PM&R and D.O.

Discussion in 'PM&R' started by Vash311, May 14, 2002.

  1. Vash311

    Vash311 Senior Member
    10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Feb 9, 2002
    Messages:
    104
    Likes Received:
    0
    Would this combination be very ideal with the training osteopathic student receive in OMM...also, what are the hours, lifestyle, satisfaction (a reach, I know, for answering, but just a guesstimate would be cool) and compensation like? Thanks!
     
  2. Note: SDN Members do not see this ad.

  3. Ligament

    Ligament Interventional Pain Management
    Physician Lifetime Donor SDN Advisor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2002
    Messages:
    4,754
    Likes Received:
    1,126
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    If you are a DO and do a PM&R residency you are set up for a very effective and very lucrative practice as long as you use your OMM.

    I am going into PM&R and many of the residencies I saw actually teach Manual Medicine (OMM) to their residents, MD and DO!

    The University of Michigan PM&R run Spine Program/Center actually uses alot of Manual Medicine. BTW, they learned it from Phil Greenman at Michigan State.

    check out the link here:
    http://www.med.umich.edu/pmr/spine/manual.htm

    Keep in mind that UofM is an allopathic program.

    Northwestern's Rehab Institute of Chicago also teaches OMM to the residents, taught by OMM fellows from CCOM. In addition, the residency director is a DO.

    Michigan State's PM&R program is also reportedly heavy on Manual Medicine.

    regards.
     
  4. bigfrank

    bigfrank SDN Donor
    7+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2002
    Messages:
    2,067
    Likes Received:
    7
    Can anyone comment on the salary of a PM & R doc that specialiazes in outpatient medicine?

    And, specifically, WHERE are the jobs?
     
  5. Ligament

    Ligament Interventional Pain Management
    Physician Lifetime Donor SDN Advisor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2002
    Messages:
    4,754
    Likes Received:
    1,126
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    PM&R doc in outpatient medicine: there is very little published info on this. What I have learned from asking docs in practice: 150k to 700k, depending on the procedures you do. EMG's and Spinal/Joint injections and Pain Managment procedures such as plexus blocks and spinal pumps can pay alot.

    Everybody I have talked to that makes alot have told me they take little to NO call.

    The opportunties are just about everywhere. There are very few PM&R docs in the first place and even fewer do an outpatient practice.

    ****, man, open your own practice and live anywhere you want!!!
     
  6. Ligament,

    Did you say 700k! I'm not disputing your facts, but seriously considering a change when I apply for residency next year. Suddenly, ENT seems less lucrative and a whole lot more tiring.

    As we've discussed before on another thread, it's hard to get an idea for how much money you'll make in a given field b/c the averages and the high/lows vary so much. If PM&R docs have the ability to make even 300k+, let alone 700k, why does the average hover around 140? Who is so content/lazy/stupid not to exploit the opportunities? I don't understand.
    :p
     
  7. droliver

    Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    May 1, 2001
    Messages:
    1,556
    Likes Received:
    72
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    I wouldn't count on the the pain mangement business always being such a lucrative field, talking to some of the anesthesia groups in town it sounds like that field is another area being targeted by the feds for slashing reimbursement
     
  8. Ligament

    Ligament Interventional Pain Management
    Physician Lifetime Donor SDN Advisor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2002
    Messages:
    4,754
    Likes Received:
    1,126
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    yeah I would say that reimbursement may very well get slashed, but it will still pay well, all in all.

    Furthermore if you do an outpatient muskuloskeletal practice, just dont take medicare/medicaid and you dont have to worry about the feds.

    To top that, take no insurance at all and take cash only. You will then be able to afford pro bono cases.

    http://www.aapsonline.org/

    It is possible, especially if you do manual medicine too.

    I would like to say that the 700k figure was near the top end that anybody told me they pulled down. I would not say it is common.

    However, income in the high 200's to mid 300's was pretty common.

    I would like to stress that this is for outpatient, private muskuloskeletal and or pain practice. Not inpatient rehab work.

    And as with anything, in five years these guys may be making 100k, or maybe averaging 500k. The point is do what you love, you cant count on the money.

    regards.
     
  9. drusso

    Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 1998
    Messages:
    6,844
    Likes Received:
    2,035
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    I'm a D.O. and a OMM fellow and will begin my PM&R residency at Mayo in 2003. It's a great field, but $700K is definitely the top 2% of earners in rehab. Most of the physiatrists doing sports, spine, pain, occ med, electrodiagnostics, and musculoskeletal kinds of practices are in the 200K neighborhood. Plus, many physiatrists become partners in ortho groups, medical directors of rehab units, co-owners of outpatient rehab facilities, or imaging centers. The typical (non-business minded) physiatrist does a little better than primary care---$140K or so and probably mixes inpatient and outpatient practice.

    That said, we're talking about a specialty with minimal call (ever hear of a rehab emergency?), low malpractice (unless doing interventional stuff), and all-in-all a great lifestyle. I know few physiatrists working more than 40-50 hours per week.

    One of the nice things about PM&R is that you can set up your practice so you get out from under the thumb of the insurance companies by doing sports medicine, performing arts medicine, occ med consulting, manual medicine, disability work, medicolegal work, etc.

    I think up till now it's been one of the best kept secrets in medicine. Things are changing though, the last PM&R match was one of the most competitive in recent history and top programs saw increases in applicants of about 15-20%.
     
  10. drusso

    Physician Moderator Emeritus Lifetime Donor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 1998
    Messages:
    6,844
    Likes Received:
    2,035
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    If you're a DO and you paid attention and practiced your OMM in school and on rotations then, in a word, yes. If you're a DO and you scoffed at your OMM training and just twiddled your thumbs in class to pass the time then you have little more to offer than a MD.
     
  11. Ligament

    Ligament Interventional Pain Management
    Physician Lifetime Donor SDN Advisor Classifieds Approved 10+ Year Member

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2002
    Messages:
    4,754
    Likes Received:
    1,126
    Status:
    Attending Physician
    I agree 100% with Dr. Russo.

    Regards, Ligament
     

Share This Page