the bill has passed- whats gonna happen to us?

[Marcus X]

First of all, I do not need anyone or any government to control me b/c I have enough common sense to figure out when I can afford something and when I cannot afford something! I know when I can afford to have children, I know when I can afford to buy a nice car, nice house, etc. I know how to budget money. I know when its a good time to have children and when its NOT a good time. etc. it sounds like common sense that everyone should have, but obviously medicaid people do not have.
Why on earth will someone have children KNOWING that they can't afford it???? Hmm...I wonder...maybe its b/c of the welfare money they will be getting!

I never said that the government should limit the number of children that one should have, but they should definetly limit the amount of money given to these people...they obviously give a very generous amount that is why welfare moms have sooooo many children. All I am saying is that those people should use some common sense and know when they can afford to have children and when they cannot. Having children is within your control, and therefore everyone should have the common sense to figure out when is a good time to have children and when its a bad time. Just like I should know right now is a bad time for me to buy a 100K car and it would be foolish of me to go out and buy one right now and it would be even more foolish for me to expect someone else to pay for it!

The problem with ignorant people like you, is that you don't know just how ignorant you are. I'm sure that in your fantasy world, everyone on Welfare is living the high-life, driving Escalades and eating caviar for dinner. Apparently that's the side of Welfare that I missed. Similarly, anyone who is ill for any reason has their own bad habits to blame.

I know that when we were on Welfare we were living LARGE off of $400 a month. You should have seen us! It was great the way my parents planned it too; they must have been some kind of GENIUSES. So here's what they did (take notes). When my dad was about 14 or so he made sure to get diabetes (this is important for later). He did this by intentionally having bad eating habits and not exercising (except for playing baseball, football, and running track in school, but those aren't exercise). When his immune system saw that, it was like, "BAM! No more insulin for you! You are SO cut off." Alright... now.. fast-forward a few years. My parents are married, dad owns a cabinet shop, building and designing custom cabinetry, making a few thousand a month; mom stays home and takes care of the little tyke. But then comes the kicker; you'll love this part. He told his diabetes to step that shiz into overdrive. Bam! Diabetic retinopathy, glaucoma, the whole shebang. Cabinet shop closes, parents separate. Disability and Welfare, here we COME! You couldn't have planned it better! The old type I diabetes/blindness/kidney failure trick! Oldest one in the book!

For a while there, I had planned on starting to shoplift and sell drugs, because I wanted to fit in with all the other Welfare kids, but they all beat me up. I guess, I was really hurt knowing I wouldn't get to go to prison like the rest of them, so I ended up where I am now.

I'd go on, but I truly think it would be lost on you. Here's an idea: please go take a course in basic logic so you can see the GAPING holes in your argument. Then, PULL YOUR HEAD OUT OF YOUR ASS YOU BLITHERING IDIOT. Honestly, I've eaten soup that was more intelligent than you. SOUP!

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[IrishHammer]

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[IrishHammer]

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[IrishHammer]

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[IrishHammer]

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[IrishHammer]

Sorry about the multipost.

 

[IrishHammer]

Its foolish to buy something that you can't afford. I took out 19K this year and will be aprox 75K to 80K in debt when I graduate (hopfully less, depends on the amount of Merit scholarships I recieve). The difference here is that I WILL pay that loan back and in less than 5 years. My credit is around 750, so I will never be dumb enough to buy anything that I can't afford.

You don't know that. What if you can't find a job after graduation? Then you're no better than all the "welfare moms" you so valiantly cry out against. The idea behind welfare is that once the people who are on it no longer need it, they are earning a salary and contribute back into the pot through taxes. Just like how you are borrowing assloads of money from the government under the notion that you will pay it back. For you to use a system that is set up with a similar idea to welfare and then bash welfare makes you uninformed and a hypocrite. And, despite the mounting wall of evidence against you, you still have yet to provide a single shred of data to back up your statements about how everyone "abuses the system". Oh, you have anecdotes about being yelled at by welfare moms? Well, given the nature of your posts, I can't imagine why they'd yell at you. **** off with your anecdotes.

 

[Old Timer]

The most difficult part of this thread is SHC1984 is so blinded by her anger that she sees certain people as less than human. Additionally she allows this anger to blind her to facts, facts for God's sake that blow enormous holes in her arguments. Once your point out that ideas she espouses as truth are factually incorrect, she then says, It's my opinion and I am entitled to it.

She bemoans that fact that these people are getting government benefits when she herself sucks at the government tit with subsidized student loans.

I don't know her well, but if I were a betting man, I would bet this is racially motivated. She does not understand how demonizing groups of people is the first step to genocide. As I pointed out the Nazi's came to power with words, not with weapons. They demonized Jews as "leeches", vermin that were destroying society. They were able to convince the German people they were less than human. Her arguments are Nazi arguments. They are frightening. Not only that, she openly admits she discriminates against people on welfare. I feel there are issues here that are not very healthy for her, for her practice of pharmacy or society in general.

 

[litetigre]

How can you generalized about women on medicaid/welfare when you obviously know nothing about it?

