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Podiatry

Discussion in 'Clinicians [ RN / NP / PA ]' started by efs, Nov 12, 2001.

  1. efs

    efs SDN Advisor SDN Advisor 10+ Year Member

    457
    1
    Jul 20, 2001
    Germany
    It's nice to see a bit more traffic. Sorry there were only a couple threads, but there doesn't seem to be much interest. I think this is due to the small number of DPM and Pre-DPM students on this site. I'd be glad to add my thoughts, comments, etc if there is interest.

    Sandj made some good comments, but I think they ought to be tempered a bit. Yes, there are problems in podiatry; but focusing solely on the negativity can also be counter-productive. If you really want more than your fill of negativity go read the stuff on Forum 54. In fact, it would probably be a good idea if you are contemplating this field. BUT, keep in mind that most of what is there is one-sided. The vast majority of DPMs are doing well, and don't see much point to spending time on a site like that. Take the time to find a local podiatrist or three and spend some time with them. See the clinics, see what they do, talk to their patients, etc. as well.

    For a little background, I spent >10 years in health care prior to decided to go into podiatry. A majority of my classmates have some "real world" experience before school. I also have very strong libertarian leanings, so this often colors my point of view. Personal responsibility is critical. I see little to know reason why anyone should believe that the schools are out to defraud the students. First of all I have seen none of it at my school. I have not seen any students who obviously do not have what it takes to get through the curriculum. For myself and from those who would talk, we have MCAT scores and GPAs that are on par with the DOs at our school, and good enough for most MD programs. As far as personal responsibility, each student should have done some research prior to matriculating. Know what you are getting into. We all had long talks with the folks in financial aid, on more than one occasion, telling us what we could expect. So far, I haven't seen anything that would indicate they lied.

    Problems within the profession. These "downward" trends that you talk about . . . I just don't see most of it. If you take some time to look into the history of the profession, the trends are going up. Problems with low student numbers . . . see the same issues discussed in JAPMA 20 years ago. Problems with residencies . . . 20 years ago there were not enough residencies to go around. In fact, they weren't even required most places. We have moved the bar up. The issue now is around standardizing the residencies. WIth the number of students now, there are more residency slots than students. (Libertarian thought here.) The market forces will adjust this. The non-competetive residencies will end up closing if nobody looks for them. The ones that are left are higher quality. With a bit more time, I expect that the stadnardized residencies will include the surgical training that students (the market) demand. Don't expect it to happen overnight, but look at where podiatry was 20-30 years aago and then consider where it will be in another 20-30 years. Now, who is going to move it there? Gotta be us.

    I've got some reading to do now, but I'll be keeping an eye ont his forum.

    More later.
     
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  3. studentpod

    studentpod Junior Member

    7
    0
    Jan 18, 2001
    I seem to be taking too many of these study breaks lately? Anyway, I would be more than happy to help answer any questions that anyone has about the profession. However, I have no idea what to say about the future of the profession. On the whole, I feel pretty good about the career choice that I have made. So far, I have enjoyed all of my clinical experiences to date; even it was only palliative care. Yes, I definitely believe that podiatry has made huge steps towards being accepted as a medical profession, but I really feel that we need to set a standard of care and a decide what we (as a whole) want to do before we can go on. As EFS/Eric stated previously, osteopaths were once considered a cult, and now, they have evolved into mainstream medicine, on par with allopathic medicine. On the other hand, chiropractors, which have also been around forever, have decided to stay away from mainstream medicine, benefit from being considered alternative care. Podiatrists have definitely made significant changes in modern medicine such as being pioneers in office based surgery, are now trying to get into hospital programs and are pushing for privileges we probably don?t need, but want, in order to try to attain legitimacy with our MD peers. What is the best way to go? Who knows? From what I have seen at Scholl, about 1/3 of the class is interested in pursuing academic type programs at high profile hospitals that are multi-year surgical programs, about 1/3 of the class want to do programs which are 0% academic and which focus on ?real world? podiatry (I believe these to be the non-competitive residencies, which focus on FF surgery, nail procedures, palliative care, general pod med,) and the last 1/3 of the class has no interest in picking up a scalpel ever again and wish to develop a career in reducing nails. Multiply this by 10 years and you have our current APMA leaders. Some want podiatry to become predominately a surgical career. This would probably help in the admissions dept as well as in becoming mainstream, but I?m also sure that there are those that want to keep doing HDS surgery and nail procedures. The only way that this issue can be addressed is by assuring that all graduates attain the same type of residency, and have access to the same type of training, so that ten years down the road, when the new board certification rules are drawn, no one can be left out in the cold. Well, this is probably just a repeat of what you all heard somewhere else. Enjoy.
     
