Separate names with a comma.
Discussion in 'Pharmacy' started by Pillmaster, May 26, 2005.
I say whichever is shorter or easier to pronounce- for example, I'll still say zocor v simvastatin
This was in response to Baller saying he wouldn't recognize the names unless they were in generic. When talking to people who know the med names, it's fine to use whatever is convenient, brand, generic, or abbreviation...but not knowing a brand or generic name is probably an issue if that's what your patients are going to refer to them by.
Which generic is easier than the brand? Just curious.
Personally I always use generic unless it is only available by brand. One exception is ZPAK. I actually hate when scripts come in written for generic when they are only available by brand because my techs never know what they are, lol. Sometimes I don't even know without looking it up.
Now that you called me out.... I guess I always say generic name unless its a hard name to pronounce- (ie tamiflu vs oseltamivir I say tamiflu).
I also say Bactroban because I just do not know how to pronounce the ridiculous generic name, now that I think about it.
How about a list of drugs that will never go by the generic name? I nominate Precedex.
Is it considered cheating/out of the scope of your list to list these combo drugs? Fine, I'll do non-combo drugs too....
Any jobs available in the Dallas/Fort Worth Area that you guys are aware of??? Any tips would be greatly appreciated. I feel like I submitted at least 30 applications some to the same company for different locations. I am not picky about where in the DFW...I just want to stay in the DFW area. Any help or recommendations would be greatly appreciated!!!
I have been more competitive for residencies than actual pharmacy jobs. 20+ apps sent out there between retail and hospital. One offer thus far for 32+ hours floating (salary slightly below $100K). But I've gotten interviews to 2/3rds of the residencies I've applied to lol.
Residencies are becoming easier to obtain than actual pharmacy jobs. This market is absolutely sickening.
Which area is this?
I'm curious to which areas you're applying to lol
They just want to use you for cheap labor
Amazing how everyone wants to exploit pharmacists
Chains and hospitals
What's the lowest starting salary you have heard for full time:
My friend who does financial planning said one if his clients was offered $89,000/year and took it
Sent from my ONE A2005 using Tapatalk
During my pharmacy schooling, I did a voluntary week-long shadowing with the owners of Smith Drug after meeting them in New Orleans at the NCPA convention. Do I win a prize?
Sorry to chime in. I am still researching the health care field to decide what I am trying to pursue for a career in health care. That is just to say that I might not know much.
Anyway, I think people care where you go for school. At least when you first start out, not yet established. From reading the med forums, it seems like those Caribbean MDs are having more difficult time to obtain residencies vs. US MD s of the same Step scores. Tier system seems to play for US MDs too though not as much as Carribean vs US.
In general, people do not care where you go for school if there are enough jobs. When the market gets tight, anything regarding your credentials could possibly become a barrier to get jobs.
Please some med students or doctors correct me if I were wrong here.
Unless law schools want to lower their bar even further down, they are currently having hard time to fill up their schools according to this article,
Lowering the Bar
More law schools are admitting less qualified students. Are they prepared for what happens next?
January 16, 2015
As the number of students going to law school drops dramatically, law schools are increasingly competing for students with lower undergraduate grades and LSAT scores.
Thomas M. Cooley Law School – the largest law school in the country – is known for admitting students other law schools would not touch. The reputation is increasingly inaccurate. Last fall, seven law schools had entering classes with lower median LSAT scores than Cooley’s.
Professors who study legal education worry that schools are enrolling more and more students who have not proved they can graduate law school. Equally concerning is that law schools are admitting and then graduating students who might not be able to pass the bar exam.
Five years ago, no American Bar Association-accredited law school had an entering class with a median LSAT score of less than 145. Now, seven law schools do, according to Jerome M. Organ, a professor at University of St. Thomas School of Law who studies the legal market. That means at least half the first-year students at seven law schools scored a 144 on the LSAT or lower.
The LSAT has a scale of 180 down to 120. The average LSAT score is around 150. The LSAT has a margin of error, but 145 is considered a symbolic line by legal education experts and school administrators.
"At one level, we’re in uncharted territory,” Organ said.
Southern University Law Center – part of the historically black Southern University and A&M College System – is one of those seven schools. Its median LSAT score last fall was 144. Still, it is running into competition for students.
“Certain schools never would have admitted a student with a 145 LSAT score several years ago,” said SULC's vice chancellor, John K. Pierre. “But this year they did and last year they did, and in some cases they are even offering students with that profile scholarships or tuition reductions.”
Enrollment at ABA-accredited law schools is the lowest it has been since 1973, even though there are 53 more law schools open now, according to Moody's Investors Service. The students still trying to get to law school also have lower test scores than in the recent past.
So the vast majority of law schools are not only shrinking in size but also admitting less-qualified students.
Organ’s work, based on annual disclosures law schools make to the ABA, shows that 136 law schools had a median LSAT score of 155 or higher in 2010. Now, only 101 schools still have an entering class with a median LSAT of 155 or higher.
The seven law schools with the lowest median LSAT scores portray themselves as schools of opportunity for students who think they can make it but may not have the scores or grades to prove it. The same schools can also be accused of irresponsibly admitting some students who don't belong in law school.
For students, the risk is not just time but money. Students with lower LSAT scores pay more to attend law school than students with higher scores. Organ found two-thirds of students with scores below 150 are paying more than $30,000 a year for law school, but they may not pass the bar and have "limited employment opportunities through which to recoup their investment in a legal education." The average student who scored 155 or higher pays less than $30,000 a year, attends a better-regarded law school and has better chances after graduating.
Three of the seven schools with the lowest median LSAT scores are in the for-profit Infilaw system. Those are Arizona Summit Law School, Florida Coastal School of Law and the Charlotte School of Law in North Carolina.
One candidate for dean of Florida Coastal became a cause célèbre last year after he was escorted off campus during a presentation to faculty.
The candidate, David Frakt, told the faculty it was unfair and ethically questionable to admit so many students with a 144 or lower. He said such scores indicate a poor aptitude for law school and mean that students face “extreme risk” of failing the bar exam. The median LSAT score for Florida Coastal’s entering class last fall was 143.
“For me, that 145 – going below that, even 145 itself – should be a no-go zone,” said Frakt, an Air Force lieutenant colonel and former legal scholar. “That really was conventional wisdom five years ago.”
Frakt said he warned Florida Coastal professors that students with low LSAT scores could risk the school’s ABA accreditation in years to come. The accreditor forbids schools from admitting students who do not “appear capable” of completing law school and passing the bar exam.
Increasingly, champions of a law school education tout law school as a solid path for students who have no intention of becoming lawyers but could use legal thinking and knowledge for other jobs. At a recent press conference hosted by the leaders of the Association of American Law Schools, there was a good deal of talk about exciting opportunities for law school graduates in fields unrelated to the practice of law.
As the number of incoming law students has fallen, most law schools have been left with a choice: They can maintain their admissions standards and suffer enrollment declines, or they can lower standards to keep up enrollment.
Barry Currier, managing director of accreditation and legal education at the ABA, said schools could run into trouble. If those lower-profile students flunk out, it would be a sign that schools are taking students they are not able to graduate.
“A school that has relatively lower credentials on the front end and high attrition may have an issue, even if their bar pass rate is good,” Currier said.ABA reaccredits schools every seven years.
It is also bad for law schools if their students graduate but fail to pass the bar, a sign that schools may be passing students through without preparing them for actually being a lawyer.
In the past two years, the number of students who have dropped out, flunked or transferred to another law school has not changed substantially, according to ABA data. It is not yet known how they will fare on the bar exam.
Currier said there are ways to check in on law schools in between regular ABA visits, but none of that interim monitoring has turned into a full-blown reaccreditation process and no schools are on probation.
“Our process is sort of set up to look back at how a school has done with the students it chose to take and how the program is offered,” he said.
Frakt, who is a controversial figure in some circles, argues the ABA is not doing enough and law schools are taking advantage of the accreditation cycle to admit students who may not pass the bar. Because of the time between admission and when students take the bar exam, the law schools admitting less-qualified students are not yet facing ABA scrutiny.
“There’s a window of opportunity there where their bar numbers don’t look too bad, so they can continue to draw in students, and make money off students,” Frakt said. “Because those students don’t realize how weak their chances really are.”
The public information available about law schools also leaves something to be desired.
The bar passage numbers, for instance, don’t on their own give students a great sense of their chances in law school. If a law school class begins with 100 students and 30 drop out over the course of law school, that leaves 70 who graduate. If 49 of those 70 pass the bar, the school’s bar passage rate will be 70 percent. But that would mean that only 49 of the 100 students the school originally admitted ended up passing the bar.
Reports released by the ABA allow the public to find out these numbers, but it involves looking at reports from several different years.
Also, because law schools report LSAT scores for the 75th, 50th and 25th percentile of their class – and not the average LSAT score – a school could have a quarter of their students with a 145 or above but 24 percent of their students with far, far lower scores. No one says it’s remotely likely, but in theory, 24 percent of a law school class could have scored a 120 on the LSAT – the lowest score possible – without its being detectable by publicly available information.
The LSAT itself is of debatable use. It’s meant to predict first-year performance, but it is used as an imperfect way of predicting graduation and bar passage rates.
Thomas Cooley, now known as the Western Michigan University Cooley Law School, has always relied on more than just the LSAT score. But unlike some other schools, its median LSAT score has not fallen below 145.
Organ, Frakt and others suspect that is because Cooley has long dealt with low-scoring students and knows it cannot dip much further into the applicant pool without seeing its graduation rate or bar passage rate deteriorate.
Don LeDuc, the president and dean of Cooley, said the school’s level student profile is a result but not the intent of admissions policies that have remained virtually unchanged despite the shocks in the market. It is working on a new admissions metric that relies more on college grades than LSAT scores, but DeLuc predicted it will not change the LSAT score much, if at all.
Because it has not lowered its admissions standards, Cooley has taken quite a hit. Its first-year class had 1,161 students in 2011. This year’s incoming class was about 60 percent smaller – just 445 students. As a result of the enrollment losses, Cooley is working to close one of its five campuses.
LeDuc said Cooley, a private nonprofit, is facing more competition for students with an LSAT score of around 145.
The dean worries about law schools that do not have as much experience with low-LSAT or low-GPA students.
“I would hope they are not going to just bring them in and do exactly what they did with their student profile in the past,” LeDuc said.
Cooley uses a predictive model to tell all students their chances of success based on their GPA and LSAT. The school doesn’t admit anyone with less than a two-thirds chance of succeeding.
Students know, in other words, that they might have an uphill climb.
That may not be so clear for students at other schools.
Jay Conison, dean of the Charlotte School of Law, said his school does not explicitly tell students their chance of success. Instead, he said, advisers tell students what they will have to do to succeed.
Charlotte is part of the for-profit Infilaw system. Its entering class last fall had a median LSAT score of 142, down from a median score of 148 in 2011.
Conison said the college is offering more students conditional admission and then fully enrolling them if they pass two pre-law classes. The school is also working to provide students more help while they are enrolled and as they prepare to take the bar – but the school will also change what it teaches.
“It is certainly very clear that it is a population that is going to require more of the kind of support mechanisms in the school that we provide for our students,” he said. “And it also will mean that the curriculum will have to be adapted to the different character of the students, and it may mean that more intensive support for bar passage will have to be provided.”
At Appalachian School of Law, a stand-alone law school in southwestern Virginia, the median LSAT score for last fall's entering class was 144. That’s the same as it was in 2011, but enrollment has fallen dramatically since then. In 2011, there were 146 incoming students. Last fall, there were 48.
Donna Weaver, a spokeswoman for the school, said that the enrollment drop meant that Appalachian had to lay off faculty but was able to protect its LSAT score. The school worried about admitting students with lower LSAT scores because it feared they would not be able to pass the bar.
But Appalachian, a private nonprofit, is also running into competition for students from other schools offering them scholarships.
“The price wars are scary,” Weaver said. “We can’t afford to just drop our tuition altogether."
Nah, where you go to school doesn't really matter in pharmacy. There can be some regional prejudices, especially if there is a local school that is well known for producing subpar pharmacists, but that isn't too common. Maybe this will change in the future, but it's not really a thing now.
Also, pharmacy school rankings are kind of a joke.
Truth. I know someone who almost failed out of pharmacy school who got a residency in a desirable location lmao. Residencies are a joke. Much like our profession.
who the hell gets 5 different vaccinations at a ****ing pharmacy
Immigrants who don't have their vaccination records applying for a greencard.
I used to live in Cleveland and I can confirm that only the east side gets lake effect snow. But wind chill effects EVERYONE. I read in the newspapers that Cleveland is dangerous, but frankly, I didn't feel unsafe in the suburbs or even in the university district (where Case Western Reserve, University Hospitals of Cleveland, Severence Hall are). However, this was years ago in early 2000's so maybe things have changed?
Undocumented workers, DREAMER kids, and businessmen from overseas with long stays but no health insurance.
You realize Cleveland was the hope of a man who kidnapped, tortured and raped three girls for over a decade, right? And this was 3 years ago in 2013. Not much has changed about Cleveland.
There is at least one psycho in just about every major city... And probably most minor ones...
Looks like new Pharmacy Manpower data has come out, still a national surplus of pharmacists overall. As a new grad I can confirm that jobs are very slim.
Were you able to find a job?
Still looking, but also still in the process of getting licensed and taking boards. Used to be you could get hired as a grad intern prior to licensure, those jobs really only exist in hard to staff areas now. In my city there are maybe 5 pharmacist jobs with most being hospitals wanting years of experience.
Get a job as soon as you get your intern license. Work your ass off, don't complain, and show that you are committed to the job and you will have an offer before you graduate. Don't be a slack ass bitch and and request every weekend off so you can go get drunk with your friends. Its really not that complicated. Even if its not the job you want, it will be much easier to find a good job if you are at least employed.
If you are willing to take a job with the Indian Health Service, Bureau of Prisons, or FDA Office of Regulatory Affairs (i.e. be an FDA inspector), the USPHS is currently accepting applications for pharmacists: http://www.usphs.gov/apply/apply.aspx. It's a really good gig with amazing benefits, you just have to be willing to have some flexibility with location, especially for your first assignment.
Isn't residency require?
No, residency is not required. The only credential you're required to have is your degree and license.
I only have 1-year of experience working as a pharmacist. What are my chances?
The Commissioned Corps application board will look at your CV, GPA, and references. They are considering new graduates as well as those with experience, so as long as your overall application packet looks good (decent GPA, good references, a well-polished CV) , only having 1 year of experience isn't an issue. There is also a phone interview in which they will ask you some typical job interview type questions, with some emphasis on what motivates you to serve in a uniformed service. In fact, if you are too experienced (i.e. over the age of 44), you wouldn't qualify for a commission anyway, so being young (and healthy) is generally an advantage. What it mainly comes down to, though, is whether you are willing to work at either IHS, BOP, or FDA-ORA (Indian Health Service, Bureau of Prisons, or FDA Office of Regulatory Affairs). They will ask you this during the initial application process, and you basically have to give your word that you will apply and accept a job with one of those agencies. To clarify, you have to apply for jobs in these agencies IN ADDITION to applying for a commission with the USPHS Commissioned Corps, since the Commissioned Corps doesn't have the authority to simply place you where ever the needs of the service are. Therefore, they will only move forward with your application if you agree to apply and accept jobs in one of those three agencies.
The advantage of applying to jobs in these agencies as a PHS commissioned officer as opposed to a civil servant is the different pay rate and benefits you get as an officer, as well as the additional responsibilities and opportunities you'll have in advancing public health. As a PHS officer, you have opportunities to go on domestic and international deployments in response to public health emergencies (e.g. man-made or natural disasters), you also have increased mobility among the various agencies that make up the Department of Health and Human Services as well as other agencies that PHS has memorandum of understandings with (such as the Department of Defense, Department of Homeland Security, and others), which enables you to have a unique and varied career. Also, if you have an interest in serving in the Coast Guard as a pharmacist, you must be commissioned as a PHS officer first. Lastly, you get to serve your country and provide care to some of our most vulnerable citizens, and you get to wear a distinguished uniform while you do it! If any of those things appeal to you, I would encourage you to go ahead and apply - you won't know what your actual chances are until you try.
Had an interview this AM with grocery store chain in city i am looking to relocate to. Feeling positive about it but they dont hire often so im sure there are a lot of applicants. now the waiting game!
I work for wag now and have been trying to transfer for a year but my district is so short staffed and my DM always just tells me there are no spots open yet where i want to go. I have also reached out to people myself. If i end up leaving WAG i will be a little sad because i like my store and techs a lot and we are a great team but you gotta do what you gotta do. My personal life is more important and right now i have nothing in the city i work except for my job
i got the job, i am leaving WAG> I am so so happy omg
What state is this?
I would agree with most of this (although I'm now the civilian side). The one thing that I would really say that separates the CC from the civilian is that the CC personnel can depend on each other for a network in a way that the Civil Service cannot, and while you have broad discretion on certain matters with CC personnel, it's a group that messing with them is professionally suicidal. If you're willing to stick with the CC over a career, the rewards are far higher than what is given to civilians (which makes up for their forced overtime).
I somewhat disagree with that assertion. "215 Part E" assignments used to be a lot more common in the old days than now. The current rules that have consent on assignments are only from Obama's (more specifically SG Garcia's) tenure which will be revoked upon the entrance of the next President or the next Surgeon General. During the old days, 215E assignments were the rule, not the exception for really hard to fill services and was used on 9/11 to detail a bunch of medical personnel (mostly physicians and nurses) to the DoD to relieve the regulars to deploy from the back line hospitals (Landstuhl and Naples) to the front. 10 USC actually has precedence, where at the discretion of the Surgeon General, you can definitely be assigned without consent on a specific personnel matter that only that person can fulfill. That's been creatively used in the past to:
"Giga, SENIOR, being the only USPHS pharmacist to regularly interact with the StudentDoctor Forums, is hereby given a directed personnel assignment to interact with StudentDoctor..."
Many of the Director Grades had at least one "assignment" during their careers as it's kind of unavoidable unless you're a real bureaucrat or avoid notice by BUPERS. In practice, this is rarely invoked for any provider, and almost never invoked for pharmacists. But I remember working with a directed assignment physician at Ft. Defiance at one point in my career as happy as the assignment dictates.
For instance, Zika. It's been declared a 42 USC C247d Public Health Emergency, I got all my favorite picks from the CC to do work for me, and if the matter was forced (it wasn't as all my favorite picks are old personal colleagues who we've worked together for years), I could have forced the matter under 42 USC 215 to HHS that I need this person for their unique talent and dealing with a declared 42 USC 247d PHE and the personnel office has no grounds to refuse (or the person).
I concede it was an oversimplified statement. Technically, there are laws on the book that give the Secretary of HHS the authority to assign and deploy PHS officers in order to meet urgent and emergent public health needs. CCHQ/CCMIS (PHS's BUPERS equivalent) tries its best to meet the needs of the service by essentially requesting for volunteers or providing incentives to officers (awards/recognition/promotion points), since it does not have the capacity or the resources to truly force assignments and deployments upon CC personnel. It is practically unheard of an officer being forced to reassign or deploy against their own volition. I imagine you have to be one special squirrel who really doesn't want to go on a particular assignment for that to happen.
I am a 2016 graduate who has a few questions. Here is a little information about myself first. I began working for a big pharmacy retail chain during my senior year of high school. I was not quite sure about what I wanted to do with my future post graduation and began taking general ed classes at my local college while continuing to work for the pharmacy. During my time working at this pharmacy I became a certified pharmacy technician and I also got to meet a lot of really good pharmacists/pharmacy managers who I had great relationships with. Eventually I decided to pursue pharmacy as my major. I continued to work ~25-30 hours per week while doing all of my pre-requisites and finally applying to pharmacy school 4 years later. There were ups and downs during my time working and going to school but I managed to get through it. After being accepted to pharmacy school I had to relocate and was unable to secure a position with the company in my new location. Unfortunately, during pharmacy school I did not secure a position post graduation, and decided against doing a residency. Now, having completed my degree and having moved back to my home town I went from student to being unemployed. At first I told myself to focus on my boards and to apply for intern positions and to keep my fingers crossed for something to open up. 1 month went by with no luck, and my MPJE was coming up the following week. I took the exam - passed and continued to study for the NAPLEX while continuing to send out applications. After a couple of weeks of applying and studying for the NAPLEX I gave up trying to find intern positions and just focused on passing this exam and becoming licensed as I thought this would allow me to find employment faster. I passed the exam and now I am a licensed pharmacist. I have done numerous online applications and have contacted all of the DMs of the big retail pharmacies in town. I don't get anything back from the online applications and the DMs just tell me that they will keep my info on hand in case a position opens up in this area. Since my options here in the city are dried up I am now facing having to relocate and find opportunities elsewhere, or find some job to get me through and continue to hope something opens up here. Here are my questions:
-Have I exhausted all of my options in this area?
-Is my best next step to start emailing DMs outside of this area? and how would I approach them.
-Does my past experience as a technician count for anything?
-Is not having worked as an intern a downside that would keep employers from possibly hiring me?
-Once I do find a position, will I get some form of training or will I just be sent out to start working, I know I will at least have to learn the software.
I know this is a long message and I appreciate any input. Thanks.
Where do you live and are you willing to relocate? Retail pharmacists are a dime a dozen in most areas. Make sure your resume is well polished and to the point. Are you applying to the same chain you worked with before? Would any of your previous managers put in a good word for you?
I live in Fl, in the Tampa Bay Area, we have several pharmacy schools here so there are many students who just graduated/are becoming licensed. Yes, I applied to the same chain for which I worked and reached out to the DM but since I left the company the DM had changed. I have reached out to my previous managers and they surely put in a good word for me but unfortunately the DM did not have anything open. I want to stay in this area but I feel now that I have exhausted my options and this is why I came on here with my post.
Yea unfortunately this is the nature of a saturated market. My only advice to you is to continue applying and ask your your friends or classmates to see if they know of any openings. If you have loans and stuff due soon, I would try to relocate. It's only going to get worse.
have you tried independent pharmacy? I was in the same position as you when I graduated last year until I found an opening with an independent which gave some income
Usually I just read about people posting about their "unicorn" jobs on here
Truth is that many pharmacists are hurting right now and are underemployed or even unemployed
Thanks for the input
Whats the best way to approach independent pharmacies? Over the phone or walk-in and talk to them, there is a few independents in the area but I never really thought that they may be looking for help.
It makes me very annoyed that students are duped by these greedy schools into thinking all is fine...I have witnessed the over-saturation of pharmacy within the last 10 years...it's been rapid and with new schools opening up like rabid vultures, I only see this problem escalating...
are you oblivious to the fact that residencies are almost necessary and it's nearly impossible to find a hospital who will train you to be a clinical pharm ?!
its less to do with hating the job and more to do with work conditions and availability of jobs...the notion that healthcare jobs are plenty is not relevant anymore.
Yea....that was maybe true 15 years ago. Now days....there are so many mid-level providers that going to med school isn't even a sure thing with job security. Only do it if you love it. Don't go into the profession just for money or job security anymore.