Pulmonary and Critical Care Fellowship 2021/2022 Cycle

icuhopeful

New Member
Sep 7, 2021
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    Hi, would have anyone have an insight into these programs for purpose of Rank order list

    Washington Hospital Center DC
    WVU, Morgantown.
    MCG, Georgia
    Allegheny, Pittsburgh
    Einstein, Philadelphia
    Metro Health- Cleveland
    Albany medical center

    Was having difficulty deciding between them. If any of you have an insight and could help ranking them based on your experience ?
    Looking for strong clinical and procedural training
     
    Oct 6, 2021
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    1. Resident [Any Field]
      Hi, would have anyone have an insight into these programs for purpose of Rank order list

      Washington Hospital Center DC
      WVU, Morgantown.
      MCG, Georgia
      Allegheny, Pittsburgh
      Einstein, Philadelphia
      Metro Health- Cleveland
      Albany medical center

      Was having difficulty deciding between them. If any of you have an insight and could help ranking them based on your experience ?
      Looking for strong clinical and procedural training
      WHC has excellent clinical training and fellows are very well trained. In addition, DMV area is great to live in. Overall I think these places are pretty comparable.
       

      pcp2md

      MD Critical Care
      2+ Year Member
      Jul 23, 2019
      24
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        Same question as above. Any insight into Houston Methodist program?

        It’s a private hospital which really impacts the autonomy and training; in both pulm and critical you will basically be assisting the attendings who run the show, very low autonomy and insufficient procedures in the critical care setting, and the pulm experience is pretty weak. Lots of turnover in leadership in last few years and serious deficiencies in training noted by recent fellows.
         
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        glaucomflecken32

        New Member
        2+ Year Member
        Aug 28, 2017
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          Any insight into the following programs from a ranking perspective both for training(clinically strong, more procedures, research is a plus but not interested in bench research) and location (PCCM first choice)?

          Mayo Clinic, Rochester - strong clinically, prestigious program, location +/-
          Cedars Sinai LA
          Stanford - CCM - drawback no Pulm for an academic career but the location is a plus factor
          UT Houston - clinically strong, overworked fellows?
          UT San Antonio - clinically strong, happy fellows
          Houston Methodist - private/academic mixed
          UT Austin - first class next year
          Montefiore/Albert Einstein - strong clinically
          Metro Health/Case Western - decent program, not sure about the location
          Tulane University
          OHSU - location is a plus factor, strength in clinical and research training
          UCSF Fresno - busy program, good clinical training
           

          Burritoes

          New Member
          Oct 17, 2021
          3
          3
            Anyone else finding it ridiculously difficult to build the rank list? I don't know if it's because of the virtual interview format but all programs seem pretty much the same...the only thing that changes is location and name.
             
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            JustLungs

            Full Member
            Jul 30, 2021
            13
            5
              Anyone else finding it ridiculously difficult to build the rank list? I don't know if it's because of the virtual interview format but all programs seem pretty much the same...the only thing that changes is location and name.
              I am with you on that. Hence, i think it's important to contribute to the program impression tab. After the advice I got from previous posts, I think i'm leaning towards name, training, current fellow camaraderie, and city (since it's going to be temporary). This helped me differentiate some programs but definitely still having difficulty with others.
               

              pccmbound

              New Member
              Jul 23, 2021
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              1. Resident [Any Field]
                ^ This is honestly a major contribution to my desire to stay in house. I am certain there are things out there I am missing but with this interview format I don't think it was really well sold to me what those things are.
                 
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                Shixo

                New Member
                Aug 12, 2021
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                  Hey guys, i have an emergency situation and i want someone who has an interview in UT McGovern Houston to switch with me interview dates. I'm scheduled on November 5 th and i want to switch it to any other date. Will appreciate your help.
                   

                  Doctor Bob

                  Fellowship aPD
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                  Feb 12, 2009
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                    When should we start sending intent emails to programs to let them know we will rank them?

                    This is unnecessary. Anything you tell them (as far as where you plan to rank them) is not viewed with any reliability and no decision is made based off that information. I wouldn't move anyone up or down my list based on how they planned to rank me. I'm their first choice? Great, they're still my 32nd. And if I don't fill by that point they'll get a spot. But I think the other 31 people would be better and someone really wanting to come here doesn't make them a better candidate per se.
                     
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                    icuhopeful

                    New Member
                    Sep 7, 2021
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                      Anyone interview at Washington Hospital Center for Pulm/ Crit - Can post their opinion

                      The excel sheet said no weaknesses.

                      But what did you guys think about Pulm procedures. One of the fellows did mention that they had thoracics and you had to be proactive to get those procedures such as chest tubes..
                       

                      Burritoes

                      New Member
                      Oct 17, 2021
                      3
                      3
                        Anyone interview at Washington Hospital Center for Pulm/ Crit - Can post their opinion

                        The excel sheet said no weaknesses.

                        But what did you guys think about Pulm procedures. One of the fellows did mention that they had thoracics and you had to be proactive to get those procedures such as chest tubes..
                        At the end of the day, these programs are trying to sell you on their program. The best way to get information is to ask the fellows; and even then, some fellows might have a different experience than others. So even though the spreadsheet is helpful, I would go with my own impression of the program from interview day/happy hour rather than what the PD’s tell you during their program overview or what I read on the spreadsheet.
                         

