Should I apply to DO schools if I have very little interest in OMM?

[deleted941029]

I hear all these stories about how OMM takes up time you could be studying for other subjects and being the type of person I am, I need all the time I can get to study.

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[DO2015CA]

I hear all these stories about how OMM takes up time you could be studying for other subjects and being the type of person I am, I need all the time I can get to study.

Do you want to be a physician but can’t get into a MD program?

 

[Faha]

What are your cGPA, sGPA, MCAT and EC's ?

 

[deleted941029]

Do you want to be a physician but can’t get into a MD program?

What are your cGPA, sGPA, MCAT and EC's ?

I was thinking of applying either MD/DO or MD/DPM. My cGPA and sGPA are 3.9+. MCAT score coming in a month but expecting 508+ (was scoring 517 average on AAMC FL 1-3 but I'm just being conservative here).
ECs: hospice, youth basketball coaching at local rec center and in a program with at-risk youth, tutoring homeless kids, research(1 pub but wasn't my project and got some grant money for my project from the undergraduate research program which a lot of science majors get), tutor for Gen chem and phsyiology

 

[mc29012]

If you get 510+ I would say that you should not consider DO programs if you have no interest in OMM/DO philosophy. You will easily get MD II's if you have no major red flags, save those DO interview spots for the applicants who don't have MD stats or want to apply to DO programs because they do want to learn OMM/believe in the philosophy.

 

[Goro]

I hear all these stories about how OMM takes up time you could be studying for other subjects and being the type of person I am, I need all the time I can get to study.

If your only chance to be a doctor is to have to deal with OMM classes, what will you do?

 

[DO2015CA]

I was thinking of applying either MD/DO or MD/DPM. My cGPA and sGPA are 3.9+. MCAT score coming in a month but expecting 508+ (was scoring 517 average on AAMC FL 1-3 but I'm just being conservative here).
ECs: hospice, youth basketball coaching at local rec center and in a program with at-risk youth, tutoring homeless kids, research(1 pub but wasn't my project and got some grant money for my project from the undergraduate research program which a lot of science majors get), tutor for Gen chem and phsyiology

Should be fine for MD if the score comes out what you are expecting. Uhh DPM will allow for guaranteed surgical specialty so if you are surgery or bust then ya DPM is an option. If you are okay in other areas of medicine then I would recommend DO>DPM

 

[deleted941029]

Should be fine for MD if the score comes out what you are expecting. Uhh DPM will allow for guaranteed surgical specialty so if you are surgery or bust then ya DPM is an option. If you are okay in other areas of medicine then I would recommend DO>DPM

What do you think are the drawbacks of DPM that makes DO>DPM? I'm not really surgery or bust but from what I've read podiatry seems to be a pretty cool/diverse field that helps a lot of people which is why I'm considering it.

 

[DO2015CA]

What do you think are the drawbacks of DPM that makes DO>DPM?

You are restricted to one area of the body right off the bat and earning potential. There used to be a DPM residency crunch but sounds like it has be resolved.

 

[Faha]

Post your MCAT score here when available. You may not need to apply to DO schools.

 

[Magus5454]

I hear all these stories about how OMM takes up time you could be studying for other subjects and being the type of person I am, I need all the time I can get to study.

Here's my take on OMM, I go to lab, I do it, I put it off till the competency as my basic science courses take up much more time. Even the dean at a Dean's hour stated they know we punt OMM.

 

[Goro]

Here's my take on OMM, I go to lab, I do it, I put it off till the competency as my basic science courses take up much more time. Even the dean at a Dean's hour stated they know we punt OMM.

I remind all DO students that OMM is the tax they have to pay for screwing up their GPAs and/or MCATs. Just suspend your disbelief and try to learn something useful.

 

[bears1992]

I’m in a DO program right now. OMM feels a little out of place, almost like I’m at a physical therapy school when I’m in lab but it’s one of the easier classes. If you can’t get into an MD school, adding OMM to your course list isn’t really that big a deal when you’re looking at the big picture. If another year of postbac would have gotten me into MD, id still stick with the program I’m in. For me, the only reason to take an extra year(s) for MD would be if you want a competitive speciality. Avoiding OMM isn’t worth taking a gap year or going carribean. If you have the choice between MD and DO, it’s a no brainer.

 

[Medic741]

I hear all these stories about how OMM takes up time you could be studying for other subjects and being the type of person I am, I need all the time I can get to study.

