Avicenna

Membership Revoked
Removed
5+ Year Member
Nov 18, 2012
465
281
Status
Pre-Medical
I feel there's a certain air of grandeur associated with a career in healthcare especially attributed to doctors. They're portrayed as especially altruistic; and that the career is only for people who exhibit that saintly altruism. They're literally doing work and getting paid for it. Most of them are not volunteering after premed years.

And with these expectations of altruism comes the idea that as doctors we're going to take care of the "underserved community" and help in making meaningful demographic changes like caring for people without the means to care for themselves. Obviously what's likely going to happen is most medical students go on to charge these same people hundreds of dollars for their treatment without a care in the world. This isn't a career based on volunteerism.

There's also a lot of expectation that as doctors we could change the state of healthcare. What? They're not legislators. Most are just drones working for hospitals. Literally all they do is treat. Beyond that, they have no power.

This may just be rhetoric part of the formality in applications, and I've gotten too accustomed to seeing this and playing along with it while writing secondaries, but doctors are painted out to be some kind of saints, and if you're not on par with them on an ethical level, you're unfit to become a doctor. This saccharine image is so hypocritical, I've gotten jaded by the self righteousness going on.

I think the real heroes (for which physicans are taking credit) are:
1. PhDs finding actual cures for diseases while getting paid a fraction of what the physicians are
2. Legislators/politicians lobbying for better options in universal healthcare

Fine, there are SOME doctors doing probono work and overseas volunteering but lettuce bee reel, they're not the majority.

With that said, while writing my secondaries I'll still be playing along with the idea that as a doctor, I could enact huge social change and see every patient rich and poor. Because that's the bs these schools obviously want to hear.

What do you think?
Inb4 stfu troll.
 
Last edited:

NimbleNavigator

Membership Revoked
Removed
Account on Hold
Mar 15, 2016
383
277
IDK man I get what you're saying on some level, but I feel like somewhere down the line something happened to you. What do you think made you jaded?
 
  • Like
Reactions: ButteredLobster
OP
A

Avicenna

Membership Revoked
Removed
5+ Year Member
Nov 18, 2012
465
281
Status
Pre-Medical
IDK man I get what you're saying on some level, but I feel like somewhere down the line something happened to you. What do you think made you jaded?
Getting disgusted by the hubris, hypocrisy, and self-righteousness in medicine. Especially in the premed culture which all too willingly perpetuates/glorifies it.

This is a pointless post. There are altruistic and selfish people in every profession. There are also people who think highly of every profession and those that do not.

There is nothing to discuss.
My point isn't that some doctors are selfish. It's that healthcare professionals are inaccurately portrayed as saints.
 
Last edited:

libertyyne

2+ Year Member
Mar 5, 2015
9,609
16,953
Status
Medical Student
I feel there's a certain air of grandeur associated with a career in healthcare especially attributed to doctors. They're portrayed as especially altruistic; and that the career is only for people who exhibit that saintly altruism. They're literally doing work and getting paid for it. Most of them are not volunteering after premed years.

And with these expectations of altruism comes the idea that as doctors we're going to take care of the "underserved community" and help in making meaningful demographic changes like caring for people without the means to care for themselves. Obviously what's likely going to happen is most medical students go on to charge these same people hundreds of dollars for their treatment without a care in the world. This isn't a career based on volunteerism.

There's also a lot of expectation that as doctors we could change the state of healthcare. What? They're not legislators. Most are just drones working for hospitals. Literally all they do is treat. Beyond that, they have no power.

This may just be rhetoric part of the formality in applications, and I've gotten too accustomed to seeing this and playing along with it while writing secondaries, but doctors are painted out to be some kind of saints, and if you're not on par with them on an ethical level, you're unfit to become a doctor. This saccharine image is so hypocritical, I've gotten jaded by the self righteousness going on.

I think the real heroes (for which physicans are taking credit) are:
1. PhDs finding actual cures for diseases while getting paid a fraction of what the physicians are
2. Legislators/politicians lobbying for better options in universal healthcare

Fine, there are SOME doctors doing probono work and overseas volunteering but lettuce bee reel, they're not the majority.

