Profile of a rejected applicant

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medworm

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I don't know of any other way to euphemize this, but what's a typical profile of a rejected MD applicant? Below 30 on the MCAT, < 3.0 GPA, and few ECs? Just curious. We all have fears. Thanks.

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I didn't get accepted at USUHS the first time I applied with approximately a 3.3 overall, 3.0 sci, 32 MCAT (all at or above 10). I had few ECs.
 
MoosePilot said:
I didn't get accepted at USUHS the first time I applied with approximately a 3.3 overall, 3.0 sci, 32 MCAT (all at or above 10). I had few ECs.


aaahahaha

moose, ur such an underachiever...

thats funny...ull get in one day
 
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just a guess, but i'd say MCAT< 30 is too harsh. maybe MCAT< 25? i guess i'd probably say MCAT of less than 25 and GPA of less than 3.2, as far as those numbers go.
 
There are more factors than just numbers that will lead to rejections. I have a friend who has >30 MCAT and >3.6 gpa and was rejected by the wide range of schools he applied to (twice). How's that for a profile?
 
redstar18 said:
There are more factors than just numbers that will lead to rejections. I have a friend who has >30 MCAT and >3.6 gpa and was rejected by the wide range of schools he applied to (twice). How's that for a profile?

Do you know why this might be? Did you read his PS? Do you know what schools he applied to? You say he applied to a wide range, which about rules that one out, but did he include his state school, etc?

Is he painfully shy/can't talk in stressful situations?

That's a really weird one. I wouldn't mind those numbers :)
 
He applied late (waiting for August MCAT), and he didn't improve his second application that much. Otherwise, I think he would have gotten in somewhere. He applied to many out of state private schools where I think he had a good shot at if he just applied earlier.
 
redstar18 said:
He applied late (waiting for August MCAT), and he didn't improve his second application that much. Otherwise, I think he would have gotten in somewhere. He applied to many out of state private schools where I think he had a good shot at if he just applied earlier.

Ah. Is this the magic year for him?
 
I know this guy who had a 31 and a 3.59.
Got the boot 3x in a row (12 interviews total)
Got in on the 4th try though. :p
 
MoosePilot said:
Ah. Is this the magic year for him?

He's not applying a third time. Fortunately, he also applied to DO schools his second time and is happy that he will be attending one of them this Fall.
 
I knew someone who had an 3.8 and MCAT=33 and didn't get accepted, yet I know of people who made Mcat scores of 19 and 20 with 3.3ish GPAs and got in. I personally did not have the greatest scores and got into two schools.
 
Another aspect of this process to think about, reapp- wise: timing. I see a lot of people scrambling and reapplying because they didnt get their stuff in on time, and got waitlisted everywhere, due to late interviews and such. So get your stuff in early and beat the rush!!!


Moosepilot- Whats up with USUHS? I thought the road to going there was a bit easir if youve had prior service. That stinks-- I thought being an AF brat would make life a bit easier for me to get into there, but listening to your story, maybe it isnt :(
 
scooter31 said:
Another aspect of this process to think about, reapp- wise: timing. I see a lot of people scrambling and reapplying because they didnt get their stuff in on time, and got waitlisted everywhere, due to late interviews and such. So get your stuff in early and beat the rush!!!


Moosepilot- Whats up with USUHS? I thought the road to going there was a bit easir if youve had prior service. That stinks-- I thought being an AF brat would make life a bit easier for me to get into there, but listening to your story, maybe it isnt :(

Now my first time the only military stink I had on me was what little rubs off in ROTC, or effectively none.

Now when I talk to them, they are giving me very good feedback. I think the military experience and proving myself in that setting is very much a plus to them, although they are also quite clear that I have to compete on the numbers side too. If I can get my personnel guy to let go of me, I think I've got a great shot at the admissions end of things (not a lock, no such thing, but a good shot).

If you've got decent numbers and can tell them you understand the military and are ok with that life (military+medicine not just medicine and oh, yeah, mil too I guess) you'll be way ahead.
 
