Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
So I worked at a dental office for 3 months full time volunteer/internship

doing both backoffice/front office work and towards the end I did a lot chair assisting

it started out with sterilization of equipment, then the room, gradually into cleanings, cavities, crowns, root canal assisting to the point where I was helping out in hour long intensive procedures by holding the suction tube

the dentist I shadowed loved me, told me to write my own LOR and he would submit it

however, there was work drama going on at the time, the receptionist/biller/HR consisted of two sisters who were young (my age) 22-25 years old and acted inappropriately most of the time and didn't like how much praise I was receiving from the dentist. they would often fight in front of patients and often tell the dentist "you don't pay enough to do this etc" while I would do everything they thought they were too good for

time comes for my LOR and I submit the one I wrote to the dentist who told me to write anything as I was the best intern/volunteer he's ever had, he told the receptionist/biller/HR to do the necessary steps to submit the document through interfolio for me and she DELETED HALF OF MY LETTER and rewrote some passages to make it sound mediocre and general.

What do I do about this? I had 2 pre dec interviews, I just found out about it today as I asked if I could see the letter she submitted for me to apply for some jobs

the dentist Iworked for/shadowed has no idea this happened, he often reminded me when I was no longer working there to write the letter and tell him deadlines without me asking, I am his favorite intern and we still keep in touch, their whole dental team is invited to my upcoming wedding.
 
Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
That is some ****ty situation. Do you believe this has negatively affected your interview opportunities or the interviews you attended?

Personally if it was me I'd be pissed as all ****, but I don't think making a scene is going to accomplish you anything. I'd take the dentist aside and let him know privately what happened and I sure as hell would uninvite that bitch from my wedding. She may not have realized what she did but that's really inexcusable and I think you have every right to let the dentist know.

Sometimes you just have to put that mark in the sand.
 

y3nd0

Kitteh likes to stare
5+ Year Member
Mar 28, 2012
644
320
Status
Dental Student
How do you know it has been changed? You listed it as a nonconfidential letter?

Why don't you just tell your dentist? Tell him that you believe the letter has been changed and for him to check the letter on interfolio. You have an original copy, and hopefully he read it before he signed it.
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
That is some ****** situation. Do you believe this has negatively affected your interview opportunities or the interviews you attended?

Personally if it was me I'd be pissed as all ****, but I don't think making a scene is going to accomplish you anything. I'd take the dentist aside and let him know privately what happened and I sure as hell would uninvite that bitch from my wedding. She may not have realized what she did but that's really inexcusable and I think you have every right to let the dentist know.

Sometimes you just have to put that mark in the sand.
I dont really know what to do. The dentist keeps in touch with me, asks me about my wedding, the back office staff, hygienist and dental assistants invite me out for drinks and such. We really got a long. Its the front office that did this to me. I have no idea what to do. I haven't gotten any offers, just silence from schools I've interviewed at. My other letters are very strong.

I'm thinking of telling him to resubmit and going to his office and helping him through the process so that the front office has no part in it at all. The letter still recommends me, but not at all how I wanted it to.
 
Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
I dont really know what to do. The dentist keeps in touch with me, asks me about my wedding, the back office staff, hygienist and dental assistants invite me out for drinks and such. We really got a long. Its the front office that did this to me. I have no idea what to do. I haven't gotten any offers, just silence from schools I've interviewed at. My other letters are very strong.

I'm thinking of telling him to resubmit and going to his office and helping him through the process so that the front office has no part in it at all. The letter still recommends me, but not at all how I wanted it to.
Honestly at this point I don't know if it would help you any but it can't hurt to try. It may or may not have been the straw that broke the camel's back when it came to your application. It's certainly not something you can let the schools know. Writing your own LoR is a big no no even though it does happen.

At this point you're just stamping out fires, but to be honest I seriously would not want people like that at my wedding no matter how "rude" it may be to uninvite them.
 
Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
If you don't end up getting any offers. I'd say definitely call the schools you interviewed at and see what went wrong and then just make your app that much stronger for the next cycle. It sucks but I don't really see any other options.
 

y3nd0

Kitteh likes to stare
5+ Year Member
Mar 28, 2012
644
320
Status
Dental Student
I dont really know what to do. The dentist keeps in touch with me, asks me about my wedding, the back office staff, hygienist and dental assistants invite me out for drinks and such. We really got a long. Its the front office that did this to me. I have no idea what to do. I haven't gotten any offers, just silence from schools I've interviewed at. My other letters are very strong.

