Seven Year Hiatus and Grade Trends

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Birdnals

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I'm sure this has been discussed ad nauseam but I'm having a hard time getting a clear answer. I'm 26 years old and this spring was my first term back in school after a seven year gap. I'll spare the story as it's pretty typical but after 32 hours of school I failed out with a 1.53. I got a 4.0 as a full time student while also working full time and while I still have a long road ahead I'm confident in myself that I can consistently achieve grades in this range. Even so, the best GPA I can end up with after 120 credits is around a 3.32 if I get all A's (unrealistic perhaps). I know ADComs look for trends in grades but would this sort of 180 after a number of years be given heavier consideration? I'm not trying to get in to Harvard or Hopkins, but I would like to attend good school (University of South Florida please!). Thanks everyone, I hope to be able to give back as I get deeper in to this pre-med process.

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I was in a similar situation. I left school after two semesters with a 2.0 at a community college, worked for a year and went back to school (4-year university). I graduated with a 3.2 from the 4-year (which when averaged with the 2.0 was obviously very low). So I went out on my own for 6 years. The past 2 years I have been taking classes as a post-bac (not a formal program just on my own) and have had a 4.0 ever since.

I took the MCAT and did well. Still, my cumulative GPA when it was all said and done was VERY low. But there were schools that looked at my improvement, and what I'd done in the meantime. I'm starting an MD school in July and couldn't be happier.

So to summarize all that : Yes, you can still go to medical school. You have a lot of hard work ahead of you, but you can do it... Emphasis on the amount of hard work ahead of you.
 
I'm sure this has been discussed ad nauseam but I'm having a hard time getting a clear answer. I'm 26 years old and this spring was my first term back in school after a seven year gap. I'll spare the story as it's pretty typical but after 32 hours of school I failed out with a 1.53. I got a 4.0 as a full time student while also working full time and while I still have a long road ahead I'm confident in myself that I can consistently achieve grades in this range. Even so, the best GPA I can end up with after 120 credits is around a 3.32 if I get all A's (unrealistic perhaps). I know ADComs look for trends in grades but would this sort of 180 after a number of years be given heavier consideration? I'm not trying to get in to Harvard or Hopkins, but I would like to attend good school (University of South Florida please!). Thanks everyone, I hope to be able to give back as I get deeper in to this pre-med process.

I don't think you need anyone telling you that 1.53 gpa is awful but the good news is its possible (hard but possible). There are options should as the D.O. route, which allows grade replacement. USF is an MD school so if you really want to go there its going to take a lot more work and more than likely you will have to do post bacc. And you will need a great MCAT score. Its up to you though, how bad do you want it?
 
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If you apply MD, you will have trouble being pre-screened out with what will likely be a 3.2ish.

If you get past that point, have a good MCAT and EC's then yes you can still do it. But it won't be easy.

If you look at DO, your GPA will be much higher likely, and you will 'normally' find them more forgiving of past sins...but that is a choice you have to make.
 
Thanks guys for the quick replies. Obviously not the "you'll be fine" responses I was hoping for but I appreciate realism vs. unrealistic optimism every time. Hard work isn't a problem, I thoroughly enjoy busting my tail in everything I do (seems like a prereq for being a physician anyways).

Thanks tipsy, that's the kind of motivation I was looking for. I'm willing to put in the hard work now and I know that even if I don't get accepted into an MD/DO program that the hard work in school will stay pay off but I want to make sure that I'm not just waking up at the crack of dawn to shadow physicians and sacrificing my time with loved ones so that I can tell people I shadowed a physician X years ago when I'm older. Congrats on your acceptance!

From what I understand (probably misunderstand), the idea of a postbac program is that 2 years of 4.0ish in postbac > 4 years of undergrad with a marginal GPA. Essentially, ADcoms give more weight to the postbac program. If this is the rationale of the postbac program, then shouldn't 3 years of 4.0ish in undergrad > 1 year of 1.53? If I've already taken all of my prereqs, then what does take during that time? Would I just take classes to inflate my GPA and if so, would it be OK to just sprinkle those classes throughout the summers?

Thanks again guys!
 
I was in a similar situation. I left school after two semesters with a 2.0 at a community college, worked for a year and went back to school (4-year university). I graduated with a 3.2 from the 4-year (which when averaged with the 2.0 was obviously very low). So I went out on my own for 6 years. The past 2 years I have been taking classes as a post-bac (not a formal program just on my own) and have had a 4.0 ever since.