With that said, while writing my secondaries I'll still be playing along with the idea that as a doctor, I could enact huge social change and see every patient rich and poor. Because that's the bs these schools obviously want to hear.

What do you think?
Inb4 stfu troll.
Have you thought that the whole reason a large portion of schools have been shifting focus to Primary care and serving underserved communities is to change the future make-up of the MD population? The evidence that is currently available states that people who are committed to undeserved communities and underserved areas tend to go on to serve those same communities.
What do you think volunteerism on an app portrays? The whole purpose of that evaluation is to figure out the applicants that are altruistic. Large amount of volunteerism is above the "check the box" mentality of applications.

I dont think you can blame adcoms for wanting to improve a considerably awful situation. They dont have truth serums to evaluate candidates, the apps and academic records is all they have, and that is all you can expect .
 

Palmyra

2+ Year Member
Mar 7, 2016
89
67
Status
Medical Student
My point isn't that some doctors are selfish. It's that healthcare professionals are inaccurately portrayed as saints.[/QUOTE]

This is absolutely BS. Yes, there are some bad apples as there are in every profession.

You try being a person who watches good people die, delivers the devastating news to their loving families, and goes home to get only a short night of rest, then gets up in the morning to do it all again in the hopes of saving lives and easing suffering. Anyone who knowingly chooses that life deserves the admiration society casts upon them.

And you shouldn't BS your way through admissions if that's how you feel. I wouldn't be surprised if adcoms saw right through your act. At least give them the courtesy of some honesty.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
 

libertyyne

2+ Year Member
Mar 5, 2015
9,609
16,953
Status
Medical Student
My point isn't that some doctors are selfish. It's that healthcare professionals are inaccurately portrayed as saints.

This is absolutely BS. Yes, there are some bad apples as there are in every profession.

You try being a person who watches good people die, delivers the devastating news to their loving families, and goes home to get only a short night of rest, then gets up in the morning to do it all again in the hopes of saving lives and easing suffering. Anyone who knowingly chooses that life deserves the admiration society casts upon them.

And you shouldn't BS your way through admissions if that's how you feel. I wouldn't be surprised if adcoms saw right through your act. At least give them the courtesy of some honesty.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk
You have an idealized view of physicians.. If anything, your perception of "watch good people die" and "easing suffering" applies more to nurses and nursing aides. ADCOMS might see through this naive view as well.
 
Last edited:

LizzyM

the evil queen of numbers
10+ Year Member
Mar 7, 2005
23,178
32,829
Status
Academic Administration
With that said, while writing my secondaries I'll still be playing along with the idea that as a doctor, I could enact huge social change and see every patient rich and poor. Because that's the bs these schools obviously want to hear.

What do you think?
Inb4 stfu troll.
Let us know how that works out for you.
 

LizzyM

the evil queen of numbers
10+ Year Member
Mar 7, 2005
23,178
32,829
Status
Academic Administration
I have two IIs and counting. I'm smart enough to know cynicism should be kept to yourself.
Let us know how that works out for you.
 
OP
A

Avicenna

Membership Revoked
Removed
5+ Year Member
Nov 18, 2012
465
281
Status
Pre-Medical
good people die, delivers the devastating news to their loving families, and goes home to get only a short night of rest, then gets up in the morning to do it all again in the hopes of saving lives and easing suffering
That's another problem. I see rhetoric like this thrown around to add to that image, but how much of it is actually true? From my hundreds of hours of clinical experiences, I haven't seen a single death or any devastating news. Doctors are all pretty well rested too.
 

NotASerialKiller

2+ Year Member
Jul 7, 2015
1,457
6,866
Status
Medical Student
When you interview for an office job they expect you to say that you care about the company, love helping customers over the phone, and won't sleep under your desk after photocopying your **** and **** and taping it to your boss' door after hours. If some people don't live up to one or all of those expectations, does that mean that the company should stop bothering to look for their ideal employee?
 

