research or clinical exposure - broadly speaking

[blissworm]

first thread fyi

generally speaking, for MD admissions to schools is research or clinical exposure more widely appreciated/recommended/required? before I get flamed let me add...

1) i know both are important 2) how can you know you wanna be a doc if you haven't been around patients? I have and I loved it, but I love my research equally so wondering what ratio to pursue both at moving forward 3) I know different schools have different missions, UNC prolly likes volunteering more than stanford, the latter being a research heavy school.

the reason I ask is because my premed advisor, MDs I research with, and family friends who claim to have adcom exp (taken with many salt) all say research is the key in, research research pubs research. But I have consistently seen our SDN gurus weigh clinicals very very heavy compared to research. Additionally, I wish to pursue academic medicine (want to go into ID and run a lab/PI clinical trials but also serve pts inpatient) so I hope to attend a research oriented school.

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[M&L]

first thread fyi

generally speaking, for MD admissions to schools is research or clinical exposure more widely appreciated/recommended/required? before I get flamed let me add...

1) i know both are important 2) how can you know you wanna be a doc if you haven't been around patients? I have and I loved it, but I love my research equally so wondering what ratio to pursue both at moving forward 3) I know different schools have different missions, UNC prolly likes volunteering more than stanford, the latter being a research heavy school.

the reason I ask is because my premed advisor, MDs I research with, and family friends who claim to have adcom exp (taken with many salt) all say research is the key in, research research pubs research. But I have consistently seen our SDN gurus weigh clinicals very very heavy compared to research. Additionally, I wish to pursue academic medicine (want to go into ID and run a lab/PI clinical trials but also serve pts inpatient) so I hope to attend a research oriented school.

This is the thing - yes, both are important , but let me explain . You need at the very list the minimum hours in both . Clinical hours are required for all medical schools (or, like you said, “how do you kjow you wanna be a doctor?”). So clinical hours is what gets you into the door. Research is what gets you into the good door and helps you stand out , and is what you need for research heavy schools . This is how I understand it .
So, I had 400 hours of research and a poster presentation in NIH. That was enough research for me, because I don’t wanna do research . But my clinical hours are over 3000 because I want to work with pts directly. For you the numbers would probably be flipped- do get a few hundred in clinicals , and aim for a lot more in research . Does it make sense ?

so, the way I look at it, it’s about the ratio .

 

[blissworm]

so, the way I look at it, it’s about the ratio .

yeah that definitely makes sense. in 2nd year and with covid just trying to decide how to organize my two remaining years to give me the best shot. Thank you!

 

[deleted1025488]

Keep in mind research doesn't have to be some sort of full-time commitment during the school year if you don't want it to. Find out what type of research you would be interested in, email around, go from there...

 

[Goro]

first thread fyi

generally speaking, for MD admissions to schools is research or clinical exposure more widely appreciated/recommended/required? before I get flamed let me add...

1) i know both are important 2) how can you know you wanna be a doc if you haven't been around patients? I have and I loved it, but I love my research equally so wondering what ratio to pursue both at moving forward 3) I know different schools have different missions, UNC prolly likes volunteering more than stanford, the latter being a research heavy school.

the reason I ask is because my premed advisor, MDs I research with, and family friends who claim to have adcom exp (taken with many salt) all say research is the key in, research research pubs research. But I have consistently seen our SDN gurus weigh clinicals very very heavy compared to research. Additionally, I wish to pursue academic medicine (want to go into ID and run a lab/PI clinical trials but also serve pts inpatient) so I hope to attend a research oriented school.

Research is over-rated. Clinical exposure is a requirement. You can get into med school with out research, although we do like knowing that you understand the scientific method.

 

[aceegreene]

This is the thing - yes, both are important , but let me explain . You need at the very list the minimum hours in both . Clinical hours are required for all medical schools (or, like you said, “how do you kjow you wanna be a doctor?”). So clinical hours is what gets you into the door. Research is what gets you into the good door and helps you stand out , and is what you need for research heavy schools . This is how I understand it .
So, I had 400 hours of research and a poster presentation in NIH. That was enough research for me, because I don’t wanna do research . But my clinical hours are over 3000 because I want to work with pts directly. For you the numbers would probably be flipped- do get a few hundred in clinicals , and aim for a lot more in research . Does it make sense ?

so, the way I look at it, it’s about the ratio .

