Sorry I just have to say it....New DO School

Discussion in 'Medical Students - DO' started by THE O, Nov 26, 2002.

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DO YOU THINK THE VA SCHOOL IS A GOOD IDEA

Poll closed Dec 16, 2002.
  1. YES....damn tooting TEX!

    25 vote(s)
    54.3%
  2. YES, with hesitation

    11 vote(s)
    23.9%
  3. HUH???....wake me up when vanna comes on

    2 vote(s)
    4.3%
  4. Maybe not....I hate voting for stuff anyway

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. NO....of course not...are you NUTS?????

    8 vote(s)
    17.4%
  1. THE O

    THE O Junior Member

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    I think that as a profession, instead of creating more DO schools we should improve and expand those that we already have...

    While some of our schools are exellent and established institutions other are...well...a little fly-by-night (just a few not many, 2-3)

    As a profession we should concentrate on building up the quality rather than the quantity of the schools. Build big medical centers for the schools when possible.....affiliate with top institutions....by multiplying we just water down the DO pool rather than improving it.

    Sometimes it's embarrasing to hear stories about brother and sister osteo-schools that are holes in the wall that seem to be desperate for applicants due to their "newness", which consist of one building in the middle of no-where, affiliated with hospitals with ill repute.

    If we continue to erect a school whenever possible, however possible, with whoever possible...we will further perpetuate the sterotypical DO-Couldn't be and MD stereotype, instead of the, DO- progressive physician image-we all want and most of us set out to become.

    Furthermore, with the multiplication of schools, we also create more demand for DO-Residency/internship spots forcing grads to apply to apply to AGME (MD) spots which are admittadly harder for us to get, and fail to preserve our rich osteopathic tradition, history and most importantly our identity. Currently we don't have enough spots to accomodate even half of our grads.....

    I personally think the new DO school in VA is a less than intelligent move on the AOA's part...and the current direction which we are taking our profession is one we will regret in the future....

    Is another DO school what we really need?

    THE-O
    The FEW, the proud, THE DO's
    PCOM (est 1899)'06
    Men-et-Manus (Minds and Hands)

    :confused: :confused:
     
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  3. SuzyQ

    SuzyQ Senior Member

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    Hey O,

    I sent you a PM
     
  4. Dr JPH

    Dr JPH Banned
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    I'm a little dissapointed to hear such things from a fellow PCOMer, but we are all entitled to our own opinion.

    As far as an new school just anywhere, no, that's not a good idea.

    But at Virginia Tech? Hell yes. Why?

    Exposure. Solid reputation. Research. More DOs.

    Those are the positives that I see with this.

    Yes, I agree that there are DO schools out there that have a slightly harder time filling spots than PCOM, but there are no fly-by-night DO schools. All the schools must fulfill the same requirements for accredidation.

    I agree 100% when you say that the DO profession needs to improve its schools. Moreso, it needs to improve its postgraduate opportunities and training.

    But as far as a new DO school being bad, I disagree. There are certainly drawbacks, but V Tech is a great opportunity.

    As far as some DO schools needing to step it up a bit...I will vote yes on that. Maybe we should all step it up.

    So, my fellow PCOMer, that's my opinion. Hope you respect it as I have respected yours. See you in class on Monday...whoever you are.
     
  5. Fenrezz

    Fenrezz AT Stills Worst Nightmare

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    I'm no expert on the subject, but I'd like to think medical schools aren't like fried chicken franchises. It's not like anyone can just decide to open up a med school. You have to be given permission from the government first, don't you? And that's only granted when it is decided that a legitimate need must be filled.

    I just assumed that that part of the country was having a hard time keeping doctors in the area. Put a medical school in place, fill it with mostly locals and you highly increase the odds that the graduates will stay and practice.

    As far as new schools, I'm all for 'em. It says only one thing: osteopathic medicine is growing. Yes, more med schools means more saturation of DO's in the market, but with that comes the constant increase in population and need for more physicians (to say nothing of the need that will be felt when all the baby boomers begin retiring starting in 8 years).

    The new school will feel growing pains at first, what school doesn't? However, I have no doubt that in due time they will be graduating great doctors, and that can only be good for the profession.
     
  6. THE O

    THE O Junior Member

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    Just a quick clairificaion.....as not to get anyone unnessesarily heated....

    Med School is Med School and as far as I am concerned there are no "good" or "bad" schools....just good and bad docs.

    Harvard graduates incompetent physicians, and it graduates excellent physicians....this goes accross the board.

    However, I feel that the resources used to erect a new DO college could be given to some of the new schools that could improve their facilities and programs in order to create more opportunities for grads and students alike.

