scholarship or prestige?

[cosmo_max]

I have a decision to make that's been slowly sucking the life out of me. I've been accepted to a not so well known state school and offered a performance based scholarship for four years and also to a top five med school. Is it better to be debt free in the end or to have gone to a top school?

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[wack]

This is a tough decision. Most people on this board say go to the cheapest place unless you want to be in academics or you want to enter a highly competitive specialty (Neurosurgery, Plastics, ENT, Urology, Radiology, Dermatology). I am dealing with a very similar situation. Top school excellent rep and location versus state school with a full scholarship ($0 tuition). Right now I am leaning towards the top school because I like it so much. Either way we will both probably wonder what if somewhere down the road. What if we were debt free (relatively speaking) or from a top school? With the exception of one doc all that I have talked to say go to the cheapest place. Kind of scary. However, I have caused myself grief many times by taking "good" advice.

 

[Izlude_Tingel]

Congrats, that is a good decision to make. Well, just my two cents. If you look at a top school's match list, you'll notice that they send many of their grads to top res programs. This is not to say that states school don't, it is just they send more of them to comp res programs. If you know you are interested in being a PCP, which I know soome people are, then I really don't see the need to go to a expensive private school. On the otherhand, if you feel like you might get into something like derm, then going to a top school might help. But honestly, no matter what school you go to in the states, if you do really well and make the connections, you will give chances everywhere. If is really how you do on the boards and you clinical rotations that is more important then just what school you attend. I would definitely lean toward the state school. Going to state med school (I am assuming it is not a UC) with a scholarship is really nice. Not having to worry about debt is worth it. Prestige is nice, but not really worth the dough unless you are going into academic med where the name does matter. Either way good-luck!

 

[Green912]

IMO for the majority of us it's of little difference whether you attend a top rated school rather then a lesser known, but solid one. If you know you'll be going after a very competitive residency then maybe it's a different story. Otherwies take the $80,000 you'll save and run.

For instance I know an ED Physician that works at a smaller community hospital probably seeing around 35,000 patients a year. No assigned trauma level. He went to undergrad at Yale then med school at Case Western. Both very top notch schools. Now believe me I have the utmost respect for ED docs (hope to be one myself), and am well aware of both school's reputations. But at $36,000 per year I'd definetly go somewhere cheaper as long as it was a solid program. Just one example I have.

 

[What the pho]

If you have a nice ass, your ass is gonna look just as good in $10 pair of used Levis, as in a $100 pair of AX jeans. Obey your thirst, image is nothing. If you?re talented you?ll still get a good res coming from your state school. Have you ever paid more than 250k just for a name brand item in your life? A wise man (Cris Rock) once said ?my looooord dats a lot money, JayZ may have his Bentley but I have an extra 250 grand in the bank.?

 

[Entei]

I have the same decision to make.

I'm choosing prestige over the money. I went to a small college on a nearly full scholarship when I could have gone to an ivy league school. Although that little school got me into a great med school, I still wish I could have afforded to go to the ivy. I would be happy at either med school, but I've worked hard for my acceptances, and I feel that I owe it to myself to attend the best school that I can.

I'm not worried about the debt. There are millions of doctors who manage to pay back their loans, no matter where they went to school. I honestly don't think that the money will be that much of an issue.

 

[Dr. Dodger Dog]

yeah ... having the same decision... a lil twist though...

I received a full scholarship from a private school... top 30 institution but I am probably going to attend my state school.

It's hard to turn down a 35k a year scholarship but at the same time, cali state schools are really too good to be true....

 

[TranceKitten]

Oh Dodger Dog, I feel ya! I am choosing the school that ?fits? over money and hoping that I am making the right decision. I have a merit scholarship from U Michigan and an acceptance from Stanford. I grew up close to Stanford and love its campus and culture. This has been an excruciating decision because Stanford has always been my first choice and then Michigan starts waving ~120K in my face. Now the only thing that has changed is a feeling of being ungrateful if I pass up this scholarship. Stanford is going to give me ~28,000/year in grant so the monetary impact of my decision becomes a difference of ~20,000 + interest. This is an amount I am willing to pay to stay close to my family and friends, a dream that I thought might not be a reality when starting this application process. Hope I am right about this?.

 

[cosmo_max]

bump

 

[fava]

hey,
for what it's worth (strength in numbers?), i am in the exact same situation: full tuition to mediocre state school versus top 5 school. I'm 99% sure i'm headed to the top 5.

 

[florence02]

Hi guys,
I'm in a similar position as well-- If all goes well, I'll have to choose from UC Irvine, UC Davis, Columbia and Northwestern. I know I'm incredibly fortunate that I am in this situation, but I don't know... I didn't realize how hard it would be to make this decision. I haven't given up on the idea of academic medicine (I'm interested in peds, but probably some subspecialty), so I know that it would be to my advantage to go to one of the private schools, but the promise of sun and low-tuition at the UCs are tempting... I wonder how much of a difference if would make in the long run in terms of the burden of loans I would have to pay back. If anyone in the same situation (or was in the same situation) can give some advice, I'd appreciate it so much. many thanks.

 

[edfig99]

I have always argued that money (or lack thereof) should not impede anyone from trying to pursue and achieve their dreams.

