Student in dispair in need of some advice

[blueflower77]

I've always dreamed to be a physician, but due to many different life situations have been deviating from the path. I am originally from another country, so have always been an international student until recently. While pursuing my first undergrad degree and being pre-med, I wanted to apply to med schools, but was told by a few of them in the state (and outside) that I/my parents would have to provide affidavit of support for 100% of payments (living, tuition, books, etc) for 4 years. Roughly the school I talked to in detail, indicated to me, I needed to show $185,000.00 in finances on a bank account, certified by a bank, otherwise, they would be unable to offer me a decision in either direction (ie: they wouldn't even consider my application). I understand their concern, they need to be paid and being an international student (especially after 9/11) could be harmful to them financially. (Just as a side note, my parents could have taken out a second mortgage but obviously didn't want to take THAT much responsibility). Bottom line is, I had no money.

To keep my visa, I had to keep doing to school, though. I had no plan B. Stupid me, should have researched this earlier, but alas - I didn't... Very disappointed, I graduated in '06 with a 3.4 with a BA in Biology with a minor in Chemistry from a small private college. In college, I did shadowing, research since high school (I went a boarding school for high school), wrote my own grant and it was funded as a first author... etc, etc. and all the other garbage. I was an NCAA athlete with a school record in swimming that still holds today, blah, blah, blah. All of that went out the window when I was told I shouldn't even apply without having financing. Around that time I was also supposed to take the MCAT. I wrote my name on it, and even though I studied for it, I didn't really care and bombed it. I got an 11 (terrifying, I know!). But I knew my life in medicine (something I had worked super hard for for a while) was over. My parents gave me no support (well, they never really did, but now it's almost like their talks proved true).

Anyway. I had to keep going to school. So I applied for nursing. At the time, the specialty was in need (well, it still is, just not officially) to the point where they would give me a green card (=permanent residence) just if I had a diploma! I got all ambitious, thinking that I would get my green card and make myself be happy in nursing, and with a scholarship was admitted to an accelerated nursing program in a top private univ. in my state that would give me a Masters in Nursing and a Bachelor's in Nursing after only 3 years. I was never excited about it, but thought this was my way out. My grandmother had a stroke that summer and around the time of my admission to nursing passed away. I was devastated. I could not go to visit her while she was laying in bed paralyzed with my family taking care of her because I knew I wouldn't be able to return (that part is a long story, but it's not important at this point). I still haven't been back (going this year), and ridden by guilt, sadness, depression, my grades bottomed out. I think I had a 2.4 my first and last semester at that school. I don't really have many memories from that semester - just remember going to school, studying and then eating and going to bed. I transferred out, not wanting to be a nurse practitioner, depressed about my grandmother and thinking I'd have to go back to my home country and my quest in US is over.

I applied to just a Bachelor's degree program because I thought, well, I hate to be a nurse practitioner and I don't like nursing, but I need to finish it because it bothered me very much that I didn't do well and I'm just one of those people who likes to finish what I had started.

I'm doing well in school, but have been emotionally through a big a struggle. I work in an ICU as an intern and love the patients, but greatly dislike the philosophy of nursing (never really liked it anyway) and have been very limited by what I can do at work and how I think. The questions I ask in class almost always receive the answer "you don't need to know that for the test" and my nursing instructors' crude and jumbled messy interpretation of microbiology and biochemistry greatly hurts me when I hear their gross misunderstanding (or lack of understanding) really of basic micro and biochem concepts (I love Organic and biochem).

Anyway, to make the long story short, my grades in nursing are better, my current GPA is 3.6 and I am graduating in May. Since all this happened, I met a wonderful guy and got married and have really had a turn around in my life (well sort of). I learned to believe in myself again and have seriously considered going back and trying one more time for medical school since now my international status is not longer an issue. My husband is fully supportive and has offered to help me study and have me not work so I can retake the MCAT and actually try to do well on it.

I know I've made some mistakes (and big ones) but I am wondering how bad of a hindrance they will be to my admissions (MD/DO/Caribbean med schools). So I'm wondering about your opinion.

My stats: Bio BA GPA 3.4, science (never calculated, not sure), MCAT (currently a pitiful 11, obviously not going to apply with that, but will retake and hope for upper 20's if not low 30s, but the 11 will still be on my record ), nursing GPA from grad program 2.4, current Bachelor's nursing GPA 3.6, hoping to raise to at least 3.7. Realistically shooting for Caribbean, but hoping that if my MCAT is higher than average, I could potentially apply to DO or MD schools in US.

