Reverse Gunning

[getunconcsious]

So the class ranking thread made me think of an important point--I'm a reverse gunner. What that means is that I try to party as much as possible and study as little as possible, in addition to trying to pass each class by a razor-thin margin. Essentially trying to get by with as little work as possible. There's quite a group of us at my school, we're the fun ones. We openly ridicule anyone who tries hard and studies a lot, and we're analogous to the cool stoners from high school.

So are there any other people like this on here? We need a thread to make fun of the diligent students who take medical school seriously. It's weird how they are in the majority. I mean didn't these people go to high school? One of the first things you learn in high school is that being smart and working hard makes you uncool and a dork...

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[tupac_don]

So the class ranking thread made me think of an important point--I'm a reverse gunner. What that means is that I try to party as much as possible and study as little as possible, in addition to trying to pass each class by a razor-thin margin. Essentially trying to get by with as little work as possible. There's quite a group of us at my school, we're the fun ones. We openly ridicule anyone who tries hard and studies a lot, and we're analogous to the cool stoners from high school.

So are there any other people like this on here? We need a thread to make fun of the diligent students who take medical school seriously. It's weird how they are in the majority. I mean didn't these people go to high school? One of the first things you learn in high school is that being smart and working hard makes you uncool and a dork...

1) I don't think there is such thing as a reverse gunner, I think the appropriate term would be slacker.

2) Just b/c you study hard doesn't mean you can't party it up as an animal, date chicks, go to gym, play sports and so forth.

3) By slacking its ok, but you are shooting yourself in the foot, your choices will be limited. There is nothing cool about being stuck in something you don't like doing. You should think how much you wanna mess around, cuz in the end you are just bending yourself over.

4) Also you should think what cool stoners are doing, probably serving you at Mickie D's.

But hey by all means party it up dog, but look to find a middle ground. Like you say it's not too cool to be gunner, its not fun to be at the bottom of your class either. Just my opinion, don't get all bent out of shape. Just figured I'd respond since you put the question out there.

 

[SitraAchra]

Getunconscious, you need to get with it. I wake up at 5am and put 1/2 a cucumber, 12.3 raspberries, and a shaven carrot into my juicemaster for breakfast supplement.

I then run 4.3 miles in 27.5 minutes. I shower. I then spend the next 3 hours reviewing materials for the day ahead.

You need to follow my example if you want to get ANYWHERE.

 

[tigershark]

Enjoy family practice.

 

[Misterioso]

or EM

 

[Law2Doc]

I wake up at 5am and put 1/2 a cucumber, 12.3 raspberries, and a shaven carrot into my juicemaster for breakfast supplement.

I give up -- how does one measure out a raspberry to the 0.3 decimal??? And what do you do with the other 2/3? And would having the rest of that 13th raspberry throw off the whole routine?

 

[SitraAchra]

or derm

 

[SitraAchra]

I give up -- how does one measure out a raspberry to the 0.3 decimal??? And what do you do with the other 2/3? And would having the rest of that 13th raspberry throw off the whole routine?

If I over-do it on the raspberries I cramp up. I have an elaborate system of scales, pulleys, and fulcrums which measure exactly to the .002 raspberry

 

[getunconcsious]

Enjoy family practice.

I may be destined for family practice, but at least I'm not an uptight A-hole!

Besides, when you're as hott as me being smart isn't really that important. Like my parents always said, it's what's on the outside that counts.

 

[Beau Geste]

So the class ranking thread made me think of an important point--I'm a reverse gunner. What that means is that I try to party as much as possible and study as little as possible, in addition to trying to pass each class by a razor-thin margin. Essentially trying to get by with as little work as possible. There's quite a group of us at my school, we're the fun ones. We openly ridicule anyone who tries hard and studies a lot, and we're analogous to the cool stoners from high school.

So are there any other people like this on here? We need a thread to make fun of the diligent students who take medical school seriously. It's weird how they are in the majority. I mean didn't these people go to high school? One of the first things you learn in high school is that being smart and working hard makes you uncool and a dork...

I think you are trying to be funny.

I was voted the "biggest procrastinator" of my senior high school class. It's pretty true though. I live on deadlines and USED to not study a lot in high school and come out with great grades. It came to bite me though in college and if I kept living that way I would never be where I am today - posting on SDN.

