rounds with gen surgery team before subspecialty clinic?

Discussion in 'Clinical Rotations' started by epsilonprodigy, Sep 29, 2014.

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  1. epsilonprodigy

    epsilonprodigy Physicist Enough 7+ Year Member

    Jun 17, 2009
    As with most schools, we have 6 weeks of general surgery plus two weeks of off-service subspecialty. My subspecialty time is primarily at an off-campus practice, which is fairly close to the university hospital where the rest of my rotation is.

    I'm now on subspecialty after 4 weeks of gen surg. This means I'll have only two weeks back on service before we wrap up. This creates a problem: I SUCK at presenting, which I was told in no uncertain terms during my mid-rotation evaluation (and frankly, I have to agree.) My attending basically told me that he can see I'm smart, that I'm doing a great job identifying what's going on with my patients and he thinks my work ethic is great, but the way I organize and present information needs serious work. I've really been working on this, but because my attending has been on vacation for two of the weeks I've actually been on general surgery, we've had very little face time- this means I'll have very little time to turn things around and show him that I'm progressing. This is important, because he's one of the muckety-mucks at my school, and I'm very interested in surgery.

    Since I need more chances to try to impress this attending, and more practice presenting, I am thinking of seeing if I can show up to pre-round and do morning rounds with the general surgery team, and then head to the subspecialty clinic afterward. Luckily, timing and geography allow this- the question is, would it send the right message?
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  3. SouthernSurgeon

    SouthernSurgeon Lifetime Donor 7+ Year Member

    Dec 17, 2008
  4. epsilonprodigy

    epsilonprodigy Physicist Enough 7+ Year Member

    Jun 17, 2009
    Interesting…. care to elaborate?
  5. SouthernSurgeon

    SouthernSurgeon Lifetime Donor 7+ Year Member

    Dec 17, 2008
    Once you're off service, you're off service.

    It would be super weird (and inappropriate) for a student to stick around to try and impress after the rotation is over.

    Additionally, even if it is somehow logistically feasible, it would be short-selling your subspecialty rotation and would be viewed poorly.
    Winged Scapula likes this.
  6. epsilonprodigy

    epsilonprodigy Physicist Enough 7+ Year Member

    Jun 17, 2009
    Not sure if this changes your opinion, but just to clarify, the rotation is not over- I do two weeks of subspecialty, then come back to gen surg for two weeks.
  7. SouthernSurgeon

    SouthernSurgeon Lifetime Donor 7+ Year Member

    Dec 17, 2008
    Then impress the team during those subsequent two weeks.

    Residents and attending's are used to the flow of students (and frequently get reminder emails from the clerkship directors about the changeover). Doing something outside the norm is not going to be viewed positively, it is just going to look weird.

    And, again, during these two weeks you have an obligation to the service you are rotating with. They will not expect or take kindly to you splitting your time. They will also be evaluating you.

    It's a terrible idea.
    Psai and Winged Scapula like this.
  8. DrBowtie

    DrBowtie Final Countdown Moderator Emeritus 10+ Year Member

    Feb 24, 2005
    Confirmed strange. You would be that guy/girl in a negative way.
    Winged Scapula likes this.
  9. giantswing

    giantswing 7+ Year Member

    Jan 12, 2010
    We all suck at presenting at first. I think it was March of third year when I finally got to the point where I could present halfway decently.

    Practice. Practice at home, in the car, and practice especially when you're done pre rounding, before you talk to the resident. Number your handwritten notes from pre rounding in the order you want to say them. Read off the note you wrote after pre rounding. Practice with a classmate - they're just as bad as you. Just practice.

    And you won't "get" it in two months - every service is a little different, every attending on every service wants something slightly different. It's okay.

    Just practice. Trust me.
  10. Kaustikos

    Kaustikos Archerize It 7+ Year Member

    Jan 18, 2008
    Always Bespin
    Honestly, I'd be happy the attending was honest with you. Work on this with subspecialty and then return as a different person.
  11. SEPsych


    Sep 7, 2014
    If the message your trying to send is that you are a massive gunner who will do things outside of social norms to try to impress people, then it would send that message. The sad thing is, I can think of attendings who this would actually impress. Granted most attendings wouldnt be impressed and every other medstudent/resident who ever heard about this would ridicule you for it.
    Winged Scapula likes this.
  12. evilbooyaa

    evilbooyaa 5+ Year Member

    Oct 10, 2011
    No. Just work hard on your subspecialty clinic, make sure you get better at presenting there, then come back and blow his socks off for your final 2 weeks. If you need more practice, just PRACTICE with someone else, NOT in front of the big boss who is going to be evaluating you.

    Agree with Kaustikos - be thankful your attending gave you some actual feedback at your mid rotation feedback session.
    Winged Scapula likes this.
  13. TraumaLlamaMD

    TraumaLlamaMD Licensed to chill 2+ Year Member

    Sep 18, 2014
    If it helps, remember that you also have a sub-I or two as a fourth year to show off your presentation skills - by that time, you'll have had your entire third year to practice and things will seem much more natural.

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