SHOULD I DECLINE D.O. & RETRY M.D. NEXT YEAR? OR AM I JUST NUTS???

[RAM#48]

drusso is absolutely right. The statement "SOME SPECIALTIES ARE VIRTUALLY IMPOSSIBLE TO ENTER AS AN OSTEOPATH" is not very accurate. I have a friend who went to DMU and is now a second year orthopaedic surgeon. Chief surgery resident at a local very allopathic institution is a PCOM graduate. It all depends on your desire to pursue a specialty. I know another DO (primary care) who did postgraduate training at Harvard. You may not end up there, but there are DO's out there who worked their tails off to get into specialties.

[This message has been edited by RAM#48 (edited 01-24-2000).]

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[DO Boy]

Well after those welcome posts to my question, I must say that I'm so very much relieved. I was just hoping I was wrong about MD residencies. Still, I can't help but feel that entering a surgery MD residency might be slightly more difficult as a DO. But, maybe I'm just completely wrong. And, maybe this will all be a moot point after my surgery rotation!

drusso, I noticed that you are a research fellow in OMM. I am working on my thesis proposal for my MPH and I was just curious about any research opportunities in OMM. Any data sets that you know of there that need analysis? If I'm going to be an osteopath, I'd love to help further the body of knowledge for the American people and MDs that OMM really works. If not, I guess I'm sticking to something with TB and DOT.

And, thank you for the welcome. I can't wait to go to TCOM!


DO Boy
TCOM 2004 Wahoo!

 

[drusso]

Well, specialty ACGME programs are more difficult for DO's to snag (that is true), but not impossible. It just requires being a little more savvy, a little more flexible, and smarter than the average bear (DO or MD bear, that is

)

Well DO Boy, have I got DATA for you!! The OMM department is actively involved in a number of research projects including, OMT in post-CABG patients, OMT in chronic low back pain, OMT and dermatonal evoked sensory potentials, OMT in animal models of cardiac ischemia, OMM in post-knee replacement patients, a meta-analysis of OMT studies, and a couple others...

You will be busy the first two years of medical school, but there is ample opportunity for you to get involved in your summer off or to pursue a predoctoral fellowship. I encourage you to stay interested in OMM research, it is something that the profession badly needs. I attended a research conference on OMM at NIH and am very optimistic that our generation of DO's will help put OMM on an evidence-based platform. OMM largely evolved as an anecdotal set of techniques, an art. There is nothing wrong with that, but insurance companies are not in the habit of reimbursing physicians for being artists...

By the way, if you're an out-of-state applicant, you should look into DO/PhD programs at TCOM. It will earn you in-state tuition. Because you will have matriculated with an MPH (I'm in the dual DO/MPH program now), you might want to consider a DO/PhD in epidemiology. It might keep you around an extra year or two, but the cost-savings are significant.

When you get here, stop by and look me up.

--dave

 

[Future DOc]

You know Lennox.....I have read most of your posts & have realized that you do nothing but bash, put down & tell untruthful statements. You are obviously of NO HELP to your fellow medical collegues who use these posts for some info. Please get off the thread if that's your style!!!

It is very obvious that you are NOT a current medical student or resident because your ignorance & arrogance would never survive in the realm of medical school/residency one minute. Also, I asked you if you are a medical student or resident. Since you did not answer my question, but instead remarked childishly esp to me, I guess you're not!!

Please discontinue your attempts to have word-wars with me because I have better things to do. If you want to think the way you do, so be it!!! No sweat off my shoulder. I just keeping thinking of the phrase "ignorant pre-med" everytime I read your posts. What a pity!!! Wake up & smell the coffee, buddy because you will be left in the dust being SO uninformed the way you are. Please try not to drag down your other collegues here with you who are atleast attempting to learn medicine...esp the DO world. Oh well....good luck to you anyway!!!

Rob
WesternU/COMP Class of 2002

 

[DO Boy]

Drusso,

Wow, I am glad to hear that there is a lot of research going on about OMT at TCOM. One of my interviewers mentioned to me a couple of doctors to talk to about OMT and low back pain research. Alas, as my plane was leaving right after the interview day, I had no opportunity to hang around.

I agree that the DO profession badly needs more OMT research. One study that makes it in the NEJM does not "prove" anything (that's what the Student Doctor says on it's website! Sheesh that looks dumb! Does somebody want to tell them that? http://www.aoa-net.org/Students/studentdr.htm).

Well, I'm full swing into my TB research so sadly, I can't do OMT for my thesis. Should've thought about it EARLIER! Oh well. Anyways, I do think I'm interested in that OMT predoctoral fellowship. Might as well put my MPH through it's paces! It's really a wonderful degree to have if you're in the health care field. When I get there, I'll look you up. Thanks!

