The hardest thing about med school is...

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shorrin

the ninth doctor
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applying. Well that's what my med-school friends tell me. Perhaps they secretly are jealous of all my free time and want to bring me down to their desperate level ;) .

seriously, though, I wanted to know what you think has been the hardest part for you so far...applying, that first day of gross etc...

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Being on OB call and getting no sleep. Then having to be at OB clinic until 5 pm the next day. Just when I thought I could go home and get some sleep, our attending decided to round at 5:30pm until 6:15. So, if you're counting, that's from 5:30 AM one day to 6:15 pm the next without a wink of sleep. I think that was hardest part of med school for me so far. The thought of doing it again in another 3 days wasn't any fun either.
 
Though I haven't hit the clinical years yet, so far just getting in has been the toughest. When you are in all you have to do is stay in. Getting there is the problem!
 
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So far, as a first-year med student, I have to second the vote for getting in. The entire application process is the most arbitrary, nerve-wracking, highly flawed procedure you can possibly imagine. Once you're in, it's quite difficult to fail out- and barring some disaster or change in plans, you will emerge with MD/DO in hand four years later. Virtually every graduate of every accredited U.S. school WILL get a residency somewhere (though maybe not in the top program in a highly competitive field- that depends a lot on your med school performance and board scores.)
 
Trying to focus for a month and a half to study for the USMLE Step I. It was sooo hard to no get discouraged, peak to early, or become distracted during that period. Also, the stress of waiting for your score was the worst. My personal worst so far... --BeeGee
 
My top three-
1) Surgery rotation. I had a lot of days like the OB day described above. I don't remember those three months due to sleep deprivation (if you don't sleep, you can't process short term memory to long term memory.)
2) Anatomy. It was first thing, first year. I suck at rote memorization, and the lectures sucked.
3) Getting in. Expensive, arbitrary, soul-crushing and time-consuming.

The three best things:
1) Seeing a pancreatectomy. I *do* remember that! The pancreas is just such a cool organ and the anatomy (in a live person) is just so neat.
2) Amanda and Brian, my study buddies. They rock.
3) The endless (and useless) cocktail trivia I now know. Very cool.

-Mary
 
While getting in wasn't easy...I can't say the first year has been much fun so far. Go to class all day, sit and memorize mindless facts all night, sleep a little, repeat. Not exaclty my idea of a good time. I HATE MEMORIZING!
 
Staying awake post call (4:30am prev. day) for a boring afternoon (5pm) lecture by a psychologist on something which I don't remember because I didn't stay awake.
 
Hardest:
1. Stress of getting in...especially when you're married and someone ELSE's life is affected too

2. Trying to stay motivated to study...day after day after day after day after day

3. Trying to come to grips with the fact that you're probably going to fail your neuroanatomy exam tomorrow because you FAILED to stay motivated and have spent half the night (after an entirely wasted day) on SDN instead of studying a bunch of mindless details that you will forget 2 days from now anyway. (yes, this is me tonight boys and girls...I'm screwed)

ps- see my post about Time & Effort vs. Number of Test Questions....
 
1. Realizing that if you study hard and take a day off a week you can pass.

2. Realizing that to earn 2 more points on the exam, you would've had to've studied an extra 40 hours.

3. Scribing a VERY BAD lecturer's lecture into something that makes sense.

Star
 
The finals. All of them, but especially those of anatomy, pathology and pharmacology. Mostly anatomy and pharmacology. Ok, I HATED ANATOMY. After this exam i made my lifetime commitment: To become the minister of education and penalize anatomy teaching with death.
 
I agree with the Cobragirl and Starflyr. It's tough being motivated day after day, sometimes I feel like a drone. And the returns of getting that extra point on a test means an investment of 10 more hours of studying.

It's really tough being caught up with everything. The volume really is tremendous. With the exception of one test so far I haven't had the chance to actually go over all of the material.
 
Getting in was easy compared to staying in.

Whoever tells you that getting in is the hardest part is a damned liar. Anatomy and biochemistry both sucked badly. Studying weeks before pathology exams sucked. Trying to motivate myself to devote hours of summer vacation to Step 1? Oh God. And internal medicine rounds that last for hours? How about standing in on eight-hour surgeries and trying not to collapse from fatigue/boredom and trying not to contaminate anything? Or knowing that some old guy at the VA Hospital has pancreatic CA and he asks you what you've found out because no one else will tell him anything. Or neurology, anything about neurology, period. I would happily take all of applying again compared to all of that.
 