Most of us who attend don’t either

 

[Mr. Babe]

Most people in my class don't care for OMM. I like some of the techniques, but most of them annoy the hell out of me. The worst thing on this planet is cranial manipulative medicine.......it's a massive wives tale because nothing actually gets fixed. CRI is a real thing, but everything else is a joke.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

You are restricted to one area of the body right off the bat and earning potential. There used to be a DPM residency crunch but sounds like it has be resolved.

Disagree with the DPM earning potential. My friend is a country DPM, gets paid the same as ortho for same procedures on foot and ankle. VERY successful. DPMs suffer from same bias as DOs is the downside. If you are making bank, who cares about the bias?

 

[alprazoslam]

You only have to (fake) like it for 10 minutes during your interview. Otherwise lol don’t go do unless no md

 

[alprazoslam]

I remind all DO students that OMM is the tax they have to pay for screwing up their GPAs and/or MCATs. Just suspend your disbelief and try to learn something useful.

Thy crown requireith a a penal sacrifice for butchering thy mcat

 

[alprazoslam]

Here's my take on OMM, I go to lab, I do it, I put it off till the competency as my basic science courses take up much more time. Even the dean at a Dean's hour stated they know we punt OMM.

We all punt OMM some of us just punt on first down


Honestly OMM has its us in helping the rest of the class pick out the tools. . Those who get a hardon for it are usually the most obnoxious people in the class and just hook onto it because they suck at everything else and want to feel superior to everyone. Just hope you don’t get them as a lab partner they want to teach you all the “new things they came up with”



Barf

 

[DO2015CA]

Disagree with the DPM earning potential. My friend is a country DPM, gets paid the same as ortho for same procedures on foot and ankle. VERY successful. DPMs suffer from same bias as DOs is the downside. If you are making bank, who cares about the bias?

You are just making the rural medicine argument that we all can make about any specialty. But the truth is most people don’t want to live rurally. There is a reason the listed salary average is ~120k

 

[deleted941029]

Anybody have other thoughts on taking the DPM route?

 

[Moose A Moose]

Anybody have other thoughts on taking the DPM route?

Yeah. Unless you want to be a podiatrist you will regret your decision.

 

[DO2015CA]

Anybody have other thoughts on taking the DPM route?

Do it if you don’t get into MD and want a guaranteed surgical specialty. Lots of diabetic feet though. Which are the bane of my existence.

 

[deleted941029]

Yeah. Unless you want to be a podiatrist you will regret your decision.

Why is that?

 

[Shammyguy3]

Most people in my class don't care for OMM. I like some of the techniques, but most of them annoy the hell out of me. The worst thing on this planet is cranial manipulative medicine.......it's a massive wives tale because nothing actually gets fixed. CRI is a real thing, but everything else is a joke.

An OMSII at a recent interview was a big fan of cranial.... i laughed inside

 

[DO2015CA]

An OMSII at a recent interview was a big fan of cranial.... i laughed inside

Most schools teach it the beginning of OMS 2 spring semester so they might be just caught up in it. Or if it was early then they haven’t actually seen the **** show and are drinking koolaid

 

[Shammyguy3]

Most schools teach it the beginning of OMS 2 spring semester so they might be just caught up in it. Or if it was early then they haven’t actually seen the **** show and are drinking koolaid

The interview was this month so who knows

 

[Angus Avagadro]

You are just making the rural medicine argument that we all can make about any specialty. But the truth is most people don’t want to live rurally. There is a reason the listed salary average is ~120k

Salary.com lists avg DPM salary from 165 to 265 K, but I get your point. Said differently, there is a price to pay for working in a physician dense area. He lives 30 min from a D 1 University, an hour from an intl airport, and hour from a major city with prof sports. Not so rural, I'd say he makes 4 to 5 times the avg you quoted. But, I get that many people might not want to live in Nebraska or S Dakota. I always counsel residents to decide WHERE in the country you want to live, then HOW do you want to live. If you want to live in San Diego, you might not be able to afford a house, maybe only a condo. If you or your spouse want to live big, go where the money is.
Life is full of choices.

 

[DO2015CA]

Salary.com lists avg DPM salary from 165 to 265 K, but I get your point. Said differently, there is a price to pay for working in a physician dense area. He lives 30 min from a D 1 University, an hour from an intl airport, and hour from a major city with prof sports. Not so rural, I'd say he makes 4 to 5 times the avg you quoted. But, I get that many people might not want to live in Nebraska or S Dakota. I always counsel residents to decide WHERE in the country you want to live, then HOW do you want to live. If you want to live in San Diego, you might not be able to afford a house, maybe only a condo. If you or your spouse want to live big, go where the money is.
Life is full of choices.