I took the MCAT and did well. Still, my cumulative GPA when it was all said and done was VERY low. But there were schools that looked at my improvement, and what I'd done in the meantime. I'm starting an MD school in July and couldn't be happier.

So to summarize all that : Yes, you can still go to medical school. You have a lot of hard work ahead of you, but you can do it... Emphasis on the amount of hard work ahead of you.

Wow, good job man! What school are you going to?
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I'm sure this has been discussed ad nauseam but I'm having a hard time getting a clear answer. I'm 26 years old and this spring was my first term back in school after a seven year gap. I'll spare the story as it's pretty typical but after 32 hours of school I failed out with a 1.53. I got a 4.0 as a full time student while also working full time and while I still have a long road ahead I'm confident in myself that I can consistently achieve grades in this range. Even so, the best GPA I can end up with after 120 credits is around a 3.32 if I get all A's (unrealistic perhaps). I know ADComs look for trends in grades but would this sort of 180 after a number of years be given heavier consideration? I'm not trying to get in to Harvard or Hopkins, but I would like to attend good school (University of South Florida please!). Thanks everyone, I hope to be able to give back as I get deeper in to this pre-med process.

I applied last cycle with a 3.23, consisting of a ~3.0 from undergrad and a 4.0 for one year's worth of postbac, and am currently attending a top 10 med school. You should check out this thread for more people's stories, with greater detail.

If you keep up your current high performance, do well on your MCAT, and have other good stuff in your application, I think you'll have a good shot at it.
 
Please keep in mind Tipsy McStagger has a history in the most highly regarded extra-curricular activity (the armed forces) and likely received extra consideration due to his or her honorable service to his or her country. You still have a chance OP, but armed services are an unparalleled way to demonstrate growth and maturity. Thank you, Tipsy for your service.

Agree whole-heartedly and I echo that thank you. I guess that's the spot I'm in right now--trying to find a way to demonstrate that growth and maturity. Unfortunately I don't think there's any amount of ECs I can do as a civilian to fully demonstrate this change but I'm deadest on trying my hardest!

I guess the card up my sleeve is that one of the docs I'm shadowing and have known for 6 years trains fellows at USF. Hopefully this connection will just allow my app to get a closer look and not get tossed aside solely because of my GPA. From what I've read, USF is already pretty good about this anyways.
 
I'm sure this has been discussed ad nauseam but I'm having a hard time getting a clear answer. I'm 26 years old and this spring was my first term back in school after a seven year gap. I'll spare the story as it's pretty typical but after 32 hours of school I failed out with a 1.53. I got a 4.0 as a full time student while also working full time and while I still have a long road ahead I'm confident in myself that I can consistently achieve grades in this range. Even so, the best GPA I can end up with after 120 credits is around a 3.32 if I get all A's (unrealistic perhaps). I know ADComs look for trends in grades but would this sort of 180 after a number of years be given heavier consideration? I'm not trying to get in to Harvard or Hopkins, but I would like to attend good school (University of South Florida please!). Thanks everyone, I hope to be able to give back as I get deeper in to this pre-med process.

Your biggest problem is avoiding auto-cutoffs. Nothing less forgiving than a computer. Since expecting a 4.0 is unrealistic, and since you don't have much room for error with less, you need to keep in mind the possibility of a postbac down the line. Hopefully it won't be necessary, but even if you get a 4.0 from here on, it certainly can't hurt to get even higher than a 3.2...

You also want to have something that will make med schools actively want YOU, instead of just the other way around. Since your problem is solely your history, and not a recent crime/IA or some crippling personality flaw that will manifest in interviews (I hope =X), I think a strong low-mid 30's MCAT will go a long way. MCAT usually can't compensate for low GPAs, but since yours is dragged down by an ancient period of failure, I think it will work in this case. And of course you need compelling ECs (better than average, since your GPA will already require a hearty share of open-minded goodwill).

Basically, from here on out, there aren't a whole lot of differences in your strategy and that of an 18-year-old only one semester deep. It's just that 1.5 is going to REALLY hurt your GPA, and you'll need to explain it, but in the end I don't think it is insurmountable at all. It just raises the stakes on everything you do from here til app time.
 
From what I understand (probably misunderstand), the idea of a postbac program is that 2 years of 4.0ish in postbac > 4 years of undergrad with a marginal GPA. Essentially, ADcoms give more weight to the postbac program. If this is the rationale of the postbac program, then shouldn't 3 years of 4.0ish in undergrad > 1 year of 1.53? If I've already taken all of my prereqs, then what does take during that time? Would I just take classes to inflate my GPA and if so, would it be OK to just sprinkle those classes throughout the summers?

