Pros and Cons of Going to Med School as a Nontrad

[Tsukiyo]

1) 3rd year undergrad, married, 22 (no children, wohoo!)
2) Not having to worry about studying in an overcrowded library, not having to live with a dorm and thus not having to deal with immature "children," being able to sign my own loan paperwork
3) Not having any friends because I don't see the world as other "kids" do, not having anyone to help me sign loan paperwork if I need it for med school (hopefully I won't)

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[spacemanxxx]

Will be 26 when I start med school next yr. Worked since graduating.

Pros: Matured perspective where I see people for what they are-less naive, background in other profession, less distracted because experienced their futility already, still have the energy to pull all nighters but have the wisdom not to, more confident & outgoing, saved some money for education, the break ensures that I won't burnout in school.

Cons: postponing having family little longer until I am a physician, starting to get white hairs , Being so frugal comes with maturity.

 

[MD Odyssey]

1) give your rank (and age too, if you're so inclined)

I'm 33, applying June 2012. Got my undergraduate degree in physics in 2007. Currently an aerospace engineer.

2) what pros you see to going to med school as a nontrad

The perspective that I have on the world is immensely different now than it was ten years ago. I'm much more aware of social problems and how they affect health care. I think that these combine to make me more aware of what I'm getting myself into.

Also, if I'm in medical school, I will never find myself wondering what life would have been like on the outside. I know exactly how boring staff meetings and cubicle life can be!

3) what cons you see of doing the same

There are enormous financial sacrifices that I'll have to make, not to mention giving up the bulk of my thirties and early forties to medical training. I make about $65,000 a year and have zero debt and no real financial obligations. Run the clock forward seven years, and I'll probably be $200,000 in debt and no real assets (401k contributions came to a halt when I decided to go to medical school).

An additional hardship for me is my personal life. My girlfriend, a physician, is completing her internship in another state and starts her residency in a couple of months (also in another state). We want to get married at some point, but those plans definitely have to be put on hold until she finishes her residency. And, since I'll probably have to move for medical school (unless I get into my state school) and then residency after that, we're forced to be apart for several years until the future is less uncertain. We're both adults and have a fantastic relationship, so the strain isn't terrible, but it's definitely not the preferred situation we would like.

 

[toff4l]

Me: 28 years old. Diagnosed with UC in 2004. Unable to finish my degree. UC became chronic and would not respond to medicine, I became sad, subtotal colectomy in 2010, Recovered, I became happy, going back to school, hope to graduate in 2013 and apply.

Pros: Wiser, your mind is clearer, you are more focused, you have more experience, maturity, you have better reasons for why you want to study medicine. When you are young there are a lot of distractions and a lot of other "stuff" in your life that filters out when you get a little older. When you are older you see everything in a new mature perspective. I actually feel that older candidates are better equipped than our younger counterparts. When you are young, you might have the grades but that really is only part of the equation. I mean you must have the grades and the MCAT score but if you didn't have them when you were younger and you have them now, who's to say you're not qualified because you didn't have them at a certain age or time?

Cons: When you start older you may or may not feel out of place when you are studying with other 20 somethings. I don't think that is a big issue but I certainly don't want to feel alienated in medical school. Also, you have to think about money. I'm single and all of my friends are married or getting married and I can't think about that because I have no money to start a family. When I am accepted to medical school then I at least know where I will be going with my life and I can start to think about relationships. But right now, It's just me and the books. I believe your 20's are probably the best years of your life; so much should happen during that time. For me, I was sick most of those years and the rest were spent in class. You're not old when you're 30 but socially you are old and I think that is something I will end up regretting over the years. That's actually the biggest con for me because I always thought I would be married by now and I'm afraid that if I do become a doctor and I meet someone then they will only like me because of the fact that I am a doctor. Other than that, I'm still fairly young, I still have the energy, and all of this can be done. Another con which is related to money is the fact that compound interest is your friend when you are in your 20's. Even though you might graduate med school later on and become financially secure, your younger counterparts will finish stronger because they have 10 or so important years on you. For me, even though I was sick, the 10 years I am losing in this process really are time wasted on so many levels. I won't feel the effects for years to come.

 

[Gavanshir]

Status: Attending physician in an academic practice (vascular surgery) at a university medical center. I started medical school at 46, completed general surgery residency, vascular fellowship. I have a bachelor's degree (summa cum laude), Ph.D- Biochemistry and Molecular Biology and my MD. (I'm old).

Pros: It's all good now that my research lab is up and running.
Cons: None

Medical school is professional school and nothing particularly magical. I met and continue to meet every challenge. I'm not a higher form of life but realistically, I have having a blast doing what I enjoy. My fiance who is a bodybuilder/personal trainer does the same.

In short, if you find find something that you love to do, it's not work. I have been fortunate enough to not have been in any job that I didn't love. Like I said, it's all good now.

I've been reading your blog for the past week. I had no idea you were in your forties. Your blog is fantastic.

 

[eablackwell]

I like this thread

1) 28, married, no kids, entering med school in August.

2) Pros- I agree with the life experiences part. Time has knocked a lot of sense into me and a lot of overbearing youthful pride out of me. I think I'll be able to handle the medical hierarchy system a lot better now than if I had gone straight through ugrad and then to med school as originally planned. Mostly I think being non-trad will allow me to be more studious yet laid back (if that makes any sense), and roll with the punches.

3) Cons- Family timing. I'm married w/o kids, but my husband and I really want them. We decided to wait until after med school, and that's fine, but it was a hard decision for me. I come from a family where if you don't have kids by around 25 something is wrong with you (yes, there is likely something wrong with them). Many of my 1st cousins who are around the same age as me have children with ages in the double digits. Luckily, since getting accepted to med school my family has laid off the guilt trips.

