Possibly the most epic piece I've ever seen about a medical career

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rekrul

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I was trolling the dark corners of the net yesterday and came across the following post on a "game" (no, lvl100 Warlock, not that kind of game) forum. Aside from the language and rather psychopathic mentality , this is so full of win and so perfectly describes some brutal truths that I had to share it here, lol. This also more or less convinced me full-stop to do EM :laugh:

Hi guys, long time lurker here. I’ve seen a lot of discussions lately centered around the concept of young dudes wanting to travel the world after putting in a good 10 or so years of work in the West. With that in mind, I thought I’d pitch in and write a not-so-brief synopsis on how a medical career-that is, becoming a physician-could fit that bill. How to become a doctor is no secret: get into medical school. This thread will focus on the "why," because I feel that many people have a fixed idea of what being a doctor entails that doesn't have to necessarily hold true. Brief disclaimer: this thread is directed more so at dudes still in college, and furthermore only that subset of them that has at least some interest in science and-most importantly-is good at test taking. Also, you best be American or Canadian. I’m sure medicine (read: $$$) is not far too different in the UK and Australia but your mileage may vary. If you’re not in the Anglosphere at all, forget about it from a monetary perspective.

Another disclaimer: I’m not a physician nor am I even a med student. In fact I hope to never attend med school as I’ll be the first to admit that there are better ways to spend one’s twenties than memorizing every ******ed little bone and blood vessel in the body. My plan A is to get an expat position and/or start a business in Asia; however that is a high risk proposition so med school is my backup plan. To that end, I’ve done the whole premed thing, shadowed physicians, done medical volunteering, taken the MCAT, and applied to medical schools. In fact I have a couple of med school interviews scheduled for later this year. More importantly, I’ve spent literally hundreds of hours doing due diligence on what one can expect from a career in medicine and how one can contort the idea of “medicine as a calling” to “medicine as an enabler of the global player lifestyle," which is ultimately what I want.

That last sentence is basically the crux of the matter. You’re probably thinking, “yes, doctors make $$$ but it comes at the price of having no life. “ This is true for many but doesn't have to be true for you. Medicine can definitely be a slog. I’m not trying to argue in this thread that it's the ultimate or even “good” life strategy for aspiring international players. Frankly, if you want to escape the West just do it asap. As a young guy you have time to figure **** out. However, if you're dead set on taking the "work now play later" approach of staying in the West initially, there are worse ways to go than becoming a physician. One of those worse ways is thinking you're gonna get an accounting or engineering degree and slave away for 10 to 15 years so that you can save what…300k? 500k? and live and travel off that puny sum.

With that out of the way, I'll get to some basics. The way medicine (in USA) works is that after college you enroll in medical school, which lasts 4 years. So ideally, you finish your official schooling at a fresh and spry 26. Bad news? You’re not done yet. For all intents and purposes, graduating medical school does not mean you can practice medicine. After your second year of med school, you take the USMLE, which is a test of the basic sciences you learned in those first 2 years. Based on your score on that test as well as grades, research, and networking skills, you then choose a specialty and apply for residencies in that specialty. This process can get dicey: if you’re dead set on becoming a plastic surgeon for example you better be the smartest person you’ve ever met, because you’ll have to be in the top 5% or so of your class(in practice, this means you’ll have to score in the top 5% on the USMLE). Now in general whenever someone says “top 5%” this doesn’t mean very much because when you look at a random group of people chances are you’ve got to go past 80-85th percentile just to get to those who are merely “somewhat competent.” Do remember though that medical students are already highly selected so that top 5% is really “top 5% of the top 5%.” You get the point. In any case, the good news is, as you’ll see in a bit you probably don’t want to be a plastic surgeon anyway.

Moving on. Let’s say you’ve done well enough on the USMLE to get your choice of specialties. Now you’ve got to decide what you want out of life. There is a huge difference between an orthopedic spine surgeon fusing the vertebrae in Payton Manning’s neck and a family doctor “prescribing” cough drops for an insufferable brat with a mild cold or telling a 300lb land whale that one step they could take to improve their health is lose a few pounds. If you really like the surgical specialties for the “coolness” factor (and the ridiculous salaries: no reason you can’t eventually be making $1m a year as a spine surgeon although $700k is more usual) then be prepared to treat medicine as a calling. But let’s assume that even at this point, we’re still treating a medical career same as before we started the process: as a means towards an end (the lifestyle we want) rather than an end in itself.