    Imagine if our profession could erect a large teaching hospital/trauma center/research center that rivals those of our allopathic counterparts, staff it with top notch PHD and DO faculty and turn out a large quantity of quality basic, clinical and osteopathic research, maybe even capture a decent chunk of NIH funding?

    It think that sort of step at an existing medical school would bring DO medicine to a new level, maybe even draw a great deal of attention to the benefits of OMM...

    until we can build an institution with resources equivalent to those of a top 50 allopathic school....osteopathic medicine will not progress in the direction that we truly want it to go.

    Remember it's quality not quanity that really matters.....

    Submitted respectfully,

    THE O
    (PCOM......give us are freaking hosptial back!!!!...'06)

    My medicine has a first name its O-s-t-e-o my medicine has a second name is p-a-t-h-ic.
     
  7. Dr JPH

    Dr JPH Banned
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    And what resources are those?

    Also, are you familiar with the way that schools are ranked by such organizations as USNews?
     
  8. maysqrd

    maysqrd Go A's!

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    If osteopathic institutions want to capture the money that is out there they will need to look internally in the future. Most government funding runs too thing, is subject to cutbacks and is extremely competitive. The best place to secure funding will be from private sources. How do you get the funds out of private foundations, organizations? Have some pull, know someone on the inside that can verify your credibility. How do we find these people in the future, we produce them!

    By putting more DO's out in the general population and by opening more DO med schools, we simple increase the odds that eventually an osteopathic doctor will be one of the people that makes the recommendation to give funding to an DO school to improve facilities and open up new research programs. It's like one big giant alumni association of DO's. And, I don't know about your schools, but my experience is that alumni association can generate A LOT of money!

    As for the big teaching hospitals/trauma centers, these are BAD decisions for most schools. They have drained finances because they continually lose money. I think that a better model is to establish an affiliate network where the hospitals are looking at the med schools as a revenue source for medicare, etc. rather than expecting the med schools to bail them out of their financial nightmares.
     
  9. DOnut

    DOnut Senior Member

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    This is a really good debate.

    The O, I have to say that I agree with your points 100% I completely understand everything that you posted.

    The prsident of the AOA made a visit to NYCOM last week as part of a leadership in medicine forum. He mentioned that NYCOM has now become the largest Osteopathic medical school in the country, and (I believe) the second largest medical school in the US.

    Now, on the surface that sounds really good! However, "largest" can be a deceiving word. NYCOM is the largest Osteopathic medical school because there are over 300 students in the 1st year class. This is an insane number. Now granted there are 46 first years students who are physicians from other countries completeing an accelerated program to obtain US licenses, this still, however, leaves a very very large class.

    It has been proven over and over again, that as you increase the student to faculty ratio, the quality of education decreases. One might say then the answer is to increase the number of schools to accomodate. I think that this is a mistake. As was said before, it is the quality of the physician you produce, NOT the quantity of physicians you produce that is truly important.

    The focus of the AOA should be to "facilitate" our medical schools in obtaining private resources, and to aid in the recruitment of large corporations funding research at Osteopathic medical institutions.

    The bottom line is, speed is not the way to go. If we are able to increase the number of top notch researchers, obtain larger research grants (NIH or other), conduct more effective clinical trials, then we will be able to gain "sponsorship" of programs from large corporations and/or government. This will provide more legitimacy to our osteopathic research which in turn will help persuade the powers that be to fund larger projects, which will facilitate the building of more advanced medical centers, which will increase the patient exposure to Osteopathic medicine, which will eventually lead to the need to expand our school.

    I do not believe another Osteopathic medical school should be opened until the AOA (and individual COM's) begin to at least implement some of the above. This is what will truly make our profession shine, and in this age of evidence based medicine, provide PROOF to why Osteopathic medicine is the fastest growing division of medical care.
     
  10. Gregory Gulick

    Gregory Gulick Senior Member

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    I know it is en vogue to blame the AOA for all of our woes, but I must stick up for them on this point. The AOA is powerless to stop an institution from opening up. Because the AOA is an accrediting body (the AMA is not), it cannot legally prevent new schools from opening. Doing so constitutes restriction of trade, and they'd lose this legal battle in a heartbeat. In fact, the AOA has been in court recently fighting the development of a new school which would be the only "for profit" osteopathic medical school in the nation. I think they deserve to be commended for that.

    So they are limited right now at discouraging new schools, but they cannot prevent them. And to be a valid accrediting body, they must accredit any institution that meets their basic requirements.

    Guys, the AOA isn't all-powerful like many of you perceive it to be. Many of the problems you all blame on the AOA are actually a result of your state medical boards or because of the U.S. Goverment (e.g., the balanced budget amendment of '97 which is preventing many AOA instutitions from enlarging their residency opportunities).
     

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