LimpSpatula

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This. I foresee no moment of ease between now and February. Biden will be declared winner tomorrow, Trump will continue to scream fraud. The GOP will want to focus on these senate races so they have to paint Democrats and GA in a bad way. That means they’re gonna have to jump on the Trump fraud train. All the while Covid is in record numbers. This will not end well unless Mitch steps up in a big way.

Are you joking? The GA runoffs will determine the power that senator has over policy. Sorry to burst the bubble, but Republicans will be backing Trump in this through January.

Please see DTJ blackmailing the Republican Party.


I think how Trump responds to GA and what ultimately ends up happening in GA will tell us. I’m thinking he’s going to seriously cripple the party.

I don’t necessarily think it works both ways. Democrats can always invoke Trump. Republicans can only invoke him with his praise, and if they supported him through this nonsense. If you think about 2024, Trumps best chances might be running as an independent. Republicans are banking on him looking like a fool to his supporters over the next month but its not a very good move for them.

At this point it is most likely Democrats take the Senate. Trump is destroying the party before our eyes.
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pgg

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Elections have consequences.

So does two months of BS Trump temper tantrums, telling people fraud is rampant, that their votes don't count, and that they should boycott the runoff. I'd say it's hard to believe they could screw up Georgia so badly, but it's not that hard to believe. I wonder what else Trump will burn down on his way out.

Bottom line, now Biden will probably get his cabinet and judges appointed without much difficulty. I'm still skeptical he'll get much of his more progressive agenda done though. No way the Court gets expanded.
 
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NicMouse64

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Elections have consequences.

So does two months of BS Trump temper tantrums, telling people fraud is rampant, that their votes don't count, and that they should boycott the runoff. I'd say it's hard to believe they could screw up Georgia so badly, but it's not that hard to believe. I wonder what else Trump will burn down on his way out.

Bottom line, now Biden will probably get his cabinet and judges appointed without much difficulty. I'm still skeptical he'll get much of his more progressive agenda done though. No way the Court gets expanded.
why not?
 

Mad Jack

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Elections have consequences.

So does two months of BS Trump temper tantrums, telling people fraud is rampant, that their votes don't count, and that they should boycott the runoff. I'd say it's hard to believe they could screw up Georgia so badly, but it's not that hard to believe. I wonder what else Trump will burn down on his way out.

Bottom line, now Biden will probably get his cabinet and judges appointed without much difficulty. I'm still skeptical he'll get much of his more progressive agenda done though. No way the Court gets expanded.
Agree. There's already democrats firmly pushing back against court packing in the Senate. With only one vote needing to be flipped, not a chance in hell it occurs. But at least we will have a functioning government not mired in gridlock for two years.
 
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Lawpy

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Someone please explain why many, many Americans have turned evil and joined forces with covid 19 and variant of concern.
 
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pgg

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uh, no.

You have trump to thank for this BTW.
Exactly. Two months of exceptionally egregious bull****, even by his standards. Two months of undermining faith in elections. Two months of questioning why anyone bothers to vote. There's no mystery at all why both of those seats were lost.
 
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Arch Guillotti

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Exactly. Two months of exceptionally egregious bull****, even by his standards. Two months of undermining faith in elections. Two months of questioning why anyone bothers to vote. There's no mystery at all why both of those seats were lost.
Believe it or not some of us are a little skeptical about having the dems run the Senate - although it isn't bad to humiliate mitch.
 
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DoctwoB

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It will be interesting to see what a 51/50 majority can accomplish. A lot of it will come down to Manchin, who is less conservative then some think, but is a West Virginia populist.,

Packing the court is almost certainly a no go unless the court is egregious in striking down legislation or Biden's acts as executive
Medicare for All definitely a no go, Public option likely a no go but less certain
Green new deal is a no go, Manchin's not going to vote against coal.
DC/PR statehood is a possibility, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Shoring up/tinkering with obamacare is likely a yes
HR1 for the people act (voting rights, etc) is likely a yes
Tax reform is possible, but will likely be a neutered version. I wouldn't be surprised if the tax on 400k plus turned to 1 million plus. Also wouldn't be surprised to see SALT deductions return.
Increased COVID stimulus is all but guaranteed
Biden gets to pick his cabinet and court nominees

The biggest consideration will come down to filibuster overrides. I fully expect Mitch to go into full obstruction mode, in which case most of the above can't happen unless Manchin agrees to filibuster overrides. I don't think he will at first, but if Mitch is obstructing everything and the 2 years are slipping by he may change his mind.
 