Let’s backtrack. What is residency, anyway? It’s basically like an apprenticeship. After medical school you apply to a residency program-let’s say it’s a general surgery residency at New York Memorial Hospital, or whatever. Since in this example the specialty is general surgery, the residency lasts 5 years. During these 5 years you’re getting worked like a dog and are making 60-70k a year. The hours are brutal (especially if it’s surgery) and the pay sucks, so 5 years is a lot, isn’t it? Yep, especially since each year of residency is costing you the difference between resident pay (60k) and attending pay (varies but could be as much as 500k even just starting out.) So ideally your perfect “lifestyle” specialty has the shortest residency possible so you start raking in the big bucks as soon as you can, at the youngest you can.

So, you want to look at those specialties with the shortest residencies. Also, you want to be able to **** off to wherever for however long you want on a whim, right? So you want shift work- you don't want specialties where you have to “build a practice,” i.e. accumulate a patient base that is relying on you and to whom you must be available round the clock. So forget **** like dermatology, cardiology, (most) surgery, etc. Finally, you of course want to get $PAID$ for the shifts you put in. With all that said, there is one specialty that is basically a no-brainer:

Emergency Medicine.

That’s right, working in the E.R. Here’s why:
First, the residency is “short” at just 3 years. A couple other specialties are also 3 years but none is less than 3. So in an ideal scenario, you graduate med school at 26 and finish up your EM residency at 29. Yeah, that ain’t that young and you’re probably behind your peers who have been in the workforce for the past 7 years, but don’t worry. You’ve put in the work and are now a financial Usain Bolt, ready to leapfrog a whole bunch of fat sluggish mother****ers who happened to get a pathetically insufficient head start on you.

Anyway, it’s not even as bad as all that. We still haven't even mentioned moonlighting. Rules about this vary, but choose your residency program wisely and you can start moonlighting your second year of residency, i.e. at the age of 27. What is moonlighting? Well, hospitals and especially emergency rooms need to be open 24/7, for obvious reasons. You’d need to employ a lot of full time dudes to make sure that the round the clock coverage is always in effect, so inevitably there are gaps in coverage. Hospitals are often desperate to fill these gaps in their schedules when somebody takes vacation, goes on leave, etc. Desperate enough to pay YOU, a lowly resident, big bucks to fill those shifts. You can easily expect to make around $200/hr moonlighting. Shifts vary from 8-12 hours depending on the hospital. You’ll be dead tired from residency and the last thing you’ll want to do is MORE work, but just do the math. Force yourself to work even 2 or 3 12-hr moonlighting shifts a month and you’re looking at a yearly bonus of $80-90,000 on top of your measly resident salary. All in all, you can reasonably expect to make 160k a year starting your second year of residency so at 27 you're already making progress, buddy!

But enough about residency, let’s consider your life as a fully-fledged attending physician. I’m going to continue assuming we’re interested in leaving America behind, since we’re intimidated by strong, independent women and feel the need to slum it with young, naïve, easily- controlled foreign girls
rolleyes.gif
. Well, now you’ve got some more choices to make. Do you want to (immediately!) live a moderately affluent life in SEA or EE, or do you want to work hard for a few years and ball out? Let’s say the former for now. Good thing about EM (and physician shift work in general) is locum-tenens and moonlighting work. Locum-tenens is simply short term contract work: you go to bum**** nowhere, Texas, and since it’s a brief stint where they’re desperate for coverage and it’s in bum**** nowhere, you get that pleasant $300/hr rate. Nice. Your contract is for 4 weeks where you work 20 12hr shifts and make $72,000. Very nice! Now you can fuk off for a while if you so choose and you've only worked a month.

Now, are you always going to be able to find such contracts, back to back? Yep, you probably could, although getting $300hr consistently may be a stretch. Something like $250 is more the norm. It’s a moot point though, because you probably won’t want to work that much. The average EM physician works fewer than 14 shifts a month and it’s for a reason, namely that those shifts are exhausting physically and mentally. Those hypothetical 20 12hr shifts in one month are something you could probably do for a few months at a stretch as a young dude just out of residency but it’s not sustainable for the long run…so they say.

