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P. Chem Sucks

Discussion in 'Pre-Medical - MD' started by bluesTank, Apr 23, 2007.

  1. bluesTank

    bluesTank Zombie 5+ Year Member

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    Feb 2, 2007
    College Station, TX
    That is all
     
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  3. anumama

    anumama 10+ Year Member

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    Jan 20, 2007
    agreed:thumbdown:
     
  4. BrownianMotion

    BrownianMotion Einstein's Simple Diffusion 10+ Year Member

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    Aug 2, 2004
    Planet Earth
    yes, yes it does
     
  5. BrownianMotion

    BrownianMotion Einstein's Simple Diffusion 10+ Year Member

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    Aug 2, 2004
    Planet Earth
    imagine having it 2 semesters worth with 2 semesters of lab (3 credits for each lecture and 3 for each lab), yes the lab really sucks!
     
  6. gmsquid

    gmsquid Member 10+ Year Member

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    Aug 13, 2006
    Haha...yeah well for me PChem I lab and lecture sucked, but I loved PChem II. I just like quantum better than thermo.
     
  7. bluesTank

    bluesTank Zombie 5+ Year Member

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    Feb 2, 2007
    College Station, TX
    I'm the opposite... In quantum right now, and I can't stand it. I hate these concepts in which I can't intuit and get my hands on...all this microscopic stuff is just too out there :rolleyes: Thermo I did enjoy, since it actually dealt with concepts I was familiar with
     
  8. xucardsfan08

    xucardsfan08 2+ Year Member

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    Jun 8, 2006
    we're just getting into statistical mechanics, i.e. the fun art of combining quantum mechanics and thermodynamics.....this should be fun


    hey, at least we actually know what is going on in those electron orbitals, everyone else just takes 'em for granted.
     
  9. TheGreatHunt

    TheGreatHunt High Performance 7+ Year Member

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    Jan 5, 2007
    I'm throwing up in my mouth right now, I had a similar thread earlier.. lol

    I think I'll wind up with an A or an AB this semester... shooting for that A, that'd be golden... and amazing.

    I hear lab is a lot more fun than lecture.

    Unfortunately our professor is like 65-70 years old, and is so damn intelligent it's ridiculously hard to even understand him the first time through. Notes+Book+Other Books = sometimes being able to understand what the hell is going on.
     
  10. Firedragon524

    Firedragon524

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    Apr 23, 2007
    Yeah I also had to take the hell that is PChem. But, I survived, and I bet it looks good on a college transcript.
     
  11. Tired

    Tired Fading away 7+ Year Member

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    Dec 12, 2006
    PChem is awesome. I never felt smarter than the first time I really understood basic Quantum. Everything has been intellectually downhill since then.
     
  12. mongrel

    mongrel Assoc. Prof. Dogsuit 5+ Year Member

    My p-chem class was taught by this guy:
    [​IMG]
    I don't know if you can tell from the pic, but he has a wicked curly and long (AND fully greased, mind you) handle-bar mustache. For me, this guy made the class. My fourth thermo-related class had a totally new ring coming from a man who knew how to properly wax his 'stache.
     
  13. ShyRem

    ShyRem I need more coffee. Physician Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    Jun 17, 2004
    Where I hang my hat.
    I loved PChem. I think having tons of math helped a bunch... complex variable calculus was a particularly helpful course, and I wish I'd had abstract algebra before pchem.

    But i'd MUCH rather do pchem than biochem. Any day. Hands down.
     
  14. baylormed

    baylormed On the Search 5+ Year Member

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    Dec 4, 2005
    Right behind you
    Yes it does.
     
  15. trinitee501

    trinitee501 New Member 5+ Year Member

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    May 25, 2004
    Thermo is definitely better than Quantum. Pchem sucks majorly and having boring teachers and early morning class doesn't inspire on to roll out of bed!
     
  16. bluesTank

    bluesTank Zombie 5+ Year Member

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    Feb 2, 2007
    College Station, TX
    = [​IMG] ?
     