I'm thinking of telling him to resubmit and going to his office and helping him through the process so that the front office has no part in it at all. The letter still recommends me, but not at all how I wanted it to.
You need to tell him. This girl(s), if what you say is true, has done something dishonest. You can't have such a person working in a dental office where they are dealing with others' privacy.
 
Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
I can tell you what my full blooded Irish mother would have done if they had done that to her. She'd have cussed them out so bad they wouldn't know which way was up, and if it was me well :diebanana:
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
How do you know it has been changed? You listed it as a nonconfidential letter?

Why don't you just tell your dentist? Tell him that you believe the letter has been changed and for him to check the letter on interfolio. You have an original copy, and hopefully he read it before he signed it.
I asked the receptionist/HR/biller to send me the letter that she sent in cause I want to use the one they have with the official letter head for my upcoming job prospects, I have to upload the letter in and I didn't have it as it was confidential. So I asked her for it and she sent me this mediocre/general LOR that I didn't write, it had maybe 2 sentences and most of what I wrote was erased/deleted.
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
I think if it happens where I have to apply next cycle. I am still volunteering for that dentist on occasion, so I have more shadowing hours, I will make sure he submits the letter himself instead of having his HR/receptionist do it as I would be there having lunch with him during one of my volunteer days
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
You need to tell him. This girl(s), if what you say is true, has done something dishonest. You can't have such a person working in a dental office where they are dealing with others' privacy.
I understand the need to tell him

and I will but not right away, I think when we talk next about how I didn't get acceptances yet and I might need to apply again, he will again tell me to write another LOR, a better one, or what not and I will show him the one that I received from his office and ask him to alter it instead of me writing it and submitting it to him just for him to pass it along to HR to do.
 

ModifiedBass

5+ Year Member
Jul 1, 2013
519
218
Status
Dentist
I really don't understand your rationale for not inquiring about this with your dentist. If you're as sure as you say you are about this situation and it means that much to you, then I see that as the only way of going about making a difference/getting any closure on it.
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
I really don't understand your rationale for not inquiring about this with your dentist. If you're as sure as you say you are about this situation and it means that much to you, then I see that as the only way of going about making a difference/getting any closure on it.
I don't know why either, but I feel powerless? I don't want to be confrontational? These girls have no tact and will cause a fight/scene for the littlest of reasons. I'm a volunteer/intern on occasion now, this isn't my livelihood, causing problems for their source of income even though they started it doesn't sound...I don't know, it could get nasty... And it HAS in front of PATIENTS when they argue with their own boss for other reasons not related to me

I'd much rather go volunteer/spend the time at a different dental office and get different LORs if this keeps up.
 

tbond5

Enrolled
Jul 8, 2013
503
85
Seattle, WA
Status
Pre-Dental
I don't know why either, but I feel powerless? I don't want to be confrontational? These girls have no tact and will cause a fight/scene for the littlest of reasons. I'm a volunteer/intern on occasion now, this isn't my livelihood, causing problems for their source of income even though they started it doesn't sound...I don't know, it could get nasty... And it HAS in front of PATIENTS when they argue with their own boss for other reasons not related to me

I'd much rather go volunteer/spend the time at a different dental office and get different LORs if this keeps up.
If I was their boss and they fought with me in front of patients and it happened again they'd be fired so fast.
 
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Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
If I was their boss and they fought with me in front of patients and it happened again they'd be fired so fast.
:thumbup: + that it presents an unprofessional work environment and just causes unneeded stress.
 
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tbond5

Enrolled
Jul 8, 2013
503
85
Seattle, WA
Status
Pre-Dental
I realize sometimes employees might have issues with how a dentist runs the practice or whatever but when crap like that happens they just need to go. As bad as it sounds you can always get a replacement dental assistant. I'm a nice guy but you screw with the culture of my practice then we've got a problem.