Thanks again guys!
I can't speak for the adcoms so I'm afraid the following is just my opinion. Ultimately I think they are trying to determine two things: would you make a good doctor and can you succeed in medical school. The former can be partly judged by your personal statement, EC's and interview, but the latter lies on two main pillars: MCAT and GPA.

We all grow up differently, and some of us mature faster than others. Personally, I was very slow to mature, hence the low GPA and duration it took to earn my bachelors. What I think got my application some attention was 1) the GPA / MCAT incongruity and military service. I did a lot of growing up in the Army, and with the discipline and maturity I developed there I was able to succeed in school and on the MCAT. I think somewhere there was an adcom member who looked at my file and said, "well, this guy's GPA is not impressive, but that is largely due to his early college years which were 6 years ago. Since he left college the first time, he served in the military, then returned to school and held a 4.0 and performed decently on the MCAT...let's bring him in and see what he has to say."

So to finally answer your question I think that a strong record of improvement is certainly beneficial. For me, it also helped to have some growing-up time in between. I think this all factors into the adcoms decisions on whether or not they want to interview you. What classes to take largely depends on the route you are trying to follow. DO schools would be an excellent option for you, especially since they allow for grade replacement (as far as I understand). So you could retake some classes you did poorly in, and raise your GPA substantially more than just doing some random classes. Whether or not you sprinkle them out over several summers I suppose depends on your situation. Your age, family considerations, job considerations etc etc. If you are only interested in MD for whatever reason, it will take more I think to raise your GPA to the point where people will really take you seriously. A solid MCAT score is your best friend as of this point, in addition to some post-bac /SMP work.

Part of my success is that I live in Texas which has many state schools that accept something like 90% of residents. Add to that military service which we Texans love ;) and I had a better chance than say if I lived in California, where probably no state school would even have considered me.

i will be an md said:
Please keep in mind Tipsy McStagger has a history in the most highly regarded extra-curricular activity (the armed forces) and likely received extra consideration due to his or her honorable service to his or her country. You still have a chance OP, but armed services are an unparalleled way to demonstrate growth and maturity. Thank you, Tipsy for your service.
I think it really was instrumental in my acceptance. The discipline and maturity I gained during my service were essential for my success. Also, the hands on trauma management undoubtedly surpassed my volunteer time in the ER.

Thank you for your kind words.

AestheticGod said:
Wow, good job man! What school are you going to?
Thank you. I decided to accept UT San Antonio's offer. I prematched there and really loved the students.

Agree whole-heartedly and I echo that thank you. I guess that's the spot I'm in right now--trying to find a way to demonstrate that growth and maturity. Unfortunately I don't think there's any amount of ECs I can do as a civilian to fully demonstrate this change but I'm deadest on trying my hardest!

I guess the card up my sleeve is that one of the docs I'm shadowing and have known for 6 years trains fellows at USF. Hopefully this connection will just allow my app to get a closer look and not get tossed aside solely because of my GPA. From what I've read, USF is already pretty good about this anyways.
Well I think earning good grades now, as well as shadowing and other healthcare-related EC's are a good way to start. I don't know if your connection will be helpful but I certainly don't think it will hurt. I would hesitate to rely on it solely though.

From what it seems like on here you have a good attitude. Keep up the shadowing, keep improving those grades and invest your time heavily into preparing for the MCAT. Do well on it and I think you will have a pretty good chance.

I wish you the best of luck.
 
Wow Tipsy, sounds like we have a pretty similar situation. After I left school I moved across the country and found myself in an Army recruiting office. Health issues kept me from enlisting but over the next six years I was forced to reconcile with my past and make some important decisions and grow up. Like you stated, this process is now instrumental to my current and future successes. At this point, I'm just glad I failed out when I didn't do any further damage to my GPA. Its incredible how a little perspective can radically shape your attitude in school. I'm rambling so I'll stop by saying thanks again for your service to our country and for your story. Success stories from similar situations are awesome to hear.

Like you said, I'm going to be attacking the MCAT as if my livelihood depends on it, cause in a sense it does. And by no means am I relying solely on my connection as an in. Figure it can't hurt but I'd rather depend on myself to get myself looked at than placing it in the hands of someone else.

Congrats again on your admission to school.
 
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