  4. studentpod

    studentpod Junior Member

    7
    0
    Jan 18, 2001
    As for the feeling of being lied to by the schools?etc, I knew what I was getting into before I signed on the dotted line, as did most others. Interestingly enough, I have noticed that some of the younger students feel more like they are being cheated somehow or another. Either they didn?t do the homework, of were somehow expecting something totally different from pod school. Personally, I didn?t apply to any other types of programs (MD, DO, PhD?) and I feel that I could have made it in, as could many of my classmates. I really believe that many of my classmates were definitely aware of what podiatry was prior to applying, whether they knew a DPM, had DPM?s for parents, or maybe have had foot problems themselves. Personally, I just wish the schools were more affordable, possibly becoming state institutions?.but I?m of course just dreaming.
     
  5. sandj9397

    sandj9397 Member 10+ Year Member

    83
    0
    Feb 8, 2001
    I wonder if your schools are the norm becauseI knew at NYCPM students had a MCAT avg of 20 according to the dean of admissions was around a twenty with a GPA of 3.4
    Possibly every podiatry school varies. Its fair to quote cycles that have existed in the past, but twenty years ago we did not have HMOs guys. Tell the insurance companies to pay podiatrists what they deserve for their length of training and expertise. Medicine is different, twenty years ago we did not need residencies or insurances to earn a living. Now DPMs do? They have not increased our scope of practice just our length of training. Application decline has happened before but have the numbers been this low? NO WAY
    There has to be something wrong for noone to be interested in applying. How can a negative trend not exist if noone wants to become a podiatrist anymore?

    ( Excuse the network 54 like posts but this forum needs something....)
     
  6. sandj9397

    sandj9397 Member 10+ Year Member

    83
    0
    Feb 8, 2001
    Eric, your school must have some excellent students. I am not trying to say the pod student is incapapble of perfoming in med school, just from my experience I have seen students who failed multiple classes. But the schools would not let them go, constantly giving them reavaluations or retakes of test. It was amazing to see these kids who could not grasp anything struggle, crying, spending hundreds of dollars on additional tutoring and still fail and still be there next semester failing again unti they finally give up thousands in the hole leaving pod school to pursue other endeavors. It might be nice and rosy at some schools, but at NYCPM its not. I can not beleive you do not what have one student in your estimation incapable of handling the curriculum. It seems like DMU and NYCPM are different worlds.
     
  7. cg2a93

    cg2a93 Senior Member 10+ Year Member

    137
    0
    Jul 24, 2001
    TX
    Sandj9397, I am a third year at NYCPM and although you were there for 2 years I disagree with you about your assesement of the school on certain points. From my experiences I have seen the school fail peolple and not allow them to continue because they have failed the classs. They allow you to take a reeval if you have less than 70 but more than a 65. If you fail the reeval you have to take the class in summer school, fail summer school you cant continue. I have seen this on many occasions. The school give you every opportunity to pass, but if you dont it is not there fault it is yours.
    Overall my experience at NYCPM is good not great, but good. I have learned so much and enjoy what I do. I dont have a negative attitude because all the Docs I know are doing well and love what they do. I realize there are websites out there that bash podiatry, but I cant be concerned with that because the people who claim to be podiatrist have entirely to much time on their hands and I know that they are a very small minority.
     
  8. efs

    efs SDN Advisor SDN Advisor 10+ Year Member

    457
    1
    Jul 20, 2001
    Germany
     
  9. sandj9397

    sandj9397 Member 10+ Year Member

    83
    0
    Feb 8, 2001
    Guys my main motive here is to draw people into this section. I am overly negative on purpose. So far I have drawn in one additional student. I know you guys read this forum but only a handful post anything. Nowadays, only the really negative material receives any attention (hence, my strategy) I believe eric had a post once on this board which lasted over a week. Come on everybody! Jump in and help this forum out. Hey the message, efs has handled himself or herself completely differently than you. Remember the argument when I tried the bashing months ago.

    Just curious, have they changed the residency system yet and are other schools allowed to join NYCPMs md program? If the answer to the latter is yes, have any students in your classes signed up?
    Later guys
     
  10. efs

    efs SDN Advisor SDN Advisor 10+ Year Member

    457
    1
    Jul 20, 2001
    Germany
    sandj,
    I understand and appreciate what you are trying to do. From my point of view it is giving me a bit of a sounding board.

    I do recall one of my posts recieving no comments. Of course it managed about the same on the other forum. Maybe in part that is because this is listed as a Pre-DPM forum rather than a DPM forum. Maybe in part it is because there are not very many DPM students. Maybe in part it is because most of them are not on this board. Maybe that is becuase most of them feel they have better things to do. (I don't think it takes much of my time.)

    Residency system is still being worked over. I don't expect to see it completely changed before I am in it. Probably not unitl after I am out of it. But it is changing, a bit at a time.

    I don't know that any other school has been offered a chance to participate in the NYCPM md program. But, why would they want to? Honestly, I can't think of any students in my class that would participate if it were possible. And, is it possible? I don't think it has done anything for NYCPM yet. Except maybe make people think twice about how they are going about "recruiting". Don't seem to remember my school recruiting. In fact all three of the schools that I applied to, I made contact with them first.

    Thanks.
     

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