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Don't forget that for every 3 applicants to medical school only 1 gets accepted, which means that there are a lot of qualified applicants who aren't admitted in any one cycle. I had a friend who got a 39 on her MCAT and didn't get in her first time around. I also know a person who got a 29 on the MCAT and got in first try to the same school. Go figure!
 
I am not sure what to think, but I did not get in and was told that it was MCAT (26S) that was the factor. I knew that my score was not good so I only applied to 11 schools, which didn't help, but I did not want to put lots of $ into a long shot. My premed advisor basically told me I would not get in a he was right - no interviews at all. Good gpa (above 3.6) and lots of research and I got things in in reasonable time. I was going to reapply this year and retake the MCAT in April, but I chickened out and now I think I'll wait a while. It was too negative of an experience to go through 2 years in a row.
 
There aren't any specific characteristics of a reapplicant, like if you get a 30 on the MCAT, you're in, but if you get a 29, you're not. Most people, though, seem to have one deficient area, be it MCAT, GPA, ECs, or timing. It just means we have a year to improve on that deficiency, and really have to convince the adcoms that the positives outweigh that negative.

If you want to know your chances, pick up a copy of the MSAR. They have graphs of number of applicants and number of acceptances for different GPA, MCAT and other stuff.
 
the numbers dont say much
i know ppl w >3.7 and >32 MCAT (which to me is freakin amazin) that didnt get in, but it depends on what state youre from/ what schools you are applying to and the rest of your ap/ life experiences n whatnot
the interview is pretty important too- human component, etc
24 is the nat'l avg for MCATs and ppl def get into good schools w MCATs of 25+. AMCAS site has stats on applied vs accepted ppl. i think the avg gpa was like a 3.5 (science) ?
 
When you say 'profile of a rejected applicant', are you looking for a typically rejected applicant? If so, I would say <25 <3.0 would be a typically rejected applicant. This you would expect. The strangest thing about the med school app process is the wide range of applicants who are rejected. Therefore, it is impossible to know who will get rejected. Very few students are pretty much guaranteed acceptances, and they are the ones with the 3.8+ 34+ MCAT. Unless there is something seriously wrong with their app (and they have some decent extracircs), they will not be rejected.
 
Here was my profile when I applied:

30 MCAT
3.5 GPA
ECs: Debate, fencing (vice-chair over north Florida), worked over a thousand hours on a hospital's nursing staff, worked in a research lab

Where did I get rejected: Hopkins, Duke, Emory, Wake Forest, Tulane, Tennessee (I was no longer considered a resident since I hadn't lived in the state for two years), South Florida, Florida (interview), and USUHS (my only waitlist)
 
damn deuist, that is really rough. are you reapplying? considering the do/carribean route?

for everyone else, when you site someone with outstanding numbers (e.g. 3.8gpa and 32+mcat), there HAS to be a reason that that person didn't get in. it doesn't make sense otherwise. i can't believe that med schools would accept someone with lesser numbers arbitrarily. i guess the million dollar question is, what did they lack? and the answer to that question is what the rest of us have to work on (who don't have the numbers).

i guess the answer really is EC, LOR, and interviewing competency... am i missing anything else?
 
I am reapplying. Luckily, my numbers are up slightly. I've also picked up a volunteering EC. I think that medical schools care about two things as far as EC's go: significant research and volunteering. While everything else is nice -- or unless you were the president of a student organization with 200+ members -- med schools really don't pay too much attention to what else you've done.

Speaking of rec letters, they are the biggest help as far as getting accepted. They give the admissions committee an understanding of who you are. While most people who apply to medical school have high numbers and can write a personal statement that says what a wonderful person he/she is, the rec letter talks about your behavior from a different perspective. Unfortunately, many medical schools want as many as 5 letters. I don't know five profs who know who I am, much less who are qualified to write a letter. I realize now that it's very important for students to start talking to profs and EC advisers very early. You should go to their office hours and let them know who you are. BUT DON"T BE OBNOXIOUS OR FAKE. Many people -- particularly physical science professors -- don't really care for pre-meds because of their perceived snotty attitude.