I hope everything works out for you bro. If it were me I'd talk to the dentist ASAP because if he likes you as much as he says he'll do what he can to remedy the situation and hopefully get you one of those coveted acceptances.
 

ramborhino

5+ Year Member
Mar 22, 2013
158
53
Status
OP - I'm sorry about your situation but it doesn't sound like this dentist is as supportive or caring as you may believe. Basically he refuses to spend ~30 minutes writing a letter for you AND puts you in an ethical quandary by having you write your own letter. I would have far more respect for the individual if they just said "no". Honestly ask yourself: would a person who really has your best interests at heart do this to you? The people who really support you will not hesitate in writing a letter for you and will go above and beyond what you've asked for. Even if this guy did write the letter, I don't think you'd want his. Find another dentist, be up-front about your intent to request a LOR, shadow for 10-30 hours, score a letter. I think this is just as much this dentist's fault as it is these other staff members. His actions (or lack of) speak much louder than his words.
 
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OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
I realize sometimes employees might have issues with how a dentist runs the practice or whatever but when crap like that happens they just need to go. As bad as it sounds you can always get a replacement dental assistant. I'm a nice guy but you screw with the culture of my practice then we've got a problem.

I hope everything works out for you bro. If it were me I'd talk to the dentist ASAP because if he likes you as much as he says he'll do what he can to remedy the situation and hopefully get you one of those coveted acceptances.
I think nothing can be done now as I learned too late in the cycle for me to "update" my LORs you know?

I will talk to him after the holidays and show him what his receptionist sent me and ask him for a more specific letter with more details of what I did there, and see what happens

If not I can always shadow other dentists. Where I worked, the other dentist at the same practice wrote me a better letter than the chopped up version the receptionist sent in (he sent it to me and showed it to me) however because of the 4 letter limit, I naively used the one I thought would be better as the other DDS let me write it
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
OP - I'm sorry about your situation but it doesn't sound like this dentist is as supportive or caring as you may believe. Basically he refuses to spend ~30 minutes writing a letter for you AND puts you in an ethical quandary by having you write your own letter. I would have far more respect for the individual if they just said "no". Honestly ask yourself: would a person who really has your best interests at heart do this to you? The people who really support you will not hesitate in writing a letter for you and will go above and beyond what you've asked for. Even if this guy did write the letter, I don't think you'd want his. Find another dentist, be up-front about your intent to request a LOR, shadow for 10-30 hours, score a letter. I think this is just as much this dentist's fault as it is these other staff members. His actions (or lack of) speak much louder than his words.
I am going to see if he will write one himself as it is very important to me that I get one from him. I spent 500+ hours at his practice and he knows me the best. However, seeing as I might not get in this year, plenty of time to update my LORs for dentists who will spend the time and effort to do these things for me themselves after I spent so much of my time helping out for free.

There's always more time to shadow others and get other letters.
 

cooliyak

Established Member
5+ Year Member
Dec 9, 2012
677
644
Colorado
Status
Dentist
I don't know why either, but I feel powerless? I don't want to be confrontational? These girls have no tact and will cause a fight/scene for the littlest of reasons. I'm a volunteer/intern on occasion now, this isn't my livelihood, causing problems for their source of income even though they started it doesn't sound...I don't know, it could get nasty... And it HAS in front of PATIENTS when they argue with their own boss for other reasons not related to me

I'd much rather go volunteer/spend the time at a different dental office and get different LORs if this keeps up.
I would say that volunteering/spending time at a different dental office and getting a different LOR is probably a good idea... not only because you can't really trust this office to upload a letter correctly, but also because writing your own LOR is completely dishonest. I don't really know what's worse- her dishonesty in altering your letter, or your dishonesty in writing your own letter in the first place.
I don't completely blame you for doing it... it is definitely tempting and you may not or may not have known that it was wrong, but I would take this as a learning experience for next time.
Also, as upsetting as it is, I don't think one letter would make too much of a difference. Yeah, your letters can have a big impact, but if the rest of your application was where it should be, then your schools would have made the same decision regardless.
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
I thought it would be so great to be able to recommend myself at the time but now I realize I'd rather have a confidential letter in the first place so that whatever I get is what I get.