Cyberdyne 101

It's a dry heat
5+ Year Member
Sep 16, 2013
4,658
5,950
Under the Bay Bridge
Status
Pre-Medical

kb1900

2+ Year Member
Oct 4, 2015
1,366
2,574
Status
Medical Student (Accepted)
It seriously just comes down to supply and demand. Shouldn't be surprising that you need to say some lofty things on ur apps
 

Lost In Transcription

reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
Apr 2, 2016
2,515
2,271
Probably still at work
Here's a point I want to nitpick. I will come talk about the content when I have more time.

PhDs get paid 6 figure salaries when they are PIs. Also, they do not have 300k+ in loans/interest from graduate school that they have to pay off. They also work terribly long and arduous hours, but their work is their own. Very rarely will you find PhDs who do what they do out of altruism. Even curing a disease usually comes from truly obsessive interest in science and solving puzzles. The disease part is how they get the grants.
I think MD/PhDs are more likely to research for the betterment of healthcare.

So yeah. They make way more than you imagine and have much different incentives than you imagine.

Legislators are paid well too.
 

Lost In Transcription

reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
Apr 2, 2016
2,515
2,271
Probably still at work
Getting disgusted by the hubris, hypocrisy, and self-righteousness in medicine. Especially in the premed culture which all too willingly perpetuates/glorifies it.


My point isn't that some doctors are selfish. It's that healthcare professionals are inaccurately portrayed as saints.
1) The premed culture does not represent medicine in practice at all.
2) Actually, most schools want to see you have a realistic view of the career and not romanticize the profession. So I'm not sure what you are complaining about.
 

james11

2+ Year Member
Jul 1, 2015
179
142
Status
Pre-Medical
It seriously just comes down to supply and demand. Shouldn't be surprising that you need to say some lofty things on ur apps
This is the most realistic assessment. If med schools can fill a class with people who truly believe this stuff, why wouldn't they do it.?

But to your point OP yes I agree it's kind of crazy the game you have to play to get in. I've shared my secondary questions with docs I know and I think if they reapplied now and answered truly honestly almost none of them would get in. The amount of anger/vitriol you're getting in response to your post suggests you've struck some sort of a nerve....
 

JB50

I'm really in I swear
2+ Year Member
Jun 30, 2016
1,440
1,767
Status
Rehab Sci Student
That's another problem. I see rhetoric like this thrown around to add to that image, but how much of it is actually true? From my hundreds of hours of clinical experiences, I haven't seen a single death or any devastating news. Doctors are all pretty well rested too.
I would vouch that your "clinical experience" is not truly doing you any good for grooming your scope of medicine if you haven't seen terminal patients, families receiving news that their loved one will never be the same, or a person actively passing away. You must either live under a rock or be blind to what goes on around you.
 

NimbleNavigator

Membership Revoked
Removed
Account on Hold
Mar 15, 2016
383
277
Getting disgusted by the hubris, hypocrisy, and self-righteousness in medicine. Especially in the premed culture which all too willingly perpetuates/glorifies it.
Honestly, I think it's pretty reprehensible that you seem to think all forms of altruism are disingenuous. There are cheats in every field. I, for one, volunteered my time to help the underserved because it's what I believe in.

I know I troll a lot on this forum... sometimes intentional and sometimes not (sorry for trolling about DO's btw, I actually think DO's are perfectly competent... I just like seeing people riled up sometimes. I think it's a character flaw of mine, to be honest) so it is probably really easy to discredit what I'm saying here. I also support Trump, but that's mainly because I don't believe in abortion.

This is one thing that I really do feel strongly about, though. You have to really examine your life and ask yourself what you're living for. Are you living for money? What are you going to do with all that money if you spent your life chasing dreams that aren't yours? Are you living for prestige? If so, why? Why does prestige even matter? Are you really going to let what someone else thinks of you dictate your life?

Also, I think you're really underestimating the power of what one person can do.
 