Anyway, it's all fun and games to accept marginal behavior as the norm, but what kind of physician do you want to be? A marginal one? Only you will know, but your patients will suffer for it.

 

[SoCuteMD]

So the class ranking thread made me think of an important point--I'm a reverse gunner. What that means is that I try to party as much as possible and study as little as possible, in addition to trying to pass each class by a razor-thin margin. Essentially trying to get by with as little work as possible. There's quite a group of us at my school, we're the fun ones. We openly ridicule anyone who tries hard and studies a lot, and we're analogous to the cool stoners from high school.

So are there any other people like this on here? We need a thread to make fun of the diligent students who take medical school seriously. It's weird how they are in the majority. I mean didn't these people go to high school? One of the first things you learn in high school is that being smart and working hard makes you uncool and a dork...

I did that last semester. But I found that my stress level in the days preceding tests was taking years off my life. So I decided to buckle down a bit more. My grades probably won't be any better, but at least I'm not packing my bags the night before tests anymore.

 

[Ypo.]

Getunconscious, you need to get with it. I wake up at 5am and put 1/2 a cucumber, 12.3 raspberries, and a shaven carrot into my juicemaster for breakfast supplement.

I then run 4.3 miles in 27.5 minutes. I shower. I then spend the next 3 hours reviewing materials for the day ahead.

You need to follow my example if you want to get ANYWHERE.

Classic...

 

[marcus_aurelius]

medical school is filled with very strange people.

what is a gunner?

cant we all just get along?

 

[Ypo.]

Anyway, it's all fun and games to accept marginal behavior as the norm, but what kind of physician do you want to be? A marginal one? Only you will know, but your patients will suffer for it.

I think this is a commonly believed myth. Real medical education starts in residency. Whether or not you mastered the Citric Acid Cycle (which you will have forgotten by residency) won't make you a good clinician. This is just a lie, spread by paranoid medical students, that motivates us to study...but if that works to motivate you...I say believe it.

IMHO-The only reason to be a gunner is to get into a competetive residency. US schools ensure that we master a core of material in medical school, and the board exams are a double check. So, if you are content to get into primary care, just passing your classes is OK.

 

[Law2Doc]

Whether or not you mastered the Citric Acid Cycle (which you will have forgotten by residency) won't make you a good clinician. This is just a lie, spread by paranoid medical students,

No way. I learned the darn thing, so you'd better believe I'm going to find a way to use it, and use it to wow my attendings with my citric acid prowess. There's bound to be some way I can work it into a differential diagnosis or two...

 

[Ypo.]

No way. I learned the darn thing, so you'd better believe I'm going to find a way to use it, and use it to wow my attendings with my citric acid prowess. There's bound to be some way I can work it into a differential diagnosis or two...

Yeah, I have to admit I keep a poster of glycolysis and the electron transport chain up on my wall. Someday it will come in handy...I just know it...

 

[bigfrank]

So the class ranking thread made me think of an important point--I'm a reverse gunner. What that means is that I try to party as much as possible and study as little as possible, in addition to trying to pass each class by a razor-thin margin. Essentially trying to get by with as little work as possible. There's quite a group of us at my school, we're the fun ones. We openly ridicule anyone who tries hard and studies a lot, and we're analogous to the cool stoners from high school.

So are there any other people like this on here? We need a thread to make fun of the diligent students who take medical school seriously. It's weird how they are in the majority. I mean didn't these people go to high school? One of the first things you learn in high school is that being smart and working hard makes you uncool and a dork...

Hi there. I know you guys!

And I have a crystal ball: You're the ones I see bitting their nails as M-4s when match day approaches, praying to God for a match at a community program in a non-competitive specialty...

But at least you're "hott."

 

[Beau Geste]

I think this is a commonly believed myth. Real medical education starts in residency. Whether or not you mastered the Citric Acid Cycle (which you will have forgotten by residency) won't make you a good clinician. This is just a lie, spread by paranoid medical students, that motivates us to study...but if that works to motivate you...I say believe it.

IMHO-The only reason to be a gunner is to get into a competetive residency. US schools ensure that we master a core of material in medical school, and the board exams are a double check.