That's why letters of rec are supposed to be confidential ure supposed to trust people to recommend you without you knowing
 

cooliyak

Established Member
5+ Year Member
Dec 9, 2012
677
644
Colorado
Status
Dentist
I thought it would be so great to be able to recommend myself at the time but now I realize I'd rather have a confidential letter in the first place so that whatever I get is what I get.

That's why letters of rec are supposed to be confidential ure supposed to trust people to recommend you without you knowing
Very true. I am sorry that this happened to you. But like what others were saying, I would confront the dentist as well as the receptionist that did that to you. There is no excuse for what happened. I am not the type of person to let people get away with things like that.
 

wb1

Aug 5, 2012
276
31
This is really sad and I am really sorry to hear that.

Ask him to write an update version of the letter and resubmit (provide envelopes) send to ADEA and schools directly. Have your ID, and all the info.

Ask him to mail them? You don't have to read it, but help him put it in the envelope?
 

Faux

5+ Year Member
Jan 26, 2013
1,897
1,460
Status
Dental Student
Blows my mind that you're waiting to tell him. Have to be a bit more hands on. This is your life we're talking about.
 

y3nd0

Kitteh likes to stare
5+ Year Member
Mar 28, 2012
644
320
Status
Dental Student
This is really sad and I am really sorry to hear that.

Ask him to write an update version of the letter and resubmit (provide envelopes) send to ADEA and schools directly. Have your ID, and all the info.

Ask him to mail them? You don't have to read it, but help him put it in the envelope?
Would he even do that? He made her write her own letter and had someone else upload it for him. He seems like he really wants to be hands off about this whole thing.
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
Blows my mind that you're waiting to tell him. Have to be a bit more hands on. This is your life we're talking about.
It just feels off putting to have to go through with this. I think I'd rather start over. The only thing I can control/change is myself. But this office whether its the dentist thats too laxed about my LOR or the receptionists who are trying to toy with me, that's enough for me to realize I shouldn't continue on this path and associate with them any longer. I should put myself into a better position and try harder for better letters of rec with different dentists and staff. They are going to do what they are going to do. I can't make them do anything and its only making my life harder and it kind of taints my time/experience with them if I do have this conversation with them.

They are going to be at my wedding, and my friendships with the back office staff might suffer as well. There's been many things these girls have done that they should have been fired for, for example telling patients about their personal life or how their husband beats them etc is not appropriate, but they are like family to him so they aren't going anywhere.
 

wb1

Aug 5, 2012
276
31
Would he even do that? He made her write her own letter and had someone else upload it for him. He seems like he really wants to be hands off about this whole thing.
Close your eyes and put the letters in the envelopes. The dentists were suppose to write their own.
It just feels off putting to have to go through with this. I think I'd rather start over. The only thing I can control/change is myself. But this office whether its the dentist thats too laxed about my LOR or the receptionists who are trying to toy with me, that's enough for me to realize I shouldn't continue on this path and associate with them any longer. I should put myself into a better position and try harder for better letters of rec with different dentists and staff. They are going to do what they are going to do. I can't make them do anything and its only making my life harder and it kind of taints my time/experience with them if I do have this conversation with them.

They are going to be at my wedding, and my friendships with the back office staff might suffer as well. There's been many things these girls have done that they should have been fired for, for example telling patients about their personal life or how their husband beats them etc is not appropriate, but they are like family to him so they aren't going anywhere.
Salvage what you can. You paid the application fees (primary and secondary)..therefore sending updated LOR will only cost you some air and a few envelopes with stamps.

You can ensure he signs and help him put the LORs in the envelopes.

Applying next cycle will cost you a year and more $$$$.

I would probably just say 'fckit' to them if you already got a seat somewhere. Otherwise, salvage what you can!
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
Close your eyes and put the letters in the envelopes. The dentists were suppose to write their own.


Salvage what you can. You paid the application fees (primary and secondary)..therefore sending updated LOR will only cost you some air and a few envelopes with stamps.

You can ensure he signs and help him put in the envelope.

Applying next cycle will cost you a year and more $$$$.

I would probably just say 'fckit' to them if you already got a seat somewhere. Otherwise, salvage what you can!
My other letters from my 2 sci professors are very strong (I hope, as I question everything now) and they don't have personal assistants to upload them etc given what they told me is true. So I have 2 from sci professors, 1 that I took 2 classes with, gave 2 presentations (volunteered to) and attended every office hours, aced both courses. The other, after the course, I volunteered at his lab for a year. I still keep in touch with both of my professors and tell them about my progress, and they are willing to alter my letters for me for any postbac/masters program once its established that this cycle is completely out of my hands.