Another con is guilt about not spending enough time with my husband and moving him around a lot. He is in the process of trying to get a work transfer to my med school's city, and then the other day I was talking to him about places he'd be willing to move to for residency and he just hugged me and said "You know, we haven't even moved to med school yet and you're already planning your next move." Makes me feel bad for what I put him through.

 

[catswym]

I've been reading your blog for the past week. I had no idea you were in your forties. Your blog is fantastic.

I would assume he's more like 60 now?

 

[catswym]

1) give your rank (and age too, if you're so inclined)

I'm 31, applied this past cycle (for entering august 2011) and got in, woo! I have my PhD in biochemistry and have worked in R & D since then (last three years).

2) what pros you see to going to med school as a nontrad

knowing this is what I want to do because I've done the other things I thought I might like to do instead of medicine and they didn't work for me. Perspective--not obsessing over social matters, having life experience to look back on. Knowing what is important to me and knowing better my capabilities and limitations.

3) what cons you see of doing the same

I'm surprisingly NOT worried about the financial aspects of things (i.e. being in debt) except as it relates to my partner. If I had gone to med school at 22 I wouldn't have been 'tied down' to a person whose career and desires I have to consider as I make these decisions. I also realize we could be buying a house in the next few years instead of going $200k in debt. I know I don't have as much energy and stamina as I did when I was 22 and that that will come into play.

 

[yankswin2011]

law student, turning 28 in the fall - After my undergrad in biochemistry, I went on to complete a Master's degree in molecular biology, then entered law school. - I plan to apply in 2011 for the 2012 entering class
I always feel like I need to give medicine a shot since it's something I've secretly wanted to do since I was 12 but later on in life, I felt like I should test out different career paths. Many people think I'm nuts but I have to do something that I've wanted since I was a child.

Pros - definitely I've had more years of life/academic experience than many undergrads entering medicine; time management in law school has been a tremendous amount of work and dedication; and it has taught me so much.

Cons - people think as an older student, my brain will not be able to retain as much information as someone fresh out of college; we'll see about that; My brain has not deteriorated in law school and it certainly won't in the next few years as I embark on this medicine career.

That's really cool -- are you planning to finish law school, or are you just cutting your losses early given the tough economy?

 

[MCAT guy]

Pros: Love the field

Cons: Wondering if I still have the Eye of the Tiger.

 

[StudyShy]

Pros: Love the field

Cons: Wondering if I still have the Eye of the Tiger.

 

[spicedmanna]

1) give your rank (and age too, if you're so inclined)

37 y/o PGY-0, finishing up last month of requirements for DO and entering into a combined military/civilian FM residency, starting June of this year. I will be 38 years old in two weeks.

2) what pros you see to going to med school as a nontrad

--Substantive work experience. I had close to 10 years of work experience prior to entering into medical school, some of which was menial and some of which was professional. The menial jobs built character, patience, and ability to tolerate a lot of BS. I learned how to live on very little and work in tough conditions. I learned how to make the most of what I had. I also had a short career in IT, first as a line programmer/data analyst, moving my way up the corporate ladder to DB manager/administrator, and then finally as a project manager at small start-ups. I know what it's like to work insanely long hours and deal with unrealistic expectations. I developed high-level customer service skills, ability to triage what was important and manage my time appropriately, refined my ability to manage large groups of people, and learned how to relate and communicate with upper management and with my staff. I wrote my fair share of "TPS" reports. Having all this work experience certainly helped make the job aspects of medicine easier. After all, being a physician is just a cool job.

--Perspective/Maturity/Wisdom. I had 10 years to think about what I wanted in life and had the advantage of having tried different jobs and careers. When I was applying to medical school, I was as sure as anyone could be that I wanted a to be a physician. Over the years, I did a lot of self-examination and learned a lot about myself. I also had a lot of time to be stupid and do stupid things, and thankfully, got that out of my system. I had time to shed what wasn't functional and to build up my strengths. On a more personal level, I learned what was important to my sustained happiness. Throughout my medical school career, I have often been the goto person for my colleagues' crises, because I've "been there and done that." This has also helped when dealing with patients, because I can readily relate to their social problems.

--Developed focused ability to get things done. I had years to refine my study skills and to develop effective means to get things done. I figured out what I did wrong all those years in college, fixed them, and no longer had the same distractions that I did back then. I'm much more organized and effective than I was when I graduated college. Studying and getting good grades was therefore much easier. I learned how to apply myself maximally and how to really focus. I went back to school after 10 years and absolutely killed all of my pre-medical prerequisite classes. This is the same focus that I took into and throughout medical school.

--More tools in my tool-belt. After all that I experienced and learned from different jobs and life situations, I gained a lot of different tools and skills, if you will. You just never know when one of these may come in handy. Medicine doesn't exist in a vacuum.

--Appearing older and wiser is a good thing in clinical medicine. Somehow, patients just assume you are more experienced than you actually are. They tend to give you more respect from the onset. Same with professors and preceptors.

3) what cons you see of doing the same

--The grass is greener syndrome. Often, when I view my peers of the same age, they appear happy in their stable life: good job, sweet car and house, wife, kids, elaborate vacations, etc. All this while I am sitting in a dank, dark shack studying my butt off, alone, with practically nothing, or slaving away as a clinical clerk. I feel so lonely sometimes. I feel jealous of their life, wonder when I will finally get those things, but then I remember that I love medicine and that it's just a matter of time. Their life may seem happier and more stable, but when I question them about it, I often get the response that they really respect what I am doing and that it takes real courage and guts to do it. I sometimes hear that it is they who envy me.

--Older, not as resilient. Yes, I admit that it is harder for me to take the abuse of the path of medicine than perhaps those who are 10 years younger. Harder to stay up, etc. Although I have developed the ability to push myself beyond my limits, I do pay the price for it. Thankfully, I have become more efficient and make up for any lack of resiliency with that.