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pgg

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It will be interesting to see what a 51/50 majority can accomplish. A lot of it will come down to Manchin, who is less conservative then some think, but is a West Virginia populist.,

Packing the court is almost certainly a no go unless the court is egregious in striking down legislation or Biden's acts as executive
Medicare for All definitely a no go, Public option likely a no go but less certain
Green new deal is a no go, Manchin's not going to vote against coal.
DC/PR statehood is a possibility, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Shoring up/tinkering with obamacare is likely a yes
HR1 for the people act (voting rights, etc) is likely a yes
Tax reform is possible, but will likely be a neutered version. I wouldn't be surprised if the tax on 400k plus turned to 1 million plus. Also wouldn't be surprised to see SALT deductions return.
Increased COVID stimulus is all but guaranteed
Biden gets to pick his cabinet and court nominees

The biggest consideration will come down to filibuster overrides. I fully expect Mitch to go into full obstruction mode, in which case most of the above can't happen unless Manchin agrees to filibuster overrides. I don't think he will at first, but if Mitch is obstructing everything and the 2 years are slipping by he may change his mind.

I agree with all of this, except I'd go so far as to say absolutely No Way on the DC/PR statehood and court packing issues.

51/50 takes everything controversial completely off the table. Maybe it'll be a good thing if only small bipartisan ideas are enacted for a couple years. We could use some collective chill-out time.
 
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vector2

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It will be interesting to see what a 51/50 majority can accomplish. A lot of it will come down to Manchin, who is less conservative then some think, but is a West Virginia populist.,

Packing the court is almost certainly a no go unless the court is egregious in striking down legislation or Biden's acts as executive
Medicare for All definitely a no go, Public option likely a no go but less certain
Green new deal is a no go, Manchin's not going to vote against coal.
DC/PR statehood is a possibility, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Shoring up/tinkering with obamacare is likely a yes
HR1 for the people act (voting rights, etc) is likely a yes
Tax reform is possible, but will likely be a neutered version. I wouldn't be surprised if the tax on 400k plus turned to 1 million plus. Also wouldn't be surprised to see SALT deductions return.
Increased COVID stimulus is all but guaranteed
Biden gets to pick his cabinet and court nominees

The biggest consideration will come down to filibuster overrides. I fully expect Mitch to go into full obstruction mode, in which case most of the above can't happen unless Manchin agrees to filibuster overrides. I don't think he will at first, but if Mitch is obstructing everything and the 2 years are slipping by he may change his mind.

The threat of the filibuster override I think will keep Mitch in check. If he’s obstructing a bill that Manchin believes is in his best interest to keep his seat by bringing home the bacon to WV, Manchin will play along with the threat with some rhetoric without actually having to act on it.
 

Mad Jack

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I agree with all of this, except I'd go so far as to say absolutely No Way on the DC/PR statehood and court packing issues.

51/50 takes everything controversial completely off the table. Maybe it'll be a good thing if only small bipartisan ideas are enacted for a couple years. We could use some collective chill-out time.
Republicans not being on board with PR statehood is an enormous mistake. Mainland PR residents have different views than those that still live there, and research has borne this out again and again. They're losing what could easily be a winning demographic, as most in PR are strongly opposed to the nore radical ideas on the left
 
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Neopolymath

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Loeffler just spoke on the Senate floor and atoned for her sins. She really is a piece of work. No wonder everyone thinks politicians are greasy.
All the Republicans need to speak before the vote. They can't vote until all of them "condemn" what happened today. Duh. Complicit pieces of garbage.
 