Mad Jack

Critically Caring
5+ Year Member
Jul 27, 2013
35,552
65,173
4th Dimension
That isn't exactly day-to-day practice or something that applies to every specialty. If you're in certain fields- surgery, critical care, emergency medicine, oncology, maybe a couple of others- you'll have to give some devastating news on a fairly regular basis. But the majority of doctors don't end up doing this sort of thing with any regularity. And honestly, while it isn't painless, it isn't some devastating thing once you're used to it if you've got the right personality and level of distance. You have to have enough empathy to be caring, but not so much that the job kills you inside.
 

Lawper

cat in a box
Gold Donor
5+ Year Member
SDN Ambassador
Jun 17, 2014
36,702
108,201
space chat
I think the real heroes (for which physicans are taking credit) are:
1. PhDs finding actual cures for diseases while getting paid a fraction of what the physicians are
2. Legislators/politicians lobbying for better options in universal healthcare
Politicians are the antithesis of heroism.
 

Mad Jack

Critically Caring
5+ Year Member
Jul 27, 2013
35,552
65,173
4th Dimension
Here's a point I want to nitpick. I will come talk about the content when I have more time.

PhDs get paid 6 figure salaries when they are PIs. Also, they do not have 300k+ in loans/interest from graduate school that they have to pay off. They also work terribly long and arduous hours, but their work is their own. Very rarely will you find PhDs who do what they do out of altruism. Even curing a disease usually comes from truly obsessive interest in science and solving puzzles. The disease part is how they get the grants.
I think MD/PhDs are more likely to research for the betterment of healthcare.

So yeah. They make way more than you imagine and have much different incentives than you imagine.

Legislators are paid well too.
And then there's the PhDs that only want to make a name for themselves, or their ones that fudge numbers to get pharmaceuticals released that are no better than their predecessors but cost ten times as much...
 

Cyberdyne 101

It's a dry heat
5+ Year Member
Sep 16, 2013
4,658
5,950
Under the Bay Bridge
Status
Pre-Medical
That isn't exactly day-to-day practice or something that applies to every specialty. If you're in certain fields- surgery, critical care, emergency medicine, oncology, maybe a couple of others- you'll have to give some devastating news on a fairly regular basis. But the majority of doctors don't end up doing this sort of thing with any regularity. And honestly, while it isn't painless, it isn't some devastating thing once you're used to it if you've got the right personality and level of distance. You have to have enough empathy to be caring, but not so much that the job kills you inside.
Oh I'm aware that it's more prevalent in certain fields. I just wanted to point out that some doctors do deal with it on a regular basis.
 

Mad Jack

Critically Caring
5+ Year Member
Jul 27, 2013
35,552
65,173
4th Dimension
Oh I'm aware that it's more prevalent in certain fields. I just wanted to point out that some doctors do deal with it on a regular basis.
But if OP is truly in it for themselves, that some doctors deal with terrible situations does not matter- they won't be that sort of doctor.
 

NimbleNavigator

Membership Revoked
Removed
Account on Hold
Mar 15, 2016
383
277
You realize how self righteous you seem when you make these criticisms? Hypocrit.
Agreed, except you spelled hypocrite wrong :p
 

Cyberdyne 101

It's a dry heat
5+ Year Member
Sep 16, 2013
4,658
5,950
Under the Bay Bridge
Status
Pre-Medical
But if OP is truly in it for themselves, that some doctors deal with terrible situations does not matter- they won't be that sort of doctor.
Perhaps I jumped the gun a bit in my initial post. Within a few days of volunteering in an oncology ward, I witnessed hospital staff move the body of a patient who passed away on their hospital bed. Another patient, who was about the same age as me, passed away a couple of months later. Although some patients did improve, overall, it was a pretty grim place. The same could be said about the county ER in my area. And while I realize that these places aren't representative of medicine as a whole, I still think the OP should learn about them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Crayola227 and JB50

Mad Jack

Critically Caring
5+ Year Member
Jul 27, 2013
35,552
65,173
4th Dimension
Perhaps I jumped the gun a bit in my initial post. Within a few days of volunteering in an oncology ward, I witnessed hospital staff move the body of a patient who passed away on their hospital bed. Another patient, who was about the same age as me, passed away a couple of months later. Although some patients did improve, overall, it was a pretty grim place. The same could be said about the county ER in my area. And while I realize that these places aren't representative of medicine as a whole, I still think the OP should learn about them.
We once lost seven patients in the MICU in a single 16 hour shift. I'm no stranger to death. A good day was one in which no one died. But if somebody did, it was just a day. I've probably personally put more people on comfort measures than there students are in most med school classes.
 