Interviews are not a major contributor to your acceptance. Most schools already have an idea of whether or not they want you. The interview merely confirms their beliefs. Most students do a pretty mediocre job of interviewing -- and admissions committees understand that most people will be nervous and will not be able to give the best answers. So long as you don't completely suck, your position coming into the interview is the same going out. For people who are borderline, however, the interview can be a benefit. A solid interview may convince a school to take you despite your average scores, ECs, and rec letters.

These are just my observations over the past two years. Feel free to disagree.
 
snowhite said:
I knew someone who had an 3.8 and MCAT=33 and didn't get accepted, yet I know of people who made Mcat scores of 19 and 20 with 3.3ish GPAs and got in. I personally did not have the greatest scores and got into two schools.

19 and 20? Which schools did they get into?
 
I think that there is no magic number but less than a 26 or less than a 3.4 GPA does not put you in a good position, especially if you went to a state school, i.e. A 3.4 at Duke counts more than 3.4 at a state university. Not to say anything against state univ, I went to the University of Florida and it was not easy by any means!
 
I got into two schools with a 24 MCAT, 3.0 science GPA, and 3.4 overall gpa. My MCAT went up however, and I was accepted to more desireable schools. (I went to a private school however.)
 
Listen folks, there is NO SENSE in trying to figure out the admissions process. A LOT of it is just sheer luck. Believe me, I know the admissions people at my medschool very well and the process with which they pick people. I mean if you really don't have a clue, than just freakin flip a coin. The year I got in (2000), I looked at the pile of accepted applicants stats with those of the rejected ones from my undergrad institution. Trust me there was NO difference in terms of MCATs, GPAs, ECs, etc. between the two piles. My premed advisor actually called up one of the medschools (my top choice) why they picked so and so over me. And the answer he got was ridiculous. "MMM, your applicant was not competitive" My stats (3.8 GPA (3.9 science) from a tough institution, 31 MCAT) were above the average of the accepted folks in that medschool (local state med school). My advisor was asking about this other person who got in the next week after interview and her stats were 3.2 GPA (2.8 science) and 26 MCAT. Go figure! The sad thing is that I personally knew her, and let me just say its a sad day when people like that are getting their picks over people like me. Justice is blind. Well, anyway I ended up at a private institution off a waitlist on the 1st day of school. What luck! I was happy for a while until I found out later that the school had picked some *****s with GPAs of less than 3.0 and MCATs of less than 27.
 
Profile of a rejected applicant:

Tot GPA-2.5
Sci GPA-2.4
MCAT-5P,6V,7B,J
ECs-Intramural sports
Limited social skills
 
Lonestar said:
I was happy for a while until I found out later that the school had picked some *****s with GPAs of less than 3.0 and MCATs of less than 27.

Yup, you're right, definitely *****s if they can't score above a 27. :rolleyes:
 
coffeeluver said:
Yup, you're right, definitely *****s if they can't score above a 27. :rolleyes:


you're kidding, right?
 
The MCAT is a very small factor regarding med school admissions dispite what some may say. I know a student at Umass Worcester who scored a 17. That score is below the minimum cut off for Osteopathic programs which is an 18. There are many other factors that go into the decision process. If you have a unique application you're in! It's that simple.

Cofeeluver: you need to shrink your head a bit. There's obviuosly some reason (excellent interview) that those other candidates got selected over you? "Class room" performance only takes you so far in medicine! I know a few doc's who are suffering from big head syndrome... it's not a good thing.

Out.
 
Unfortunately, that's not true. The MCAT plays a large role and at many schools (UMass included), your GPA and MCAT scores are inserted into an equation and the result is placed on the front of your file before it's even forwarded to the admissions committee. It sucks, but that's the way it's done.