So let’s step back and take a look at the broader picture. You’re now 29. You’ve done moonlighting for the last 2 years of residency and hopefully paid off your med school debt with the proceeds. Your income potential is around $3000 a day (assuming a middle of the road $250/hr but gruesome 12 hr shifts). You can work as much or as little as you wish, wherever you wish, so long as you apply for the requisite state medical licenses. If you choose to get a steady job in Texas (generally best state for physician compensation) you will make $400k a year on roughly 13-15 8hr shifts a month. Do some moonlighting above and beyond that and you can make $500-600k without stretching yourself too much, or up to $700k if you go full-on kamikaze mode. Let’s say that first year out of residency you put in the time and make $600k. Congrats, you’ve almost caught up to your accountant and engineer friends (let’s be generous and say that their first 8 years income out of college looked like this: 60+70+80+90+100+110+120+130=$760,000). Of course, you added( 600k-tax-1 year living expense) to your bank account, whereas they added (760k-tax-8 years living expenses) to their accounts. Chances are you’re ahead, even taking compounding investment returns into account.

I can easily live on less than 20k a year in USA especially when working like a madman, and so can you when you keep your goals in mind. After that first year of full time work you put away roughly 350k after tax and living expenses into the bank and you’ve just turned 30. Now you’re ready to **** off to wherever you want for 3 months before coming back for another 1 month locum-tenens contract. You’ve got decent capital already and you know you can always get more so you’re not risk averse. Invest that money in your ***** paradise and become a somebody. Hell, you’re an American trained doctor for chrissakes, the business opportunities are endless both home and abroad. You’re ****ing set, more or less, because you’re always just a week of 12hr ER shifts away from another $15,000.

Now compare your situation to that of an average working stiff 8 years into his career. Moral of this story: if you’re a college kid and you’re thinking that the path you want to take is to invest your 20s and early 30’s into a career here in the West rather than jetting off to your ***** paradise right off the bat, seriously consider medicine. Unless, of course, you go to HYPS and have an inside track for a Wall Street job, in which case you already know to disregard this without me having to tell you.

Some concluding disclaimers: the situation I’ve described is very uncommon in medicine. Most doctors are blue pill as hell, have families, and care deeply for the patients. Moreover, they’ve grown fat and happy and hustling is not their forte. They’d rather work within the same 20 mile radius to stay close to the wife and kids than jet around the country in pursuit of those 300/hr contracts. The jobs I described are like the “Canadian Oil Fields” of medicine. You’re not going to be paid $300/hr to work a 9-5 shift in NYC or LA.

Finally, and most importantly: all I wrote above is true for today and today only, and may not and almost certainly will not describe the situation 10 years from now. The US healthcare system is under intense financial pressure. Moreover, the corporate leeches and parasites have started to descend upon the medical profession. Consider this: When a dentist pulls a tooth, the dentist gets the money. When a plumber fixes the sink, the plumber gets the money. When the factory worker builds the car, the CEO and shareholders get the money and the worker gets crumbs. Why? Because the worker is part of a large organization and in large organizations the money is always sucked to the top. Medicine is undergoing a profound transformation. It is changing from a system where medical care is provided by physician owned practices. In such practices, physicians are both the providers of medical care and the owners of the business, so the money flows to them. Increasingly, gigantic “Healthcare Systems” have been assimilating these independent practices and turning doctors into hospital employees, cogs in a machine. In the eyes of the parasitic elite, for too long have doctors escaped relatively unscathed from the despoiling of the American economy by the vampire class. If 100 Orthopedic surgeons earn $200,000 a year instead of $500,000, then that means 30 million dollars was just freed up to go to the Healthcare System CEOs and the private equity firms behind them! There are other potential pitfalls that I won’t go into, but the takeaway is just be aware that today’s reality may be tomorrow’s wistful reminiscence. But that is true of the future period, not just medicine.

Anyway, I hope some of you found this interesting/useful. Hit me up if you have any questions.

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Can you expound upon "game" forum?
 
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Gross. I need a scalding shower with bleach after reading that.

I mean, kiddo isn't wrong about the opportunities that are available to him. He just doesn't seem to have a soul. Glad medicine is his plan B.
 
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http://www.rooshvforum.com/post-875511.html

seems like some PUA / red pill type forum, therefore op is dumb

Gee, thanks for the unsolicited personal attack. I tend to judge things based on the merit of their arguments rather than the source. If Pol Pot tells me 2+2=4 I ain't gonna front. I'm not into that community, but if I happen to stumble upon something that that resonates with me I'll give it credit, whether it comes from a game forum or a feminist blog.
 
Hahaha whoever wrote that is crazy. For some reason the way he described going all over the place to do locums work reminded me of the Mad Max movie that came out this summer.
 
