TeamHealth Locums Rate

[deleted547339]

Has anyone here done locums for TeamHealth? Any idea what they pay? Do they even use locums, or only their “special ops” nonsense?

I ask because they’re advertising an opening in the town where my in laws live and I was considering picking up a couple shifts every other month or so while visiting. I had them try to recruit me for a full time job and talking to them was exhausting, so I figure it’s easier to come here and ask. Is it even worth it?

Thanks.

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[thegenius]

Has anyone here done locums for TeamHealth? Any idea what they pay? Do they even use locums, or only their “special ops” nonsense?

I ask because they’re advertising an opening in the town where my in laws live and I was considering picking up a couple shifts every other month or so while visiting. I had them try to recruit me for a full time job and talking to them was exhausting, so I figure it’s easier to come here and ask. Is it even worth it?

Thanks.

I work for TH, but don't do Locums. Overall don't like TH, but maybe if you are Locums and you agree with the pay, then you can minimize your exposure to them. Can't they just tell you what the pay is? Like "I won't answer any questions until you tell me what the job pays?"

 

[Hamhock]

They do locums through a company call D&Y.
As best I understand, D&Y is a subsidiary or somehow owned by Team Health.
HH

 

[Groove]

I've worked for them and didn't really any bad experiences. They have a more "corporate" culture and I had the feeling that they micromanage the docs a bit more than others but there were no deal breakers. Very professional. Good to decent sites, at least in my area. I'd probably work for them if they paid more than my current gig.

They have "special ops" which is a separate division if I remember correctly and you travel to different sites within a regional footprint. Rates are higher. Then they have something called HIT team which is more of a local locums where you are working at several sites usually within driving distance, no more than say...1-2 hours away. Last I talked with them I think Special Ops was $300/hr in my area and the HIT team was $275/hr which was an increase over their old salary of $250/hr. Contract was fairly standard, room to negotiate within reason. They have a lot of resources online for their docs, more than my current CMG. I forget what it was called...mine navigator or something like that. I have some friends who have been working for them for awhile and seem pretty happy.

 

[EctopicFetus]

Their locums is all done thru d&Y. TH 100% owns D&Y.

D&Y lets them pay more than TH. Had an offer for $325/hr via D&Y. TH offered like 260 for the same job.

 

[MechEDoc]

Last I knew special ops paid $250 an hour, $275 per hour if one averaged 156 hours per month per quarter. Upside is that TeamHealth leaves most docs alone to do their job is a see fit. Downside is very little involvement with the hospital, process improvement, and working with a highly variable set of colleagues. You will be forced to "supervise" mid-level providers of dubious quality (some are excellent, however many are underqualified for the role they are placed in - i.e. a cheap doctor substitute). Scheduling is a nightmare. Ideally if you work in a travel capacity you would fly into town, work a contiguous block of shifts, and then return home. In reality your schedule will be flagged minute, you'll work some days, have time sitting in a hotel room, work nights, and possibly flip back to days. Many ERs may be lacking critical equipment.

There are easier ways to earn a living.

 

[MechEDoc]

You may also find yourself at the end of a 3 month block, thinking "sweet, I worked 157 hours my first month, 155 hours my 2nd month, and I am on track to hit 156 hours this month" (13 shifts ×12 hours per shift) when you login to look at your schedule and see that without any notification every physician's hours for the remainder of the month have been reduced by 2 hours per shift. If you inquire as to why you'll find out that someone, somewhere (i.e. not your medical director, and likely not even the regional medical director) was looking at patient volumes over the last two weeks and decided to trim 2 hours off every physicians shift, however the PA shifts have been increased to make up for the decreased physician hours). You realize you will be short by 4 hours this month, not only will you lose this pay, you will also lose your entire quarterly bonus. This 4 hour decrease in your remaining shift will cost you $12,800 and you'll get to spend an extra 4 hours sitting in a hotel room staring at the walls rather than working or being at home. Since you are late in the scheduling cycle there will be no way to pick up extra shifts.

Welcome to your CMG job!