                        JustbreatheMD

                        New Member
                        Oct 5, 2021
                        2
                        1
                          I was wondering if any one has any advice about how to rank. Each program is very different and no program has everything. I have a spectrum of programs I have interviewed at. Some are extremely academic (top 20 in US news) with 18 months of research. Most are mid tier academic programs that are more clinical oriented but opportunities for research. Some have lung transplant at their hospital (which I hear increases procedures), some offer a track with a masters degree (which I would consider doing just to understand how to interpret clinical trials better). Some have IP fellowships (which can give an inside track for sub-fellowship, but may take away procedures).
                          What do you guys think are the most important things to look for when making a rank list? Is name and being in the top 20 programs super important, even if the clinical training may not be as strong, as it could provide opportunities later? What if you’re leaning towards community practice more? Is it more so clinical training that’s important? Should I base only on location? (I don’t mind moving if I have to). Is having a lung transplant center super important? What about airway management (what if intubations are done by anesthesia)?
                          would love advice from someone in the field. @Doctor Bob
                           
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                          Aug 11, 2021
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                          1. Resident [Any Field]
                            I was wondering if any one has any advice about how to rank. Each program is very different and no program has everything. I have a spectrum of programs I have interviewed at. Some are extremely academic (top 20 in US news) with 18 months of research. Most are mid tier academic programs that are more clinical oriented but opportunities for research. Some have lung transplant at their hospital (which I hear increases procedures), some offer a track with a masters degree (which I would consider doing just to understand how to interpret clinical trials better). Some have IP fellowships (which can give an inside track for sub-fellowship, but may take away procedures).
                            What do you guys think are the most important things to look for when making a rank list? Is name and being in the top 20 programs super important, even if the clinical training may not be as strong, as it could provide opportunities later? What if you’re leaning towards community practice more? Is it more so clinical training that’s important? Should I base only on location? (I don’t mind moving if I have to). Is having a lung transplant center super important? What about airway management (what if intubations are done by anesthesia)?
                            would love advice from someone in the field. @Doctor Bob
                            I think you should first decide if research is or is not important to you. That will help you to initially divide your fellowship options into 2 categories and you can focus on the category important to you first and then the other programs fall into your lower rankings. Most have research but some are research "heavy" and that is a different type of experience from "heavy clinical", again depending on your ultimate plan. I would also consider your interactions with the existing fellows during interviews. How did they seem - happy, unhappy, etc. They will all be tired. But what is the feel you got from them. The team can make or break your time in fellowship. The PD is important, but your time will be spent with your peers and the attendings. Did you like the attendings ?
                            Third, do they have a good volume of cases in the area you want to specialize in (CF, RHC, etc). You want to be an expert in your planned specialty if you already know your career path. I can't answer on secondary degrees - the importance of such is totally up to you. Also, I don't think program name is as important as everyone says it is. Most programs are actually very good and will get you what you need, so make the time at your selected program as enjoyable as possible by picking a place that made you feel comfortable.
                             
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                            in_10_so

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                            Jan 25, 2017
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                              SOS: need help with ROL.
                              I am an IMG with no family, friends, & connections in US and virtual interviews didn't help either. Any/every input will be greatly appreciated.
                              Preference: Prestige/name, strong all-rounded clinical experience with supportive/happy faculty and fellows, willing to teach. I have had my fair share of airways already, so don't care much about that. Bronch suite numbers matter as I may do IP fellowship. Research is a side gig. Location doesn't matter. Long term goal: Clinician educator.
                              Current ROL:
                              1) Michigan State University, Grand Rapids
                              2) Methodist Houston
                              3) Rutgers RWJMS, New Brunswick
                              4) WVU, Morgantown
                              5) U Tennessee, Memphis
                              6) U Toledo
                              7) Albany Medical Center
                              8) SUNY Downstate
                              9) Rutgers NJMS
                              10) NYP Queens

                              Thank you.
                               

                              IMDubJay

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                              Jul 24, 2021
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                                This is unnecessary. Anything you tell them (as far as where you plan to rank them) is not viewed with any reliability and no decision is made based off that information. I wouldn't move anyone up or down my list based on how they planned to rank me. I'm their first choice? Great, they're still my 32nd. And if I don't fill by that point they'll get a spot. But I think the other 31 people would be better and someone really wanting to come here doesn't make them a better candidate per se.
                                Super late to the game with this reply but thought it was worth adding this perspective: I have had two programs tell me the opposite. During one of my interview days (mid tier academic program) the PD said to the entire group something to the effect that we are only interviewing applicants that we are excited about having come to our program and it will help if you let us know if you are ranking us highly. It was kind of awkward at the time (and frankly delivered in an off-putting way) but I believe there are programs that adjust their rank list based on applicant communication.
                                 

                                Doctor Bob

                                Fellowship aPD
                                10+ Year Member
                                Air Force
                                Feb 12, 2009
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                                1. Attending Physician
                                  Super late to the game with this reply but thought it was worth adding this perspective: I have had two programs tell me the opposite. During one of my interview days (mid tier academic program) the PD said to the entire group something to the effect that we are only interviewing applicants that we are excited about having come to our program and it will help if you let us know if you are ranking us highly. It was kind of awkward at the time (and frankly delivered in an off-putting way) but I believe there are programs that adjust their rank list based on applicant communication.

                                  If all their applicants move that program to the top of their list, it shifts the match in their favor; meaning they are more likely to match the people they want rather than potentially losing them to other programs.

                                  The NRMP has some nice videos on their website that go through how the match process works and how it ultimately favors the applicant -if- they make their rank list dependent on where they want to actually go rather than trying to game the system. On the program side I can either try to convince all the applicants to put me high on their list (thus making me more likely to get my top choices) or I can make my rank list longer.

                                  There is no benefit to me to move someone who is a less desirable candidate up my list just because they're ranking me highly. If I don't get applicants that I prefer more, I'm going to drop to the point on my list where I pick that person up anyways. But I might as well at least take a shot at matching someone I'd rather have more.

                                  Edit: it's not to say that programs don't tell people deceptive things like this... but there is no benefit to them to actually act on it behind the scenes.
                                   
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