The Clinical Complaint about Columbia

[kitejunky27]

Hi all,

Seems to me that Columbia has been getting bashed on a bit recently for two main reasons, its cost, and its supposed lack of clinical training. Not going to go into the cost as thats a personal judgement, but I want to share some thoughts about the clinical aspect.

I talked to my dentist/mentor about his opinion on Columbia's supposed weakness and wanted to share it.

He says that no matter where you go to school your going to really learn your clinical skills and get them up to speed in the one or two years immediately following school, likely in a residency or a specialty program. He therefore says that for as far as picking schools we should be more concerned about the quality of the medical education than the amount of clinical practice mandated. There are obviously tons of good schools with great programs out there, but I am a little tired of seeing Columbia written off so fast by so many as the typical example of a clinically weak school (Though thats debatable since its really up to the student to get their clinical skills in shape and since I have heard Columbia has a new curriculum which gets students into clinic earlier).

Anyway just something to think about. Take it or leave it. Not really trying to get into a detailed argument about Columbia's strengths and weaknesses just wanted to share some advice I was given.

Good luck choosing everyone

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[lazybummy]

He says that no matter where you go to school your going to really learn your clinical skills and get them up to speed in the one or two years immediately following school, likely in a residency or a specialty program. He therefore says that for as far as picking schools we should be more concerned about the quality of the medical education than the amount of clinical practice mandated. There are obviously tons of good schools with great programs out there, but I am a little tired of seeing Columbia written off so fast by so many as the typical example of a clinically weak school (Though thats debatable since its really up to the student to get their clinical skills in shape and since I have heard Columbia has a new curriculum which gets students into clinic earlier).

Exactly what my dentist/mentor said.. im following his advice.. and as Corky said at UPenn about SDN... "It's like the blind leading the blind". Take everything in with a grain of salt.

 

[junkemails44]

Great post. I truly feel that it comes down to a personal preference. Do not listen to people's opinions, since they are in the same shoes as you are; they really do not know much more than you would know. But for me, price is a big thing. I honestly loved the two NYC schools, but I could not look past the price.

 

[cmills66]

Great post. I truly feel that it comes down to a personal preference. Do not listen to people's opinions, since they are in the same shoes as you are; they really do not know much more than you would know. But for me, price is a big thing. I honestly loved the two NYC schools, but I could not look past the price.

same here

 

[armorshell]

I talked to my dentist/mentor about his opinion on Columbia's supposed weakness and wanted to share it.

He says that no matter where you go to school your going to really learn your clinical skills and get them up to speed in the one or two years immediately following school, likely in a residency or a specialty program. He therefore says that for as far as picking schools we should be more concerned about the quality of the medical education than the amount of clinical practice mandated.

Did your dentist/mentor graduate from Columbia?

 

[kitejunky27]

No he graduated from UMDNJ

 

[lazybummy]

Mine graduated from NYU

 

[AskJeeves]

According to predents.com Columbia is less expensive ($166,436) than NYU ($197,388), Temple out of state ($172,312), UPENN ($195,880). So, what you talkin bout Willis?

 

[The Anhedonia]

Did your dentist/mentor graduate from Columbia?

armorshell, don't you go to UoP, one of the most expensive schools in the country? (granted it's 3 years, but still)

i agree with the op. those who bash columbia either have (a) never been there nor have seen the curriculum/facilities/etc., (b) were invited to an interview, but didn't pay attention to what the faculty/current D3's and D4's had to say, (c) don't know that Columbia just received the highest possible "grade" of accredidation from the ADEA (so much so that the committee left 2 days earlier than scheduled), or (d) fail to realize that no school is going to make you a dental master once they hand you a degree.

just my $0.02

 

[ucla2134]

I interview there, got a chance to talk to students there. Long story short, do not go there if your only goal is GP.

 

[The Anhedonia]

I interview there, got a chance to talk to students there. Long story short, do not go there if your only goal is GP.

yes, columbia openly admits that their program is more or less designed to send you on the track of specialization, but that includes doing GPRs/AEGDs. Besides, many practicing dentists recommend that you do advanced education to increase your speed and the repertoire/scope of your skills.

 

[hunterpostbacst]

yes, columbia openly admits that their program is more or less designed to send you on the track of specialization, but that includes doing GPRs/AEGDs. Besides, many practicing dentists recommend that you do advanced education to increase your speed and the repertoire/scope of your skills.

