Preliminary/transitional year - surgery

[Grohaila]

I am a FMG seriously looking into doing the transitional year in Surgery, but a non-surgical residency after that (Rad or RO). Although the favourable workmarket sour-graped them for the FMG.

I know people will think I'm bonkers, BUT, it's only one year, and you learn a lot. That is, if you get in.

So what spots would those be - surgery preliminary, nondesignated? What chance has a FMG of getting into one of those? Do you apply for "transitional year" under ERAS heading? Or surgery?

Inquiring minds want to know.

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[Winged Scapula]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by Grohaila:
•I am a FMG seriously looking into doing the transitional year in Surgery, but a non-surgical residency after that (Rad or RO). Although the favourable workmarket sour-graped them for the FMG.

I know people will think I'm bonkers, BUT, it's only one year, and you learn a lot. That is, if you get in.

So what spots would those be - surgery preliminary, nondesignated? What chance has a FMG of getting into one of those? Do you apply for "transitional year" under ERAS heading? Or surgery?

Inquiring minds want to know. •••••There is no "Transitional Year, Surgery". If you only want to do a year, you apply for "Preliminary Surgery" through ERAS. Most programs with a Categorical Surgery program will also have Preliminary spots. These are generally not very competitive (ie, only those going into surgical subspecialties who HAVE to do a Prelim year in Surgery tend to apply for them. Oh...and those crazy enough - like you! :wink: ).

 

[Grohaila]

Thanks for the reply.

Still, if say all prelim spots are pre-assigned (we have this many PGY2 positions, we need these many prelim surgeons), I could still end the odd man out ("These spots are not for non-surgical residents, dufus!").

I don't think I'm THAT crazy, two RadOnc biggies, breast (in the works) and prostate (well established), ask one to stick radioactive needles in folks. Head and neck cancers are also amenable to this type of approach (if you have a surgeon's hand :wink: ). Good surgical skills will be a bonus for the future radonc attending.

 

[Sevo]

You're interested in a preliminary surgery year.

They're pretty easy to come by. Several hundred were unfilled in the match this year. In fact, most of those positions were probably filled with FMGs.

And on a completely different note, I think by "crazy" Kimberli was referring to your desire to do a preliminary surgery year, not Rad-Onc.

 

[Grohaila]

I understood full well Queen Kimberly's message.
I wuz just trying to explain that "there's method to my madness".

That is, there are plenty of oncologists able to heel with juice, not so many able to heel with titanium (the coating of brachytherapy needles) - ergo, the future will be good for needle-pushers.

 

[Winged Scapula]

My comment about your "craziness" is the fact that, especially at university programs, you will not be gaining much in the way of surgical skills. Frankly, I think my IM colleagues do MUCH more "sticking needles" into people than I do - they more frequently have to draw blood or their patients, etc. I can see that the ability to do these techniques is helpful for Rad Onc - however, consider the following:

1) the amount of surgical skills you will gain by doing 1 Prelim Surgical year is not significant - regardless of the program

2) the skills you will gain, if any, are not likely to be relevant to your future practice

and 3) the skills you do gain may be lost by the time you actually start using them.

In the end, the literature finds that the amount of operating you do early on in a surgical residency (whether Prelim or not) does not make a significant difference in your skills at the end of your residency. But don't let me discourage you from doing a Surgical year.

As for Prelim spots being "pre-assigned" yes, some of these will be assigned to ENT, Uro, Ortho residents, etc. if the programs you apply to have these residencies. However, there are STILL HUNDREDS of open spots which were not pre-assigned or otherwise filled. I would not worry in the least about getting a Prelim Surgical spot should you want one.

 

[neutropeniaboy]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only reason I see to do a preliminary surgery year is that the skills you gain managing pre- and post-surgical patients will become relevant in later years of surgical residency (and beyond, perhaps).

The only other time I can think of when a preliminary surgical year may be helpful is when going on to anesthesia. And even then, there's a lot of medicine in anesthesia...

 

[Winged Scapula]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by neutropeniaboy:
•Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only reason I see to do a preliminary surgery year is that the skills you gain managing pre- and post-surgical patients will become relevant in later years of surgical residency (and beyond, perhaps).

The only other time I can think of when a preliminary surgical year may be helpful is when going on to anesthesia. And even then, there's a lot of medicine in anesthesia...•••••This IS my point - you spend the VAST majority of your time as a surgical intern (prelim or categorical) doing pre and post op management, NOT in the OR, doing procedures, etc. You can do just as many line starts, central line placements, etc. as a medicine resident without all the other pain of being a surgical resident.

 

[Future GI Guy]

Hey Kim,

Did you get my email?

Thanks.

Future GI Guy

 

[Winged Scapula]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by Future GI Guy:
•Hey Kim,

Did you get my email?

Thanks.

Future GI Guy•••••NO I didn't... please resend it. I would be glad to read it.