  17. mongrel

    mongrel Assoc. Prof. Dogsuit 5+ Year Member

    Exactly! I bet my p-chem prof could pull off an awesome Wario for Halloween. But seriously, I don't think you understand how awesome his mustache was. Waxed into two little perfectly symmetrical curls extending the entire width of his face. I don't even want to think about the kind of daily 'stache-prep he goes through when he wakes up. That's dedication that perhaps even the most devoted physician can learn from... Wait, maybe I should grow out a handle-bar as a talking point during interviews. Hmmm... **writing this down**
     
  18. PseudomonasPAO1

    PseudomonasPAO1 New Member 7+ Year Member

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    Aug 14, 2006
    Miami, FL
    Ditto that! PChem I just seemed like GenChem with calc thrown in. PChem II was pretty neat from what I recall. I vaguely remember something about Schrodinger's cat :)

    And yes the lab was cool for both parts, but the lab reports were killer. I remember doing page-long derivatives for error propagation and whatnot. And I will never forget the 40 page kinetics lab report. Made me appreciate Michaelis-Menten a whole lot more.

    And yes you can brag you survived PChem when it's over (there's even a bumper sticker!)..And it does raise eyebrows now and then :)
     
  19. xucardsfan08

    xucardsfan08 2+ Year Member

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    Jun 8, 2006
    how is everybody's class set up?
    at my university, pchemI is thermodynamics, pchemII is kinetics, statistical mechanics, and quantum is a separate class (pchemI is 3cred, II and quant are both 2c)
     
  20. .surgical.

    .surgical. Senior Member 7+ Year Member

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    Aug 16, 2006
    out
    Next year, 8am class time...

    Chemistry major though, I'm not too worried
     
  21. Ginkneephur

    Ginkneephur Insane Since 1984 2+ Year Member

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    Mar 30, 2006
    FL
    I hate pchem!! :mad: Doing pchem 2 now and our lecture final is Friday, lab final Monday. Writing 70 page lab reports is not fun. If someone had told me ahead of time how awful pchem is I woulda been a PE major...ok, prolly not. I like chemistry just not writing crazy lab reports. :thumbdown:
     
  22. bluesTank

    bluesTank Zombie 5+ Year Member

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    Feb 2, 2007
    College Station, TX
    I guess while we're on topic, and I'm here freaking out about my test tomorrow...can anyone (in quantum mechanics terms) thoroughly explain to me what the difference between Molecular orbital and Valence bond theory is? Like, I have the formulas in front of me but the explanation of the differences don't make sense in my notes..anyone happen to have a good answer? :scared::scared:

    Thanks!
     
  23. munnabhai

    munnabhai Junior Member 2+ Year Member

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    Jul 27, 2006
    <-- PChem and Biochem next semester :scared:

    to top it off, its been 3 years since multivar.... I love to hate myself...
     
  24. novawildcat

    novawildcat Senior Member 5+ Year Member

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    Aug 22, 2005
    When I took PChem a lot of the chemistry students bombed it simply because they sucked at algebra. The math in PChem is basic, nothing harder than some simple integrals or derivatives. The chem students that sucked at pchem simply couldn't do algebra.
     
  25. TheGreatHunt

    TheGreatHunt High Performance 7+ Year Member

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    Jan 5, 2007
    I agree, the math isn't very intensive, unless you're doing a wicked Lagrange undetermined multiplier kind of problem... Those can get hairy to solve for afterward, even though they're supposed to be the "intellectual" approach vs the "Mundane", hahah.
     
  26. PseudomonasPAO1

    PseudomonasPAO1 New Member 7+ Year Member

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    Aug 14, 2006
    Miami, FL
    Multiple integrals and partial derivatives are all you will likely see from calc3..I stopped at calc2, but our Pchem prof was cool..He gave us a crash course on calc3 stuff we needed, it was pretty straightforward.
     
  27. Ginkneephur

    Ginkneephur Insane Since 1984 2+ Year Member

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    Mar 30, 2006
    FL
    We use a lot of derivatives, integrals, and partial derivatives. Some of the equations that pop up are differential equations but we don't know any different cuz we didn't have to take differential equations. :p
     
  28. ShyRem

    ShyRem I need more coffee. Physician Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

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    Jun 17, 2004
    Where I hang my hat.
    Ah, yes, but complex variable was so helpful. I walked in late one day to see an equation on the board. The prof said "Ah, here she is... so.. what's the answer??" I looked at it and said "zero as long as the domain is simply connected". Took him two hours to get to zero in class. I could do it in 5 seconds thanks to complex variable calc.

    So yeah, you can absolutely do pchem with just basic calc I, II, and III. But the extra math background makes it a lot of fun and a lot less work.
     