"In 2005 non-elderly females made up 54% of the Medicaid population. Generally speaking, women & children make up about 2/3 of the Medicaid enrollees.​

​

.The blind, disabled and elderly make up 25% of the Medicaid population. Yet, they consume 71% of the Medicaid resources" - Health Care Delivery, McCarthy Schafermeyer

Before you go and stir something up, you need to check some of your facts before you go blabbing about it. Medicaid and welfare spending going up associated with women and children is one of the worse misconception that people have. Yes it was created for women and children, Yes majority of the people in it are women, but that does not mean that they account for most of the spending!
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They are the most now since the implement of medicare part D. Your number since 2005 and part D came in 2007. In the meantime medicaid spending still baloons. But the point is not that if they account for little, then we don't care about the waste. Well, if you are broke, even spending one extra dollar should concern you, wouldn't it? It is only in a fantasy world that we can print money and help everyone.
But please everyone, bashing each other idea and go to the extreme examples do not solve any problem. A policy is not always effective forever. That's why there is a change, amendment, subsitution to law at some point. Furthermore, there is no policy that will please everyone.
Welfare is a system for helping the poor. It is a system set up on entitlement. Recognizing the problem, even President Clinton and Congress made a dramatic change with ADFC. I don't remember exactly but it certainly reduced the duration you're on welfare and you have to find work to receive welfare. Of course there is pro and con of this idea. Cons are it assume everyone on welfare is bad and will push them out the street. Pros is that it cut down the abuse, forcing people to look for job. Clinton's policy was applied during an economic boom, so it's quite amazing that they had money but still be consious about rational spending.
The system have loopholes. When economy is good, the public ignore. But times are bad, states close down parks and services, delay refund, fighfighter and police,teacher lose jobs, furlough for state worker,etc . We must rethink our strategy. We can spend money out of the deficit like president Obama said or we can cut down spending. These schools of thought have been in conflict and there are data backup on both. However, people often fail to come to a compromise.
Back to medicaid, It is a social program and it WILL help a lot of people in need. The sad part is that there are many out there who did not know and did not apply for this benefit. So anyone except social workers out there who said that care about the poor, how often do you go out and advocate and raise awareness to the poor about the service you can offer? However, there are people out there who abuse the system. We don't know whether medicaid spending can sustain until our country go broke. For people who said that you want the lazy to go work, do you have a plan to avoid rationing?
That to be said. Since we are struggling to assist people already on the planet, as a human should we create more human whom we can't nurture the fullest human beings? This will raise the question of woman choice and the government control of abortion and family planning. One side will say that it's wrong and inhumane to prohibit birth of a child. One side will argue that children on the street receive no help and our money should go there, and we make more human and we can't educate them right. Which one is right? There is no definite answer.
Recognizing that bringing both sides to the table is an extremely difficult task. But as an American, I strongly believe united we stand, we will prevail. God bless America!

 

[miamifl]

I have to agree that it doesn't make much sense to keep having children if you're on welfare, but then again EVERYONE"S situation is different. This particular person seems like she is trying to get out of welfare, otherwise she wouldn't be back in school (whatever it is that she is doing and I don't think it's basketweaving, otherwise she would probably not be commenting on the pharmacy forum) which btw is very difficult when you have kids/family, so I don't know what her story is, but I certainly think she deserves a lot of credit for that.

 

[SHC1984]

You don't know that. What if you can't find a job after graduation? Then you're no better than all the "welfare moms" you so valiantly cry out against. The idea behind welfare is that once the people who are on it no longer need it, they are earning a salary and contribute back into the pot through taxes. Just like how you are borrowing assloads of money from the government under the notion that you will pay it back. For you to use a system that is set up with a similar idea to welfare and then bash welfare makes you uninformed and a hypocrite. And, despite the mounting wall of evidence against you, you still have yet to provide a single shred of data to back up your statements about how everyone "abuses the system". Oh, you have anecdotes about being yelled at by welfare moms? Well, given the nature of your posts, I can't imagine why they'd yell at you. **** off with your anecdotes.

I might not find a job that I love, but I will find a job and pay off my loans. There is no way in hell I will be dumb enough to not pay money that I owe and ruin my credit score.

 

[SHC1984]

The most difficult part of this thread is SHC1984 is so blinded by her anger that she sees certain people as less than human. Additionally she allows this anger to blind her to facts, facts for God's sake that blow enormous holes in her arguments. Once your point out that ideas she espouses as truth are factually incorrect, she then says, It's my opinion and I am entitled to it.

She bemoans that fact that these people are getting government benefits when she herself sucks at the government tit with subsidized student loans.

I don't know her well, but if I were a betting man, I would bet this is racially motivated. She does not understand how demonizing groups of people is the first step to genocide. As I pointed out the Nazi's came to power with words, not with weapons. They demonized Jews as "leeches", vermin that were destroying society. They were able to convince the German people they were less than human. Her arguments are Nazi arguments. They are frightening. Not only that, she openly admits she discriminates against people on welfare. I feel there are issues here that are not very healthy for her, for her practice of pharmacy or society in general.

You are just waaaay too emotional here. No, I have nothing against anyone's race and I do not discriminate against welfare people. But like I say...if you rush me on your RX you will get it slower. If you are a good patient and sit there quietly waiting for you RX and don't give me crap, then you will get it within 15 minutes for sure. Thats how I operate.

Her post is offensive to me and I am not the type to sit back and not say anything. Posting about being on medicaid and living off OTHER people's money and showing no remorse about it is offensive. Starting a thread thats says "wow people actually pay for their own medical care???? I can't imagine that! I just leech off the govnrment!!! Yay!!! and I have a 4.0 and my husband doesn't have to work either and my children also get to live off the governement!!!" Sorry that **** is offensive. Kinda like if someone cheated on an exam and then started a thread about, "wow you guys actually study for an exam???? I found the answer key on my professors's desk and didn't have to study at all. I have a 4.0 and didn't do a damn thing to earn it! People are stupid when they actually take time out to study!!" That might not be offensive to most people but its offensive to people that actually STUDIED for the exam. If she didn't so openly post about living off the government and showing that she is actually so proud to do so, then I would not be so offended. Its the same as the cheating situation. Most people will just let that **** slide, but for people that actually studied for the exam its offensive. Plain and simple.

