ortho- can i get in? lifestyle?

[icebreakers]

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I'm a second year, and I've been interested in ortho for quite a while now. However, recently I had a conversation with my own ortho doc (for some tendonitis) re: his experience in the field and he had me leaving the office slightly worried. He mentioned that he, " ate dinner with his kids only 5 times in their childhoods...and that he wouldn't choose the field again if he had the choice."

Don't get me wrong...I think he really does enjoy his work and from my experiences and from talking with some of his patients, I hear that he's definetely one of the best in the area.

I'm most willing to invest my life into my career. Having been frequently in a cast and on crutches in my childhood, I find this field extremely rewarding in that you get to see patients regain mobility and independence from injury and pain. Aside from that, I think the musculoskeletal system is an engineering marvel...a work of art.

However, I do NOT want to resent my passion for this field if it takes me away from my family and from other stimulating avenues that lie ahead in my life.

Is it possible to have a financially rewarding career (I have many loans to repay and many many more interests in life to pursue) in this amazing field while still having dinner with my wife and kids on a weekly basis?


-----------------secondly

as a second year student, just about to start board prep soon (well this whole year has been prep anyways), I have been passing my classes. Some of my classmantes tell me that you need honors and AOA to get in this field.

My ortho doc was telling me it makes a huge difference if you know people in the field and that if I am truly determined to enter this field, I should start courting a program ASAP. Who's right, and what should I do to improve my chances?

Thanks a lot

 

[icebreakers]

also, continuing from above............

I was told by someone in the field that working in ortho is getting harder and harder b/c of the decline in reimbursments from insurance companies....and that work in this field can become a financial trap.

is this true? is there light at the end of the tunnel?

 

[orthoboyz]

I think that your passion in orthopaedics is commendable...but unfortunately, it is one of the most competitive residencies in surgery and just 'passing' your classes is not enough.


I'm a third year right now and I just completed my elective in ortho. I'm AOA and I did really well on my boards. From what my attendings have told me...these programs pick the best of the best. You're going to have to ace your boards (>95%) or I suggest putting your focus in some other field.

I'm not trying to be rude or discouraging, but I feel that this is the best advice that someone can give you.

Additionally, I also must say that I think it is ludicrous that your physician told you that knowing people in the field will help. Knowing people will help only if you're already at the top, but you sound like you've been struggling.

anyways, good luck and this is my two cents

 

[womansurg]

Originally posted by orthoboyz
From what my attendings have told me...these programs pick the best of the best. You're going to have to ace your boards (>95%) or I suggest putting your focus in some other field

It's so interesting how things are so cyclical. Used to be that ortho was not competitive - staffed by neanderthal types was the stereotype. When I was applying, urology wanna-be's were folks who couldn't compete for gen surg positions. Now those two fields are competitive.

Also, one of my classmates tried to match in gen surg and couldn't, so instead he did anesthesia - at Harvard (!!!). Now anesthesia is fairly competitive to get into.

I just think it's interesting...

 

[icebreakers]

thanks for the input....yeah, I do think your point is interesting.

I really feel like i'm in a dilemma and am curious as to what you or anybody else has to say about my situation.

is 'orthoboyz' or whatever his name is...right? or do I have a shot at this amazing (at least in my opinion) field of surgery?

 

[neurogeek]

Of course you've got a chance! You have to work at it over the next couple of years and see how things go. Here are a couple of examples: 1) two years ago a friend of mine, an IMG nonetheless, matched into ortho. There is no AOA for IMGs and his boards weren't > 95%. 2) Last year my cousin matched into ortho. I don't remember him being AOA. I know he got 83rd percentile on step 1. Anyway, do your best on the boards. See how things go 3rd year. Don't give up yet.

As far as lifestyle goes, I know orthopods who enjoy a very rewarding family life. Once you're practicing you can decide how you want to work (to some extent).

Good luck.

 

[bonecutter]

Originally posted by orthoboyz
I'm a third year right now and I just completed my elective in ortho. I'm AOA and I did really well on my boards. From what my attendings have told me...these programs pick the best of the best. You're going to have to ace your boards (>95%) or I suggest putting your focus in some other field.

I'm not trying to be rude or discouraging, but I feel that this is the best advice that someone can give you.

Additionally, I also must say that I think it is ludicrous that your physician told you that knowing people in the field will help. Knowing people will help only if you're already at the top, but you sound like you've been struggling.

The last person you should listen to is a third year who has not matched and is reporting his summation of third hand information put together from scattered conversations with 'his' attendings on an anonymous board. That said the same goes for me. Set up a face to face meeting with your program director and get some real, valuable feedback. He/she will also be able to give you some real advice on what you need to do over the next few years to maximize your chances to match.