 

[MechEDoc]

While you're sitting in your hotel room listening to the local trailer trash banging next door, you are going through charts of patients seen by the mid-levels. You realize that the 2-year-old with a fever of unknown origin for 6 days that you told the NP required further evaluation for atypical Kawasaki disease was sent home without any further evaluation. No labs were drawn, no urine was checked, and you're wondering if this kid is going go on to have coronary artery aneurysms... To add to the joy, the chart was forwarded to you four days after the patient left emergency room.

 

[miacomet]

I think the OP was interested in picking up 1-2 shifts a month, not being a "special ops" slave, which is the worst corporate medicine has to offer. I've worked with various CMGs as a regular locums, which is preferable, if not perfect. Why any doc signs up for the in-CMG moonlighting gig I will never know. Why docs will donate their free time to sign PA charts is also beyond me. This is why the profession is declining, folks.

 

[thegenius]

While you're sitting in your hotel room listening to the local trailer trash banging next door, you are going through charts of patients seen by the mid-levels. You realize that the 2-year-old with a fever of unknown origin for 6 days that you told the NP required further evaluation for atypical Kawasaki disease was sent home without any further evaluation. No labs were drawn, no urine was checked, and you're wondering if this kid is going go on to have coronary artery aneurysms... To add to the joy, the chart was forwarded to you four days after the patient left emergency room.

What a bloody nightmare!

 

[TheComebacKid]

The docs I know who work at TeamHealth seem miserable.

Why some of us will sell our souls to these corporations are beyond me. Don't mean to be a downer, but the future of EM is bleak if this is all we have to look forward to.

By all means, don't do academics if you don't want to. But people fall into this trap of working for CMGs like this because they think they are being compensated fairly, when in reality, they are just being taken advantage of. Soon an EM physician's job will be to just sign off on midlevel charts and not even see patients anymore.

It's a disgrace.

 

[miacomet]

The docs I know who work at TeamHealth seem miserable.

Why some of us will sell our souls to these corporations are beyond me. Don't mean to be a downer, but the future of EM is bleak if this is all we have to look forward to.

By all means, don't do academics if you don't want to. But people fall into this trap of working for CMGs like this because they think they are being compensated fairly, when in reality, they are just being taken advantage of. Soon an EM physician's job will be to just sign off on midlevel charts and not even see patients anymore.

It's a disgrace.

Agreed, but I think new grads have it hard with their 300k in debt and not too many options. Debt is slavery, yet Americans sign up for it in DROVES. As long as young people buy into the Ponzi scheme that higher education has become, they will continue to graduate with massive debt and have no choice but to slave away for CMGs in horrible situations.

I would suggest to high school students that the trades are a far better deal than higher education for many, many people, and that college (and medical school) are only worth it if one can graduate with minimal debt. Debt is NEVER worth it. All my colleagues are stuck with their crazy student loans and fat mortgages, and are thus completely controlled by their jobs, unable to fight the power.

Fait accompli for corporate medicine, and corporate America, no? They have young Americans signing up in droves to voluntarily relinquish their freedom.

 

[Arcan57]

The docs I know who work at TeamHealth seem miserable.

Why some of us will sell our souls to these corporations are beyond me. Don't mean to be a downer, but the future of EM is bleak if this is all we have to look forward to.

By all means, don't do academics if you don't want to. But people fall into this trap of working for CMGs like this because they think they are being compensated fairly, when in reality, they are just being taken advantage of. Soon an EM physician's job will be to just sign off on midlevel charts and not even see patients anymore.

It's a disgrace.

I'm confused over your rhetoric. How does contracting to provide emergency medical services for a contract staffed by a CMG = selling your soul? There aren't enough cush academic jobs to make that a viable strategy for the majority of EM grads. And if you're going to "do academics" only to spend all your shifts cranking out volume in a community shop, I'd argue that at least it's better to be fairly compensated for it.

There are definitely exceptions, but the national trend is that hospitals prefer to deal with CMGs. Hospitals want pliant physicians so they can jump through the hoops required to balance keeping the feds, the med staff, and the patients satisfied. I don't think we can convert America into a "FSEDs as the dominant vehicle for delivering emergency care" model. That means we have to deal with the hospital and what the hospital wants. Gone are the days (if they were ever there) were the majority of ED docs could show up for their shift, collect the majority of the RVUs they billed, and maybe show up for a meeting once a month. Most ED docs don't want to put the time and effort in to meeting the hospitals expectations (I make no assumptions about how reasonable those expectations are), and so we give up part of our revenue to have someone else deal with it. We want to be off when we're off, so we let someone else sit at the table and then complain when things don't go the way we wanted.