I also used a letter from a boss I worked for for 7+ years as a clerical assistant and I have no reason to question her letter, she was sad to see me leave, the office bought me gift cards/cake when I graduated. The only mediocre letter is the one from the dentist that I dedicated a lot of time towards. It's disappointing but what can you do. the letters were supposed to be confidential in the first place, I shouldn't have known she altered them but I asked if I could have it to recommend me for some job to do that required for me to upload a letter and got his permission, she sent me that. He has been hands off about it. Hard lesson learned.
 
Jun 5, 2013
300
84
Michigan
Status
Dental Student
1. like ramborhino said, if he really cared about you he would of wrote the letter himself, he was just too lazy in my opinion and who knows maybe the stuff he had to say about you would of been better than the stuff you had to say about yourself.
2. Knowing how the front desk is and how jealous they were of you receiving praise you shouldn't of let them submit the letter or even get their hands on it. If I were you i would of told the dentist that you weren't comfortable with having anyone know that you wrote the letter yourself or even have them get their hands on it and that you would rather have him submit it. It's not like you are asking me to do something crazy, it would of taken him literally less than 5 minutes to submit it himself or you could of spent a few minutes with the dentist submitting it together.
3. Now that the front desk knows you wrote the letter who knows they might of even emailed the school and told them you wrote it. People that are sneaky and jealous are capable of everything.
4. I am sorry but i don't think you should of posted on this forum that you wrote the letter because schools take this stuff seriously and many schools monitor this forum and maybe they could find out who you are by asking SDN for your email. There's not much we can do to help you because what was done was done and the only advice you're going to keep getting is to tell the dentist, it's not like you can call the schools and tell them " hey by the way i wrote the letter and it was sabotaged, let me send you my version, it WAAAY better i guarantee you'll want to accept me"

I am really sorry to hear what happened to you, i hope karma gets her back one day because at the end of the day it's your future. I hope it all works out for you and you get accepted this cycle, best of luck :)
 

Ferneezy

I don't always Go Blue, but when I do...
5+ Year Member
Jun 19, 2009
1,136
549
Status
Dental Student
writing your own LOR is completely dishonest. I don't really know what's worse- her dishonesty in altering your letter, or your dishonesty in writing your own letter in the first place.
how's the air up there?

i'm certain plenty of candidates draft their own letters before dentists and professors edit them to match their own voice and writing rhythm. at the end of the day, if they are putting their name on the document and endorsing the content within, where's the dishonesty?

i wrote three of my four lors, so remember: i'm not only the LOR Club President, but i'm also a client.
 
Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
I'd honestly be interested in knowing the OP's stats now, and when he submitted to possibly see if this had as much of an effect as he thinks it did.
 
Aug 21, 2013
73
45
Mount Doom
Status
Dental Student
1. like ramborhino said, if he really cared about you he would of wrote the letter himself, he was just too lazy in my opinion and who knows maybe the stuff he had to say about you would of been better than the stuff you had to say about yourself.
2. Knowing how the front desk is and how jealous they were of you receiving praise you shouldn't of let them submit the letter or even get their hands on it. If I were you i would of told the dentist that you weren't comfortable with having anyone know that you wrote the letter yourself or even have them get their hands on it and that you would rather have him submit it. It's not like you are asking me to do something crazy, it would of taken him literally less than 5 minutes to submit it himself or you could of spent a few minutes with the dentist submitting it together.
3. Now that the front desk knows you wrote the letter who knows they might of even emailed the school and told them you wrote it. People that are sneaky and jealous are capable of everything.
4. I am sorry but i don't think you should of posted on this forum that you wrote the letter because schools take this stuff seriously and many schools monitor this forum and maybe they could find out who you are by asking SDN for your email. There's not much we can do to help you because what was done was done and the only advice you're going to keep getting is to tell the dentist, it's not like you can call the schools and tell them " hey by the way i wrote the letter and it was sabotaged, let me send you my version, it WAAAY better i guarantee you'll want to accept me"

I am really sorry to hear what happened to you, i hope karma gets her back one day because at the end of the day it's your future. I hope it all works out for you and you get accepted this cycle, best of luck :)
The schools don't monitor these threads and they wouldn't go through the trouble of asking SDN for his email besides the fact that it breaks confidentiality if they were to give it to him. While I agree it isn't exactly honest to write your own letters. I'd place that blame solely on the Dentist in question. He should have known better, and I don't know about you but it can be intimidating telling someone who has given you the time and opportunity in your office that you think he is wrong and should do something differently.