Other stuff obviously matters as much if not more...but the MCAT does count.
 
If that's true than how did someone matriculate with a 17? I thought the average GPA for Umass matriculants was around a 30? I don't know the rest of her profile however, I do know she scored a 17.
 
akalin24 said:
If that's true than how did someone matriculate with a 17? I thought the average GPA for Umass matriculants was around a 30? I don't know the rest of her profile however, I do know she scored a 17.

Now, I don't know this person and don't mean to assume anything, but my best guess is that she was a post-bac. Most post-bacs are disadvantaged students (minority or not) who have less-than-stellar scores and they take a few med school classes with the other students. Then they reapply based upon their performance in those classes (and other stuff too...). So with a 17, I would guess that she went through that program, but I could be wrong...
 
hi all...last year I applied to 15 schools, got one interview: Albany Med and was rejected. my MCAT was only 25O but everything else was good (i thought). problem was I applied at the deadline for AMCAS and the schools b/c I had been sick. Just wanted to add my info: 25O mcat, 3.53ug, 3.3grad applied LATE!
 
i'm a rejected applicant - 9 schools, 2 interviews, and i'm reapplying right now

i did early decision last year, and was deferred. - BIG MISTAKE!! by doing early decision, I was very late applying to other schools.

i have a 30 MCAT, and a 3.2 from a very difficult engineering school. I also have worked in an ER for 3.5 years as a tech. I have tons of shadowing, volunteer, and leadership ECs.

I did get an interview at one of the schools that I applied late to after i was deferred, but they later rejected me. When I called to talk with the Dean to ask why, he said, "I don't know, we really liked you, really, its just luck!"

So this year, i'm hoping to be "lucky" atleast once. I'm not doing early decision, just applying to lots of places.

in the meantime, i'm doing a one year MPH. If anyone has any input on the MPH program and acceptance to med school, please let me know.

Good luck to everyone!
 
Nebmuse said:
Don't forget that for every 3 applicants to medical school only 1 gets accepted, which means that there are a lot of qualified applicants who aren't admitted in any one cycle. I had a friend who got a 39 on her MCAT and didn't get in her first time around. I also know a person who got a 29 on the MCAT and got in first try to the same school. Go figure!

I thought it had changed to more like... 1 out of every 2 applicants... am I wrong?
 
It is a reality for a lot of people to not get accepted anywhere..even after two cycles with incredible stats. The fact is that there are not enough spaces for everyone...and it sucks for those whose dream is to get their MD. I was in the same dilema.....reapply for a third cycle....wait another year...and go through a long grueling process. then I heard about schools in the caribbean. After attending open houses and meeting docs who graduated from those schools and are more than successful here in the US I realized that this was my chance. Certainly there are schools that you def do not what to go to....but the caribbean big three....SGU....AUC....ROSS have a better...longer reputation. I will be attending SGU this fall and I have no regrets. I will take the same courses...the same USMLE and apply for the same residency programs. In two years I will be state side working along with other 3rd year students. Certainly there is more pressure and expectations in going to a foreign school but in the end you will have the same MD as everyone else. Being an IMG requires you to work harder than US students....perform better on the USMLE......but in the end it will prove to help you. There are many IMG's who have placed in the top residencies.....Hopkins Rad/Onc...Stanford. I guess what I am saying is that it is not impossible to reach your goal of MD. I tried and failed twice and I now I am finally starting on my path to becoming a great physician. Hope this helps anyone.
 
akalin24 said:
The MCAT is a very small factor regarding med school admissions dispite what some may say. I know a student at Umass Worcester who scored a 17. That score is below the minimum cut off for Osteopathic programs which is an 18. There are many other factors that go into the decision process. If you have a unique application you're in! It's that simple.

Cofeeluver: you need to shrink your head a bit. There's obviuosly some reason (excellent interview) that those other candidates got selected over you? "Class room" performance only takes you so far in medicine! I know a few doc's who are suffering from big head syndrome... it's not a good thing.