That being said, I have to impress upon you right now that medicine is in a VERY precarious place right now. Federal axe waving is going to result in a dramatic cutbacks in what the feds pay hospitals to train residents, as well as reimbursement (medicare). That means residency spots will disappear because hospitals won't be able to absorb the costs. State axe waving is causing significant cutbacks in hospital reimbursement (medicaid), which also will significantly affect residency training. Federal, state and HMO axe waving is causing horrendous problems with reimbursement (and so financial cutbacks in life post-residency). and then there's the liability crisis.

Undergrads are coming out of college with increasing debt. Add in the credit cards that many of us use... now you are faced with a med school choice....Med school is expensive - tuition, books, and all that jazz... board exams are ridiculously priced. throw in the clinical skills exam you guys will have to take... the residency application process... hmmm...free money and no glam.... or glam and owe a lot of money.

Given the current economic turmoil of medicine, I think it is time to be business savvy, and go with the free money. Med school is med school is med school. If you do well, you will have your pick of residency programs...and if you can keep your debt as low as possible, all power to you. It is not the med school that will land you an academic job, it's your residency, and yes, a high prestige med school opens doors to those top residencies, but so does an Honor student with super high board scores and tons of extracurricular activities from ANY school Most physicians are paying back their loans within 7 years (of an anticipated 10). If you decide you wanted to do the private practice thing, that's about 5-6 years of paying off all your debts, while trying to get the practice going, before you even start making money.

yes, you can plan on being financially okay even with debt from a top school...but why have that burden? take advantage of being debt free, go to residency, and you can come right out and start making money from the get go.

I don't envy the decisions you guys have to make....good luck.

 

[cosmo_max]

Edfig-thanks for putting it into perspective.

 

[wazupshah]

I think it's easy to down-play debt when you're looking at it from this perspective (wide-eyed, ego-boosted, MS0).

When you're 4 years down the line, starting your residency and the interest starts kicking in on the $100,000+ debt hanging over your head, you'll be sayin "why O why didn't I choose the blue pill?"

 

[jwin]

Originally posted by Entei

I'm not worried about the debt. There are millions of doctors who manage to pay back their loans, no matter where they went to school. I honestly don't think that the money will be that much of an issue.

be careful applying this logic to your student loans. there are not many doctors in repayment who have the kind of debt that we are going to graduate with. doctors who are in repayment now probably graduated 7-8 years ago. add on the four years for us to go med school and this is a time difference of 12 years. (they are class of 1995 and we are class of 2007) tuition increases at nearly 6% a year and even more so at many schools in the last few years due to the economy sucking. we are in a brave new world of costly higher education.

 

[ready]

For those wanting to go into Academic Med, I have an alternative perspective.

So we all agree that reputation can matter in Academic Medicine, BUT I wonder how much of us are likely to go into a lower paying academic medicine position w/ >$100,000 debt load.

I feel pretty committed to Academic medicine but I'm starting to wonder if that commitment will decrease as my debt increases.

What do you guys think?

 

[goldenbears18]

Originally posted by ready
For those wanting to go into Academic Med, I have an alternative perspective.

So we all agree that reputation can matter in Academic Medicine, BUT I wonder how much of us are likely to go into a lower paying academic medicine position w/ >$100,000 debt load.

I feel pretty committed to Academic medicine but I'm starting to wonder if that commitment will decrease as my debt increases.

What do you guys think?

I think that this is a really valid point. I'm considering academic medicine as well, and I have been told from someone in the field that it is naive not to consider future debt considering that academic salaries are so low. And when you think about the fact that someday (if not already) you'll have a family, mouths to feed, a mortgage to pay, and retirement accounts to build, ... well, it makes sense that as your financial obligations increase or your life priorities change, academic medicine might not seem nearly as appealing as it did when you were just beginning your medical education. At some point, it becomes a question of how practical you need to be.

 

[florence02]

This question of whether to go to a state school (decent but unranked UCs) or a top-10 school is eating me alive. I think that going to the most prestigious school is going to be the best for my career, but what do I know about what I would want to do 10 years from now? I may want to pursue academic medicine now, but who knows maybe I'll want to become a community physician in the end... Also, I'm interested in working for MSF sometime in my career, hopefully before I'm too old or start a family... but if I have loans to pay off for a long time, maybe I won't get a chance. As someone already said, I think either way, I'll look back and wonder what would have happened had I gone to the school that I don't end up going. I guess the important thing is to make a decision based on your gut instinct (with a bit of pragmatism, I guess) and don't look back and regret your decision. (easy to say, hard to do...)

I know that attending med school is a privilege and an honor in itself... especially at a time like this. I need to not lost sight of what's important and why I want to become a doctor in the first place... it's not for prestige or for ego, but that I genuinely want to help people. The question is, what is the best way for me to accomplish that?

 

[md_student10021]

all indications are that you ought to choose the top-5 or top-10 school. why? let me put it into perspective.

compare match lists. top schools send virtually everyone to top residencies, in every field, including those that are the most competitive.

lesser schools will always send a handful of students into top residencies, but there is a caveat...virtually all of these students are at or very near the top of their classes. this means you have to work extra-hard to get that coveted derm residency.

of course, if you are set on a career in FP, go with the state school. But the top-5/10 will allow a wealth of post-graduate opportunities.

best of luck.