To the OP: on continuing to use this dentist as a LoR. As you said you put a significant amount of time and effort creating a relationship with him and some of his staff, but also it's not a good idea to put yourself in a postion where you are surround with toxic people such as that. Believe me it can bring you down. I personally would not continue to rely on someone like that till some of his staff was let go and since you said it's like a "family" atmosphere (a business is a business not a family) that seems unlikely. I would move on down the road there are many Dentist out there to shadow and learn from and you may even be able to get an assisting job out of it.
 

doc toothache

10+ Year Member
Jan 17, 2006
8,150
2,287
Status
Dentist
1. It is possible that the dentist made the changes rather than you archenemies, as you suggest.
2. It smacks a little odd that you are on such good terms with the protagonist, yet are unable to obtain a copy of the submitted document.
3. A little too much drama over an LOR, which is unlikely to have had the impact on your application that you believe it did.
4. Why not move on to the next topic, which is finding out why your application was overlooked and what you can do to improve it?
 
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OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
1. It is possible that the dentist made the changes rather than you archenemies, as you suggest.
2. It smacks a little odd that you are on such good terms with the protagonist, yet are unable to obtain a copy of the submitted document.
3. A little too much drama over an LOR, which is unlikely to have had the impact on your application that you believe it did.
4. Why not move on to the next topic, which is finding out why your application was overlooked and what you can do to improve it?
I did get the original copy submitted from the receptionist.

I don't think it affected my application that much, but it was a major disappointment to get that kind of letter after all the free work I gave them. And because he often doesn't handle his own email, he treats the front office like his personal assistants, he doesn't know what they did.

People have called the office for the jobs that I've applied to and he has given them great feedback as my professional reference so why would he change my letter if he is praising me to strangers when they call?

It's just disappointing to find out like this this late in the cycle. If I knew ahead of time before I spent my time there that he wasn't going to be hands on in the LOR process as well as having his receptionist submit through his email account I would have spent my time elsewhere and volunteered at a different office you know? I worked full time there and covered for many people as I kind of floated around for whichever role I should fill for the day whether it was dental assisting or receptionist/consultation making charts. Heck I even did janitorial duties and shopping duties, ordering supplies and such. Again, I don't think it affected my application as there were other things I should improve, (dat scores, gpa etc) but seeing this version made me feel like it was a waste of time because of the dynamics of this particular office.

I got a different letter from a different dentist and its definitely better than the one I submitted, so next application cycle if I have to go through this again, I will try for better letters if I have the time or submit the better letter.
 
Aug 7, 2011
515
65
Status
On one of my letters sent to NYU, the professor started the letter with name but then continued with "Jonathan" (not my name) until the last sentence where he used my name again. Obviously it was a generic letter but it didn't make a difference on my interview or my acceptance. Wasn't brought up at all.
 
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doc toothache

10+ Year Member
Jan 17, 2006
8,150
2,287
Status
Dentist
What you are saying is that you "paid" for a superlative letter that you wrote, but got a generic instead.
 

Daneosaurus

D4
7+ Year Member
Mar 13, 2012
1,941
1,449
Status
Dental Student
That is some ****** situation. Do you believe this has negatively affected your interview opportunities or the interviews you attended?

Personally if it was me I'd be pissed as all ****, but I don't think making a scene is going to accomplish you anything. I'd take the dentist aside and let him know privately what happened and I sure as hell would uninvite that bitch from my wedding. She may not have realized what she did but that's really inexcusable and I think you have every right to let the dentist know.