--Occasional generational differences with classmates. Because I grew up in a different generation, sometimes the gap creates a bit of distance between myself and my classmates. However, this hasn't been too much of a problem.

 

[thes_hunter]

I'm just finishing up MS-2.

I was 36 when I started, will turn forty 3 months after I get my MD.

I concur on all the 'more life experience', 'empathy', 'better priorities', and such the previous posters have mentioned.

But this all addresses non-trad as an age. I may be 'old', but I also came from a Fine Arts background. Something I don't see often in my peers. I feel this gives me an edge on visual and 3d information. Though other non-art majors can have a similar advantage.

One of the plastic surgeons I followed last summer told me that I would be wasting my talent as a sculpture if I did not go into a surgical field, especially plastic surgery. If I could crave realistic lips from clay and stone, I could do so from flesh when needed.

I have to agree with him, I feel my training in the arts would make me a better surgeon faster than someone with no artistic talent or training. (However, my flat feet, my bodies desire to sleep 8-10 hours, the high synoscope probability, and my enjoyment of a good work life balance make me less prone to wish to endure the part of a general surgery residency that plastic surgery would require.)


So it is not just the age, wisdom, and maturity that us non-trads bring. But our experience in other fields will help us extend medicine's usefulness in directions that would be difficult for people who followed a more traditional path.

 

[Lazyluke]

so great to hear all these stories

1) Only 21, graduating from a UK university in June and beginning the loooong road to physicianship, starting at the Mills post-bacc in August.

2) I've done all the parties and the stupid stunts and drinking, and I've enjoyed it and had a good time, but now I can focus on just ticking the boxes that need to be ticked...and hopefully making one or two friends along the way.

3) I had the choice between med school in England and med school in the states, and for various reasons I decided on the latter. It's not an easy decision because I have to start all over in an unfamilar system (I don't think you Americans realise how complicated the world of GPAs, credits and GREs is to an outsider!) and I also have to leave old friends. Being a little older than the norm, though, is not a huge issue I don't think.

I suppose one other issue is that all my friends back in the UK will have salaries by the time I am still applying for med school. I've never really known what it is like to have an 'income', and I won't find out for a loooooong time yet.

 

[JunoLucina]

It seems that we've had a plethora of threads lately asking if this or that age is too old to go to med school. Everyone's situation is unique, but med school will put us all through the same meat grinder. I think it might be helpful for current and future premeds to have a thread with input about the biggest pros and cons of med school/residency/being a physician. Obviously, those who are further along in their training (i.e., not premeds!) will be able to give more anecdotal observations, but everyone (including premeds) should feel free to post their thoughts. Please also state where you are at in your training so that other readers have some context for your thoughts. The general format is the following:

1) give your rank (and age too, if you're so inclined)
2) what pros you see to going to med school as a nontrad
3) what cons you see of doing the same

I hope we will get some discussion going that will be useful to all of us. Please do *not* flame other users for their opinions or based on their level of training. All of the thoughts in this thread will obviously be the poster's opinion, and everyone is entitled to their opinion about what med school or residency is like or will be like.

1) Pre-Med student at 30 yrs. of age

2) The pros that I can foresee are more like things I hope will be pros. I went to nursing school instead of working toward medical school. I thought that the shorter amount of school would be more beneficial due to having a husband and one year old daughter. To make a long story short, I found out that it is incredibly hard to do any type of medical schooling with that type of situation. The hours of studying, clinicals, and trying to have a family life is hard. I failed out of nursing school, and thought that I myself was a failure. It took a long time for me to believe in myself again. These things have (hopefully) prepared me for what's to come. Six years later, I think I'm finally ready. I want this more than ever now, and can't wait to get started!

3) Cons? Fear... Can I really do this? Should I do this? What if I waited too long?

 

[Seth Joo]

It seems that we've had a plethora of threads lately asking if this or that age is too old to go to med school. Everyone's situation is unique, but med school will put us all through the same meat grinder. I think it might be helpful for current and future premeds to have a thread with input about the biggest pros and cons of med school/residency/being a physician. Obviously, those who are further along in their training (i.e., not premeds!) will be able to give more anecdotal observations, but everyone (including premeds) should feel free to post their thoughts. Please also state where you are at in your training so that other readers have some context for your thoughts. The general format is the following:

1) give your rank (and age too, if you're so inclined)
2) what pros you see to going to med school as a nontrad
3) what cons you see of doing the same

I hope we will get some discussion going that will be useful to all of us. Please do *not* flame other users for their opinions or based on their level of training. All of the thoughts in this thread will obviously be the poster's opinion, and everyone is entitled to their opinion about what med school or residency is like or will be like.

I am 31 years old and in my 3rd year as med student in Arizona.

I think the main pros are being able to reinvent yourself, living like a student again in a more structured environment, learning new things.

The negatives are having no income and relying on savings and student loans, sometimes being older than other students can have both negative and positive repercussions.

 

[J ROD]

Update........it is not worth it. Wish I would have listened to friends.

 

[jl lin]

why not? bad hair day?

LOL.

So I have to wonder how much clinical and what type did JDUBB have before applying to medical school?

Biggest issue. Someone telling you,"Listen. It blows. . ."does nothing and entices people to say, "Oh. I'll show you why it will work for me."
Only thing that will be remotely helpful is to get a ton of clinical exposure--particularly while you are caring some courses--but, if not, clinical exposure one way or another is good. Also, there is a ton of political BS in healthcare and medicine--like in other fields. Difference is, the level of stress with which most people in healthcare and medicine have to work already tops you over; it's already more than enough. When the other political BS comes into play, there is no more human tolerance left many times. Add to that the work hours.