LizzyM

the evil queen of numbers
10+ Year Member
Mar 7, 2005
23,178
32,829
Status
Academic Administration

Cyberdyne 101

It's a dry heat
5+ Year Member
Sep 16, 2013
4,658
5,950
Under the Bay Bridge
Status
Pre-Medical
Why shadowing primary care providers alone is not enough...
This job falls to residents and to attendings in emergency medicine and trauma surgery and critical care as well.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/09/04/opinion/sunday/how-to-tell-a-mother-her-child-is-dead.html
It looks like you missed my post :)
 
  • Like
Reactions: LizzyM

Goro

7+ Year Member
Jun 10, 2010
53,645
78,897
Somewhere west of St. Louis
Status
Non-Student
I probably make about 50% less than my clinical colleagues, but I don't have an R01, either. I'd probably double my salary if I could nail one of those.

Anyway, even if I came up with a cure for metastatic colon Ca tomorrow, doctors would be the ones actually proving it in patients and administering it. I'm perfectly OK with that.

One correction to LIT, our work is NOT our own. Intellectual property belongs to our research institutions. My own university would profit handsomely from any Ca cure I come up with. Me? Not so much.

Here's a point I want to nitpick. I will come talk about the content when I have more time.

PhDs get paid 6 figure salaries when they are PIs. Also, they do not have 300k+ in loans/interest from graduate school that they have to pay off. They also work terribly long and arduous hours, but their work is their own. Very rarely will you find PhDs who do what they do out of altruism. Even curing a disease usually comes from truly obsessive interest in science and solving puzzles. The disease part is how they get the grants.
I think MD/PhDs are more likely to research for the betterment of healthcare.

So yeah. They make way more than you imagine and have much different incentives than you imagine.

Legislators are paid well too.

PhDs finding actual cures for diseases while getting paid a fraction of what the physicians are
 

Lost In Transcription

reports of my assimilation are greatly exaggerated
2+ Year Member
Apr 2, 2016
2,515
2,271
Probably still at work
I probably make about 50% less than my clinical colleagues, but I don't have an R01, either. I'd probably double my salary if I could nail one of those.

Anyway, even if I came up with a cure for metastatic colon Ca tomorrow, doctors would be the ones actually proving it in patients and administering it. I'm perfectly OK with that.

One correction to LIT, our work is NOT our own. Intellectual property belongs to our research institutions. My own university would profit handsomely from any Ca cure I come up with. Me? Not so much.




PhDs finding actual cures for diseases while getting paid a fraction of what the physicians are
Come on Goro! Get that R01! It's pretty difficult but you got this.

Yeah sorry. I didn't mean literally yours. :p Just that PhDs get to choose their experiments (LOL until reviews come back) and what they study. And that they usually do it out of....not altruism. Just obsessions and SOME desire to better humanity.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Crayola227

Goro

7+ Year Member
Jun 10, 2010
53,645
78,897
Somewhere west of St. Louis
Status
Non-Student
Don't blame clinicians for the pedastal the public and patients out them on.

I feel there's a certain air of grandeur associated with a career in healthcare especially attributed to doctors. They're portrayed as especially altruistic; and that the career is only for people who exhibit that saintly altruism. They're literally doing work and getting paid for it. Most of them are not volunteering after premed years.

And with these expectations of altruism comes the idea that as doctors we're going to take care of the "underserved community" and help in making meaningful demographic changes like caring for people without the means to care for themselves. Obviously what's likely going to happen is most medical students go on to charge these same people hundreds of dollars for their treatment without a care in the world. This isn't a career based on volunteerism.