Out.

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. 80% of this game is about numbers. I can't speak for DO schools, but their mcat ave's are in a few cases, MUCH lower than MD schools. I had one of the highest interview scores possible at a university, an above ave. mcat, and i applied disadv, w/ additional medical hardships. My application is absolutely unique. This process is very flawed and I find your analysis trite, oversimplistic and misleading.

This is not personal in anyway... but this is not the thread to create false hope for the damned.
 
I had a 34 and 3.75 GPA and got rejected from UF, USF, Miami, UAB, Emory (waitlisted and never got the call), & Duke.

The second time around I applied to 18 schools and stopped interviewing after I got into Tulane
 
exgatr said:
I had a 34 and 3.75 GPA and got rejected from UF, USF, Miami, UAB, Emory (waitlisted and never got the call), & Duke.

The second time around I applied to 18 schools and stopped interviewing after I got into Tulane

Creepy...I had a 33 and 3.8, got rejected from UF and Emory (pre-interview), USF and UAB (post-interview). I filed the Duke secondary in the circular filing cabinet. This year I'm applying to 11, including Tulane. Maybe things will work out for me. Please share your tulane interview experience with me.
 
Response to Lonestar - Heres a thought- maybe you had a hard time getting in because you are unbelievably arrogant. I hope I never get you as a doctor. How many of your "*****" patients would score a 27 or higher on the MCAT? What an ego.
 
deuist said:
I am reapplying. Luckily, my numbers are up slightly. I've also picked up a volunteering EC. I think that medical schools care about two things as far as EC's go: significant research and volunteering. While everything else is nice -- or unless you were the president of a student organization with 200+ members -- med schools really don't pay too much attention to what else you've done.

Speaking of rec letters, they are the biggest help as far as getting accepted. They give the admissions committee an understanding of who you are. While most people who apply to medical school have high numbers and can write a personal statement that says what a wonderful person he/she is, the rec letter talks about your behavior from a different perspective. Unfortunately, many medical schools want as many as 5 letters. I don't know five profs who know who I am, much less who are qualified to write a letter. I realize now that it's very important for students to start talking to profs and EC advisers very early. You should go to their office hours and let them know who you are. BUT DON"T BE OBNOXIOUS OR FAKE. Many people -- particularly physical science professors -- don't really care for pre-meds because of their perceived snotty attitude.

Interviews are not a major contributor to your acceptance. Most schools already have an idea of whether or not they want you. The interview merely confirms their beliefs. Most students do a pretty mediocre job of interviewing -- and admissions committees understand that most people will be nervous and will not be able to give the best answers. So long as you don't completely suck, your position coming into the interview is the same going out. For people who are borderline, however, the interview can be a benefit. A solid interview may convince a school to take you despite your average scores, ECs, and rec letters.

These are just my observations over the past two years. Feel free to disagree.
Good advice- but I disagree with you about the interview- I think in general a good or bad interview is what calls the shots. i know of many cases where the interview was the deciding factor- although it may be different at your school.
 
My profile back in 2000:

MCAT 36S
GPA 3.97 (University of Arizona...I know...but seriously grade inflation is everywhere not just state schools)
EC's - plenty including hospice, research with a first author paper, campus service groups, student government, etc.

Rejected from - pretty much all California state schools, Stanford, Harvard
Waitlisted, but never made the cut - Tulane, Mayo
Waitlisted, made it just in time - University of Arizona

And my guess is it wasn't because of the interview or interpersonal difficulties: I have experience in public speakingand debate and have won awards at regional competitions in interviewing skills.

If you want to ask me, I don't think the scores or any kind of number matters much for state schools, at least not ours. I know of people with dismal GPAs and MCATS as low as 19. In fact sometimes I think the lower your MCAT score the better your chance of getting in to U of A. It is possible that I fit the almost rejected applicant better than someone with a 3.0 GPA and 25 MCAT for U of A.