I know the extracurriculars won't outweigh my grades, but I have 2 publications in science journals, 6 years of research experience, my own grant where I'm a 1st author doing research at a local medical school, shadowing in the past, currently working (for the past 1.5 years) in pediatric ICU as an intern and will be a nurse there after I graduate. After several conversations with our attendings, they're hoping to help me get involved with some shadowing, but more probably doing actual clinical research, so they can write me a faculty recommendation for our local school (and obviously others). Hoping to become a state resident by the time I apply.

What do you think?
(I've read many other posts and I know some people can be very honest to the point of rudeness. I would greatly appreciate constructive criticism and honest but polite advice. I roam this forum like you: to find helpful hints, not disruptive comments.) Thanks!

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[zebalong]

As an RN it saddens me that you are not excited about nursing, i COMPLETELY understand your frustration about nursing not having a strong solid biological background, but i think you'll find that in medical school you will understand and learn pathophysiology much EASIER than people who have never learned it before.

I hope you work a couple of years as a nurse, take time to really develop your application and increase your MCAT score, im not really familiar with international applicants but im pretty sure you'd be set for DO or carribean range in terms of gpa and MCAT even with that first lower one since it was a long time ago.

I hope you practice at least a couple of years, you took a spot in that nursing school that another applicant was dieing to have.
Remember, nursing school is a bit like medical school nowadays with the high demand and pay, at least in california it is. So take pride that you have accomplished becomming an RN and i hope you learn to enjoy it for what it is- caring for patients.

best of luck and stick with it, you can do it.

 

[blueflower77]

Thank you for your response, zebalong. To be honest, I don't think nursing school is competitive and I don't think I did someone a disservice by "taking someone else's spot" in nursing school. 25% of my current graduating class has failed and the nurses I have worked with (for the most part) are angry with their profession, they do not enjoy it and they can't wait to go to graduate school or pursue a different area - but then, when rotating through those "other areas" as a student, I do not see any more enthusiasm from those nurses in comparison to those I work with. I am very glad you enjoy being a nurse because the nursing world needs more people like you. But unfortunately, it is a not a field I find satisfying, that's all.

 

[pianola]

To have a better idea of what's going on you might want to calculate an overall GPA for yourself with all undergraduate classes included.

That's all I have for right now.

Good luck.

 

[dragonfly99]

It sounds like you should go for it.

Without knowing what you are going to get on the MCAT, we can't really predict how competitive an applicant you will be. I wouldn't write yourself off, even for MD schools, at this point, but it's good you are open-minded about where you'd be willing to go. Carib. would be hard if you are married, b/c probably nothing to do down there, no job, for your spouse...

My suggestions:
1) get your undergraduate transcripts and calculate your cumulative undergrad GPA
2) try to calculate your science/math undergrad GPA. I'm not sure if some of the nursing classes count for that?
3) your research experience sounds good
4) if you feel like you haven't forgotten a lot of the science classes you took in college, would go straight for studying for the MCAT. You could potentially take it in April or July. In your situation I'd take a review course (Princeton Review or Kaplan, etc.). You have a job and you have money, so why not?
5) I wouldn't quit your job...why not find a part time nursing position, one that will allow you time to study for the MCAT, maybe take a biology class here and there in the next 1-1.5 years if needed, and just enjoy being married, etc.
6) getting a letter of rec. or two from a physician would probably help your application

 

[blueflower77]

Thanks for your suggestions, dragonfly99!

 

[meister]

Normally I wouldn't give much weight to a low MCAT score as an indicator of anything, but how did you get an 11? What was the breakdown per subject?

 

[blueflower77]

I'm not sure - considering that I randomly answered the questions because I didn't care, that's probably how. I was surprised myself. My breakdown was I think pretty even. I think I had a 4, 4, 3 or something like that. Terrible, I know.

 

[BruceBanner]

Blueflower77-

I dont think you are out of the running yet. The major hurdle you have to clear here is your MCAT score. I think your grades are right on the bubble for a US school, but you should be ok if you nail the MCAT. I think if you really dig deep and do your absolute best to prepare for a second MCAT, and combine that with your extensive EC stuff, you could put yourself right in the mix for getting into to a US school. You have a great story to tell.

It would be fair to speculate that the 11 might bar you from consideration at some US MD schools, but if you really do well this next time I think that will mitigate your old score and prove it was not indicative of your abilities.