 

[Tinkerbell22]

They are the most now since the implement of medicare part D. Your number since 2005 and part D came in 2007. In the meantime medicaid spending still baloons. But the point is not that if they account for little, then we don't care about the waste. Well, if you are broke, even spending one extra dollar should concern you, wouldn't it? It is only in a fantasy world that we can print money and help everyone.
But please everyone, bashing each other idea and go to the extreme examples do not solve any problem. A policy is not always effective forever. That's why there is a change, amendment, subsitution to law at some point. Furthermore, there is no policy that will please everyone.
Welfare is a system for helping the poor. It is a system set up on entitlement. Recognizing the problem, even President Clinton and Congress made a dramatic change with ADFC. I don't remember exactly but it certainly reduced the duration you're on welfare and you have to find work to receive welfare. Of course there is pro and con of this idea. Cons are it assume everyone on welfare is bad and will push them out the street. Pros is that it cut down the abuse, forcing people to look for job. Clinton's policy was applied during an economic boom, so it's quite amazing that they had money but still be consious about rational spending.
The system have loopholes. When economy is good, the public ignore. But times are bad, states close down parks and services, delay refund, fighfighter and police,teacher lose jobs, furlough for state worker,etc . We must rethink our strategy. We can spend money out of the deficit like president Obama said or we can cut down spending. These schools of thought have been in conflict and there are data backup on both. However, people often fail to come to a compromise.
Back to medicaid, It is a social program and it WILL help a lot of people in need. The sad part is that there are many out there who did not know and did not apply for this benefit. So anyone except social workers out there who said that care about the poor, how often do you go out and advocate and raise awareness to the poor about the service you can offer? However, there are people out there who abuse the system. We don't know whether medicaid spending can sustain until our country go broke. For people who said that you want the lazy to go work, do you have a plan to avoid rationing?
That to be said. Since we are struggling to assist people already on the planet, as a human should we create more human whom we can't nurture the fullest human beings? This will raise the question of woman choice and the government control of abortion and family planning. One side will say that it's wrong and inhumane to prohibit birth of a child. One side will argue that children on the street receive no help and our money should go there, and we make more human and we can't educate them right. Which one is right? There is no definite answer.
Recognizing that bringing both sides to the table is an extremely difficult task. But as an American, I strongly believe united we stand, we will prevail. God bless America!

The problem I have is that the people who really do need it like you said, sometimes don't get it because they don't know they can get it or they barely qualify for it, while other people learn how to bypass the system and don't even need it at all. I don't think anyone on here can come up with 100% undisputed or up to the minute accurate data on how many people abuse it, what percent they're using up that others really need, etc, so yeah it is going to be shady and generalizing to both sides of the argument so I am ready to admit that openly. I just think that either side has emotional views, and some of those happen to be far off to one side or the other... Personally I really dislike all these new shows coming on TV about "16 and pregnant" "18 kids etc etc" (I actually think they just had another). I think it is teaching younger girls that it is socially acceptable to get pregnant at a very young age and not fully branch out and experience all the different options they could have in life if they just waited. I'm not advocating "controlling" anyone at all, but you best believe that if I am a health care provider I will use every bit of knowledge that I can to educate people on their options... Young girls can protect themselves buy using birth control or condoms, or not having sex at all if their religious or social values adhere to that. I honestly don't think it makes the child's life or the mother's life any better to be on welfare if they can easily prevent it that is.

 

[Old Timer]

You are just waaaay too emotional here. No, I have nothing against anyone's race and I do not discriminate against welfare people. But like I say...if you rush me on your RX you will get it slower. If you are a good patient and sit there quietly waiting for you RX and don't give me crap, then you will get it within 15 minutes for sure. Thats how I operate.

Her post is offensive to me and I am not the type to sit back and not say anything. Posting about being on medicaid and living off OTHER people's money and showing no remorse about it is offensive. Starting a thread thats says "wow people actually pay for their own medical care???? I can't imagine that! I just leech off the govnrment!!! Yay!!! and I have a 4.0 and my husband doesn't have to work either and my children also get to live off the governement!!!" Sorry that **** is offensive. Kinda like if someone cheated on an exam and then started a thread about, "wow you guys actually study for an exam???? I found the answer key on my professors's desk and didn't have to study at all. I have a 4.0 and didn't do a damn thing to earn it! People are stupid when they actually take time out to study!!" That might not be offensive to most people but its offensive to people that actually STUDIED for the exam. If she didn't so openly post about living off the government and showing that she is actually so proud to do so, then I would not be so offended. Its the same as the cheating situation. Most people will just let that **** slide, but for people that actually studied for the exam its offensive. Plain and simple.

You know what. I will now have to put you on ignore. It is truly a waste of time to have a conversation with someone who has such a casual acquaintance with the truth. Nothing in what you said above about the student on welfare is the truth. Not a single word. You see people on welfare as less than you. That's a shame. You are a very selfish and evil person that I will choose not to associate with any way shape or form. I feel sorry for you. Life has a way of working out. I hope you never have any role reversals or tragedies befall you. Because you will have to hate yourself the way you hate others. To live a life with so little compassion...... Sad, so very sad....

 

[SHC1984]

You know what. I will now have to put you on ignore. ....

OMG, NO!!!!! anything but that! If putting me on ignore means I don't ever have to read any of your crappy posts again, then by all means please do!

I want to associate with you? you are the one replying to my original post, I don't think I have ever reply to any of yours.

 

[Rebel78]

wow, pretty obvious around here some folks don't have much "life experience" at all.

need to get out in the real world.