I think in my case I probably wasn't competitive enough to cut it at the good schools I applied to. And U of A likes older, non-traditional students whereas here I was just a fresh graduate not looking to take time off or have kids or get other useless degrees I never planned to use. In fact, schools (at least when I applied) can see the other schools you have applied to and whether you have been accepted or not. When I was interviewing at Tulane, the dean picked up the list and said, "Well you still haven't been accepted to your state school with the numbers you have. Why do think that is?" I explained my reasoning and he just gave a "humph" and continued with the interview.

So--if you want to know about profiles, I would keep it focused to one school or at least a type of school. The students that go there can probably tell you a lot about that school when they get to know the people that got in there. There are probably some schools that use MCATs and such as screening, but by no means all schools care.

Good luck to all of you. IMO from a 4th year medical student: I don't really know if it's worth it. If you asked me during my 3rd year I would have told you it was definitely not and to do something else like get a normal job and start making money like all of my friends did. There is something to be said for having a very normal life.
 
You'll love Tulane. Everything is so laid back here. Nobody is pretentious at all. We're a smart group of people who know how to have a good time.

The interview was great, don't worry about it at all.

kwgold said:
Creepy...I had a 33 and 3.8, got rejected from UF and Emory (pre-interview), USF and UAB (post-interview). I filed the Duke secondary in the circular filing cabinet. This year I'm applying to 11, including Tulane. Maybe things will work out for me. Please share your tulane interview experience with me.
 
I am also one of them REJECTS:

GPA: 3.5 (University of Wisconsin-Madison)

MCAT: 26

I applied only once to 5 ALLOPATHIC, and 5 OSTEOPATHIC schools. I was rejected from all allopathic schools, but was accepted at 3 OSTEOPATHIC schools. However, I ran to the Carribean instead. :idea:

Reasons for my rejections

1) Aplied very late
2) I was not a US citizen back then (yes, I am a fist generation FOB)
3) I was very nervous during the interviews, and almost knew nothing about the US health care system.
4) A relatively low MCAT and GPA
5) Too few EC activities (I was a book worm)
6) I worked in research labs as an undergraduate (you know "dish washer/scut jobs", but never published

I wish I had stayed and applied a second time to more allopathic schools. :(

Anyway, too late now. I will be graduating next year from the Carribean, and going off to residency in General Surgery (hopefully).

Good Luck to you all.
 
when i applied last year i had a 3.35overall, 3.27 BCPM with a 30P...applied late and got rejected to the 4 or 5 schools in where i finished the 2ndary. this year, i have a 3.45 Overall, 3.44 BCPM (i rocked my senior year) with same MCAT and will be attending GT's SMP so well see what happens

PS: i was suprised i got a 2ndary from UCI but i was too lazy to do it
 
If medicine is your dream then go for it and never give up. Pay no attention to naysayers, numbers or other artificial criteria. Reapply and reapply as long as it takes. It may take you longer than some others to get in but don't give up on your dreams!
 
I am also one of them REJECTS:

GPA: 3.5 (University of Wisconsin-Madison)

MCAT: 26

I applied only once to 5 ALLOPATHIC, and 5 OSTEOPATHIC schools. I was rejected from all allopathic schools, but was accepted at 3 OSTEOPATHIC schools. However, I ran to the Carribean instead. :idea:

Reasons for my rejections

1) Aplied very late
2) I was not a US citizen back then (yes, I am a fist generation FOB)
3) I was very nervous during the interviews, and almost knew nothing about the US health care system.
4) A relatively low MCAT and GPA
5) Too few EC activities (I was a book worm)
6) I worked in research labs as an undergraduate (you know "dish washer/scut jobs", but never published

I wish I had stayed and applied a second time to more allopathic schools. :(

Anyway, too late now. I will be graduating next year from the Carribean, and going off to residency in General Surgery (hopefully).

Good Luck to you all.
Why didn't you attend any of the DO schools?
 
Why didn't you attend any of the DO schools?

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