If EPs sold their souls to anyone, it was to the concept of convenience. For the docs in SDGs that are grinding away in hospital committees, system meetings, and that really hold each other accountable for the care they provide - it's a damn shame if/when your hospital pulls the rug out from under you. That's a crap situation, and you deserve to be angry at the group that replaced you. For the docs that couldn't pick their CEO, CMO, or CNO out of a line-up, have never interacted with a member of the med staff outside of the ED, and watched colleagues provide consistently substandard care without doing anything - why do you expect to be able to freeload off of the people that are doing those things for you?

 

[doggydog]

Agreed, but I think new grads have it hard with their 300k in debt and not too many options. Debt is slavery, yet Americans sign up for it in DROVES. As long as young people buy into the Ponzi scheme that higher education has become, they will continue to graduate with massive debt and have no choice but to slave away for CMGs in horrible situations.

I would suggest to high school students that the trades are a far better deal than higher education for many, many people, and that college (and medical school) are only worth it if one can graduate with minimal debt. Debt is NEVER worth it. All my colleagues are stuck with their crazy student loans and fat mortgages, and are thus completely controlled by their jobs, unable to fight the power.

Fait accompli for corporate medicine, and corporate America, no? They have young Americans signing up in droves to voluntarily relinquish their freedom.

What are you talking about? This is a forum for physicians and medical students. Was your medical school a trade school?

 

[MechEDoc]

What the **** are you talking about? This is a forum for physicians and medical students. Was your medical school a trade school?

Medicine is almost a trade. I've worked trades, white collar (PhD in a high tech sector) and emergency medicine. I think we have elements of both in our field. A high school friend of mine stayed in lawn mowing / landscaping. Did some community college to round out his skills. Had a nice house and land in a nice town with good schools (i.e. a "doctor" town) fully paid for by the age of 30 and was making $100k a year by 2003-5 time frame and has been doing so ever since. My fortunes have been up and down (now heading up), his are probably just fine.

 

[deleted547339]

Agreed, but I think new grads have it hard with their 300k in debt and not too many options. Debt is slavery, yet Americans sign up for it in DROVES. As long as young people buy into the Ponzi scheme that higher education has become, they will continue to graduate with massive debt and have no choice but to slave away for CMGs in horrible situations.

I would suggest to high school students that the trades are a far better deal than higher education for many, many people, and that college (and medical school) are only worth it if one can graduate with minimal debt. Debt is NEVER worth it. All my colleagues are stuck with their crazy student loans and fat mortgages, and are thus completely controlled by their jobs, unable to fight the power.

Fait accompli for corporate medicine, and corporate America, no? They have young Americans signing up in droves to voluntarily relinquish their freedom.

Pump the breaks a bit. I’m about as debt averse as anyone, but you’re going to the extreme. Really? Debt is never worth it? I went to a cheap state school and got out with under 100k in debt for med school which is now paid off. I’m an attending making decent money (although I’m sure some people on here would say I’m getting robbed). I’d say that was worth it. I’m in my early 30s making bank with no debt. We’re going to buy a modest house in a nice area and try to pay it off in 8-12y.

Don’t get me wrong, you can do it the wrong way with debt. You can go to a private school and take out 300k plus 100k for undergrad and then buy an 800k house. Yea, if you do that, it’s not worth it. But you don’t have to be so fatalistic.

 

[miacomet]

What the **** are you talking about? This is a forum for physicians and medical students. Was your medical school a trade school?

What the **** are you talking about? This is a forum for physicians and medical students. Was your medical school a trade school?

That's not what I wrote- I wrote that the trades can be a better deal than higher education, medical school included.

 

[doggydog]

That's not what I wrote- I wrote that the trades can be a better deal than higher education, medical school included.

Everyone aspires to be an electrician or plumber when they are older. Everyone aspires to marry an electrician too.

 

[miacomet]

Everyone aspires to be an electrician or plumber when they are older. Everyone aspires to marry an electrician too.