Well said. 120 was a website that was probably dated. 165k would be worth it if pc was something you dreaded. 40k for career fulfillment is def worth it.

 

[Norwood-Sano]

I hear all these stories about how OMM takes up time you could be studying for other subjects and being the type of person I am, I need all the time I can get to study.

The best way to rationalize this is knowing that you will learn to palpate very well and will get some more hands on anatomy training.

 

[NTT123]

Anybody have other thoughts on taking the DPM route?

Just as Angus mentioned, there is bias and stigma towards to Non-MD physicians.

DPMs suffer from same bias as DOs is the downside.

However, there are still many DPMs who are making great living and very successful.

I will list a few examples.

There is a DPM as Chief of Medical Officer in top 10 Non- profit health System.
Ex: Advocate Aurora Health Care.

There is a Chief of Medical Officers in their hospital is DPM
Ex:
Broadlawns Medical Center, IA.
Valley Baptist Medical Center, TX.

There is a Chief of Medical Staff who is a DPM.
Ex:
Dekalb Medical Center/Hillandale, GA.
Healdsburg district hospital, CA.

There is a Chairman/ Chief of Surgery who is a DPM.
Ex: Lake Charles Memorial Hospital, LA.

There is many hospital that orthopedic Surgery and Podiatric Surgery are in the same department.

There is a Chief of Orthopedic Surgery/ Podiatric Surgery department who is a DPM.

Ex: Howard County General Hospital (John Hopkins Medicine)

No to mention, there are many DPMs who are faculty at MD/DO schools.

Nova DO school's retiring associate dean was a DPM.

DPM are now in the same physician pay grade, authority, leadership promotion, and loan forgiveness programs as MD/DO in the Veterans Health Administration.

If you can get a copy of sullivan cotter physician compensation report or MGMA, you should be see a more accurate salary for all specialty including DPM.

Go shadow multiple DPMs and find out if this is a career you want.

 

[Angus Avagadro]

The best way to rationalize this is knowing that you will learn to palpate very well and will get some more hands on anatomy training.

And you might actually help a few people feel better.

 

[ortnakas]

"Very little interest in OMM" or "will be miserable if I am doing OMM"/"will be miserable if I'm not an MD"?

If the former: still apply. A lot of us don't end up using OMM, and spending that much time in OMM was annoying. While (assuming I passed Level 3) I have no intention of studying it ever again, I'm proud to be a physician and I don't care what letters are behind my name, so if osteopathic medicine is how I got here, yay, I'm happy with it.

If you know with absolute certainty that you will be miserable while doing OMM (like, lifechangingly miserable, not just annoyed), or only want to be a specialist/subspecialist that will be a difficult path as a DO, or will have an inferiority complex your entire career, then don't apply to DO schools. Do what you need to do to make your application MD-schools-friendly and go for that.

Edit to add: I have no plans of ever doing counterstrain, cranial, or really most OMM "in real life," but like a few other posters have said, it gives you some palpatory skills that are handy during regular H&Ps, your musculoskeletal exam will be solid, and there's a few methods here and there that are admittedly handy. So even though I'm not a diehard devotee of A.T. Still, I don't view my time in OMM first and second year as a total waste.

 

[deleted941029]

Update: Got my MCAT score back and got a 519.

 

[nicejewishboi]

Update: Got my MCAT score back and got a 519.

Sounds like you're not going to DO school. Congrats on the 519!

 

[Angus Avagadro]

No to your OP. You scored in 98%tile on the MCAT. Opportunities will abound if the rest of your app is competetive. No need to be a DO if you dont want to practice like one.

 

[Goro]

Update: Got my MCAT score back and got a 519.

Ok, start list with WashU

 

[BornSinner]

If you're not interested in OMM, then PCOM is probably the best DO school to apply to. Obviously you still have to give the whole "holistic, OMM toolkit" interview jargon, but administration is really pushing towards being competitive with the rest of the Philly area MD schools.

Research and boards (USMLE) are being emphasized and OMM is being downsized big time. It's only taught about 1.5 hours (if that) per week (already least amount of hours for a DO school) during didactic years and just recently has been removed from the 3rd year clinical clerkship curriculum giving students an extra elective month. Clinical OMM is now only a 1-week, check-the-boxes, didactic course during 3rd year.

Good time to apply to PCOM if DO school is your objective.