My personal opinion (admittedly the least valuable portion of this post) is that orthoboyz is off base on a few points. You have to be solid on the boards but not >95%. AOA will help but is not a necessity. Finally, knowing someone in ortho will prove invaluable on the interview trail. Ortho is a small world and people talk. Having a great letter and someone who can make phone calls on your behalf can really make the difference. It did for me and I matched at one of the top programs. I was not AOA, had solid but not stellar grades and solid board scores.

Orthoboyz,
That post was both rude and discouraging as well as coming off arrogant. You'll need to work on that before heading out on the interview trail. Also check your sources, it is ludicrous to think that you can get into a good program with just board scores and grades and without an orthopedist in your corner. Just check orthogate.com and note all the AOA, top boards people that surprise surprise did not match. Good luck to you too

Bonecutter

 

[Foxxy Cleopatra]

I think that things like board scores and AOA may help you in getting a few more interviews but are not an instant ride into any specialty. We had a high interest this year in ortho at my school, and both of the non-AOA, average candidates matched where one with extremely strong board scores and AOA did not. One of my friends (who was not AOA, okay, but not great grades and boards) is phenomenal to work with. He is very knowledgeable but not the sort to try to one-up anyone, everyone loved working with him (he worked very hard and was a great team player) and there was never any doubt regarding his interest and dedication. Sure enough, he matched here.


Study hard for the boards and try to get the best marks you can, but if you don't end up with a perfect profile, I think your doors still will be open. I'd work on getting some good letters as well and making your interest known and show that you're the sort of person who'd be great to work with and I'd guess that you will have a pretty good shot.

 

[Celiac Plexus]

Grades and Step I score are very important. Great grades, and a high step I score allow you to relax a little and know that you will get a good number of interviews. But even if you are not AOA, and get a not-so-stellar Step I score, you can STILL match in to just about any field you want.

In my class a LOT of guys went for ortho. We had almost a 90% match rate. Some of the guys were AOA, and prolly blew out Step I. Some of the guys had started doing research with the ortho dept from day 1. Some of the guys did neither but honored the heck out of 3rd year and relied on a few key connections to secure them a spots. One guy was AOA, had a HUGE board score (he managed to tell everyone who would listen including the ortho attendings), but did not match.

Granted, the higher your rank, and the better your step I is, the more confident you can feel about getting interviews... but by NO MEANS ARE YOU EXCLUDED if you don't have those things. I agree with the poster above who advised you to meet with the ortho PD or chairman and start figuring out what you have to do to get a spot.

Good luck!

 

[Crypt Abscess]

First of all, I would like to say how great the field of ortho is. Although I recently decided on IM, I thouroughly enjoyed the month of Ortho that I did.

In this years class at my school, five applied to ortho, only three matched. The three that matched ortho were all AOA (two Junior, one Senior) with high board scores. The two that didn't match had fairly high boards (>230), but were not AOA. However, in the previous years class, I know three guys that matched Ortho who were not AOA, and had average/slightly above average board scores. They were very well connected though with the dept, having done research, and stated there interest early as a first year. They matched at their home program. If they hadn't matched there, I don't think they would have matched anyplace else (one of them even told me this).

Bottom line- it is very possible to match in Ortho with average board scores and non-AOA, just make connections early.

Crypt

 

[bonecutter]

Originally posted by womansurg
It's so interesting how things are so cyclical. Used to be that ortho was not competitive - staffed by neanderthal types was the stereotype. When I was applying, urology wanna-be's were folks who couldn't compete for gen surg positions. Now those two fields are competitive.

It is rather interesting how things come around full circle because now those comments are starting to surface about general surgery. What next? 😕

 

[icebreakers]

I really appreciate everyone's advice...it was all very informative and I think after my next exam i'm going meet with our director here to see what I should start doing...and to see if I can observe a few surgeries before I start studying for the boards.

also...I was wondering if someone could please tell me what is the basic difference between academic practice and private practice. Is the main difference that physicians in academic practice also have a professorship with an academic institution as well as involvment in research? Is there any difference at all in their out-patient involvement? Lifestyle differences? Is private practise more 'routine'?
oh........I guess details specific to ortho would be really nice, but I'd appreciate any general differences too!

 

[icebreakers]

😀 could any of you please share with me how to get those really good board scores...

I'm going to be having 8+ wks to study for the boards (based on my scheduling).

is there any 'magic' plan, that if I completed it twice over, I could pretty much guarantee myself a really really good board score...so that I could be confident in the next two years as I go about my quest for a really competitive residency (ortho)?
😕 😕 😕