There's also a lot of expectation that as doctors we could change the state of healthcare. What? They're not legislators. Most are just drones working for hospitals. Literally all they do is treat. Beyond that, they have no power.

This may just be rhetoric part of the formality in applications, and I've gotten too accustomed to seeing this and playing along with it while writing secondaries, but doctors are painted out to be some kind of saints, and if you're not on par with them on an ethical level, you're unfit to become a doctor. This saccharine image is so hypocritical, I've gotten jaded by the self righteousness going on.

I think the real heroes (for which physicans are taking credit) are:
1. PhDs finding actual cures for diseases while getting paid a fraction of what the physicians are
2. Legislators/politicians lobbying for better options in universal healthcare

Fine, there are SOME doctors doing probono work and overseas volunteering but lettuce bee reel, they're not the majority.

With that said, while writing my secondaries I'll still be playing along with the idea that as a doctor, I could enact huge social change and see every patient rich and poor. Because that's the bs these schools obviously want to hear.

What do you think?
Inb4 stfu troll.
 

Matthew9Thirtyfive

*breathes in* boi
Moderator
2+ Year Member
Jan 11, 2016
15,105
22,378
Status
Medical Student
Don't blame clinicians for the pedastal the public and patients out them on.
I'm still trying to figure out where this pedestal went. I've met so many people who think doctors are overpaid med dispensers who look everything up on WebMD.
 

NimbleNavigator

Membership Revoked
Removed
Account on Hold
Mar 15, 2016
383
277
I'm still trying to figure out where this pedestal went. I've met so many people who think doctors are overpaid med dispensers who look everything up on WebMD.
The world wide web
 

NecrotizingFasciitis

SDN Bronze Donor
Bronze Donor
2+ Year Member
Jul 15, 2015
1,502
2,265
Status
Medical Student
I'm still trying to figure out where this pedestal went. I've met so many people who think doctors are overpaid med dispensers who look everything up on WebMD.
I had a conversation with a couple of my best friends the other day about corruption in healthcare. Both of them thought physicians were terrible money-sucking leeches that try to get patients into these perpetual circles of treatment so they can keep getting paid. One of them even said he would rather be left to die on the side of the road if something went wrong with him instead of having me call an ambulance, just so he could avoid giving physicians any more money. I about died inside.

I can't imagine where all of this hate came from... But it's truly saddening that some people think like this. It's like so many have said in this thread, there are bad eggs in every profession/group.. And unfortunately they seem to be the ones everybody hears about because it makes a good story. But I'd like to believe the vast majority of physicians got into what they're doing for the right reasons.

And in response to OP, I've thought similar things at times. There are a lot of pre-meds that express what I like to call a sort of "pseudo-genuinenism" when it comes to being empathetic and humanistic, and it's blatantly obvious who these people are. But I've met a handful of pre-meds that I know are going to be amazing physicians one day too. I'd like to believe that medical schools do their best to filter for the latter of the two.
 

Goro

7+ Year Member
Jun 10, 2010
53,645
78,897
Somewhere west of St. Louis
Status
Non-Student
Your post immediately reminded me of an old friend who once said to me when we were both in our 20s "I'd rather be dead that live to be old."

Both speakers displayed a profound immaturity.

Your friend will only be too happy to whimper "save me, save me"! to the doctor as he's wheeled into the ER after an accident, or a burst appendix.



I had a conversation with a couple of my best friends the other day about corruption in healthcare. Both of them thought physicians were terrible money-sucking leeches that try to get patients into these perpetual circles of treatment so they can keep getting paid. One of them even said he would rather be left to die on the side of the road if something went wrong with him instead of having me call an ambulance, just so he could avoid giving physicians any more money. I about died inside.

I can't imagine where all of this hate came from... But it's truly saddening that some people think like this..
 

