programs/postdocs for PhDs to get clinical research training

[Sonya]

---

Members don't see this ad.

Hi,

I am doing a basic science phd. I have seriously considered doing MD afterwards, as I feel I want to be interacting with patients, not just cells or computers, to improve peoples lives. But, I am also wondering if there are programs which will train me for clinical research after my PhD. Well, I know there are such programs, but id like to know more about them. How long are they, any particularly good programs, or somewhere I can read about them? More importantly, are there programs that will train me to be working with patients in the clinical research trials, and yet still also involve me scientifically? Actually, a more fundamental questions, is whether such a role is needed in clinical research besides by the physician?

I have a general idea of clinical research. The PhDs design studies and do the statistics and get grants. MDs treat the patients as needed for the study, and research assistants interview patients. Are these the main components of clinical research, anything else?

Thanks,
Sonya

 

[QofQuimica]

I'm a PhD now in my third year of med school. I don't know much about any programs like you're describing, if they even exist. But if you're interested in the PhD-to-MD path, check out my sticky at the top of the forum. Also, feel free to PM me if you have questions.

Hi,

I am doing a basic science phd. I have seriously considered doing MD afterwards, as I feel I want to be interacting with patients, not just cells or computers, to improve peoples lives. But, I am also wondering if there are programs which will train me for clinical research after my PhD. Well, I know there are such programs, but id like to know more about them. How long are they, any particularly good programs, or somewhere I can read about them? More importantly, are there programs that will train me to be working with patients in the clinical research trials, and yet still also involve me scientifically? Actually, a more fundamental questions, is whether such a role is needed in clinical research besides by the physician?

I have a general idea of clinical research. The PhDs design studies and do the statistics and get grants. MDs treat the patients as needed for the study, and research assistants interview patients. Are these the main components of clinical research, anything else?

Thanks,
Sonya

 

[Fencer]

This program (Master in Clinical Investigations) does not require a PhD as a pre-requisite, but provides the essentials for a clinical researcher:

http://iims.uthscsa.edu/ed_msci_overview.html

 

[xanthines]

I don't know about post-doctoral programs but here's an interesting PhD program...
http://www.lerner.ccf.org/molecmed/phd/

Perhaps they'll have post-doc positions soon for them?

-X

 

[pseudoknot]

This isn't applicable to the OP but it's related and interesting:
http://msm.stanford.edu/

There used to be some similar programs at various schools, referred to as the Markey Pathway. I think the funding for that ended a few years back.

On another note, I think that 98% of people outside of medicine who are interested in "clinical research" don't really know what it's about, and probably wouldn't be so interested if they did.

 

[Sonya]

THanks for the input. i'll check out the thread about phd then MD. I was looking for that link on cleveland clinic, i had read about the program before, and couldn't find what i had read. so, thanks. its interesting u say 98% of ppl who think they are interested in clinical research don't stay. well, right now this is just an idea im tossing out there and exploring. The plan of MD after PhD is much more definitively in my mind. And, so yes i may be in that 98%, but thats why i'm trying to learn more.

sonya

 

[sunshine8i8]

pitt has a "clinical scientist training program" (as opposed to the mstp or pstp which they also have) that is specific for training in clinical research

http://www.icre.pitt.edu/cstp-m/application_information.html

 

[Neuronix]

The Pitt program was created with the same goals and in competition with the CCLCM 5-year program. The draw is that for your year of servitude in research you get a half to full tuition scholarship for medical school. The same goes for CCLCM, as even before they announced full scholarships for all they were pretty much giving them for most anyways...

Keep in mind any allopathic medical school will have ample opportunity for you to get involved in research if you choose to. You can always find funding for year out type opportunities. The real draw is getting medical school paid for, and this is how the 5-year programs get the top students. Sometimes, albeit rarely, well qualified (high ugrad/grad GPA and high MCAT) PhD students will end up with a half or full scholarship at a medical school without the stipulation that you must spend an extra year there. A few of these still float around this forum.

So I just want you to keep in mind that you don't need to apply to a specific "program" to get trained in clinical research. If you want to get into medical school, get into medical school. Worry about the admissions and financing aspects first. You can get involved with whatever kind of research you want at any school down the line, and often find funding to do whatever kind of research you wanted somewhere else if you so chose.

 

[Doodledog]

Hi,

But, I am also wondering if there are programs which will train me for clinical research after my PhD. ...... Actually, a more fundamental questions, is whether such a role is needed in clinical research besides by the physician?

Thanks,
Sonya

Sonya:

This is not all that uncommon for a PhD in basic science to become interested in doing more clinically-oriented work, or optimally work that directly involves patients but still can use some of the skills learned during PhD training. The usual way is to to a post-doc in a lab that is doing "translational" research. This can often be a lab in which patient-derived samples are analyzed for various metabolites, genetic polymorphisms, etc. Many such labs, even if not looking for a basic scientists, will be glad to consider someone with this type of training and teach them things they need to know such as human use (IRB) rules, etc. I have had such post-docs in my group so I know it is possible.😉

If your interest is more public policy or epidemiology, it will be harder to obtain such training directly and you may need to consider a different route such as a medical or public health degree. This is an uncommon transition however.

 

[CCLCMer]

THanks for the input. i'll check out the thread about phd then MD. I was looking for that link on cleveland clinic, i had read about the program before, and couldn't find what i had read. so, thanks. its interesting u say 98% of ppl who think they are interested in clinical research don't stay. well, right now this is just an idea im tossing out there and exploring. The plan of MD after PhD is much more definitively in my mind. And, so yes i may be in that 98%, but thats why i'm trying to learn more.

sonya

If you have any questions about CCLCM, feel free to ask. We have several students who came in with PhDs. There are two in my class of 32.

The Pitt program was created with the same goals and in competition with the CCLCM 5-year program. The draw is that for your year of servitude in research you get a half to full tuition scholarship for medical school. The same goes for CCLCM, as even before they announced full scholarships for all they were pretty much giving them for most anyways...

Not that it really matters now since the school has gone tuition free for everyone, but the average financial aid before this year was about half tuition. Not everyone got half tuition though. Some people got very little in grants, and others had full tuition covered. A few people even got stipends like MD/PhD students do along with full tuition (and they still do).

Keep in mind any allopathic medical school will have ample opportunity for you to get involved in research if you choose to. You can always find funding for year out type opportunities. The real draw is getting medical school paid for, and this is how the 5-year programs get the top students. Sometimes, albeit rarely, well qualified (high ugrad/grad GPA and high MCAT) PhD students will end up with a half or full scholarship at a medical school without the stipulation that you must spend an extra year there. A few of these still float around this forum.

So I just want you to keep in mind that you don't need to apply to a specific "program" to get trained in clinical research. If you want to get into medical school, get into medical school. Worry about the admissions and financing aspects first. You can get involved with whatever kind of research you want at any school down the line, and often find funding to do whatever kind of research you wanted somewhere else if you so chose.

Exactly. The main difference is that if you come to CCLCM, you are locked into doing the fifth year of research, but you can change your mind if you go to a regular med school. Also, CCLCM students get free tuition for medical school, not just the research year. During the research year and the two research summers, everyone is guaranteed a stipend even if they don't find outside funding. If you're absolutely sure you want to do a fifth year for research, and you're comfortable with the unorthodox curriculum that we have, it's a pretty sweet deal as far as medical school goes. But it's definitely not the best program for everyone.