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Hannibal - why are you in med school anyway? Is there ANYTHING you like about it????

The hardest thing for me was realizing that no matter how hard I worked, I might just not be quite smart enough to get top grades. Once you're in, it's not too tough to pass if you work hard...BUT, you have to realize everyone in your class is also working hard (even if they act like they don't, they do) and they all were among the top students in high school and often college. Not everyone can honor every class, and I personally felt somewhat defeated that I couldn't ever honor anything. However, I finally reached some acceptance of this, just in time for 3rd year, where, by they way, I am doing a little better thanks to clinical evaluations that even out my low-but-passing exam scores. And, I can now see the light, that I WILL be a doctor and I WILL know enough to diagnose and treat my patients well.
 
Originally posted by tulanestudent:
•Hannibal - why are you in med school anyway? Is there ANYTHING you like about it????

The hardest thing for me was realizing that no matter how hard I worked, I might just not be quite smart enough to get top grades. Once you're in, it's not too tough to pass if you work hard...BUT, you have to realize everyone in your class is also working hard (even if they act like they don't, they do) and they all were among the top students in high school and often college. Not everyone can honor every class, and I personally felt somewhat defeated that I couldn't ever honor anything. However, I finally reached some acceptance of this, just in time for 3rd year, where, by they way, I am doing a little better thanks to clinical evaluations that even out my low-but-passing exam scores. And, I can now see the light, that I WILL be a doctor and I WILL know enough to diagnose and treat my patients well.•••

Not all pre-meds were at the top in high school. Some were not at the top in college either. In college there were a lot of people who studied hard an aced everything and were not pre-med. When I needed help with organic chem, the person that helped me was NOT a pre-med student. I was a physics major and the people I studied with were going to become physicists and not doctors. Physics came with ease for these people. Yet, they studied like hell and came on top.
 
Fourthwatch, I've been reading several of your posts, and in all of them you are extremely defensive against pre-meds/ meds. I noticed this while reading your posts on "In this day and age who would want to become a doctor..." and in this topic. What's up? Are you tripping? Why this immense vendetta against people who have a passion for medicine?

No one in this topic said anything about pre-meds being the ONLY people at the top of their class. Yes, you are correct, Ph.D.'s/research folks are extremely bright, they take very difficult classes, they study like there is no tomorrow, etc. More power to them. May they succeed in what they are doing and contribute to society in their own way. But that doesn't mean that med folks are inferior or have animosity towards other folks. We are just different. We do what we love and vice versa. I don't undertand why you feel the need to continously defend your value/competitiveness as someone who is not in the med field. Please don't forget that this bulletin board is about those aspiring to go into the health care field, not about those aspiring to become physicists, Ph.D.'s, or the types of folks you seem to defend with such vigor.

I'm sure you'll have quite a response to my post, but I just wanted you to know that no one is bashing you, and if they are they do not represent the majority. We work very hard for what we love, as do other folks in other professions. But we are not concerned about them. We are concerned about us. That's why this bulletin board is called the student DOCTOR -- the doctors that are interested in health.

Peace!
 
Originally posted by MD Dreams:
•Fourthwatch, I've been reading several of your posts, and in all of them you are extremely defensive against pre-meds/ meds. I noticed this while reading your posts on "In this day and age who would want to become a doctor..." and in this topic. What's up? Are you tripping? Why this immense vendetta against people who have a passion for medicine?

No one in this topic said anything about pre-meds being the ONLY people at the top of their class. Yes, you are correct, Ph.D.'s/research folks are extremely bright, they take very difficult classes, they study like there is no tomorrow, etc. More power to them. May they succeed in what they are doing and contribute to society in their own way. But that doesn't mean that med folks are inferior or have animosity towards other folks. We are just different. We do what we love and vice versa. I don't undertand why you feel the need to continously defend your value/competitiveness as someone who is not in the med field. Please don't forget that this bulletin board is about those aspiring to go into the health care field, not about those aspiring to become physicists, Ph.D.'s, or the types of folks you seem to defend with such vigor.