 

[Marcus X]

You are just waaaay too emotional here. No, I have nothing against anyone's race and I do not discriminate against welfare people. But like I say...if you rush me on your RX you will get it slower. If you are a good patient and sit there quietly waiting for you RX and don't give me crap, then you will get it within 15 minutes for sure. Thats how I operate.

Her post is offensive to me and I am not the type to sit back and not say anything. Posting about being on medicaid and living off OTHER people's money and showing no remorse about it is offensive. Starting a thread thats says "wow people actually pay for their own medical care???? I can't imagine that! I just leech off the govnrment!!! Yay!!! and I have a 4.0 and my husband doesn't have to work either and my children also get to live off the governement!!!" Sorry that **** is offensive. Kinda like if someone cheated on an exam and then started a thread about, "wow you guys actually study for an exam???? I found the answer key on my professors's desk and didn't have to study at all. I have a 4.0 and didn't do a damn thing to earn it! People are stupid when they actually take time out to study!!" That might not be offensive to most people but its offensive to people that actually STUDIED for the exam. If she didn't so openly post about living off the government and showing that she is actually so proud to do so, then I would not be so offended. Its the same as the cheating situation. Most people will just let that **** slide, but for people that actually studied for the exam its offensive. Plain and simple.

Got a 1 on the reading comprehension part of the PCAT, did we? Let's see what she ACTUALLY said:

"And, yes, it's close to impossible to find a Dr...at least on Medicaid. I know because I've had it before for pregnancy and my kids have it now. I guess that makes me a leech. $*** happens people. The doctors you find are usually in old crappy buildings, with dirty wallpaper on the walls, old squeaky examination tables, you sit there and wait forever, with people piling up in the hall ways, sick kids screaming...one time there were so many people out in the hall way that the fire alarm went off because it got so hot. This went on for 2 years until by some miracle a new medical center was built closer to our house and a Dr. there was accepting new patients, but guess what? He doesn't any more, and the place opened last fall, but we got lucky...and now can enjoy a new building with nice bathrooms and clean examination rooms.

So I guess we'll can just keep on being leeches, while I'm making a 4.0 GPA, with two kids on Medicaid and a husband who had to get on disability. You can now throw stones."

Her first point: She agrees with the previous posters saying that it can be difficult to find a doctor on Medicaid. She knows this because she HAD it before, when she was pregnant. The word "had" in English is the perfect tense of the verb "to have" meaning "to possess". This means that IN THE PAST, she WAS on Medicaid. Furthermore she goes on to state that her children are on it now. Guess those kids should get out there and get to work making shoes for Nike, eh?

Next: She says that even when you do find a doctor on Medicaid, the situation is usually less than optimal. The facilities are old, dilapidated, and worn out. In short, it's not exactly Beverly Hills 90210: Government Edition.

Continuing: She comments that she has a 4.0. The structure and phrasing of her sentence seems to indicate, "Hey, you can call me a leech all you want, but I'm working my ass off to better myself and get out of this situation." The next part of this section, where she comments that her husband had to get on disability sheds some light on the rest of the situation. Perhaps, just perhaps, her husband had a job capable of supporting the family. However, as the poster pointed out previously, "$*** happens", and perhaps hubby sustained some kind of injury which affected his ability to work, and went on disability. Seeing that her husband would likely be unable to return to work for the indefinite future, she decided to go back to school to get an education and a career that would let her support her family, surviving on Medicaid in the short term. You'll recognize that this is somewhat analogous to how the government pays the interest on your student loans while you're in school.

Also: Do you even know what disability means? Are you ******ed. In states which offer disability, such as California and New York, an employee pays a set percentage of their pre-tax wages into a state disability insurance fund. This contribution is optionally matched by his or her employer. In the event that the employee sustains and injury which prevents him or her from working, he or she can receive, in California up to 55% of his or her average weekly pay OR up to $959, whichever is less (2009 figures). The costs to administer and audit this program are paid out of the employee/employer contributions. In short, the money her husband is receiving is out of a fund into which he paid.

I suppose, however, in your world the situation went something like this. "Hey, hubby, you should fall off a house while roofing and break your back so that you don't have to work any more. That way we can just sit around and suck on that fat government teet."

If we accept the extremely-unlikely premise that you'll concede that the husband's collecting of disability benefits isn't intentional and driven by laziness, you'd probably then say that she has no right to be in school and should be working at the Wal-Mart to support her kids. Well, and this might be intensely hard for your to grasp, by that very same logic, YOU shouldn't be in school either. You don't have the money to pay for your schooling, so the GOVERNMENT is paying the interest on your subsidized loans for you; that's what subsidized means, by the way. And please don't mention your credit score. You have NO WAY of knowing what this woman's credit is like. While you may know plenty of people on Medicaid/Welfare/SDI that have poor credit scores, that's irrelevant; say it with me now, "Correlation is not causation. Correlation is not causation." There? Got that?

 

[SHC1984]

If we accept the extremely-unlikely premise that you'll concede that the husband's collecting of disability benefits isn't intentional and driven by laziness, you'd probably then say that she has no right to be in school and should be working at the Wal-Mart to support her kids. Well, and this might be intensely hard for your to grasp, by that very same logic, YOU shouldn't be in school either. You don't have the money to pay for your schooling, so the GOVERNMENT is paying the interest on your subsidized loans for you; that's what subsidized means, by the way. And please don't mention your credit score. You have NO WAY of knowing what this woman's credit is like. While you may know plenty of people on Medicaid/Welfare/SDI that have poor credit scores, that's irrelevant; say it with me now, "Correlation is not causation. Correlation is not causation." There? Got that?