People aspire to different things. The ROI for training to be a plumber is pretty good, it's easier to be your own boss, there are no CMGs, and no third party payers. And I really, really appreciate my plumber when I need them! As to marrying- to each his own, no?

Not everyone who goes into medicine aspires to something. Many may or do, but for others it might be the path of least resistance or simply expected or a well-worn path. Some consider it "prestigious," but others may sniff at clinical medicine in comparison to other fields/careers.

 

[miacomet]

People aspire to different things. The ROI for training to be a plumber is pretty good, it's easier to be your own boss, there are no CMGs, and no third party payers. And I really, really appreciate my plumber when I need them! As to marrying- to each his own, no?

Not everyone who goes into medicine aspires to something. Many may or do, but for others it might be the path of least resistance or simply expected or a well-worn path. Some consider it "prestigious," but others may look down on clinical medicine, and particularly EM.

 

[EctopicFetus]

People aspire to different things. The ROI for training to be a plumber is pretty good, it's easier to be your own boss, there are no CMGs, and no third party payers. And I really, really appreciate my plumber when I need them! As to marrying- to each his own, no?

Not everyone who goes into medicine aspires to something. Many may or do, but for others it might be the path of least resistance or simply expected or a well-worn path. Some consider it "prestigious," but others may sniff at clinical medicine in comparison to other fields/careers.

Plumbers have their own issues. I dont **** on the tradespeople cause they do **** I dont know about and fix problems when I have them.

They can try to start their own plumbing business but someone else is bigger. The difference is that I cant just pop open an ED and staff it with my friends. The CON in my home state is essentially impossible. The plumber can’t do that but they have their own issues. The CMG insanity on Emdocs today was classic!

 

[hoot504]

There's nothing wrong with pursuing a trade. More than that, I agree w/ miacomet, it can be a very wise decision for someone early in their life. Better to learn some skills early and potentially own your job than rack up debt attaining your B.A. in underwater basket weaving.

 

[p1acebo]

People aspire to different things. The ROI for training to be a plumber is pretty good, it's easier to be your own boss, there are no CMGs, and no third party payers. And I really, really appreciate my plumber when I need them! As to marrying- to each his own, no?

Not everyone who goes into medicine aspires to something. Many may or do, but for others it might be the path of least resistance or simply expected or a well-worn path. Some consider it "prestigious," but others may sniff at clinical medicine in comparison to other fields/careers.

Cool story bro, maybe you should quit and become a plumber?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[miacomet]

Cool story bro, maybe you should quit and become a plumber?


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

LOL. If I had to do it again, I might, at least from the financial perspective!

 

[TheComebacKid]

I don't buy the argument that crushing debt should serve as a major impetus to pursue a career with a CMG. While academic salaries of course pale in comparison to what a CMG will pay you, the fact of the matter remains that many academic attendings do fine from a debt standpoint. Many of my attendings who make 190K-250K (probably closer to 300K for upper leadership) paid off their loans within 4-5 years post residency. Do they live in the same caliber homes as the attendings at our community site? Of course not. They drive Toyotas. But they are far from suffering, and their debt is not hanging over their head.

The bottom line is that many of them are very happy at work in spite of their lesser salary.

By all means, if you are happier working for a CMG because the added income adds a lot to your life, I am nobody to judge. But as an outsider looking in and being a resident at a program that has a roughly equal split between the community site which is run by a CMG and the academic site, the academic physicians to me seem a lot happier. I know not all CMGs are the same and not all hospitals/jobs are the same, but these are just my casual observations.

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

Most doctors don’t pay off their debt in 4-5 years. Paying off debt early is a realitvely new thing in doctor circles.

 

[GeneralVeers]

Many of my attendings who make 190K-250K (probably closer to 300K for upper leadership) paid off their loans within 4-5 years post residency. Do they live in the same caliber homes as the attendings at our community site? Of course not. They drive Toyotas. But they are far from suffering, and their debt is not hanging over their head.

Ughh.....that's a dealbreaker for me.

 

[miacomet]

Ughh.....that's a dealbreaker for me.

hahahaha

 

[deleted547339]

Ughh.....that's a dealbreaker for me.

Some of us have Honda’s.