I'm sure you'll have quite a response to my post, but I just wanted you to know that no one is bashing you, and if they are they do not represent the majority. We work very hard for what we love, as do other folks in other professions. But we are not concerned about them. We are concerned about us. That's why this bulletin board is called the student DOCTOR -- the doctors that are interested in health.

Peace!•••

By the way, I have no vendetta. I am a second year med student with a phd and I take offense when people make assumptions about other careers. This has happened on these boards. For instance, people have made statements such as, "Medicine is the only career where one will sacrifice the most." Also, there have been times when people have agreed with me.
 
Why am I here? That's a good question. Probably I don't know how to quit, and don't have any plan that would be any better. If I had a better idea, I'd probably do it.
 
Why am I here? That's a good question. Probably I don't know how to quit, and don't have any plan that would be any better. If I had a better idea, I'd probably do it. ••

For me, listening to people I respect say such negative things about their careers in medicine is the hardest thing about medschool. Will this be coming from my mouth in two or three years? I hope not... I really do.
 
the application procedure was easily the hardest part so far. i'm only a first year, so i have no input on clinical rotations. staying in is MUCH easier than getting in. anatomy was not fun but everyone figures out how to pass. in contrast to what many people here are writing, i do not study day after day- i'm back to the ol' college schedule of sort-of studying for a few weeks (i.e. going to class and conferences) and then stepping it up the week before (or the day before, depending on the class) the test. i suppose since NYU is pass/fail and i'm not looking to go into a competitive residency (internal medicine), i have a lot less stress than other med students. but most of my classmates here seem to be nearly the same.

bud
 
Originally posted by MD Dreams:
•Please don't forget that this bulletin board is about those aspiring to go into the health care field, not about those aspiring to become physicists, Ph.D.'s, or the types of folks you seem to defend with such vigor.
•••


The difference is that a lot of those PhDs will be underemployed and have little job security next to the majority of doctors.
 
hannibal- just the fact that you have a quote from Butthead is enough to make me think youre alright-

the hardest thing...I have to RANK them? hell, applying was a breeze, I still had optimism then...those were the days

Alright, its not THAT bad. I mean, shoot, sometimes you get to sleep, right? and thats pretty cool (in butthead voice)
 
heres my bitch session. :p

the hardest thing about medical school after coming from a big ten university is the small size. it feels like high school...and i hated high school! people gossip all the time...stupid **** like whos hooking up with who. Rumors everywhere! the environment can be so 'in bred' that its stifling. all my college friend are in chicago, 1400 miles away...its hard to meet folks outside medical school...

is it just me or does anyone have similar feelings?
 
Here's a perspective from a fourth year med student. 1) The hardest part of medical school is to interact with dying patients. 2) Realizing that you do not know nearly as much as your attendings and that this process will take years. Just when you thought you know something well, another layer from onion is peeled by your attendings. Remember what the word PIMP stands for when you get on your clinical rotations. Put In My Place. You will know the feeling well. 3) Waiting for residency match results after working so hard for 3.5 years and that may mean not matching at your top 3 choices or even your preferred specialty.
 
Originally posted by giantDHrider:
•heres my bitch session. :p

the hardest thing about medical school after coming from a big ten university is the small size. it feels like high school...and i hated high school! people gossip all the time...stupid **** like whos hooking up with who. Rumors everywhere! the environment can be so 'in bred' that its stifling. all my college friend are in chicago, 1400 miles away...its hard to meet folks outside medical school...

is it just me or does anyone have similar feelings?•••

I am lucky to not have had this problem in med school. The people in school seem to be only in to studying and sleeping every chance they get. They seem to have no interest in other students. The only gossip I have heard had to do with instructors. Some of my classmates even wonder what some are like in their personal lives and if they seem strange, what are they like with their patients.

fw
 
One of the hard things in med school was having to deal with tempermental individuals in my pbl tutorial and clinical skills group.

Also, gross anatomy lab.
 
The hardest thing about med school? Two words: rectal exams.
 
Doing an 8 hour Whipple and with my oh so great luck many complications after being up all night in the OR with a triple hit and run trauma where all 2 of the 11 year old boys and the one 19 year old die. Standing there holding retractors, getting yelled at by the attending who is stressed out because there's some damn artery that's bleeding that we can't find at 4:00 pm post call (that was a 4:30am till 7:00 pm the next day for me, no sleep at all, didn't even get to sit down the previous night). All this because the chief resident wanted me to do this case because it was a patient I was following. Going home and knowing you'll have to do this again in 2 days. Of course no other stretch of time was worse for me during my medical school career.