Matthew9Thirtyfive

*breathes in* boi
Moderator
2+ Year Member
Jan 11, 2016
15,105
22,378
Status
Medical Student
I had a conversation with a couple of my best friends the other day about corruption in healthcare. Both of them thought physicians were terrible money-sucking leeches that try to get patients into these perpetual circles of treatment so they can keep getting paid. One of them even said he would rather be left to die on the side of the road if something went wrong with him instead of having me call an ambulance, just so he could avoid giving physicians any more money. I about died inside.

I can't imagine where all of this hate came from... But it's truly saddening that some people think like this. It's like so many have said in this thread, there are bad eggs in every profession/group.. And unfortunately they seem to be the ones everybody hears about because it makes a good story. But I'd like to believe the vast majority of physicians got into what they're doing for the right reasons.

And in response to OP, I've thought similar things at times. There are a lot of pre-meds that express what I like to call a sort of "pseudo-genuinenism" when it comes to being empathetic and humanistic, and it's blatantly obvious who these people are. But I've met a handful of pre-meds that I know are going to be amazing physicians one day too. I'd like to believe that medical schools do their best to filter for the latter of the two.
Your post immediately reminded me of an old friend who once said to me when we were both in our 20s "I'd rather be dead that live to be old."

Both speakers displayed a profound immaturity.

Your friend will only be too happy to whimper "save me, save me"! to the doctor as he's wheeled into the ER after an accident, or a burst appendix.
Agreed. It's like that with many professions. Everyone hates a cop/physician/lawyer/paramedic until they need one.
 

giantswing

7+ Year Member
Jan 12, 2010
789
1,012
Status
Guys, the real heros here are the nurses, whom are the back bone of the hospital. Without them, nothing could function. Literally, nothing! (They remind me of this all the time, when they call me for an order so they can do stuff). Also, the NPs who sacrifice an extra two years of their life to get a master's degree online, so they can go save all the rural people from the money grubbing MDs.
 

Mad Jack

Critically Caring
5+ Year Member
Jul 27, 2013
35,552
65,173
4th Dimension
Guys, the real heros here are the nurses, whom are the back bone of the hospital. Without them, nothing could function. Literally, nothing! (They remind me of this all the time, when they call me for an order so they can do stuff). Also, the NPs who sacrifice an extra two years of their life to get a master's degree online, so they can go save all the rural people from the money grubbing MDs.
The real heroes are the people from environmental services. Just imagine if they went on strike for a week- how does I clean room? Where in the actual hell does the trash eventually go? Where are the cleaning supplies even kept? Where do we dispose of sharps containers and other biohazardous stuff?

The hospital is a place of symbiosis. While I recognize your post was facetious, the truth is the whole hospital would break down if any group of people disappeared except management. Many of the suits could vanish and things would actually run more smoothly.
 

giantswing

7+ Year Member
Jan 12, 2010
789
1,012
Status
The real heroes are the people from environmental services. Just imagine if they went on strike for a week- how does I clean room? Where in the actual hell does the trash eventually go? Where are the cleaning supplies even kept? Where do we dispose of sharps containers and other biohazardous stuff?

The hospital is a place of symbiosis. While I recognize your post was facetious, the truth is the whole hospital would break down if any group of people disappeared except management. Many of the suits could vanish and things would actually run more smoothly.
I know and agree, esp the suits part.

The nurses tooting their own horn really gets to me sometimes tho.
 

JB50

I'm really in I swear
2+ Year Member
Jun 30, 2016
1,440
1,767
Status
Rehab Sci Student
I know and agree, esp the suits part.

The nurses tooting their own horn really gets to me sometimes tho.
It's no different than physician's tooting their own horn or being arrogant for being a physician. Nurses, in their own regard, are very good at what they do and are needed in order for the healthcare team to run smoothly or even run at all. I despise the physicians I see in the hospital that I work at treating nurses poorly simply because they don't think nurses know what they are talking about. Nurses spend so much fricken time with the patients that I would trust a change in condition reported by the nurses vs. anyone else. Nursing and physician education is so different that the two are great compliments of each other, not the other way around.
 