  29. hawkeey

    hawkeey Member 5+ Year Member

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    Nov 6, 2005
    Well honestly as a physical chemist, I do like P. Chem, but it's not for everyone.

    It gives you a good idea about what molecules do at a very fundamental level. Quantum, thermo, and kinetics do pop up every once in the while in medicine (eg. electron tunneling, free energy of chemical gradients, and Michaelis-Menton enzyme-substrate kinetics). You definitely do not *need* to understand P. Chem to understand these topics, but it certainly does help a lot. They are a lot less mysterious.

    One of the things that you must absolutely pick up in the academic world is that not everyone thinks in the same way. That doesn't mean there is a hierachy of intelligence; it just means there are different kinds of intelligence. Maybe you are good at absorbing a lot of facts, while the guy sitting next to you loves taking Hamiltonians.

    So figure out what you are good at (usually what you like) and what you are not good at (usually what you do not like) and recognize it. Learn what others are good at and know when its time to find a p. chemist to solve a physical problem.
     
  30. johnnydrama

    johnnydrama I'm no Superman 10+ Year Member

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    Jun 13, 2006
    P. Chem tells you what type of lab alcohol is okay to spike your drinks with. 95% = good, 100% = bad. Since ~97% ethanol/H20 is an azeotrope, you can't distill past that point without spiking it with something nasty (like benzene). This is the most memorable thing I learned in p chem (although to be honest it pops up in orgo as well). :p

    Oh yeah, and also that a leaking hydrogen tank is even more dangerous than you would expect, because unlike most gases, it heats up when it expands.
     
  31. BlackSails

    BlackSails 2+ Year Member

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    Apr 4, 2007
    You can extract the benzene out. Also, I think the 95% alcohol in my lab is denatured with benzene to stop enterprising gen chem students from stealing it.
     
  32. bluesTank

    bluesTank Zombie 5+ Year Member

    679
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    Feb 2, 2007
    College Station, TX
    100% ethanol is impossible to achieve (but would in theory be perfectly safe). Also, lab grade ethanol has methanol impurities in it, which forms the azeotrope you referred to. Methanol in small quantities (even < 10mL) will:

    A) Make you blind
    B) Kill you

    Moral of the story: Don't drink anything in lab

    (PS: I know it was a joke, but some people might be dumb enough to try.)
     
  33. mdm2fly

    mdm2fly 5+ Year Member

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    Jan 13, 2007
    you definitely weren't in my pchem class. we used algebra in our first genchem class for simple pchem intro "surveyish" material, but my actual pchem class was full of partial derivatives, for starters...and integrals and partitions. i left that class knowing less about pchem than i did going in.
     
  34. mongrel

    mongrel Assoc. Prof. Dogsuit 5+ Year Member

    Haha, yah- but not to fear! One treatment for methanol poisoning involves intravenous ETHANOL! :eek:

    :banana:<--me if I were to be put on an ethanol drip
     
  35. xucardsfan08

    xucardsfan08 2+ Year Member

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    Jun 8, 2006
    100% ethanol is possible. That's what anydrous ethanol is, benzene is used to get around the azeotrope problem. Trace amounts do remain, although not trace enough that drinking enough of it might cause complications, as benzene (as everyone knows) is carcinogenic.

    All lab alcohol, however, is denatured simply to remove the government tax on purchasing it to save a lot of money.

    All that stuff is taught in organic though, while p-chem just taught us why.


    As for the lab, the particle-in-the-box lab portion....30minutes, now I get to write up the lab report on that, i'm really excited.
     
  36. Ginkneephur

    Ginkneephur Insane Since 1984 2+ Year Member

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    Mar 30, 2006
    FL
    I'm done! Finished pchem lecture friday!!!!! :D :D The pchem lab final is monday. :(

    Almost done! :banana: :banana:
     
  37. gmsquid

    gmsquid Member 10+ Year Member

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    Aug 13, 2006
    We used to ahve 200 proof ethanol in our lab. Apparently to buy that stuff you need special authorization...
     
  38. novawildcat

    novawildcat Senior Member 5+ Year Member

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    Aug 22, 2005
    LOL you should see the cabinents full of pure ethanol we have where I work. We have like 200 5 L bottles of the stuff.
     
  39. dumplings

    dumplings Junior Member 10+ Year Member

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    Jun 12, 2003
    so just wondering since i'm contemplating taking pchem next semester...
    does it look good for med school?
     

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