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It will be interesting to see what a 51/50 majority can accomplish. A lot of it will come down to Manchin, who is less conservative then some think, but is a West Virginia populist.,

Packing the court is almost certainly a no go unless the court is egregious in striking down legislation or Biden's acts as executive
Medicare for All definitely a no go, Public option likely a no go but less certain
Green new deal is a no go, Manchin's not going to vote against coal.
DC/PR statehood is a possibility, but I wouldn't bet on it.
Shoring up/tinkering with obamacare is likely a yes
HR1 for the people act (voting rights, etc) is likely a yes
Tax reform is possible, but will likely be a neutered version. I wouldn't be surprised if the tax on 400k plus turned to 1 million plus. Also wouldn't be surprised to see SALT deductions return.
Increased COVID stimulus is all but guaranteed
Biden gets to pick his cabinet and court nominees

The biggest consideration will come down to filibuster overrides. I fully expect Mitch to go into full obstruction mode, in which case most of the above can't happen unless Manchin agrees to filibuster overrides. I don't think he will at first, but if Mitch is obstructing everything and the 2 years are slipping by he may change his mind.
I think the public option might be a good thing as it will delay the inevitable--medical for all.
 

BLADEMDA

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Agree. There's already democrats firmly pushing back against court packing in the Senate. With only one vote needing to be flipped, not a chance in hell it occurs. But at least we will have a functioning government not mired in gridlock for two years.
Sure. That’s what we need a functioning government run by drunken sailors with no regard for the budget whatsoever. The answer to Trump’s fiscal irresponsibility is to double down and spend twice or three times as much as he did. Great.
They have no regard for the kids in grade school who are going to inherit a 50 trillion. Dollar deficit and a currency worth 1/2 as much as today.
This is just shameful, reckless government run by socialist hacks with no regard for this nation.
Higher taxes are just part of the solution. Controlling spending is also crucial for this nation’s future.
Before Vector2 chimes in about the Trump tax cuts the fact is those can be reversed and taxes raised higher on that same group. That’s not the same as giving away the treasury to every citizen who can never repay the handouts.
 
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NicMouse64

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Sure. That’s what we need a functioning government run by drunken sailors with no regard for the budget whatsoever. The answer to Trump’s fiscal irresponsibility is to double down and spend twice or three times as much as he did. Great.
They have no regard for the kids in grade school who are going to inherit a 50 trillion. Dollar deficit and a currency worth 1/2 as much as today.
The republican party had a choice between being seditionists riling up the resentment of it's base, or being the party of fiscal responsibility. They have shown through multiple periods of governance that it is just lip service. Democrats have largely had lower deficits than republican presidents. So not sure where this 2-3X fear comes from?
 
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vector2

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This is just shameful, reckless government run by socialist hacks with no regard for this nation.

Embarrassing how little self-awareness you have.

Remind us, which of these presidents did you vote for or vote against?

"Reagan took the deficit from 70 billion to 175 billion. Bush 41 took it to 300 billion. Clinton got it to zero. Bush 43 took it from 0 to 1.2 trillion. Obama halved it to 600 billion. Trump’s got it back to a trillion+."
 
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Fart Daddy Smooth

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F this guy and every other trump toadie trying to call the fire dept now after the house has already burned down

Seriously. Same with the cowards at Facebook and Twitter who waited until the last two weeks of his term to de-platform him.
 
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Goro

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The biggest consideration will come down to filibuster overrides. I fully expect Mitch to go into full obstruction mode, in which case most of the above can't happen unless Manchin agrees to filibuster overrides. I don't think he will at first, but if Mitch is obstructing everything and the 2 years are slipping by he may change his mind.
There used to be a time where one had to actually stand up and speak for a prolonged period of time to do a filibuster. The Senate could easily revert to that policy.
 