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Man, I am so sick of hearing kids in their early 20's talking about stuff like this as if they have figured it all out. Come talk to me in ten to twenty years. :rolleyes: That whole thing was so thoroughly gross. He was being sarcastic when he said he's looking for "young, naïve, easily-controlled foreign girls," right? Please tell me that was sarcastic.

Also, can people who do not genuinely want to practice medicine please just withdraw their applications right now?
 
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This sounds like it was writer by Charlie Sheen MD...

That said is locum work really that common? It sounds kind of fun to me
 
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Dam.... there is some truth to what he wrote. But, yea its also the mind of someone who is pretty much only focused on the money in medicine. I agree though, overall its a very cynical, gross statement on medicine.

He is right about money hungry greedy insurance companies etc though.

So..his points are pretty much moot to people who want to genuinely practice medicine.
 
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Dam.... there is some truth to what he wrote. But, yea its also the mind of someone who is pretty much only focused on the money in medicine. I agree though, overall its a very cynical, gross statement on medicine.

He is right about money hungry greedy insurance companies etc though.

So..his points are pretty much moot to people who want to genuinely practice medicine.

Agree. The most charitable interpretation of his writing is that he was contributing on a forum that catered towards lifestyle hacking and thus emphasized that aspect of medicine in his piece. Obviously if you are invited to speak at a conference about Physician Entrepreneurs your content will be different from one you would prepare for a conference on Social Justice and Medicine or what have you. At least that's the way I look at it, but for me the glass is always half full lol.

Anyway I posted this because if you strip away the offensive language the underlying analysis is pretty legit.
 
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Agree. The most charitable interpretation of his writing is that he was contributing on a forum that catered towards lifestyle hacking and thus emphasized that aspect of medicine in his piece. Obviously if you are invited to speak at a conference about Physician Entrepreneurs your content will be different from one you would prepare for a conference on Social Justice and Medicine or what have you. At least that's the way I look at it, but for me the glass is always half full lol.

Anyway I posted this because if you strip away the offensive language the underlying analysis is pretty legit.
what exactly is the underlying analysis? that if you do locums EM work you can make a lot of money? sex tourism schemes like this might sound appealing if you're starved for women as i imagine you are since youre on a PUA forum. but life happens along the way, watch when you're 2 cars picket fencing it
 
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I'm considering locums later on, but for very different reasons than the original poster. I would do it because it opens up the opportunity to do research or global health more substantially.
 
what exactly is the underlying analysis? that if you do locums EM work you can make a lot of money? sex tourism schemes like this might sound appealing if you're starved for women as i imagine you are since youre on a PUA forum. but life happens along the way, watch when you're 2 cars picket fencing it

Take your puny insults and shove them up whatever hole you feel most comfortable with, friend. Better yet, build yourself a time machine and take a hike to Germany in 1939 or Stalin era USSR, whichever end of the political spectrum you prefer. Wouldn't want your tender sensibilities to be hurt by exposure to viewpoints you find distasteful. Or just cry to mommy. Whatever floats your boat.
 
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Take your puny insults and shove them up whatever hole you feel most comfortable with, friend. Better yet, build yourself a time machine and take a hike to Germany in 1939 or Stalin era USSR, whichever end of the political spectrum you prefer. Wouldn't want your tender sensibilities to be hurt by exposure to viewpoints you find distasteful. Or just cry to mommy. Whatever floats your boat.
b-b-but muh hypergamy... wahhh western women so mean

you're named after a starcraft player and browse PUA forums. but i genuinely believe you will lose your virginity shortly
 
Omg I laughed so hard reading all of that. TBH I've never wanted to go into EM more hahaha
 
b-b-but muh hypergamy... wahhh western women so mean

you're named after a starcraft player and browse PUA forums. but i genuinely believe you will lose your virginity shortly

Actually I'm named after a Poker player who happened to also play starcraft.

Btw, here is a useful link, too few people know about it it's quite a shame:
www.google.com

It will allow you to find relevant articles on the internet without manually browsing through forums. Wonderful technology and much overdue, really.
 
Some of that post is true, but he is woefully underselling the amount of debt that most people have from undergrad/med school and woefully overselling the moonlighting experience in residency.

The real world version is, you're going to be deep 6 figures in debt, you're going to be paying that s*** off for 15 years post-residency, and you're going to be making ~50K/yr in residency and not feeling like doing moonlighting shifts. I know there are some programs/departments that have sweet moonlighting setups, but even if you find one of these, you're looking at ~100Kish? Certainly not mid-100s.
 