There has always been and will always be reality shock--and it will usually be most high in the medical fields and healthcare fields. And on top of that, it will cost you a yacht-full of time and money to even get to play on the battlefield of medicine and healthcare. Hence, the more clinical exposure to the stress and exhaustion and frustration, the more realistic view for that in which you are facing for a lifetime. After that, it's about how much you truly like what you are doing and what you make out of it all, and if you can find the right work-life balance.

 

[ChE04]

LOL.

So I have to wonder how much clinical and what type did JDUBB have before applying to medical school?

Biggest issue. Someone telling you,"Listen. It blows. . ."does nothing and entices people to say, "Oh. I'll show you why it will work for me."
Only thing that will be remotely helpful is to get a ton of clinical exposure--particularly while you are caring some courses--but, if not, clinical exposure one way or another is good. Also, there is a ton of political BS in healthcare and medicine--like in other fields. Difference is, the level of stress with which most people in healthcare and medicine have to work already tops you over; it's already more than enough. When the other political BS comes into play, there is no more human tolerance left many times. Add to that the work hours.

There has always been and will always be reality shock--and it will usually be most high in the medical fields and healthcare fields. And on top of that, it will cost you a yacht-full of time and money to even get to play on the battlefield of medicine and healthcare. Hence, the more clinical exposure to the stress and exhaustion and frustration, the more realistic view for that in which you are facing for a lifetime. After that, it's about how much you truly like what you are doing and what you make out of it all, and if you can find the right work-life balance.

I was going to write something very similar, but you beat me to it... So I'll just post this link: http://www.thedailybeast.com/articl...tor-became-the-most-miserable-profession.html


Oh, and 31 year old 3rd year med student here... totally worth it so far (loving third year), but I think residency is when most people start to regret it.

 

[adoctoralawyer]

Update........it is not worth it. Wish I would have listened to friends.

Why not? Care to elaborate for us newbies that are still on the edge of the trenches? What changed? What is different from what you expected?

 

[QofQuimica]

I'll go first.

1) I'm a fourth year med student taking off a year for research. I was 31 when I started med school and am now 34.

2) Pros of med school as a nontrad: I think the biggest pro for me has been that I have more of a sense of perspective. What I mean is that certain things that would have gotten me all upset ten years ago roll off my back better now. Once during first year, one of my trad classmates was all bent out of shape over some minor issue, and I was talking to her about it and reassuring her that it wasn't as bad as she thought. She commented that I really understood how she was feeling, and I told her, "Ten years ago, I was you." After I said that, it really hit me how true that was, and how much I've grown psychologically and spiritually in the past decade.

3) Cons of med school as a nontrad: For me, it was getting used to expectations and a culture that were foreign to me in many ways. I really hate how hierarchical medicine is, although obviously that issue will resolve itself over time as I continue to move up in that hierarchy. I also find that I'm not as physically resilient as I was ten years ago. For example, it seems like all-nighters affect me more than they did when I was my trad classmates' age. Not that I can't keep up the pace, but I feel downright hung over the morning after a night on call, without having had any fun the night before.

It's been five years since I posted this thread, and I am now an attending. Will be turning 40 this year. Basically still agree with what I said above.

My jury is still out on whether med school was "worth it." In another five years when I'm planning my transition to partial or full retirement at age 45, then we'll see.

 

[jl lin]

It's been five years since I posted this thread, and I am now an attending. Will be turning 40 this year. Basically still agree with what I said above.

My jury is still out on whether med school was "worth it." In another five years when I'm planning my transition to partial or full retirement at age 45, then we'll see.

I am unsure what your specialty is; and I am certain you have your reasons--and they are probably quite logical. But to me, even though there is a wink there, retirement, even partial, at 45, says IT ALL. I mean even if you won the lottery and had a windfall inheritance, that's way too young. I am thinking you will be doing more than sitting on a beach somewhere drinking Mai Tais and Mojitos while reading a book. Looks great now, but it can get old fast. I say you will probably teach and then plan all those trips on professor downtime- to beaches drinking whatever and reading whatever--or maybe doing wild, white river rafting.

 

[QofQuimica]

I am unsure what your specialty is; and I am certain you have your reasons--and they are probably quite logical. But to me, even though there is a wink there, retirement, even partial, at 45, says IT ALL. I mean even if you won the lottery and had a windfall inheritance, that's way too young. I am thinking you will be doing more than sitting on a beach somewhere drinking Mai Tais and Mojitos while reading a book. Looks great now, but it can get old fast. I say you will probably teach and then plan all those trips on professor downtime- to beaches drinking whatever and reading whatever--or maybe doing wild, white river rafting.

I didn't intend to suggest that I'd stop working altogether. I just won't be practicing medicine full-time, and maybe not at all.

Most people would quit their jobs today if they could, including just about everyone reading this forum. I doubt I have to spell this out to any of you nontrad premeds. After all, if you folks loved your current jobs so much, why would any of you be so interested in doing mine?

 

[jl lin]

I didn't intend to suggest that I'd stop working altogether. I just won't be practicing medicine full-time, and maybe not at all.

Most people would quit their jobs today if they could, including just about everyone reading this forum. I doubt I have to spell this out to any of you nontrad premeds. After all, if you folks loved your current jobs so much, why would any of you be so interested in doing mine?

I actually love a lot of what I have done as a RN.
Re: the highlighted part, well, that's another story of which I have shared bits and pieces, so I won't go into it again. In another thread, I used the word repression. It's a powerful force.

I think a lot of us like to work; we just want it to be on our own schedules.

I am interested in why you would not want to continue working in medicine. Also, would you not consider academic medicine? You communicate so well, and it seems, at least from SDN perspective, that such would be a natural fit for you. I'd love to sit in your lectures and labs. But then I'm a dork that likes school and conferences and such.

 

[QofQuimica]

I actually love a lot of what I have done as a RN.
Re: the highlighted part, well, that's another story of which I have shared bits and pieces, so I won't go into it again. In another thread, I used the word repression. It's a powerful force.

I think a lot of us like to work; we just want it to be on our own schedules.

I am interested in why you would not want to continue working in medicine. Also, would you not consider academic medicine? You communicate so well, and it seems, at least from SDN perspective, that such would be a natural fit for you. I'd love to sit in your lectures and labs. But then I'm a dork that likes school and conferences and such.

I actually am an academic physician, albeit a clinical assistant prof (so no research expectations for my position, and sporadic teaching duties).

As for why I want to work less, my goals have changed as I've gotten older, similar to many people, I suspect. I'm sure that most nontrads would agree that what you want at age 20 or 30 may not be what you want at age 40 or 50. At this point in my life, I value my time more than I had in the past, and I don't want a career that is all-consuming of my life any more. I suppose it's fair to say that I want to be on my own schedule, too. Being an academic physician does offer some flexibility, but I still find myself driving over to the hospital plenty of nights when I'd just as soon not be.

 

[Jumai]

1) give your rank (and age too, if you're so inclined)

I'm a 38-year-old pre-med. I have a bachelor's and a master's but am back in college completing the med school pre-reqs. I hope to enter med school at the ripe ol' age of 40 or 41.

2) what pros you see to going to med school as a nontrad

I see tons of pros, mostly related to a new sense of focus that comes from already having achieved all of the OTHER things that were so important to me (marriage, children, home ownership, financial security, etc.). As I see it, at this point med school is a huge bonus in my already rich life. I'm grateful that I have the opportunity to do this amazing thing with the support of my husband and without taking on tons of debt.

3) what cons you see of doing the same

Cons for me are related to the sacrifices (mostly in terms of time that could have been spent together) that my whole family will need to make. I feel guilty knowing that my kids will need to be shipped off to various caretakers and activities while I'm pursuing my dream.

Hi,i know it has been a while you posted this,my story seems like yours,I am 39 and starting post bacc next summer...my kids are 9,6 and 18 months....have you graduated now and can you please mentor me/ let me know what your experience was like.thanks

 

[LingoLaine]

Hi,i know it has been a while you posted this,my story seems like yours,I am 39 and starting post bacc next summer...my kids are 9,6 and 18 months....have you graduated now and can you please mentor me/ let me know what your experience was like.thanks

Ha! Thanks for bringing this post to my attention. Weird to see it again because I don't remember writing it. I graduated this May and am now a 45-year-old intern. I'm not going to lie, this is TOUGH. The sacrifices are bigger than I imagined. If I could go back, I don't think I would do it again.

 

[adoctoralawyer]

Ha! Thanks for bringing this post to my attention. Weird to see it again because I don't remember writing it. I graduated this May and am now a 45-year-old intern. I'm not going to lie, this is TOUGH. The sacrifices are bigger than I imagined. If I could go back, I don't think I would do it again.

Can you elaborate for us? In what way is it different than you expected, and why would you not do it again.

And thanks @Jumai for waking this thread up. Can others that posted here a few years ago post whether they feel they did the right thing in retrospect by going to med school or whether they are rethinking their previous enthusiasm. We all want to be able to learn from others' experiences.

 

[sazerac]

1) 4th year medical student, age 46
2) pros -
I think I get taken more seriously by residents and attendings when at the hospital.
This is my third career, so I don't worry about stuff (i.e. medicine) as I did in my first career - my job doesn't define me.
I have a lot more experience to draw on for making analogies, or just shooting the breeze at the nurses station.
3) cons
Can't really think of any.
Maybe if I was more aggressive about my career I would find perceived slights or something.
My second career involved some physical exertion like fire fighting and mountaineering and environmental exposure so the exertion in the hospital doesn't bother me.

Would I do it again? For sure! Gained a lot of knowledge I was naturally curious about, met my wife, had two children with her, and found a reliable and interesting career (changed my mind a couple times in school). I'm doing interviews now, and get to see all these different programs and go on all these trips. I've been busy, but it's been fun.

I'm going into psych, so perhaps my opinion would be different if I chose a more grinding specialty.

 

[ayjaystudent]

I'm just finishing up MS-2.

I was 36 when I started, will turn forty 3 months after I get my MD.

I concur on all the 'more life experience', 'empathy', 'better priorities', and such the previous posters have mentioned.

But this all addresses non-trad as an age. I may be 'old', but I also came from a Fine Arts background. Something I don't see often in my peers. I feel this gives me an edge on visual and 3d information. Though other non-art majors can have a similar advantage.

One of the plastic surgeons I followed last summer told me that I would be wasting my talent as a sculpture if I did not go into a surgical field, especially plastic surgery. If I could crave realistic lips from clay and stone, I could do so from flesh when needed.

I have to agree with him, I feel my training in the arts would make me a better surgeon faster than someone with no artistic talent or training. (However, my flat feet, my bodies desire to sleep 8-10 hours, the high synoscope probability, and my enjoyment of a good work life balance make me less prone to wish to endure the part of a general surgery residency that plastic surgery would require.)


So it is not just the age, wisdom, and maturity that us non-trads bring. But our experience in other fields will help us extend medicine's usefulness in directions that would be difficult for people who followed a more traditional path.

Out of curiosity, what specialization are you pursuing now?

 

[QofQuimica]

Can others that posted here a few years ago post whether they feel they did the right thing in retrospect by going to med school or whether they are rethinking their previous enthusiasm. We all want to be able to learn from others' experiences.

I'll be quitting my faculty job in six weeks, taking a six month sabbatical to go abroad and study something of personal interest to me, and then starting a fellowship at age 42 in a much less remunerative field. After that, I'm not sure yet. I'm considering myself semi-retired as of January.

I don't think if I had the chance to redo the past decade of my life that I would have spent it going to medical school/residency/working as a physician. In hindsight, I can think of a lot more worthwhile and interesting things to do with my time. At the same time, I don't regret having had those experiences, either, although I am pretty darn excited about jumping off the career treadmill. And of course, it's easy to say now that the price I paid was too high, but as a premed, I couldn't have possibly known that. If I had thought then that medical school wasn't worth it, I obviously would have pursued a different goal.

I think people are reading this thread hoping to use it to help figure out if med school is right for them. The problem is, no one else can tell you if medicine is right for you. And I'm not sure one's life's work should be pigeonholed into a binary decision like that anyway. There is really more of a continuum from rightness to wrongness, as opposed to an either-or. The goal, then, is to push further toward the rightness side, which, depending on your other goals in life, may or may not be compatible with a career in medicine. In my case, I like being my own boss and maximizing my personal freedom and independence. A traditional career in medicine won't give me the kind of life I want, not even in academia. I don't hate medicine; it has many good points. And I do think I'll be able to cobble something more to my taste together. But I probably would have enjoyed a different career more.

The best advice I can give to the rest of you is to consider what you want your life to be like in another decade or two. And then consider whether medical training is the best path to get you there.

 

[teacherman]

Been away from SDN for a long time, but figured I'd post since it was very helpful for me during the whole process.

1) Age 40, 1st year EM attending. Started medical school at 32.
2) Pros-the whole process is a roller coaster with tons of highs and lows. However, now that I'm at the end I truly love what I do. Medical school was actually great. For me, since I had a career and family I was used to setting a schedule and follow it so med school wasn't bad at all. Residency also had lots of highs and it is where you truly become a doctor. Overall, I think it was totally worth it!
3) Cons-it's a huge sacrifice from a financial, time, emotional standpoint, especially during residency which is a beast. This is worse if you have family/kids. It is very isolating for yourself and even more so for them. It's hard to assume a huge debt and not have any money to do anything for at least 7 years. You do tend to lose your identity somewhat during the process. But, luckily, you get most of it back at the end!


PM if you have any questions. Good luck!

 

[Danglars]

I don't think if I had the chance to redo the past decade of my life that I would have spent it going to medical school/residency/working as a physician.

WOW, I cannot describe the impact this sentence has had on me. I'm a non-trad doing my medical school pre-requisites at this very moment, and I never would have thought I'd be reading this statement ever. This may be the tipping point for me to admit my 3 years of setting up the time for myself to transition careers was an unfathomable mistake.

I recently read somewhere else today or yesterday a very heartfelt essay and the ending paragraph was that "time is all we have" and you—QofQuimica—have indirectly communicated the overall theme of what I read on some type of uplifting blog.

I have been told by every doctor I've expressed interest in MD/DO future career path and they have ALL unequivocally warned me "don't become a doctor unless in your heart, it's the ONLY job/profession you can see yourself ever becoming" and I may in fact jump ships.

To the other non-trads, just thought I'd share this to anyone else having doubts. Thank you to everyone who has posted in this thread. I appreciate the honesty of everyone. Since we're older, we understand how life is about tradeoffs which the youngsters don't really have any inkling of an idea what that is yet, lol.

 

[bumblebee611]

Since the thread is revived, I thought I'd shout out to @tigress if she's still out here -- would love your advice on making it through as a single parent. I'm currently an M1 at 44 and the only single or divorced parent in my class. The parenting part is the only thing making school tough at this point.

 

[QofQuimica]

WOW, I cannot describe the impact this sentence has had on me. I'm a non-trad doing my medical school pre-requisites at this very moment, and I never would have thought I'd be reading this statement ever. This may be the tipping point for me to admit my 3 years of setting up the time for myself to transition careers was an unfathomable mistake.

I recently read somewhere else today or yesterday a very heartfelt essay and the ending paragraph was that "time is all we have" and you—QofQuimica—have indirectly communicated the overall theme of what I read on some type of uplifting blog.

I have been told by every doctor I've expressed interest in MD/DO future career path and they have ALL unequivocally warned me "don't become a doctor unless in your heart, it's the ONLY job/profession you can see yourself ever becoming" and I may in fact jump ships.

To the other non-trads, just thought I'd share this to anyone else having doubts. Thank you to everyone who has posted in this thread. I appreciate the honesty of everyone. Since we're older, we understand how life is about tradeoffs which the youngsters don't really have any inkling of an idea what that is yet, lol.

I'm glad it was a helpful perspective, but it may or may not apply to you. I don't live a traditional lifestyle (nomadic, no family/spouse), and I'm perennially restless.

I've basically come to the conclusion that I don't want a "profession" at all. I don't want to work 80 hour weeks (or even 60 hour weeks, or even 40 hour weeks, at least not all the time). I don't want to deal with bureaucracy and go to meetings. I don't want to answer "how high?" when random manager types tell me to jump. I also don't want to be a "boss" and manage other people. So even though I enjoy the actual medicine part at times, and I dearly enjoy teaching, I really don't enjoy being a physician, at least not in a traditional career model. Whether there's a niche for me to engage in PT work after fellowship remains to be seen. But at the moment at least, I think semi-retiring so I can work when/on what I want is the best option.

There's no doubt in my mind that medicine is NOT a career one should do for the money. And I'm sad to say that was becoming my main driving force toward the end. I don't mean in the sense of needing a high income so I could be living a high lifestyle. I mean in the sense of, how fast could I accumulate enough funds so I'd never have to work again and could early retire. And when I realized that what I really wanted was to be able to quit my job, it was a small step from there to concluding, you know, there is literally nothing to stop me from quitting right now. I SHOULD quit. So I did.

I am not going to "never work again." But I am not going to have a career in medicine. And that change in perspective has made all the difference for me, because it has made it possible for me to stay in medicine.

 

[SilveoDante]

WOW, I cannot describe the impact this sentence has had on me. I'm a non-trad doing my medical school pre-requisites at this very moment, and I never would have thought I'd be reading this statement ever. This may be the tipping point for me to admit my 3 years of setting up the time for myself to transition careers was an unfathomable mistake.

I recently read somewhere else today or yesterday a very heartfelt essay and the ending paragraph was that "time is all we have" and you—QofQuimica—have indirectly communicated the overall theme of what I read on some type of uplifting blog.

I have been told by every doctor I've expressed interest in MD/DO future career path and they have ALL unequivocally warned me "don't become a doctor unless in your heart, it's the ONLY job/profession you can see yourself ever becoming" and I may in fact jump ships.

To the other non-trads, just thought I'd share this to anyone else having doubts. Thank you to everyone who has posted in this thread. I appreciate the honesty of everyone. Since we're older, we understand how life is about tradeoffs which the youngsters don't really have any inkling of an idea what that is yet, lol.

I often find that the majority of doctors who bash medicine come from backgrounds where they never had to struggle to make ends meet. "It is slave labor", "The pay is not worth it", etc. News flash: all careers are hard and at various times can seem to not be woth the effort. As someone from a blue collar background who worked 60+ hours a week through school, I laugh at these statements. It is simply far too easy to lose perspective, especially in a group that generally comes from a privileged background (average medical student parental income is slightly over 150k).

I remember a physician who told me that I would be better off becoming a UPS driver or an engineer. Funny enough, I had worked for UPS and my job was nicknamed the 'widow maker'. Also, I have friends who are engineers, and the only ones who make big bucks work 80+ hours per week and hate working a job without passion. Simply put: there is no easy way out unless you come with a silver spoon in the rear-end or create something (and even the latter requires tremendous effort).

I guess it all comes down to passion and perspective. Without it, your life is doomed (regardless of your profession).

 

[QofQuimica]

Q - why no interest in starting a practice?

Hire someone on 100% commission for insurance paperwork.

Find a decent building and medical assistant and you're done. Give the medical assistant profit sharing and you won't have to manage them conventionally either.

Well....

I also don't want to be a "boss" and manage other people.

And

I don't live a traditional lifestyle (nomadic, no family/spouse), and I'm perennially restless.

And

I've basically come to the conclusion that I don't want a "profession" at all.

I could be wrong, but I just don't think I have the makings of a nascent entrepreneur. I don't even think I should buy a house, at least not until or unless I decide to settle down somewhere.

I often find that the majority of doctors who bash medicine come from backgrounds where they never had to struggle to make ends meet. "It is slave labor", "The pay is not worth it", etc. News flash: all careers are hard and at various times can seem to not be woth the effort. As someone from a blue collar background who worked 60+ hours a week through school, I laugh at these statements. It is simply far too easy to lose perspective, especially in a group that generally comes from a privileged background (average medical student parental income is slightly over 150k).

There's something to this, but it's not only this. Medicine is not like other careers. You are dealing with people's lives here, not spreadsheets and not widgets. It is not something you can do kind of half-heartedly or without some emotional investment (well, at least I would argue, it shouldn't be!). If you go into medicine for the wrong reasons (financial especially), it is also easy to get trapped by the amount of debt you've taken on with no other way to pay it back except to keep pushing forward. And people who feel trapped are bitter, no matter how gilded their cage may be.

While I wouldn't call being a physician slave labor (I am hardly a slave, as evidenced by the fact that I can and did quit), neither is medicine worth doing solely, or even primarily, for the money. Having been on both ends (first where I had more month than money, and now having way more money than I can spend), I can tell you this: having more money than you can spend does not solve all your problems the way many lower-income people assume it will. While it makes some problems easier, it also creates new problems. I never could have imagined or predicted some of those types of things, such as needing a crash course on how to properly invest, for example. Up until the age of 39, I never had given it a second thought because I never had anything to invest.

If you've never done so, it's fascinating to read people's accounts of winning the lotto or otherwise coming into a large sum of money, and their reports of how that changes their lives, both for good and for ill. Because for someone who isn't used to making a professional salary, becoming an attending will feel like receiving a huge windfall...over and over, every other week. Even after 2.5 years of being an attending, I still feel like I've won the lotto every other week. The sums that pass through my bank account are just....mind-boggling. I will pay more in income taxes this year than I'll gross as a fellow next year, even with being a state employee, and even with living in a tax-free state. And you know what? That kind of income is still not enough to make the job "worth it" if you're not doing it for some other reason on top of making money.

I guess it all comes down to passion and perspective. Without it, your life is doomed (regardless of your profession).

This I would wholeheartedly agree with.

 

[TheTao]

I often find that the majority of doctors who bash medicine come from backgrounds where they never had to struggle to make ends meet. "It is slave labor", "The pay is not worth it", etc. News flash: all careers are hard and at various times can seem to not be woth the effort. As someone from a blue collar background who worked 60+ hours a week through school, I laugh at these statements. It is simply far too easy to lose perspective, especially in a group that generally comes from a privileged background (average medical student parental income is slightly over 150k).

I remember a physician who told me that I would be better off becoming a UPS driver or an engineer. Funny enough, I had worked for UPS and my job was nicknamed the 'widow maker'. Also, I have friends who are engineers, and the only ones who make big bucks work 80+ hours per week and hate working a job without passion. Simply put: there is no easy way out unless you come with a silver spoon in the rear-end or create something (and even the latter requires tremendous effort).

I guess it all comes down to passion and perspective. Without it, your life is doomed (regardless of your profession).

1000 votes up with this working class background versus not.

I also married an Engineer that's also an Entrepreneur and he DEFINITELY works more than most docs I know.

