT stats...or high mcats and good GPA's and vice versa. Every single one of them has sought out other opportunities in either research, teaching, clinical, or other things. I think it's pretty common to have volunteer experience under your belt. These people with high numbers are usually very ambitious and over achievers...thus, they will go out of their way to do as much as possible!
HOWEVER, by saying this, I do not mean that people with lower numbers are not ambitious or over achievers...I just am saying that usually, people with higher numbers are going to have these other "life experiences" we like to talk so much on this forum about.
This is where the people with lower numbers come in. Admissions committee's look at those people with higher numbers a little less closely b/c they perform so well on the tests and in classes...Wow, he has a 41 and a 3.9999...he's amazing! He's been doing research for 2 years...and he volunteered for a homeless shelter once...He also did some hospital work for a while....maybe he has some personal expereinces to add to it on his essays...
Now we take another applicant....He got a 28 and has a 3.4...In order to overcome the "obstacle" of not performing "as well" as the other applicant...that person NEEDS some pretty significant life experiences. Okay..so this person went to Batswana for 3 years..has built a missionary in Costa Rica...Won numerous awards for his humanitariasm....etc etc...Now this person has a better chance. However, if he had none of these experiences...he would not be able to compete with the first guy.
Hmmmm...i think this is long winded...oh well...The last examples didn't prove anything on my part..but I will leave them just for fun
Sooooooo....what I am saying is that if you have high numbers...you will most likely have SOME DECENT (if not Good or great!) experiences to back it up. I do not know anyone at my school with awesome numbers and nothing to back it up with (however, i do not know everyone obviously..) Still....it's so hard to argue on here sometimes b/c people are so grounded in their beliefs...argh!!!
ah well....I will go eat some scooby snacks

 

[Scooby Doo]

Baylor21,

Yes..same with my interview group..there was 1 girl and 5 or 6 guys. All the guys were from Emory and then one from Princeton. The girl was from I think a Tennessee school.

As for the final composition of Vandy students..i think its a 2:1 ratio of guys:girls ...

As for this year being more of a numbers game....I still am going to disagree with that! I said it before that I thought it was going to be a big numbers game.....but I have to retract that statement (made about a month ago). I now do not think this is going to be the case.

 

[Sir William Osler]

I agree with my bro Scooby on this issue. Medical Schools aren't under any more time stress as any other year. Their job is to put together the best class possible. Nothing AMCAS can do or cant do will affect that. I agree that numbers are very important in getting your foot through the door. I have a good friend who got a 31 mcat/3.8 from Duke who got into penn, and his best friend at duke got a 3.9 and a 39 and only got into UMaryland. However, the latter guy got interviews everywhere. The point is numbers can open up some doors, but it's up to you and your experiences to get to the acceptance level. This year is no exception. And there are in fact very many overachievers who can get both very high marks and test scores and "real-life" experience. Scooby's logic is very insightful .

 

[USeF]

Originally posted by kutastha:
• I personally don't understand why people say, "I go to a state school", or "I had an interview at a nameless school today." ..
Andrew•

Kutashta, I personally felt the exact same way about stating schools and being specific, never thinking of possible conseqences (or always marginalizing them) until a very unfortunate incident happened to me about a month ago. I was going to let it slide, since I learned my lesson but now I realize it's a very valuable one for all...

In August I started a thread called "the most archaic secondary.." about the medical school at my undergrad (U of South Florida). Posting in some anger, I shot from the hip, flaming them on having a type-written app that had the nationality question repeated and had a line in the legal portion that was no longer valid. After some replies about my harsh critiscm, I realized what it may have seemed like and went on to explain why I would actually be happy at the school: the faculty I know personally, a college of public health, the wealth of hospitals/opporunties in Tampa etc...
Well about a week later I get an email from the dean of student affairs (who has befriended me through a class I took 2 yrs ago) to meet with him asap. I figured it was about an email I sent directly to the office (which wasn't nearly as inflammatory)

When I get there, he hands me two stapled pages and says, "do you recognize this?" Sure enough, an anonymous person from SDN emailed the admissions director a link to the thread that incriminated me. Luckily, I had this friend on the other side who knew me better than that, giving me the opporuntity to explain myself to the director ... (if interested in the end of the story, let me know)


Point is, be careful what you say on a public board, or atleast ensure it can't be traced back to you.

 

[Scooby Doo]

Yea...I actually just had a dream either last night or the night before..that I went to an interview...and I was walking through the admissions office and all the computers had the SDN forums on there and the admissions officers were looking through the forums!!!! I was so scared that they were going to start laughing at scooby doo and say he was a loser who should have never applied to medical school and he will never get any "medical scooby snacks".... Even now the thought sends chills down my spine....
No scooby snacks for this great dane...what will the world have come to?!?!?!??!
But yea..it was a nerve-racking dream to say the least!

 

[mj]

Originally posted by USeF the Bull:
• In August I started a thread called "the most archaic secondary.." about the medical school at my undergrad (U of South Florida). Posting in some anger, I shot from the hip, flaming them on having a type-written app that had the nationality question repeated and had a line in the legal portion that was no longer valid. After some replies about my harsh critiscm, I realized what it may have seemed like and went on to explain why I would actually be happy at the school: the faculty I know personally, a college of public health, the wealth of hospitals/opporunties in Tampa etc...
Well about a week later I get an email from the dean of student affairs (who has befriended me through a class I took 2 yrs ago) to meet with him asap. I figured it was about an email I sent directly to the office (which wasn't nearly as inflammatory)

When I get there, he hands me two stapled pages and says, "do you recognize this?" Sure enough, an anonymous person from SDN emailed the admissions director a link to the thread that incriminated me. Luckily, I had this friend on the other side who knew me better than that, giving me the opporuntity to explain myself to the director ... (if interested in the end of the story, let me know)


Point is, be careful what you say on a public board, or atleast ensure it can't be traced back to you. •

That's actually kind of scary Bull. Shame on the person from SDN that would e-mail that to hurt you. I hope it turned out ok for you.

Now I have to rethink my catdog post. I hope adcoms like catdog.

mj

 

[praying4MD]

Ok, I get what you're saying Scooby. I guess we are speaking from different experiences because *most* of the people I know with unbelievable stellar stats have zero life experience & really crappy extracurrics. That taints my image a little I suppose. But of course, you are speaking from experience as well, so I will take that into consideration in changing my "stereotype" now.

USEF the Bull: YIKES! That's the scariest story I've EVER heard on SDN!! That SDNer should be banned, no doubt. What a jerk. I hope everything worked out ok for you.

 

[nochaser]

Goodness, Bull! That is something else! i thought the whole purpose of BB's was to be able to speak freely, vent, hit things back and forth, etc., so on and so forth. I can't believe that someone would email your negative comments about a secondary to that school! Either you have your own peronal enemy on this board, or someone is very desperate at blowing away the competition. I feel for ya'...