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Some of that post is true, but he is woefully underselling the amount of debt that most people have from undergrad/med school and woefully overselling the moonlighting experience in residency.

The real world version is, you're going to be deep 6 figures in debt, you're going to be paying that s*** off for 15 years post-residency, and you're going to be making ~50K/yr in residency and not feeling like doing moonlighting shifts. I know there are some programs/departments that have sweet moonlighting setups, but even if you find one of these, you're looking at ~100Kish? Certainly not mid-100s.

I guess it really does depend on how much debt you have and how much scope you have to moonlight. Even if you're making 100k and keeping 60k of that after tax, that's still a decent amount of money to put into paying back loans. When I was in undergrad I spent under 10k a year for living expenses (rent+ food + misc.). I guess if you're really committed, you could throw around 80k into your loans over the last 2 years of residency. If you went to a relatively inexpensive state school and have no/few loans from undergrad, as many people do, best case scenario you're left with around 100k of debt after you complete your residency. At that point, if you really go all out for the first year doing locum tenens as per the OP, I think the numbers come out not too different than what the analysis there was getting at.
 
Some of that post is true, but he is woefully underselling the amount of debt that most people have from undergrad/med school and woefully overselling the moonlighting experience in residency.

The real world version is, you're going to be deep 6 figures in debt, you're going to be paying that s*** off for 15 years post-residency, and you're going to be making ~50K/yr in residency and not feeling like doing moonlighting shifts. I know there are some programs/departments that have sweet moonlighting setups, but even if you find one of these, you're looking at ~100Kish? Certainly not mid-100s.

People spend 15 years paying off $200,000?! :eek:
 
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Oh it's possible. I even have friends with situations similar to what you described (public school, scholarships, moonlighting, no kids, etc) graduate residency with no loan debt. I'm just saying for all the premeds out there thinking that that they could totally pull this off, that it's only a reasonable analysis for someone who hasn't actually gone through it (such as whoever the OP was).

And also, you would be miserable if you did this. Living in a s*****y apartment and drinking Natty Light is fine when you're in college and even your early twenties, but it starts to get old quick, and is only exacerbated by the stress of medical school/residency. At some point you start to realize it might be nice to sleep in a decent place and drink a decent beer when you get the chance.
 
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People spend 15 years paying off $200,000?! :eek:

Easily. And $200K is generous. Last I checked the avg debt was ~$250K? Might be more now. It's so depressing when you realize that like 95% of your monthly loan payment is interest and 5% is going towards the principal (all numbers made up, but not far from the truth).

Most people think (or at least I did) that, "oh, that's nothing, once I make an attending salary I'll pay that off in 2-3 years." But between school debt, car payments, house payments/rent, kids, being in a higher tax bracket, etc, it doesn't get paid off as fast as you think. Most repayment plans are 10-15 years, some longer. There are also a wide variety of programs that help you minimize your starting debt and/or repayment, ranging from the military to public service, etc etc. But those come with their own pluses and minuses.
 
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That's crazy! IDK, I guess I just have this fairytale-like vision where I'm going to be a single bachelor living in a small one bedroom apartment, eating top ramen, and saving my attending salary for 2 years and be 32 years old with zero debt and live the baller life. I'm sure it's much easier said than done though, especially considering lots of people usually get married and start having children around that time.

That's what I'm saying. The ratio of people who THINK they can do this to people who actually DO do it is quite high. It's because when you're in college or just finishing, you HAVE done it and it's not so terrible and you think you can keep doing it. But unless you're really obsessed with prioritizing money above everything else (which most of us aren't), it doesn't end up that way for all the reasons I mentioned and more. And if you're that obsessed with making money, then you've already made a mistake by choosing medicine.
 
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Easily. And $200K is generous. Last I checked the avg debt was ~$250K? Might be more now. It's so depressing when you realize that like 95% of your monthly loan payment is interest and 5% is going towards the principal (all numbers made up, but not far from the truth).

Most people think (or at least I did) that, "oh, that's nothing, once I make an attending salary I'll pay that off in 2-3 years." But between school debt, car payments, house payments/rent, kids, being in a higher tax bracket, etc, it doesn't get paid off as fast as you think. Most repayment plans are 10-15 years, some longer. There are also a wide variety of programs that help you minimize your starting debt and/or repayment, ranging from the military to public service, etc etc. But those come with their own pluses and minuses.