How is it a myth? Procrastination spreads into all areas of work, including clinical areas. Forgetting to write in a patient's chart because "you'll do it later", missed referrals, forgetfulness with prescriptions - it could all happen from procrastination (which is a learned behavior) in residency. If you think procrastination is only for studying the Citric Acid Cycle, forget it!

I'm not a paranoid med student. I'm not a med student at all. But I do work in a healthcare field, and have for quite a while, so I do know a thing or two about medical deadlines, and if you think someone won't notice late paperwork, etc. just wait.

So, if you are content to get into primary care, just passing your classes is OK.

I think this is a terrible thing to say about the primary care field. It's demeaning to those who actually want to go into that area. Granted, primary care is where most physicians who do poorly end up, but that's because there is the most need there. I was just on the phone with an FP- she was appalled at that quote when I read it from my e-mail inbox. Primary care docs are not "average" docs, especially those who work long hard hours and still love their job.

Anyway, shame on you for making primary care sound like such a mediocre job!

 

[Ypo.]

How is it a myth? Procrastination spreads into all areas of work, including clinical areas. Forgetting to write in a patient's chart because "you'll do it later", missed referrals, forgetfulness with prescriptions - it could all happen from procrastination (which is a learned behavior) in residency. If you think procrastination is only for studying the Citric Acid Cycle, forget it!

I'm not a paranoid med student. I'm not a med student at all. But I do work in a healthcare field, and have for quite a while, so I do know a thing or two about medical deadlines, and if you think someone won't notice late paperwork, etc. just wait.



I think this is a terrible thing to say about the primary care field. It's demeaning to those who actually want to go into that area. Granted, primary care is where most physicians who do poorly end up, but that's because there is the most need there. I was just on the phone with an FP- she was appalled at that quote when I read it from my e-mail inbox. Primary care docs are not "average" docs, especially those who work long hard hours and still love their job.

Anyway, shame on you for making primary care sound like such a mediocre job!

Nice sermon. Shame on me indeed.

It is not an insult to say that you don't have to have 'gunner boardscores' to get into a noncompetetive residency. Don't you think that you are being ridiculous with your little tirade?

I'm not advocating procrastination or to aim for low goals. I'm advocating pacing yourself and not burning yourself out with ultra-competetiveness. I plan on going into FP myself and I aim for at least a B average in my classes, but I'm not going kill myself if I barely pass a class. The medical schools set those pass rates for a reason-because that is how well you need to do to become a competent physician.

Since you are 'not' in medical school-perhaps you should wait until you get there to pass judgement on whether passing a class with a 75% is sufficient to become a good clinician. There are some classes that will kill you no matter if you study for for five hours a day on that subject alone.

 

[Beau Geste]

Nice sermon. Shame on me indeed.

It is not an insult to say that you don't have to have 'gunner boardscores' to get into a noncompetetive residency. Don't you think that you are being ridiculous with your little tirade?

Nope.

I'm not advocating procrastination or to aim for low goals. I'm advocating pacing yourself and not burning yourself out with ultra-competetiveness. I plan on going into FP myself and I aim for at least a B average in my classes, but I'm not going kill myself if I barely pass a class. The medical schools set those pass rates for a reason-because that is how well you need to do to become a competent physician.

Then say what you mean. Your previous post was placing emphasis that all you need is the minimal effort, which isn't true.

Since you are 'not' in medical school-perhaps you should wait until you get there to pass judgement on whether passing a class with a 75% is sufficient to become a good clinician. There are some classes that will kill you no matter if you study for for five hours a day on that subject alone.

Med school isn't the only educational arena that's hard. You pass judgement on me like I've never been in a hard class. I left a Ph.D. program to pursue medicine, and in that program you had to keep an 80% pass rate. It wasn't easy, either.

There are better ways for advocating pacing and not burning out in med school without advocating the bare minimum.

As for the tirade - too bad. Primary care doctors take a lot of crap, and you were adding to it.

 

[relema]

You make our class interesting

 

[Ypo.]

Then say what you mean. Your previous post was placing emphasis that all you need is the minimal effort, which isn't true..

I did say what I meant (you just took it and jumped to some wrong conclusions). The ONLY thing I emphasized was that you don't have to be a gunner to get into a primary care field. Do you even know what a gunner is?

Med school isn't the only educational arena that's hard. You pass judgement on me like I've never been in a hard class. I left a Ph.D. program to pursue medicine, and in that program you had to keep an 80% pass rate. It wasn't easy, either.