Although, now waiting for match seems just as bad but it's like labor I guess, you forget how painful those bad days are and just focus on the unpleasant feelings right now.
 
hmmm. I'm not certain that I really should have opened up this can o' worms. However, I am in search of a reality that is more real than my "er" conceptions and more personal than simply watching the docs that I volunteer for.

What I'm wondering now is, are any of you happy in this path you've chosen?
 
the hardest thing for me is gonna be getting up for cell bio tomorrow after drinking tonight... man i can already feel it...

bud
 
What I'm wondering now is, are any of you happy in this path you've chosen?

••

Well, I think I'll be happy once my intern year is over. I like clerkships, for the most part. I don't think I would like doing anything else *more*, except possibly sitting on my ass (or skiing) all day while money rains from the sky. I may yet grow up to be a ski bum, but damn it, I'll be a ski bum with an M.D.!

-Mary
 
i think one of the things that makes the really hard days so bad is that we have very few people that we can identify with. very few, if any, people outside of medicine have any idea what it can be like to tell a twelve year old her brain tumor is back AGAIN and that we really can't do much more for her. but even inside the game, for whatever reason, fellow med students, who you would think would be in a similar position, have a hard time letting you have a beer and just gripe about the way your resident runs rounds like a drill sargeant or interrupts your patient presentation to the attending with a last minute change he just made in management without clueing you in at all.

sure there are times everyone can laugh together and say "oh man, do you remember that attending who pimped everyone on the first names of the people who designed those procedures-what a jerk." but for some (or many) reasons, that end of the day release is often met instead with justification of the behavior and downplaying of events. maybe it's healthier to do this, but it makes things harder for me.

and residents! i mean sure there are a few cool ones. but you would think that since they've been through the med student situation fairly recently, they might remember how it can be. however, it often seems they either quickly forget or take the attitude that since it was tough for them, it will be tough for us. i'm not even simply talking about the work. some residents just have no people skills. how do these people get jobs?? i guess when i look at my class though, i can see those team bosses-to-be. scary.

phew, see now don't i feel better? i should've had a beer ;)
 
Mary,

Good to hear there are other ski bums/docs out there. I am a first year at the U of Utah. We are blessed to be 30-45 minutes from the best snow anywhere. Already have 23 days at Alta this year!
 
Jen grab a beer. You sound like you need one.

Seriously, residents are overworked and underpaid and are too tired to really care much about what interns and medical students think about them. What residents really care about is getting all the work done that the attendings want done. They want to shine as field marshalls in their attendings eyes. Who else are they going to get job letters of recs from? Who is evaluating them so that their contract will be renewed next year or so they can get that covetted fellowship?

Having said all that, sometimes you will find a resident or interns or both that are awesome to work with. I had a team like this during my medicine months. We were literally fighting each other for admissions and procedures and covering for each other. We presented cases and educational blurbs during work rounds. It was about the most fun I ever had outside of radiology, of course. No one treated me like the "dumb" 3rd year medical student or yelled at me. To top this all off, my attending was wonderfull as well. I have not to this day had a team like that. That is what I will strive for when I do my prelim/transitional year.
 
I agree, and I'm not even in my clinical years yet. Many of the my classmates seem to put up huge fronts instead of acting like normal human beings who occasionally screw up. I am learning to show as little vulnerability as possible around these people and to not disclose that I am nervous or scared about anything. One "friend" of mine commented on how she was surprised that I did poorly on our anatomy practice practical (not the real thing) since I had looked at Netter's more than 3 times, and acted as if she did great on the practical. I doubt that she did do that great, but if she did ya think she'd offer to help other people out or something? Apparently not.. oh well.. back to studying.