See, that's depressing to me. I'm definitely one of those guys who likes to think come 1st year of being an attending, it's going to be a balls to the wall effort to get rid of all that dam debt. For my tomorrow, I give my today and all that. Even the numbers themselves bear it out, as per the tax calculator a 500k income will result in 155k tax for a take home pay of roughly 320k once you factor in SS and pray that at least some states still have no income tax 7 years from now.

So my thinking is, I've lived with roommates since I can remember, I will certainly do so during medical school and residency out of necessity. Surely I can postpone getting that McMansion for one more year, right? So if I can pull in 500k gross, I should be able to pay off well over 200k in debt in that first year of being an attending.

That's what my dreams are made of, getting that debt gone the first year, and that's why the article appealed to me as much as it did. But at the same time it seems like the prevailing wisdom is that this almost never happens, and your post is one more data point to that effect. Back to reality, lol.

Edit: xyphr basically posted the same exact thing I was trying to say.
 
See, that's depressing to me. I'm definitely one of those guys who likes to think come 1st year of being an attending, it's going to be a balls to the wall effort to get rid of all that dam debt. For my tomorrow, I give my today and all that. Even the numbers themselves bear it out, as per the tax calculator a 500k income will result in 155k tax for a take home pay of roughly 320k once you factor in SS and pray that at least some states still have no income tax 7 years from now.

So my thinking is, I've lived with roommates since I can remember, I will certainly do so during medical school and residency out of necessity. Surely I can postpone getting that McMansion for one more year, right? So if I can pull in 500k gross, I should be able to pay off well over 200k in debt in that first year of being an attending.

That's what my dreams are made of, getting that debt gone the first year, and that's why the article appealed to me as much as it did. But at the same time it seems like the prevailing wisdom is that this almost never happens, and your post is one more data point to that effect. Back to reality, lol.

I think I may have come across as more doom-and-gloom than I wanted on the financial front. It's not that, because chances are as a physician you'll be able to live quite comfortably. And not everyone who is paying off med school loans 10 years down the line is doing it because they couldn't afford to do it earlier. It's just that they have decided to prioritize other things in life first (family, things, experiences, making money (if you have a low interest rate on your loans you might be better off investing your money rather than paying them off sooner), etc).

And I'm not advocating living above your means by any stretch. The principles of the article are sound (minimize expenses, maximize income), but the details are all wonky and super extreme as you might expect from somebody who hasn't been through it.

Also, just think about what your wants/desires were 8 years ago. Most of the people on this forum were probably worried about getting that new mountain bike or making the JV soccer team or getting to first base with Timmy/Tiffany. What makes you think the things you want right now will still be the same things you want 8 years in the future?
 
I see your point, but I think I'm a bit different in that regard. Right now, I work for a management consulting company and have a pretty decent income, but I still live in a $300/month apartment with roommates (albeit made easier by the fact I'm mostly out of the house traveling on business) and after I crashed my early 2000s Toyota I never got a replacement. Sure, I could move into a $1500/m studio and buy myself a new Mustang while applying to med school, but frankly seeing my bank account grow and debt shrink is far more satisfying. I just hope I can keep that same mentality into my late 20s and early 30s, but only time will tell.
 
Of everything that seems off throughout this post, I find the salary figures to be most misleading/unlikely.
 
Of everything that seems off throughout this post, I find the salary figures to be most misleading/unlikely.
The ortho spine is more realistic, the EM is a joke.

Edit: ortho still somewhat inflated. 700k/yr is definitely above average, with many academics making 350-600k.
Source: one parent in ortho-spine, one in neurosurg
 
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The ortho spine is more realistic, the EM is a joke.

Edit: ortho still somewhat inflated. 700k/yr is definitely above average, with many academics making 350-600k.
Source: one parent in ortho-spine, one in neurosurg

lol
 
Take your puny insults and shove them up whatever hole you feel most comfortable with, friend. Better yet, build yourself a time machine and take a hike to Germany in 1939 or Stalin era USSR, whichever end of the political spectrum you prefer. Wouldn't want your tender sensibilities to be hurt by exposure to viewpoints you find distasteful. Or just cry to mommy. Whatever floats your boat.
Oh sweet, sweet irony, I've missed you so.
 
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Not really sure what fallacy he's using (since it's been like 7 years since a philosophy of logic class,) but he disguises false and far-out-there claims with some basic truths. He got the parts on training correct (years of time it takes, the fact that you work like a dog in gen surg, the "best of the best," etc.) but to make assertions of how much you get paid, the moonlighting, the HUGE salary jump that you get from going from a resident to an attending physician is pretty much false (in general, non-extreme cases.)
 
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