My close friend in columbia told me that their medical classes were not good for those who wanted to learn much clinical experience in school and be a GP following upon graduation. It's simple. 24 hours are given to us and they force students to study more on sciences, then you can imagine how much less experience clinics!

 

[wwdaffodils]

I worked with a dentist who graduated from Columbia about two years ago, and she took the GP route. She was a non-traditional student and dentistry was her second career, so from the beginning she knew she wanted to practice dentistry as soon as possible so she had no interest in specializing. She did say that the Columbia administration doesn't especially encourage people to go directly into private practice, but that it can certainly be done. Even though she was done with her requirements in her 4th year, she was still in the clinic as much as possible to get as much practice as she could get. You get what you put into it, basically, just like every other school.

 

[The Anhedonia]

You get what you put into it, basically, just like every other school.

 

[Skygrandpager]

According to predents.com Columbia is less expensive ($166,436) than NYU ($197,388), Temple out of state ($172,312), UPENN ($195,880). So, what you talkin bout Willis?

Then that info is from ~1980. The tuition+fees is easily over 200k. not sure about the rest tho.

 

[somethinpositiv]

Then that info is from ~1980. The tuition+fees is easily over 200k. not sure about the rest tho.

Predents has a ton of good information, but you really can't look at their tuition numbers. I'm not sure if they've ever been updated... lol

 

[pinetar321]

Here is columbia's cost breakdown according to the financial aid flyer they gave me:

Year 1 : Tuition + Fees + Books = $57,448 + $17,482 Living = $74,930
Year 2 : Tuition + Fees + Books = $57,763 + $18,716 Living = $76,479
Year 3 : Tuition + Fees + Books = $56,493 + $22,459 Living = $78,952
Year 4 : Tuition + Fees + Books = $57,728 + $19,650 Living = $77,378

Grand Total $229,432 + $78,307 = $307,739

 

[pinetar321]

Also JUST tuition each year is $47,132 for a grand total of $188,528

 

[armorshell]

armorshell, don't you go to UoP, one of the most expensive schools in the country? (granted it's 3 years, but still)

I fail to see what that has to do with anything.

 

[junkemails44]

same here

You're a wise man...haha That is why you will be my classmate next year

 

[WUD UP]

armorshell, don't you go to UoP, one of the most expensive schools in the country? (granted it's 3 years, but still)

i agree with the op. those who bash columbia either have (a) never been there nor have seen the curriculum/facilities/etc., (b) were invited to an interview, but didn't pay attention to what the faculty/current D3's and D4's had to say, (c) don't know that Columbia just received the highest possible "grade" of accredidation from the ADEA (so much so that the committee left 2 days earlier than scheduled), or (d) fail to realize that no school is going to make you a dental master once they hand you a degree.

just my $0.02

Hey can you post where you saw the "grade of accredidation" for columbia? i really wanna check that out

 

[ozzie33]

(c) don't know that Columbia just received the highest possible "grade" of accredidation from the ADEA (so much so that the committee left 2 days earlier than scheduled)

just my $0.02

I'm going to have to call BS on this until you show a source, which I am willing to be there isn't because any list of "grades" given to dental schools by the ADEA would already be all over these boards in threads such as "rank these dental schools".

 

[armorshell]

I'm going to have to call BS on this until you show a source, which I am willing to be there isn't because any list of "grades" given to dental schools by the ADEA would already be all over these boards in threads such as "rank these dental schools".

The highest possible grade given out by CODA is "Pass"

 

[pinetar321]

i can confirm the "accreditation." McManus said it to us on my interview day. They're pretty much the balls.

 

[ozzie33]

The highest possible grade given out by CODA is "Pass"

haha well then I stand corrected

 

[Skygrandpager]

haha well then I stand corrected

So it's either pass or fail and they got pass. Not super crazy awesome pass ? On a side note, has there been any failed accreditations to any d schools in recent years?

 

[The Anhedonia]

Hey can you post where you saw the "grade of accredidation" for columbia? i really wanna check that out

this is just what we were told during our interviews. nothing more, nothing less. they explained that CODA (or whomever) was impressed with the quality the cirriculum that they even left 2 days earlier than scheduled. take what you want from that.

I'm going to have to call BS on this until you show a source, which I am willing to be there isn't because any list of "grades" given to dental schools by the ADEA would already be all over these boards in threads such as "rank these dental schools".

just what we were told. however, CODA does have certain thresholds for accredition, and it is based on these thresholds that they eventually decide to make schools "not reporting requirements" or "reporting requirements".