Oh, by the way, I'm an in-state so DO/PhD won't be necessary to shave of tuition for me. Besides, I want to go straight into residency and become an excellent physician! (don't we all!)


DO Boy
TCOM 04 wahoo!

 

[Tech]

I applied to both DO and MD schools. I just want to be a physician. I have heard great things about OMT. OMT is not a chiropractic function. It is beyond that. OMTers intends on healing ailments and are not looking for routine visits as some chiropractors are. I think that if one truly wants to become a physician and has an inner desire to heal and be challenged throughout their medical career than either DO or MD should do the job.

Some will say that DO surpasses MD in that OMT augments the traditional medical education. Through OMT, DO's may have better musculoskeletal (hope I spelled that right) anatomy skills. They may even have an advantage over MD's at orthopaedic surgery. I don't know, but one could clearly argue this.

I will glady go to either MD or DO schools. I think that on the most part, DO schools have smaller class sizes. I know one MD that wishes she was a DO. She said that both have the same end result and same pay, but DO education was easier. I really doubt that because how the hell would she know. Did she go to both MD and DO schools? How could anyoe say that unless they have been to both types of schools?

About the osteopathic philosophy. It makes perfect sense to me. I don't think it proposes anyhting radical.

Overall, I have a burning desire to become a physician, so just choose a school, whether DO or MD, based on convenience.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Originally posted by Tech
I applied to both DO and MD schools. I just want to be a physician. I have heard great things about OMT. OMT is not a chiropractic function. It is beyond that. OMTers intends on healing ailments and are not looking for routine visits as some chiropractors are. I think that if one truly wants to become a physician and has an inner desire to heal and be challenged throughout their medical career than either DO or MD should do the job.

Some will say that DO surpasses MD in that OMT augments the traditional medical education. Through OMT, DO's may have better musculoskeletal (hope I spelled that right) anatomy skills. They may even have an advantage over MD's at orthopaedic surgery. I don't know, but one could clearly argue this.

I will glady go to either MD or DO schools. I think that on the most part, DO schools have smaller class sizes. I know one MD that wishes she was a DO. She said that both have the same end result and same pay, but DO education was easier. I really doubt that because how the hell would she know. Did she go to both MD and DO schools? How could anyoe say that unless they have been to both types of schools?

About the osteopathic philosophy. It makes perfect sense to me. I don't think it proposes anyhting radical.

Overall, I have a burning desire to become a physician, so just choose a school, whether DO or MD, based on convenience.

as if the OP really cares.

 

[MeganRose]

Originally posted by Blitzkrieg
as if the OP really cares.

Blitz that is too funny.

 

[DW]

on the one hand, you've got kids asking about thank you notes, which i guarantee there has been a thread about in the least 3 days they could find easily via search function......

on the other, you've got people bumping up redundant threads that were started years ago

silly newbies

 

[TeinVI]

 

[SouthernGirl]

Originally posted by TeinVI

LMAO!

Tein VI, will you marry me?

 

[TeinVI]

Originally posted by SouthernGirl
LMAO!

Tein VI, will you marry me?

why, yes

 

[Raptor]

TienVI, you just prove that the ladies like the bad boys . Maybe I should get kicked off SDN, it might pick up my reputation.

 

[Perseverant 1]

To address the original poster: don't forget that most secondary applications ask if you attended medical school! You would have to explain all of this if you were granted an interview.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Originally posted by Perseverant 1
To address the original poster: don't forget that most secondary applications ask if you attended medical school! You would have to explain all of this if you were granted an interview.

now wth was that, my friend

 

[Perseverant 1]

Blitz-
I am not the sharpest tool in the shed, but i don't understand your reply. Am i missing something?

 

[14931]

perserverant, the thread is 2 years old, i dont think the OP even here still

 

[shake well]

do M.D. schools know if you have been accepted to D.O. schools?