JB50

I'm really in I swear
2+ Year Member
Jun 30, 2016
1,440
1,767
Status
Rehab Sci Student
The real heroes are the people from environmental services. Just imagine if they went on strike for a week- how does I clean room? Where in the actual hell does the trash eventually go? Where are the cleaning supplies even kept? Where do we dispose of sharps containers and other biohazardous stuff?

The hospital is a place of symbiosis. While I recognize your post was facetious, the truth is the whole hospital would break down if any group of people disappeared except management. Many of the suits could vanish and things would actually run more smoothly.
I think this is one of the most misunderstood concepts about the hospital that a lot of us don't understand and are never exposed to.
 

giantswing

7+ Year Member
Jan 12, 2010
789
1,012
Status
It's no different than physician's tooting their own horn or being arrogant for being a physician. Nurses, in their own regard, are very good at what they do and are needed in order for the healthcare team to run smoothly or even run at all. I despise the physicians I see in the hospital that I work at treating nurses poorly simply because they don't think nurses know what they are talking about. Nurses spend so much fricken time with the patients that I would trust a change in condition reported by the nurses vs. anyone else. Nursing and physician education is so different that the two are great compliments of each other, not the other way around.
LOL just wait till you are a medical student, and the nurses treat you like s*** for just being a medical student. Or you're a resident and the nurses still treat you like s***, and then you get a new and/or stupid nurse while you're on at night, and they call you about stupid s***. Then you get in the elevator and you see a nursing student with a t shirt that says something like, "Be nice, I'll save your life from the doctor." Just wait. You too, in time, will hate nurses too.
ETA: oh, and if you actually treat do anything that could be percieved as treating a nurse poorly, their boss will come down on you like a ton of bricks, because they have time to give a s*** about that, and your PD/attending will not have time to deal with that. So guess what will happen? I have never, ever seen a resident or attending treat a nurse bad for the sake of being bad. I have seen them yell at a nurse when they do something that hurt a patient, and the nurse yells right back. No ownership for their mistake, either, just that they were busy.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Crayola227 and JB50

Lucca

Will Walk Rope for Sandwich
Staff member
Administrator
5+ Year Member
Oct 22, 2013
8,215
17,888
City of the Future
Status
Medical Student
Agreed. It's like that with many professions. Everyone hates a cop/physician/lawyer/paramedic until they need one.
Professionals are the faces of institutions, as a result they reflexively receive the resentment. If you want to be angry, be angry at the institution. In healthcare, be angry at the insurance providers. Don't think paramedics really meet this bill though.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Goro
OP
A

Avicenna

Membership Revoked
Removed
5+ Year Member
Nov 18, 2012
465
281
Status
Pre-Medical
Ok i said that wrong. Politicians aren't heroes. What I meant was those are the positions people should pursue if their goal really is to "help" people, because those are the positions that can have the biggest effect.
 

JB50

I'm really in I swear
2+ Year Member
Jun 30, 2016
1,440
1,767
Status
Rehab Sci Student
LOL


just wait till you are a medical student, and the nurses treat you like s*** for just being a medical student. Or you're a resident and the nurses still treat you like s***, and then you get a new and/or stupid nurse while you're on at night, and they call you about stupid s***. Then you get in the elevator and you see a nursing student with a t shirt that says something like, "Be nice, I'll save your life from the doctor." Just wait. You too, in time, will hate nurses too.
ETA: oh, and if you actually treat do anything that could be percieved as treating a nurse poorly, their boss will come down on you like a ton of bricks, because they have time to give a s*** about that, and your PD/attending will not have time to deal with that. So guess what will happen? I have never, ever seen a resident or attending treat a nurse bad for the sake of being bad. I have seen them yell at a nurse when they do something that hurt a patient, and the nurse yells right back. No ownership for their mistake, either, just that they were busy.
rekt. thanks for the insight. I guess I was speaking from a non-medical-student point of view from my experiences just observing it. I could see how some of that would rustle the jimmies of a student/resident/attending, especially the t-shirt.


 
Last edited: