Physicians vs. Dentists

[opel]

I was just reading the posts about the future of physicians which made me think of this, currently who makes more physicians or dentists? And if the salaries of physicians went down would'nt dentist salaries also go down? and would'nt pharmacists salaries go down and would'nt... you get the point
Most of the salaries of different professions depend on each other and so all salaries would go down! In other word do what you love and let everything else take care of it self.

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[ckent]

Not sure I get your logic about one profession's salary being "tied" to another. I can assure you though, that what physicians get paid has nothing to do with what dentists get paid and what pharmacists get paid, there are very different driving forces behind each one of those salaries in terms of compensation. It's interesting that you should ask who gets paid more though, because some dentists can make a lot more then some physicians could ever make. I know that some dental students have posted salaries of endotists and orthodontists being in the 300,000-500,000 range (and I am inclined to believe that because I remember my bill for my orthodontic treatments when I was younger). Dentists also work far fewer hours too, and when the do have "call", they usually can take the call while they are home and usually don't have to do anything for it. I know that a lot of dentists work 4 days/week, 30 some hours a week, and make a hefty salary. They are not as bound to politics either, because I don't think medicare or medicaid pays for dental procedures, and most people pay for their dentistry care out of pocket leaving most dentists to charge whatever they want. I have my own reasons of why I would never consider going to dental school, but everybody has their own ideal career and medicine is obviously not for everybody.

 

[none]

Whoa! They certainly do have similiar driving forces behind them! And those forces are known, affectionately, as HMOs.

 

[deva]

I'm pretty sure that, in general, physicians get paid more than dentists, although there are some exceptions, as already noted.

One issue is this: Why do physicians make more than dentists even though the education costs, etc of becoming a physician or dentist are similar? One reason is a restriction to entry in the field of medicine (it is harder to get into med school), which increases monopoly power. If anyone out there is an economics major, I'm sure you understand these issues much better than I do (I am only taking economics of health care now), so feel free to comment, correct me, whatever

 

[deva]

I just realized that some people may think that my statement above is offensive (when I said that medical school was harder to get into than dental school). Please don't attack me for this; I am not saying that doctors are better, more intelligent, more driven, whatever, than dentists. I was only saying what I remember from lecture. Honestly, I really don't know how difficult it is to get into dentistry programs.

 

[vixen]

hey deva, dental school gpa's a little lower than med school gpa's, but a lot of that has to do with a lot less people applying to dentistry than medicine (dent is less popular). Also, there are only 55 dental schools in the country...I don't know how many med schools there are...us predents are less in numbers. I don't know what the ave FP or what the ave gen dentist makes, but I think they're pretty close. Like ckent said, the lifestyle of a dentist is a lot more likable though.

 

[ehop24]

regarding incomes, according one of those governing bodies that measures salaries, the median (or average, not sure which) income for a general dentist exceeds that of a general physician. apparently, 2001 was the first year that this has happened, but they expect the trend to continue in the future. a large portion of the blame lies in the fact that dentistry has managed to distance itself more from hmo's. sorry i cant remember the exact publication.

 

[darkmatter]

Dentistry is probably the most financially stable job, but not a profession that pays higher than a general physician. The good thing about medicine though is that you have a variety of options when it comes to specialization (and "upgrading" your career).

 

[bald]

My uncle is an oral surgeon, and i would wager he does better than most physicians. granted, he is not your typical dental graduate. he said the dentists didnt jump on the HMO bandwagon with physicians, and as a result, their salaries have suffered less.

 

[Lavndrrose]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't oral surgeons MDs?? You go to medical school to become an oral surgeon, not dentistry school?

Okay I might be wrong...anyone??

While I was doing a search, I found a DDS that offerred Facial Aesthetics (i.e., laser skin resurfacing). Just curious...since when were dentists trained to perform this? Or is there some special training that they can go through?

 

[CaliBoy]

I have to say that I believe that dental school is easier to get into than medical school. My roommate is a pre-dent and has a much lower GPA than I do, almost zero ECs, and minimal research, and has already been accepted at several very big name schools. Even he is suprised at how much easier it is than he thought. Yes, this is just one applicant I'm going by in my comparison, but interpret that how you may.

 

[Whisker Barrel Cortex]

A few answers:

Almost all oral surgeons go to dental school first. Some do an oral surgery residency right after getting their DDS and then start practicing. Some go into programs where they do 2 years of med school after dental school, get an MD, then do their residency.

Dental schools are definitely easier to get into than med schools. Don't ask me how I know, I just do.

I think that the average salary for dentists is lower than the average physician (I've seen the stats at several sites). I would believe, however, that general dentists make as much as the average FP, general internal med, and peds docs. I also know that endo, orhtodontics, and oral surgeons make as much as or more than many of the higher paid medical subspecialties. The reason for the difference in total average income is because a lot higher proportion of med students go into specialties than dentists.

 

[vixen]

caliboy, like I said, a lot less people apply to dental school making the gpa's lower etc. dental school is by far less popular than med school.

dark matter, you can "upgrade" your dental career also...there are many specialties...general dentistry, oral/maxillofacial surgery, orthodontics, prosthodontics, periodontics, pedatric dentistry, oral biology/pathology, endodontics, comm. and preventive dentistry, etc.

whisker bc,

I agree with you that physicians didn't join the HMO bandwagon...more like forced into it. Luckily dentistry hasn't been affected as much, for the obvious reasons you've stated.

 

[praying mantis]

My dad is an oral surgeon and has an DDS degree. I know that many new oral surgeons are now getting an MD. But I think this is a new thing, b/c all the oral surgeons I know (graduating in the 60's and 70's) have either DDS or DMD degrees.

 

[vixen]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by bald:
• •••quote:•••Originally posted by vixen:
•
I agree with you that physicians didn't join the HMO bandwagon...more like forced into it. Luckily dentistry hasn't been affected as much, for the obvious reasons you've stated.•••••good lord. you people take everything so literally. my statement is not "totally incorrect." i didnt meant to imply that they got on willingly, only that they ended up there, and the dentists didnt. i made no attempt to explain why - that wasnt the point of the discussion. the discussion was about salaries, and this was relevant. how doc's ended up there and dds' didnt is not relevant. go find something to do. although, i suppose if i'm not looking for people with nothing better to do that make 394 posts on a www msg board, i shouldnt be here in the first place - my mistake.

bald•••••dude, 394 posts is nothin! <img border="0" alt="[Laughy]" title="" src="graemlins/laughy.gif" /> looks like someone needs to chill out <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="eek.gif" /> :wink:

 

[shorrin]

here is an interesting article about pharm schools increasing thier number seats due an increase in the need for pharms. The pharmD deficit has driven up salaries for pharms. It's a buyers market for them right now.
<a href="http://www.cnn.com/2002/fyi/teachers.ednews/04/04/pharmacist.shortage.ap/index.html" target="_blank">http://www.cnn.com/2002/fyi/teachers.ednews/04/04/pharmacist.shortage.ap/index.html</a>

 

[Whisker Barrel Cortex]

bald,

You are right, I am above personal insults and I have removed the posts above. I would, however, like to point out, that the personal attacks began with your insults about people who post here often not having a life and calling me a " a gunner pointing out irrelevant mistakes made in class only in attempt to demonstrate their mastery of useless details."

I just hope this thread has taught you the importance of paying attention to what you write (as I have learned as well). Your phrasing in the original post, however randomly you chose it, gave the wrong impression and I wanted to correct it (not everyone is as knowledgable about HMOs as you are).

As for my comment on the thickness of your skin, I stand by it. If your reaction to someone commenting on something you wrote is indicative of your reaction to criticism in general (even if you think it is a trivial point), you will be constantly angry at residents and attendings during your clinical rotations.

Peace. Go out and have a good time tonight, I know I will (thanks to your advice on going out and doing something).