The government offers $8500 sub loans to EVERYONE, even my friends that do NOT need the loans took it out anyways because it's interest free during school. I believe one of my friends took out the 8K sub loan even after his parent's pay for his full tuition, I don't see anything wrong with that. They have six months to pay if off interest free after graduation, so why not take it out? Since its offered to everyone, I do not see anything wrong with taking it out. Kinda like if taxes are flat (everyone pays the same percentage) then there is no need to argue about paying taxes either. Its when things are NOT offered to everyone, that is when people start to argue.

 

[IrishHammer]

The government offers $8500 sub loans to EVERYONE, even my friends that do NOT need the loans took it out anyways because it's interest free during school. I believe one of my friends took out the 8K sub loan even after his parent's pay for his full tuition, I don't see anything wrong with that. They have six months to pay if off interest free after graduation, so why not take it out? Since its offered to everyone, I do not see anything wrong with taking it out. Kinda like if taxes are flat (everyone pays the same percentage) then there is no need to argue about paying taxes either. Its when things are NOT offered to everyone, that is when people start to argue.

So it's perfectly fine for you and your friends to take something that the government offers even if you don't need it, but if someone needs Medicaid to cover their health insurance costs, then according to your posts, they're automatically lazy and irresponsible?

Have you even formed your own beliefs or are you just suffering from "Spoiled Little Rich Bitch Syndrome" where you espout your wealthy parents' beliefs without actually taking the time to look at reality and develop an informed view based on facts? There isn't one single employee at your parents' restaurants that has to rely on any kind of government aid to get by? For their sake, I hope not, because they are sure to get their ass canned in no time, since being on government aid means they must be a lazy person and a terrible worker.

 

[Marcus X]

The government offers $8500 sub loans to EVERYONE, even my friends that do NOT need the loans took it out anyways because it's interest free during school. I believe one of my friends took out the 8K sub loan even after his parent's pay for his full tuition, I don't see anything wrong with that. They have six months to pay if off interest free after graduation, so why not take it out? Since its offered to everyone, I do not see anything wrong with taking it out. Kinda like if taxes are flat (everyone pays the same percentage) then there is no need to argue about paying taxes either. Its when things are NOT offered to everyone, that is when people start to argue.

Disability is available to everyone that meets the requirements: they have to have paid into the system; they have to have a legitimate disability. Furthermore, Medicaid is also offered to everyone who meet the requirements. And, to be perfectly accurate, the loans aren't available to everyone. They are available to everyone who meets the requirements: must be enrolled half-time or better in an accredited institution, must not be in default on any other student loans or owe a refund on an education grant, etc. Furthermore, it's not "interest free". There is interest accruing on the loan while you are in school. However, the government PAYS that interest for you.

So, am I to understand that, by your logic, this woman should not be in school because her husband is unable to work so SHE should be working instead? If your answer is "yes", then you have just implicitly advocated a system in which people can never improve their situation, in which people are kept down by things which happen through no fault of their own. This is America, remember? Here in America, the Land of Opportunity, we believe that you can better yourself and create a better situation for your family and your descendants through hard work and dedication. That is what this woman is attempting to do. However, if it weren't for this temporary help, she'd be forced to work a dead-end job which may or may not have health benefits on the hope that, perhaps, her children will have a better shot at it when or if they get to college which they won't be able to pay for either.

 

[SHC1984]

There isn't one single employee at your parents' restaurants that has to rely on any kind of government aid to get by?

No, pretty much all of them have greencards only and would not be qualified anyways. Chefs actually get paid pretty well... they make around $3500 to $4500 a month. Waitress get tipped very well too, none of them have any little kids, either already grown up or have no kids. Although, I have heard some of the waitresses complain about working very hard and NOT being able to live off of medicaid (they actually say "free govrnement money"), but I know what they mean. LOL...

And my parents aren't rich, they are very hardworking immigrants that pay more taxes than most Americans. That is why its very offensive to hear about people cheating the system. My parents came to this country with only 30K and worked their way up by being HONEST.

 

[SHC1984]

Disability is available to everyone that meets the requirements: they have to have paid into the system; they have to have a legitimate disability. Furthermore, Medicaid is also offered to everyone who meet the requirements. And, to be perfectly accurate, the loans aren't available to everyone. They are available to everyone who meets the requirements: must be enrolled half-time or better in an accredited institution, must not be in default on any other student loans or owe a refund on an education grant, etc. Furthermore, it's not "interest free". There is interest accruing on the loan while you are in school. However, the government PAYS that interest for you.

So, am I to understand that, by your logic, this woman should not be in school because her husband is unable to work so SHE should be working instead? If your answer is "yes", then you have just implicitly advocated a system in which people can never improve their situation, in which people are kept down by things which happen through no fault of their own. This is America, remember? Here in America, the Land of Opportunity, we believe that you can better yourself and create a better situation for your family and your descendants through hard work and dedication. That is what this woman is attempting to do. However, if it weren't for this temporary help, she'd be forced to work a dead-end job which may or may not have health benefits on the hope that, perhaps, her children will have a better shot at it when or if they get to college which they won't be able to pay for either.

all this arguing makes my head hurt. you make some good points...I have to go study now. I will respond later.

 

[docss26]

This thread is getting kind of ridiculous. You all clearly have your own personal beliefs and feel strongly about them. This is America. Not everyone will see eye to eye with you. There is no point in name calling and attempting to make the other look bad or feel bad. This is the way it is. I think we have heard enough from both parties. I am starting to see a lot of redundancy in this thread. A moderator should close this.