There are better ways for advocating pacing and not burning out in med school without advocating the bare minimum.

As for the tirade - too bad. Primary care doctors take a lot of crap, and you were adding to it.

I made a completely true statement-that you don't need outstanding boardscores to get into a primary care residency-and from that you leapt to the conclusion/judgement that I was saying FP is a lowly profession, that you 'should' aim for the lowest score possible to get into primary care, that I was advocating procrastination, not filling out patient's charts, the list went on and on...I passed no judgement on you-it was the other way around, gf.

I didn't mind the tirade, Megboo. I actually thought it was funny. But you really should take your sanctimonious attitude down a notch or two if you expect to get along with your classmates in medical school. Its good to aim high, but you need to be realistic. Not everyone is capable of getting those gunner scores-how is that a putdown?

 

[Beau Geste]

I did say what I meant (you just took it and jumped to some wrong conclusions). The ONLY thing I emphasized was that you don't have to be a gunner to get into a primary care field. Do you even know what a gunner is?

Wow. Did I hurt your feelings? Gunner = shooting for highest marks at the expense of others.

I made a completely true statement-that you don't need outstanding boardscores to get into a primary care residency-and from that you leapt to the conclusion/judgement that I was saying FP is a lowly profession, that you 'should' aim for the lowest score possible to get into primary care, that I was advocating procrastination, not filling out patient's charts, the list went on and on...I passed no judgement on you-it was the other way around, gf.

Yep. It looked to me like you were advocating primary care as a way to "just get by". Sorry if I misinterpreted it, but that's how it appeared to me. Funny how that can happen when there are just words and no metalinguistic cues.

But, I'm sorry, I can't be your gf - I'm married!

I didn't mind the tirade, Megboo. I actually thought it was funny. But you really should take your sanctimonious attitude down a notch or two if you expect to get along with your classmates in medical school. Its good to aim high, but you need to be realistic. Not everyone is capable of getting those gunner scores-how is that a putdown?

I get along fine with my present classmates, and got along fine with my past (at least they came to all my parties and drank my beer), so I'm not really that worried when it comes to med school, even if I will be more than 10 years older than most of them will be.

I will warn you now that I will stick up for things I feel strongly about. If you want to call it a tirade and laugh at it, so be it. I'm sure you've held your ground and been laughed at, too.

As far as my attitude, well, you can think what you want of me. Sticks and stones. Sticks and stones.

 

[Krazykritter]

I can't stand all the down w/ FP talk on SDN. Although I personally do not want to go into it, I still have respect for the people who do. Come on...good FP's get paid to basically go in and B.S. w/ their patients about how life is and what might be bothering them on a certain day. It might not be high excitement but at least most of them like what they do. If you are an a-hole and hate patients then don't go into it, but just passing the classes in med school doesn't mean you are destined for FP.

 

[idq1i]

I can't stand all the down w/ FP talk on SDN. Although I personally do not want to go into it, I still have respect for the people who do. Come on...good FP's get paid to basically go in and B.S. w/ their patients about how life is and what might be bothering them on a certain day. It might not be high excitement but at least most of them like what they do. If you are an a-hole and hate patients then don't go into it, but just passing the classes in med school doesn't mean you are destined for FP.

FP is a profession of preset protocols:
x mg of HCTZ for a systolic BP of y mmHg
x mg of statin for y level of LDL
a, b, c vaccinations at d years of age
everything else gets referred out.

As far as I am concerned, this can/should easily be handled by an NP/PA

 

[Psycho Doctor]

We openly ridicule anyone who tries hard and studies a lot, and we're analogous to the cool stoners from high school.

So are there any other people like this on here? We need a thread to make fun of the diligent students who take medical school seriously. It's weird how they are in the majority. I mean didn't these people go to high school? One of the first things you learn in high school is that being smart and working hard makes you uncool and a dork...

Along those lines, one of the first things I learned in high school is that gays are uncool, whether they are smart and hard working or not.

 

[Beau Geste]

FP is a profession of preset protocols:
x mg of HCTZ for a systolic BP of y mmHg
x mg of statin for y level of LDL
a, b, c vaccinations at d years of age
everything else gets referred out.