 

[Danglars]

As someone from a blue collar background who worked 60+ hours a week through school, I laugh at these statements.

Working 60 hours a week builds character and makes you a better human being. I believe you will make a WONDERFUL doctor and the medical profession is honored to have you and your patients will be blessed concomitantly.

I guess it all comes down to passion and perspective. Without it, your life is doomed (regardless of your profession).

I too have friends that are engineers and they jokingly call me the "real" engineer because I'm more analytical than them about life. If I were to respond to this comment, I'd be like everybody else. Instead, I'd just ask you (respectfully, of course) to continue your train of thought about what you guess it all comes down to. Introspection is a fine tool, and the cute bunny in my avatar hereby authorizes you to use that tool often and always.

Your post reminded me of an anesthesiologist who was VERY active on this forum. I'd remember his name, but he had over a thousand posts and he was an admin & lifetime donor and all that. But he was diagnosed with terminal lung cancer. All I remember about what I read in his story was that he was a non-smoker and a light, social drinker. If anyone can point me to his story, I believe it was about 6-7 years ago if I had to guess? His username had a school-name in its moniker.

Basically, his story was similar to one I was fortunately smart enough to save and print out. I also hereby advise anyone who reads this to ALWAYS print, save, and email yourself any story that is when a person POURS THEIR HEART OUT bravely on the internet in a desperate plea for their wisdom and perspectives not to die along with their body. Here is one such story I have saved, printed, and emailed to myself (all 3 of my email addresses I use):

https://www.reddit.com/r/IAmA/comments/5245bz/iama_33_yearold_radiologist_two_months_after_i/

If anyone can please tell me how I would go about searching for the anesthesiologist story about a highly active SDN user, I'd very much appreciate it. It's even more powerful and touching than the reddit radiologist's story.

 

[TheTao]

Your post reminded me of an anesthesiologist who was VERY active on this forum. I'd remember his name, but he had over a thousand posts and he was an admin & lifetime donor and all that. But he was diagnosed with terminal lung cancer. All I remember about what I read in his story was that he was a non-smoker and a light, social drinker. If anyone can point me to his story, I believe it was about 6-7 years ago if I had to guess? His username had a school-name in its moniker.

Here's the story , http://crushmycancer.blogspot.com/

 

[Danglars]

Here's the story , http://crushmycancer.blogspot.com/

Don't be sad. He's in heaven. God is very weird and I seriously have no idea what the point of this bible verse is all about...

God has given me narcissism and made me a remarkable writer. I have a very close relationship with God and after a few beers (allow me to rant, but forgive me if Jack-n-coke halves my effective IQ) I am of the opinion that God purposefully makes himself impossible for ANY human brain to understand God.

Humans trying to understand God is more laughable than an ant trying to understand the subtle nuances between Sn1 & Sn2!

I'll just pardon myself from being the laughing stock of SDN for the evening. (blame my shot glass which is 10 ounces rather than 1 ounce) which made me pour way too much!! Oh and yes I listen to country music and I love nascar. (gonna wake up and never log back into SDN or check this thread ever again!! yikes!) why can't I just delete this post rather than submitting it???

 

[Danglars]

This happened to me 7 hours ago (if you can guess my city)

(report #02-17-01701)

 

[Danglars]

Who knew that listening to country music while driving around your neighborhood pretending it's a nascar track could get swat officers with guns pointed at you and vicious canine scary dogs that appeared to be high on meth. They had that look in their eye like Jesse Pinkman from breaking bad the first time Walt White tried to meet Gus Fring at Pollos Hermano's in the city of Guinness, lol.

 

[gallons]

WOW, I cannot describe the impact this sentence has had on me. I'm a non-trad doing my medical school pre-requisites at this very moment, and I never would have thought I'd be reading this statement ever. This may be the tipping point for me to admit my 3 years of setting up the time for myself to transition careers was an unfathomable mistake.

I recently read somewhere else today or yesterday a very heartfelt essay and the ending paragraph was that "time is all we have" and you—QofQuimica—have indirectly communicated the overall theme of what I read on some type of uplifting blog.

I have been told by every doctor I've expressed interest in MD/DO future career path and they have ALL unequivocally warned me "don't become a doctor unless in your heart, it's the ONLY job/profession you can see yourself ever becoming" and I may in fact jump ships.

To the other non-trads, just thought I'd share this to anyone else having doubts. Thank you to everyone who has posted in this thread. I appreciate the honesty of everyone. Since we're older, we understand how life is about tradeoffs which the youngsters don't really have any inkling of an idea what that is yet, lol.

His quote did not stir anything in me so I must be on the right track.

 

[Ad2b]

His quote did not stir anything in me so I must be on the right track.

Q = she... fyi

 

[gallons]

Q = she... fyi

proof?

 

[Ad2b]

proof?

personal conversations

 

[QofQuimica]

proof?

I realize that these days gender identity can be....fluid. However, I have been female for nearly 42 years now, and I remain female. The SDN founders have also verified my identity as a physician, a PhD, and as faculty (meaning they know who I am IRL). If that's not enough "proof" for you, sorry.

 

[Ad2b]

I realize that these days gender identity can be....fluid. However, I have been female for nearly 42 years now, and I remain female. The SDN founders have also verified my identity as a physician, a PhD, and as faculty (meaning they know who I am IRL). If that's not enough "proof" for you, sorry.

Oh, Q, I have not followed up on where your path is headed/staying, but I hope you will still be around these parts.

You are <3 'd

 

[gallons]

I realize that these days gender identity can be....fluid. However, I have been female for nearly 42 years now, and I remain female. The SDN founders have also verified my identity as a physician, a PhD, and as faculty (meaning they know who I am IRL). If that's not enough "proof" for you, sorry.

I was being sarcastic. Sorry.