Sometimes you just have to put that mark in the sand.
I would like to echo this. What a vindictive b****.
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
What you are saying is that you "paid" for a superlative letter that you wrote, but got a generic instead.
paid with my time, effort, dedication, hard work yes

I didn't anticipate him telling me to write my own, and even If I didn't get the opportunity to write it myself, I felt like I deserved a letter written by him for me.
He signed it, it has the official letter head, when people call he still recommends me but the actual letter isn't even written by him, it was written by his staff/me and he just signed off on it.
 

doc toothache

10+ Year Member
Jan 17, 2006
8,150
2,287
Status
Dentist
1. No office wants/deserves all of the drama you exemplify. (The next go round, he/she might have to re think allowing someone to shadow/volunteer in his/her office.)
2. Shadowing does not come with a quid pro quo.
3. Maybe in this case you got what you paid for.
4. Great janitorial work does not necessarily translate to a great dentist.
5. Irrespective of who wrote the letter, once sent, he/she becomes the sole author.
6. Can we give this puppy some rest?
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/shadowing-the-seven-stages.792000/
 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
1. No office wants/deserves all of the drama you exemplify. (The next go round, he/she might have to re think allowing someone to shadow/volunteer in his/her office.)
2. Shadowing does not come with a quid pro quo.
3. Maybe in this case you got what you paid for.
4. Great janitorial work does not necessarily translate to a great dentist.
5. Irrespective of who wrote the letter, once sent, he/she becomes the sole author.
6. Can we give this puppy some rest?
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/threads/shadowing-the-seven-stages.792000/
I have not said anything to the office or brought anything up to the staff. I appreciate your input but what you are saying is extremely harsh when you don't know who I am. The drama at the office is not related to me but has everything to do with the front office staff.

number 2/3

yes it doesn't come with a quid pro quo, why am I still a little miffed? I STILL volunteer at this office, they call me when a dental assistant takes the day off or receptionist isn't there, and they don't pay me. I can admit that this is my fault for being taken advantage of, as I don't NEED hundreds of more hours for my application but I expected a little bit of reciprocation and honesty in the form of a professional reference and or letter. If he had never intended to write one after using me in these circumstances where he actually needed me, then he should HIRE MORE DENTAL ASSISTANTS and STAFF.

as for number 4, I basically did EVERYTHING he asked me to do which included janitorial duties, I didn't say I was a janitor for a dental office, I said I volunteered and did chair assisting plus front office work as well.
 

cooliyak

Established Member
5+ Year Member
Dec 9, 2012
677
644
Colorado
Status
Dentist
how's the air up there?

i'm certain plenty of candidates draft their own letters before dentists and professors edit them to match their own voice and writing rhythm. at the end of the day, if they are putting their name on the document and endorsing the content within, where's the dishonesty?

i wrote three of my four lors, so remember: i'm not only the LOR Club President, but i'm also a client.
The air up here is fine. A little thin seeing as I am in Colorado, but thanks for asking.

The dishonesty comes because there is a reason the letters are confidential. The schools want to know what the professors and dentists honestly think about the candidate, not what the candidate thinks of themselves but turns in with the dentist's signature on it. If admissions committees were to find out that someone did that, they would probably throw out the application or at the very least confront them about it during an interview. They are looking for honest people to uphold the integrity of the profession, not someone who can justify a wrongdoing because "plenty of candidates" do it. gymbee2013 even recognized that it was dishonest after it was pointed out. I hope you can come to the same conclusion.

 
OP
gymbee2013
Nov 15, 2013
77
13
Status
Pre-Dental
honestly, I don't care about this anymore.

In the end, I only have myself to blame. Should have been smart enough to realize I wasn't going to get anything good out of my time/effort there when they told me to write it myself and he will have his assistant submit it for me.

I will just volunteer elsewhere and look for more reputable places that aren't "family run" as its not my cup of tea.
How do I close this thread? I am going to do it now.
 
Feb 25, 2012
508
111
Status
Dental Student
Rather than all this speculating, you could just sit down with the dentist 1-on-1 and figure out what exactly happened. It'd remove a lot of the guesswork, address the issue, and probably find a satisfactory resolution to this situation. Do it diplomatically, show him the letter that was sent versus the original letter, and figure out what happened. At this point, you have nothing to lose, especially since it seems you've already resigned yourself to reapplying and shadowing elsewhere.