As far as I am concerned, this can/should easily be handled by an NP/PA

Please refer to www.aafp.org. You will find the scope of practice on the website . There is truly a difference between NP/PA and FP. Do not start a war on this - you will lose in an allopathic med thread.

There may be an argument in previous posts, but I gather we all agree that FPs are important.

 

[Beau Geste]

Along those lines, one of the first things I learned in high school is that gays are uncool, whether they are smart and hard working or not.

Uh-oh.

 

[Ypo.]

Yep. It looked to me like you were advocating primary care as a way to "just get by". Sorry if I misinterpreted it, but that's how it appeared to me.

Ummmm...by your overreaction it was quite apparent that was the way you took it. You don't need to keep repeating yourself-unless you feel it somehow strengthens your point.

You are really barking up the wrong tree. But feel free to keep on humping my leg if its getting you off.

Seriously, I am all for being a good doctor and striving your best, and not procrastrinating. I just don't think you need to be a gunner to meet those requirements and to get into primary care, and unlike you-(I'm able to think in more than two dimensions) I don't think that by acknowledging the fact that primary care doesn't require high board scores- it somehow reflects badly on the profession. Being a good clinician is much more than an A plus in biochemistry.

 

[SigPi]

If I over-do it on the raspberries I cramp up. I have an elaborate system of scales, pulleys, and fulcrums which measure exactly to the .002 raspberry

For some reason, your posts made me spit my drink out through my nose laughing Seriously, damn, lol. Reminds me of the characters in the book "the third policeman" , hilarious. Btw, anyone read this one??

 

[tigress]

FP is a profession of preset protocols:
x mg of HCTZ for a systolic BP of y mmHg
x mg of statin for y level of LDL
a, b, c vaccinations at d years of age
everything else gets referred out.

As far as I am concerned, this can/should easily be handled by an NP/PA

A lot (if not most) of medicine is like this 85-90% of the time. It's the rest of the time when the training really matters.

 

[Callogician]

what is a gunner?

A gunner is an exceedingly competitive medical student who dedicates his life to sabotaging his fellow classmates in order to improve his relative ranking. The etymology of "gunner" comes from an exceptional student named Jonathan "Bezerker" Wertzer. He stood seven foot tall, 350 lbs solid muscle-an ortho prospect. He used to dress in pirate regalia, set up with a sniper rifle on the roof of Harvard med, and pick off whomever got the top score on the most recent exam.

Nowadays, a character like Wertzer is far and few between, but the terminology still stands. Modern gunners use more conservative methods like giving out false information, spreading unpuritan rumors to faculty members about classmates, or drugging competitors before tests (often by enthusiastically offering them a pretest danish).

 

[Beau Geste]

Right, you're married to an ex-con, correct? Sure you wouldn't rather be married to a medical student? I take offense at that blatantly anti-homosexual statement. Just because you are a woman married does NOT mean you can't have a girlfriend. In case you didn't get it-I'm giving you a prime example of putting words in someone's mouth.

I can't believe you would write something like this.

My EX-husband, a New Zealand national is an ex-con, but when I was married to him I knew him as someone else. After he was busted, I left him, and rightly so.

And about the girlfriend comment - can't a person be monogamous with their husband?

I really take offense at the personal attack, especially about my ex. My husband now is currently a law-abiding, wonderful man. And he's a mechanic, not a physician.

So, when you try to dish it back, have your facts straight. And stop with personal attacks.

 

[Beau Geste]

Ummmm...by your overreaction it was quite apparent that was the way you took it. You don't need to keep repeating yourself-unless you feel it somehow strengthens your point.

You are really barking up the wrong tree. But feel free to keep on humping my leg if its getting you off.

Seriously, I am all for being a good doctor and striving your best, and not procrastrinating. I just don't think you need to be a gunner to meet those requirements and to get into primary care, and unlike you-(I'm able to think in more than two dimensions) I don't think that by acknowledging the fact that primary care doesn't require high board scores- it somehow reflects badly on the profession. Being a good clinician is much more than an A plus in biochemistry.

This is turning from debate to attack, and I refuse to further participate in it. Your original version was sent to my e-mail inbox, and you went too far.

 

[21JumpStreet]

or derm

No. Derm is super competitive. You got to get great grades and do really well on the boards. Many applicants have a research background before applying.

"Life in moderation." anonymous