Originally posted by jen628:
•i think one of the things that makes the really hard days so bad is that we have very few people that we can identify with. very few, if any, people outside of medicine have any idea what it can be like to tell a twelve year old her brain tumor is back AGAIN and that we really can't do much more for her. but even inside the game, for whatever reason, fellow med students, who you would think would be in a similar position, have a hard time letting you have a beer and just gripe about the way your resident runs rounds like a drill sargeant or interrupts your patient presentation to the attending with a last minute change he just made in management without clueing you in at all.

sure there are times everyone can laugh together and say "oh man, do you remember that attending who pimped everyone on the first names of the people who designed those procedures-what a jerk." but for some (or many) reasons, that end of the day release is often met instead with justification of the behavior and downplaying of events. maybe it's healthier to do this, but it makes things harder for me.

and residents! i mean sure there are a few cool ones. but you would think that since they've been through the med student situation fairly recently, they might remember how it can be. however, it often seems they either quickly forget or take the attitude that since it was tough for them, it will be tough for us. i'm not even simply talking about the work. some residents just have no people skills. how do these people get jobs?? i guess when i look at my class though, i can see those team bosses-to-be. scary.

phew, see now don't i feel better? i should've had a beer ;) •••
 
Good to hear there are other ski bums/docs out there. I am a first year at the U of Utah. We are blessed to be 30-45 minutes from the best snow anywhere. Already have 23 days at Alta this year!

••

Pbbt!

On the topic of students who "front"...
I found that most of my classmates do the opposite - "Oh, I did so badly, I'm sure I failed, oh, woe is me!" It is a culture of complaint. I think the trick is finding the small group of normal people in your class. I've found two other people who have lives and significant others and drink some beers and study hard but not too hard.

-Mary
 
I am surprised by people's opinion of the residents that they worked with. After thinking about all of my rotations in third year and the first half of fourth year I can't think of a single resident that I did not get along with. They were all very sympathetic to medical students, sent us home early, enjoyed teaching when they could, and were generally friendly people. I could name 2 that weren't as friendly, but they were by no means the kind of person jen mentions. Maybe I was just lucky. Or maybe some programs have worse resident's than others.
 
"They were all very sympathetic to medical students, sent us home early, enjoyed teaching when they could, and were generally friendly people. "

Wow, maybe I could do residency where you are, they don't seem overworked at all. Where might that be?
 
Remember, residents were just like the students in your class. Some are freakin' gunner a-holes who you couldn't get along with if you tried. On the other hand, some are the coolest people who you would go to the bar with after work.

Worst part of medical school: Blindly going through the first 3.5 years thinking I had to get a certain level of grades or a certain USMLE score just to find out that that crap only matters in the most competitive specialties and really doesn't matter for greater than 80% of us (I'm doing general surgery). Even my friends who matched for ORL weren't AOA.

Advice: learn what you need to, get your grades where you can, don't sweat it when you don't, have a beer (or 6) with your friends (often) even if you're not a big drinker, work hard and play harder. Patients and residents/faculty want intelligent social humans to talk to (even in surgery ). ;)

I've loved almost every day of medical school and really enjoy medicine. I have to say 3rd year was a little painful for me though. <img src="graemlins/wowie.gif" border="0" alt="[Wowie]" />
 
Yeah, I can see where that would be annoying, especially when the complainers are the ones that ruin the curve by getting top scores. But I'd rather have that than "Oh, anatomy is so easy and I just love the smell of formaldehyde and so does my wonderful perfect fiancee/boyfriend/spouse!" Oh yeah, for the record, not all med students without significant others are freaks with no life and warts sprouting on our eyeballs. And with that, I better go treat the warts on my eyeball ;) Oh yeah, to answer the original question, the hardest part of first year is learning how to stay afloat in anatomy and how to study for it. I'm still learning..
Originally posted by Mary the Med Student:


Pbbt!

On the topic of students who "front"...
I found that most of my classmates do the opposite - "Oh, I did so badly, I'm sure I failed, oh, woe is me!" It is a culture of complaint. I think the trick is finding the small group of normal people in your class. I've found two other people who have lives and significant others and drink some beers and study hard but not too hard.

-Mary•••
 
mary the med!

a girl after my own heart...although Id rather be on a board....i hear we are getting more snow in the northeast soon...although i broke my foot, 5th metatarsal, a week and a half a go dancing to ska... cursed injuries!...only 2.5 weeks left till snowboarding though.

med students are a weird lot. many pretending they never study and that they aren't competitive. puhleeeeesssse! except that you want honors grades and move on with your life.

I think Id like to be a ski/board bum too...oh wait, I did that before med school...hehe
 
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