If I may ask, how'd you get to 3000 hours of clinical hours? Were you employed in a clinical setting? Coz I feel like getting that many hours must be very difficult.

 

[NY_Med]

If I may ask, how'd you get to 3000 hours of clinical hours? Were you employed in a clinical setting? Coz I feel like getting that many hours must be very difficult.

My guess would be full time 1-2 gap years of work in the clinical setting. I have about ~4,500 and about 3,300 of them were done during my gap years. That being said I could only imagine once you get over a certain metric ADCOMS members really would not put that much stock in it. realistically there is no difference between some with 1,500 hours and 5,000 hours; there was significant commitment to medicine in both instances. The most important thing that matters at that point is what you learned and how it impacted your journey and desire to pursue medicine.

 

[M&L]

If I may ask, how'd you get to 3000 hours of clinical hours? Were you employed in a clinical setting? Coz I feel like getting that many hours must be very difficult.

yeah that was my job. a normal person should probably stop at a few hundred

 

[M&L]

My guess would be full time 1-2 gap years of work in the clinical setting. I have about ~4,500 and about 3,300 of them were done during my gap years. That being said I could only imagine once you get over a certain metric ADCOMS members really would not put that much stock in it. realistically there is no difference between some with 1,500 hours and 5,000 hours; there was significant commitment to medicine in both instances. The most important thing that matters at that point is what you learned and how it impacted your journey and desire to pursue medicine.

yeah definitely. That was my job what paid the bills, i didnt do it for medical school.

 

[blissworm]

Research is over-rated. Clinical exposure is a requirement. You can get into med school with out research, although we do like knowing that you understand the scientific method.

could you recommend a good number of hours to hit by app time? and are paid clinical exposures (pharm tech, pt transport etc) not as good as volunteering? I have to pay some bills :/

 

[M&L]

could you recommend a good number of hours to hit by app time? and are paid clinical exposures (pharm tech, pt transport etc) not as good as volunteering? I have to pay some bills :/

paid clinical exposures are DIFFERENT from volunteering. volunteering is there to show that you are committed to service. its like comparing apple and steak. completely different caterogies.

 

[Goro]

could you recommend a good number of hours to hit by app time? and are paid clinical exposures (pharm tech, pt transport etc) not as good as volunteering? I have to pay some bills :/

Employment is always good.

Shoot for >150 of patient contact experience

 

[EdgeTrimmer]

first thread fyi

generally speaking, for MD admissions to schools is research or clinical exposure more widely appreciated/recommended/required? before I get flamed let me add...

1) i know both are important 2) how can you know you wanna be a doc if you haven't been around patients? I have and I loved it, but I love my research equally so wondering what ratio to pursue both at moving forward 3) I know different schools have different missions, UNC prolly likes volunteering more than stanford, the latter being a research heavy school.

the reason I ask is because my premed advisor, MDs I research with, and family friends who claim to have adcom exp (taken with many salt) all say research is the key in, research research pubs research. But I have consistently seen our SDN gurus weigh clinicals very very heavy compared to research. Additionally, I wish to pursue academic medicine (want to go into ID and run a lab/PI clinical trials but also serve pts inpatient) so I hope to attend a research oriented school.

are you a freshman?

 

[blissworm]

are you a freshman?

soph, but covid basically eliminated a potential year

so I racked up 400hrs pharm tech before I quit because covid, I know that usually isnt counted as clinical but is that something?

 

[toastedbutter]

paid clinical exposures are DIFFERENT from volunteering. volunteering is there to show that you are committed to service. its like comparing apple and steak. completely different caterogies.

Wait question, so is it okay to have volunteering hours that are nonclinical and then my clinical exp is paid or something like that? Another way to phrase this is, is clinical volunteering a "required" part of your app or is it fine to have both clinical exposure and volunteering, not necessarily together?

 

[M&L]

Wait question, so is it okay to have volunteering hours that are nonclinical and then my clinical exp is paid or something like that? Another way to phrase this is, is clinical volunteering a "required" part of your app or is it fine to have both clinical exposure and volunteering, not necessarily together?

i never had any clinical volunteering at all. Clinical employment, and non clinical volunteering.