 

[spacecowgirl]

Further proof that a person have book smarts but still be a goddamn idiot. Where do you think student loans come from? Some anonymous, bottomless teat? What happens if you get injured and can't finish school or can't work long enough after graduation to pay off your loans, SHC?

Wow, just....wow. I wish I would be there the first time you get your comeuppance out in the real world.

 

[SHC1984]

Further proof that a person have book smarts but still be a goddamn idiot. Where do you think student loans come from? Some anonymous, bottomless teat? What happens if you get injured and can't finish school or can't work long enough after graduation to pay off your loans, SHC?

Wow, just....wow. I wish I would be there the first time you get your comeuppance out in the real world.

What does me taking out student loans have to do with anything? As I have already explained I took out a loan b/c it is interest free. My parents could have sold some land and I could have gone to school without any loans, but why if there is an interest free loan? The land will only go up in value over time so why sell it now? You are the idiot if you took out more than you can pay back. I have already PLANNED out how much and WHEN I will pay my loans back, so I don't need your smart ass telling me about my future when I have already planned it out myself.

 

[SHC1984]

This thread is getting kind of ridiculous. You all clearly have your own personal beliefs and feel strongly about them. This is America. Not everyone will see eye to eye with you. There is no point in name calling and attempting to make the other look bad or feel bad. This is the way it is. I think we have heard enough from both parties. I am starting to see a lot of redundancy in this thread. A moderator should close this.

+1

People here are obviously dead set on changing my mind about supporting welfare moms...and I have thought about it and still do not agree with it. I am getting tired of repeating myself too. People's views are different, I am against affirmative action (heaven forbid you get into a school due to MERIT!), pro choice, atheist, etc. the list goes on. There will always be idiots on here wanting me to change my mind and obey their rules, but thats never going to happen. LOL...

 

[Rebel78]

I wish I would be there the first time you get your comeuppance out in the real world.

No you don't. I honestly hope she never does. People like that can't deal with it most of the time.

 

[miamifl]

+1

People here are obviously dead set on changing my mind about supporting welfare moms...and I have thought about it and still do not agree with it. I am getting tired of repeating myself too. People's views are different, I am against affirmative action (heaven forbid you get into a school due to MERIT!), pro choice, atheist, etc. the list goes on. There will always be idiots on here wanting me to change my mind and obey their rules, but thats never going to happen. LOL...

I agree with the fact that it is wrong to deliberatly keep having children that one can't support, but you were just mean to that woman without knowing her, saying that she's in basket weaving school. I think she's trying to get out of welfare and not bragging about being on it...just a comment, but really, in general people should not get so stressed out trying to change other's minds, specially people you don't even know...this is supposed to be a networking tool to help and share, not to be mean or call names or force one's views on others. Also I don't know if anyone's noticed but that person apparently hasn't even come back to this thread, and here is everyone calling names and arguing about what she posted 2 days ago

 

[spacecowgirl]

I have already PLANNED out how much and WHEN I will pay my loans back, so I don't need your smart ass telling me about my future when I have already planned it out myself.

Where do you think federal student loans come from?

My point was that you have a plan, and that's great, but life doesn't give two sh*ts about your plans. What if you become disabled (through no fault of your own, naturally) and the only job you can physically perform is to be a Walmart greeter for $7.00/hr? How would you pay off those loans then? What happens to unpaid federal loans?

That's my point, which I though was fairly obvious in my last post.

 

[SHC1984]

Where do you think federal student loans come from?

My point was that you have a plan, and that's great, but life doesn't give two sh*ts about your plans. What if you become disabled (through no fault of your own, naturally) and the only job you can physically perform is to be a Walmart greeter for $7.00/hr? How would you pay off those loans then? What happens to unpaid federal loans?

That's my point, which I though was fairly obvious in my last post.

Well then I guess I will have to sell that piece of land then...

 

[Carboxide]

Well then I guess I will have to sell that piece of land then...

No, your PARENTS will sell it. What do you think people who do not have rich parents do?

 

[HRoark]

Where do you think federal student loans come from?

My point was that you have a plan, and that's great, but life doesn't give two sh*ts about your plans. What if you become disabled (through no fault of your own, naturally) and the only job you can physically perform is to be a Walmart greeter for $7.00/hr? How would you pay off those loans then?

Either get it discharged, consolidate, or forgivness. Just in case anyone was curious.

 

[SHC1984]

I agree with the fact that it is wrong to deliberatly keep having children that one can't support, but you were just mean to that woman without knowing her, saying that she's in basket weaving school. I think she's trying to get out of welfare and not bragging about being on it...just a comment, but really, in general people should not get so stressed out trying to change other's minds, specially people you don't even know...this is supposed to be a networking tool to help and share, not to be mean or call names or force one's views on others. Also I don't know if anyone's noticed but that person apparently hasn't even come back to this thread, and here is everyone calling names and arguing about what she posted 2 days ago

I have strong views and I am not the quiet sit there and look pretty type of girl...so yeah.... I don't usually like to start arguements nor do I like to share my views b/c I DO NOT CARE if other people believe them or not. The only thing that matters is ME and whether I believe them or not. I could careless what other people believe. However, for example, when I see people in favor of things like affirmative action or outlawing abortion or other views that I believe in etc. thats when I voice my opinion and it gets ugly. I had a catholic dentist one time tell me that he will not write me a LOR if I don't go to church with him...and I flat out told him there is no such thing as god (I also say some stuff about god that is too offensive to post on here! LOL..but you get hte point) and walked out of the building. He liked me a lot before that incident!

Well, as much as I love to continue this argument of who is right and who is wrong...I can't I have an exam tommorrow. Have a good night.

 

[Rebel78]

The only thing that matters is ME and whether I believe them or not.

You pretty much summed it up right there. I think everybody should see where everybody stands.

 

[Carboxide]

Either get it discharged, consolidate, or forgivness. Just in case anyone was curious.

You realize it's about impossible to get a loan discharged or to get loan forgiveness, right? Good luck with THAT unless you file for bankruptcy...and that's just a whole 'nother bag of toys.

 

[Filler]

The only thing that matters is ME and whether I believe them or not.

Seems to be the only thing you've said thus far that actually makes sense.

 

[HRoark]

You realize it's about impossible to get a loan discharged or to get loan forgiveness, right? Good luck with THAT unless you file for bankruptcy...and that's just a whole 'nother bag of toys.

You most certainly can do both of those things, with bankruptcy being only 1 of the ways to achieve one of these ends.

 

[Ackj]

Also: Do you even know what disability means? Are you ******ed. In states which offer disability, such as California and New York, an employee pays a set percentage of their pre-tax wages into a state disability insurance fund. This contribution is optionally matched by his or her employer. In the event that the employee sustains and injury which prevents him or her from working, he or she can receive, in California up to 55% of his or her average weekly pay OR up to $959, whichever is less (2009 figures). The costs to administer and audit this program are paid out of the employee/employer contributions. In short, the money her husband is receiving is out of a fund into which he paid.

I'm not sure what the actual NY law is, but I know my mom was out of work for around 3 weeks (removing cancerous colon polyp) and she got around $400 per week. If you sit back and say "oh, thats $20k a year, thats great" you're certainly wrong. Your budget and expenses are based off of your income, so when something unexpected comes along, you can be in serious trouble. Fortunately, my parents have a decent amount of money saved, but they still have a mortgage and bills to pay, and they try to help me out a little bit with tuition. This is a prime example of how useful disability can be. You never know what can come up and disrupt your ability to pay bills, so some assistance can be needed. Next time you look at your paycheck and groan about the few dollars that are deducted for disability, think of it as an investment for when you or somebody you know might get some bad luck and need it.

 

[SHC1984]

You pretty much summed it up right there. I think everybody should see where everybody stands.

That just means that I do NOT try to enforce my views on other people. Which is something that everyone else here has yet to learn. If you go back and re-read my original post you will see that I was just recommmending to a welfare mom to THINK twice about having more children especially with the country's current economy and crime rates. No where was I trying to enforce my views on anyone here, I was just asking a welfare mom to think twice before she has more children that she obviously CANNOT afford. Which is actually for her benefit...LOL...That is all and then a TON of people seem to think they need to change my views and add words in my mouth that I did not say. No where on this thread did I mention any government involvement, student loans, or anything else.

 

[Marcus X]

That just means that I do NOT try to enforce my views on other people. Which is something that everyone else here has yet to learn. If you go back and re-read my original post you will see that I was just recommmending to a welfare mom to THINK twice about having more children especially with the country's current economy and crime rates. No where was I trying to enforce my views on anyone here, I was just asking a welfare mom to think twice before she has more children that she obviously CANNOT afford. Which is actually for her benefit...LOL...That is all and then a TON of people seem to think they need to change my views and add words in my mouth that I did not say. No where on this thread did I mention any government involvement, student loans, or anything else.

Okay, Princess. I agree with you 100% that people should on Welfare should probably not be having more kids they can't support. However, that's not really the view you've espoused here. You have said that; however, you've also strongly implied that EVERYONE on Welfare/Medicaid/Disability is a lazy bum. What's that phrase again? "The best laid schemes o' mice an' men / Gang aft agley." Oh yeah... that's it. You have plans. Lots of people have plans, sometimes they don't work out. Sometimes **** JUST ****ING HAPPENS. What happens if you get hit by a drunk driver and get paralyzed from the neck down? Is your insurance going to support you for the rest of your life? No. What if they driver of the other car doesn't have insurance? You'll sue them? Can't get blood out of a turnip, sweetheart. (That is to say, in case Stupid is your first language, "You can't get money from someone who doesn't have any money to give you even if the court tells them to give it to you.") People who don't have wealthy parents to bail them out can either flail helplessly, or they can get some help. But under your worldview, these people, once doomed, are doomed forever. You deny them the chance to better themselves, to build wealth, and to, later, bail their faltering children out of trouble.

You are arrogant. You live in a bubble. Not everyone is wealthy. Not everyone has all the opportunities than you have. You are completely correct that people should not buy things they can't afford. You are also correct that some people do and that some people are lazy. You cannot, CANNOT generalize this to all people on Welfare/Medicaid/Disability. It's simply not a valid generalization.

The only view that people want you to change is the view that every single person on Welfare is a lazy bum. People want you to accept that not everyone is as fortunate as you. We just want you to see that sometimes bad **** happens to good people. All we have on this tiny little rock on the edge of some massive galaxy in the cold, dark reaches of space are each other. It's to the benefit of everyone to help these people get back up on their feet and begin contributing to society. Please, just try to see that. Maybe the system has flaws; maybe it could use some tuning up. That does not mean that everyone who uses it is abusing it. It does not mean that the idea itself is flawed.

Please.

Please just try to see that.