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Mad Jack

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Sure. That’s what we need a functioning government run by drunken sailors with no regard for the budget whatsoever. The answer to Trump’s fiscal irresponsibility is to double down and spend twice or three times as much as he did. Great.
They have no regard for the kids in grade school who are going to inherit a 50 trillion. Dollar deficit and a currency worth 1/2 as much as today.
This is just shameful, reckless government run by socialist hacks with no regard for this nation.
Higher taxes are just part of the solution. Controlling spending is also crucial for this nation’s future.
Before Vector2 chimes in about the Trump tax cuts the fact is those can be reversed and taxes raised higher on that same group. That’s not the same as giving away the treasury to every citizen who can never repay the handouts.
I think you're going a bit overboard when we haven't even seen proposals. I predict we'll see increased taxes that offset most deficit spending
 

pgg

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Seriously. Same with the cowards at Facebook and Twitter who waited until the last two weeks of his term to de-platform him.
I don't think that issue is quite so simple. These are media platforms that have grown to the point that they're effectively the primary national platforms for speech.

I want to know what the president and other public figures of note are saying.

They should've waited until Jan 21st at least.
 
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VA Hopeful Dr

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I don't think that issue is quite so simple. These are media platforms that have grown to the point that they're effectively the primary national platforms for speech.

I want to know what the president and other public figures of note are saying.

They should've waited until Jan 21st at least.
Yeah keep in mind the courts issued an injunction against Trump a number of years ago saying that he could not block anyone from his Twitter feed.
 

vector2

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I don't think that issue is quite so simple. These are media platforms that have grown to the point that they're effectively the primary national platforms for speech.

I want to know what the president and other public figures of note are saying.

They should've waited until Jan 21st at least.

The success of FB and Twitter have really put them in a weird sitch. They are technically private platforms and they have their own TOS and can do whatever they want if users are breaking those TOS. OTOH, the freakin’ President is on your platform, uses it as his primary communication tool, and has 100m followers.

It’s a tough spot to be in vis a vis freedom of speech, and even if social media can do whatever they want I think they should de facto treat the President with a very hands off approach when it comes to censorship. And I think that that’s really what they’ve done. However, trump got to the point where he was essentially shouting fire in a movie theater, and even 1A doesn’t allow for that.
 

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There used to be a time where one had to actually stand up and speak for a prolonged period of time to do a filibuster. The Senate could easily revert to that policy.

I would be all in favor of that if the people forced to listen to it were allowed to pelt the speaker with eggs and rotten fruits/veggies. Hell I might even watch cSPAN
 
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drmwvr

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People are truly losing their s**t...on the fringes that is....where was all the breathless pearl clutching when Seattle and Portland was going down?
 
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drmwvr

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Does congress make laws in either of those places?
No, they make laws for citizens that live in those places and if the laws that are made in DC mean nothing, then why is DC so special?
 
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chessknt

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No, they make laws for citizens that live in those places and if the laws that are made in DC mean nothing, then why is DC so special?
Who said they mean nothing?

You are equating people attacking a police precinct that has no bearing on my existence to people attacking the seat of federal governance of the country with the stated goal of trying to stop transition of power of the executive branch. If you can't see the difference then you are part of the problem.

And there was so much conservative pearl clutching over the Seattle bull**** zone or whatever it was called it was on fox 24/7. People on this forum have cited concern over Portland riots as a reason they supported the failed despot trump because they were so afraid the left wouldn't support law and order. So I am confused as to why you think nobody cared before.
 
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Arch Guillotti

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On both sides. :D
Not in this particular case. Only Republicans hitched their wagon to Trumps crazy train. His fantasy about widespread voter fraud is a JOKE and these clowns particularly Cruz, Hawley, Ron Johnson ought to be ashamed of themselves. They played into his conspiracy theories either because there are as dumb as Trump themselves or (more likely) they are making a calculated political move for when they try to court the "deplorables".

Ben Sasse I give a bit of credit and Mitt Romney even more. Even the Grim Reaper and Mike Pence showed up.
 
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