 

[Katie]

although I know that this thread is old and probably needs to die, as an MD student I resent it when DO students say that people only go for the MD program b/c of prestige. This is not true, people choose whatever med school they go to for different reasons (location, in-state tuition, facilities, student body, reputation, patient population served, etc.). Also, I am under the impression that osteopathic training generally spends more time on OMM and the physical examination, while allopathic schools generally tend to emphasize training students to take a medical history. This doesn't mean that DO schools do not teach students how to interview a patient or that MD schools neglect training in Physical Diagnosis. It just means the areas of focus are different, and I tend to like the MD approach of starting out learning to talk with your patients before you learn to palpate and diagnose. Another reason I chose allopathic medicine was b/c many osteopathic schools (with the notable exceptions of PCOM and Touro) are in small cities or rural areas, and I prefer the more urban setting that a large # of East Coast allopathic schools provide. I love Boston and all it has to offer and know that I wouldn't be enjoying life nearly as much if I had gone to KCOM, although KCOM is a great school. So please don't boil it down to an issue of prestige; it is just as often a matter of personal preference as illustrated in my case.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

Originally posted by Katie
although I know that this thread is old and probably needs to die, as an MD student I resent it when DO students say that people only go for the MD program b/c of prestige. This is not true, people choose whatever med school they go to for different reasons (location, in-state tuition, facilities, student body, reputation, patient population served, etc.). Also, I am under the impression that osteopathic training generally spends more time on OMM and the physical examination, while allopathic schools generally tend to emphasize training students to take a medical history. This doesn't mean that DO schools do not teach students how to interview a patient or that MD schools neglect training in Physical Diagnosis. It just means the areas of focus are different, and I tend to like the MD approach of starting out learning to talk with your patients before you learn to palpate and diagnose. Another reason I chose allopathic medicine was b/c many osteopathic schools (with the notable exceptions of PCOM and Tuoro) are in small cities or rural areas, and I prefer the more urban setting that a large # of East Coast allopathic schools provide. I love Boston and all it has to offer and know that I wouldn't be enjoying life nearly as much if I had gone to KCOM, although KCOM is a great school. So please don't boil it down to an issue of prestige; it is just as often a matter of personal preference as illustrated in my case.

LOL.

I love you, beautiful katie

 

[badassy]

I'm lucky, here in Ontario we dont have DO's. I dont believe doctors who have DO degrees can pratice here. Only do somewhat of a therapy approach.

 

[Thewonderer]

Originally posted by badassy
I'm lucky, here in Ontario we dont have DO's. I dont believe doctors who have DO degrees can pratice here. Only do somewhat of a therapy approach.

DO's in Canada don't go to "med" school; they go to OMT schools to learn how to manipulate and that's it.

DO's in the US go to med + OMT schools. i.e. they learn pharmacology, biochemistry, pathology, internal medicine, surgery, ob/gyn, etc. and on top of that, OMT.

These are very different. some provinces in Canada do allow American DO's to become real doctors who have prescription, hopsital or OR priviledge, but that's just too much hassle.

 

[Kovox]

MD...DO...

It's just LETTERS dude...who cares about letters..you're going to medical school to serve sick people and to be a good physician.

Both DO and MD programs are excellent and both produce great doctors. Choose the program that you think suits you the best.

 

[Mutterkuchen]

I don't mean to be an ass, but the only reason that I didn't apply to apply to DO schools is because of the prestige. I did not want to spend my whole career justifing that a DO is the same as an MD. I honestly believe that there is only a small difference between the two, but many people don't know that in the general public.

 

[Kovox]

Originally posted by JBJ
I don't mean to be an ass, but the only reason that I didn't apply to apply to DO schools is because of the prestige. I did not want to spend my whole career justifing that a DO is the same as an MD. I honestly believe that there is only a small difference between the two, but many people don't know that in the general public.

I don't think you're an arse at all and your concern is very legitamate. Amoung the medically educated world, people know that DO and MDs are the same..go through rigorous training etc. but among the public, most don't know what DOs are.

But think about this:

When you're in an emergency room, with a teenager who was just rolled in, with a renal penetrating injury caused by a bullet wound from a gang fight, with a Grade IV vascular damage -- containing hemaorrhaging with extensive urinary extravasculation..........he isn't going to sit up and ask you if you're an MD or DO (I'd probably faint if he did, that's pretty harsh damage) nor are his parents and relatives going to ask you that...all they care is that you do your job and save his life.

Either way, good luck with everything. I would't apply to Osteopath schools and try to transfer to Allopath schools...it's difficult if not impossible to do (there's an earlier thread about this)

 

[ChubbyBaby]

I don't mean to be an ass, but the only reason that I didn't apply to apply to DO schools is because of the prestige. I did not want to spend my whole career justifing that a DO is the same as an MD. I honestly believe that there is only a small difference between the two, but many people don't know that in the general public.

Dr. Jon Marshall, resident physician & HydroxyCut clinical researcher/spokesperson, is a graduate of an osteopathic school. That's gotta count for something.

 

[GoSpursGo]

Holy thread resurrection, Batman!

Suffice to say, the OP's question has been asked, answered, and one way or another resolved at this point. Closing.