 

[HolyLights]

Okay, Princess. I agree with you 100% that people should on Welfare should probably not be having more kids they can't support. However, that's not really the view you've espoused here. You have said that; however, you've also strongly implied that EVERYONE on Welfare/Medicaid/Disability is a lazy bum. What's that phrase again? "The best laid schemes o' mice an' men / Gang aft agley." Oh yeah... that's it. You have plans. Lots of people have plans, sometimes they don't work out. Sometimes **** JUST ****ING HAPPENS. What happens if you get hit by a drunk driver and get paralyzed from the neck down? Is your insurance going to support you for the rest of your life? No. What if they driver of the other car doesn't have insurance? You'll sue them? Can't get blood out of a turnip, sweetheart. (That is to say, in case Stupid is your first language, "You can't get money from someone who doesn't have any money to give you even if the court tells them to give it to you.") People who don't have wealthy parents to bail them out can either flail helplessly, or they can get some help. But under your worldview, these people, once doomed, are doomed forever. You deny them the chance to better themselves, to build wealth, and to, later, bail their faltering children out of trouble.

You are arrogant. You live in a bubble. Not everyone is wealthy. Not everyone has all the opportunities than you have. You are completely correct that people should not buy things they can't afford. You are also correct that some people do and that some people are lazy. You cannot, CANNOT generalize this to all people on Welfare/Medicaid/Disability. It's simply not a valid generalization.

The only view that people want you to change is the view that every single person on Welfare is a lazy bum. People want you to accept that not everyone is as fortunate as you. We just want you to see that sometimes bad **** happens to good people. All we have on this tiny little rock on the edge of some massive galaxy in the cold, dark reaches of space are each other. It's to the benefit of everyone to help these people get back up on their feet and begin contributing to society. Please, just try to see that. Maybe the system has flaws; maybe it could use some tuning up. That does not mean that everyone who uses it is abusing it. It does not mean that the idea itself is flawed.

Please.

Please just try to see that.

This just sums up what everyone has been trying to say all this time. People's view of the world doesn't change over night. Only through personal experiences will they be able to walk in the shoes of those that are unfortunate enough to experience hardships. Until then, they can sit on their high horse and say whatever. Don't worry, that's what Karma is for, to teach them a lesson that words can't.

 

[spacecowgirl]

Either get it discharged, consolidate, or forgivness. Just in case anyone was curious.

So who eats those costs of money that is never recovered? Oh yeah, tax payers. Who is the "leech" now?

 

[spacecowgirl]

The only view that people want you to change is the view that every single person on Welfare is a lazy bum. People want you to accept that not everyone is as fortunate as you. We just want you to see that sometimes bad **** happens to good people. All we have on this tiny little rock on the edge of some massive galaxy in the cold, dark reaches of space are each other. It's to the benefit of everyone to help these people get back up on their feet and begin contributing to society. Please, just try to see that. Maybe the system has flaws; maybe it could use some tuning up. That does not mean that everyone who uses it is abusing it. It does not mean that the idea itself is flawed.

Word.

 

[avuong]

not write me a LOR if I don't go to church with him...

quoted for truth (qft)

 

[Tinkerbell22]

I have strong views and I am not the quiet sit there and look pretty type of girl...so yeah.... I don't usually like to start arguements nor do I like to share my views b/c I DO NOT CARE if other people believe them or not. The only thing that matters is ME and whether I believe them or not. I could careless what other people believe. However, for example, when I see people in favor of things like affirmative action or outlawing abortion or other views that I believe in etc. thats when I voice my opinion and it gets ugly. I had a catholic dentist one time tell me that he will not write me a LOR if I don't go to church with him...and I flat out told him there is no such thing as god (I also say some stuff about god that is too offensive to post on here! LOL..but you get hte point) and walked out of the building. He liked me a lot before that incident!

Well, as much as I love to continue this argument of who is right and who is wrong...I can't I have an exam tommorrow. Have a good night.

Wow that is pretty funny! He wanted you to go to church for your LOR... that is the first time I've ever heard something like that! My dentist is really laid back and he's hilarious too... The building has really tall and skinny windows with mirror tint on them and a bus stop right outside the room. People are always coming up to the mirror and picking at their nose and making faces and doing stuff at the bus stop because they don't think we can see them so he sits there and makes you laugh the whole entire time. One time during the harley bike week the house across the street was being rented out and they had a jacuzzi on the balcony. Let's just say some pretty crazy stuff was going on in broad daylight because they thought no one could see them up there and he told everyone all about it when we came in for our appointments.

 

[Ackj]

You see, Compassion activates Gs--> adenylyl cyclase --> cAMP --> phospho kinase A pathway, and welfare funds activate in parallel the TKR --> ras --> MAP kinase cascade which leads to the synergistic downstream regulation of the brain centers involved in impulse control, saving money, and commiting lower levels of crime. One can say, Compassion + welfare are the signalling molecules for picking one's self up from one's own bootstraps.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

Why the hell is a dentist writing a LOR? I'll write one for anybody on here. I'll make **** up that makes you sound like a person awarded the damned Medal of Honor.

And that said, Ayn Rand was a ****ing *****. 1984 should go read her stuff. She sounds just like her. But oddly less logical...

 

[Carboxide]

Why the hell is a dentist writing a LOR? I'll write one for anybody on here. I'll make **** up that makes you sound like a person awarded the damned Medal of Honor.

And that said, Ayn Rand was a ****ing *****. 1984 should go read her stuff. She sounds just like her. But oddly less logical...

Lol...I want one! But SHC originally applied to dentist school and then decided on pharmacy.

 

[rphello]

And that said, Ayn Rand was a ****ing *****. 1984 should go read her stuff. She sounds just like her. But oddly less logical...

I was thinking the same thing. And I thought her followers only existed in laboratories.

 

[SHC1984]

Either get it discharged, consolidate, or forgivness. Just in case anyone was curious.

You can only do that stuff for business loans, credit card debt, etc. For student loans the ONLY way to get out of that is DEATH. If anyone can just so easily get rid of student loans then everyone on here might as well borrow 300K+ and then file for "forgivness" after graduation.