So I second DragonFly's advice. My suggestion would be to work part-time and take a prep course, and really dedicate yourself to the MCAT for 2-3 months. Try and get a couple letters from doctors, and when you apply cast the net wide!! You'll find a lot of intense opinions about the caribbean schools, but if I were you I wouldnt do it unless you have NO other choice. The risk is too great and life can be tough down there. You wouldnt be able to get any government loans and there are a lot of unhappy students in these programs.

Best of luck.

 

[blueflower77]

Thanks for your advice, Mr. Banner. I have certainly read about the schools in the Caribbean and know 2 students at 2 different schools who are going through medical school there and I completely agree with you that going there should be my last resort. For both of the individuals mentioned above it was either going there or not be a physician at all. From my understanding, unless one has a LOT of money, going there is like going to hell and back and one comes back "a foreign medical graduate" and "2nd class", but if that's what I have to do to become a physician then I guess that's what I have to do...

 

[graduate2be]

It sounds to me like you would be given some consideration from more than a few U.S. med schools. You just have to work on that MCAT score. If you have doubts about your GPA, you may want to look at attending an SMP (Special Masters Program). There are some great threads regarding those programs posted here. However, if you can significantly boost your MCAT score, I can't imagine that you wouldn't get in SOMEWHERE.

 

[Barfalamule]

I'm not sure where I see the despair. You have a good story that will make a strong personal essay, you have strong patient contact and you have research experience. Fear rules a lot of people's lives. Don't let it dictate to you what you can and cannot do. Beat the inner-demons back and open a can of whoop-ass on the MCAT. That is all you need to do right now.

I came out of Ugrad with a 3.1 cum. and a 2.6 science and I'm starting in a US med school in the Fall.

 

[CrazyPremed]

I'm working as a nurse in an ICU, and finishing premed reqs.

The actual job of nursing is much different from school, and you will use PLENTY of Pathophysiology in the ICU. Secondly, no one likes care plans and nursing diagnosis, and there are plenty of things that really stink about the nursing profession.

The reality is, just because you don't like nursing and you are interested in Micro and Patho, doesn't mean you are a strong candidate for medical school. Getting good grades, high MCAT scores, shadowing, etc. is what it is all about.

You seem to know what you need to do, and it sounds like you are capable of achieving it. Working part time as a nurse can give you the chance to focus on the premed journey, while gaining medical experience with a level of responsibility that few premeds experience before residency. You are in a good place right now.

Good luck on your journey.

CrazyPremed

 

[janalex]

I'm working as a nurse in an ICU, and finishing premed reqs.

The actual job of nursing is much different from school, and you will use PLENTY of Pathophysiology in the ICU. Secondly, no one likes care plans and nursing diagnosis, and there are plenty of things that really stink about the nursing profession.

The reality is, just because you don't like nursing and you are interested in Micro and Patho, doesn't mean you are a strong candidate for medical school. Getting good grades, high MCAT scores, shadowing, etc. is what it is all about.

You seem to know what you need to do, and it sounds like you are capable of achieving it. Working part time as a nurse can give you the chance to focus on the premed journey, while gaining medical experience with a level of responsibility that few premeds experience before residency. You are in a good place right now.

Good luck on your journey.

CrazyPremed

I agree... I work in the ER and I havent filled out one care plan. I do get frustrated when I am yelled at for writing a medical diagosis vs. a nursing diagosis tho....or when I ask a WHY? question, and other nurses tell me Im thinking too deep on a medical level and I should only focus with nursing care. Working part time as a nurse is a HUGE benefit! Take advantage of your level of responsibilty while you have this opportunity. When you think about...its huge- the patient's life is in your hands.

 

[dragonfly99]

What the heck?!
Can someone please explain to me, "nursing diagnosis"? What is that?

 

[dragonfly99]

p.s. to the OP: don't think you'll get out of doing BS paperwork by going to med school...physicians have a lot of it, too...it's just different BS paperwork than the RN's have to do, and you don't see the docs doing it b/c they are over doing it somewhere else, like sitting in medical records signing charts, or dictating, or hiding out somewhere writing notes for the chart!

 

[agirl]

deleted.

What the heck?!
Can someone please explain to me, "nursing diagnosis"? What is that?

 

[blueflower77]

Haha - you guys are so funny. Yeah, I know medicine has paperwork. My mom works in private practice and they also do charges in addition to double the paperwork. BUT there is a difference between relevant and irrelevant paperwork (dictation vs. broccoli dinner. ) Thanks, agirl, that was awesome!