The HRSA predicts an oversupply of ~50,000 pharmacists by 2025; similar predictions for NPs/PAs

[Amicable Angora]

Family is not rich. All graduate schooling undertaken so far has been paid for via federal student loans and the family hasn't paid for anything, just like most pharmacy students' situations. I don't owe anything to anyone; if I actually "took" a spot from someone who applied to pharmacy school and didn't get accepted because of me, then they probably had a pitifully low GPA that was below the required minimum to be eligible to apply in the first place (e.g., <2.1). They probably had stats that were so bad in the first place that they probably wouldn't have received an interview offer even if I hadn't been in the applicant pool. As for AA school, I obviously didn't intend on failing out. Trust me -- if I could step into a time machine and turn the clock back to early January 2016, I would return a week early from Christmas break and start practicing for the lab re-take at least 5-7 days prior to the test day instead of the night before. If I get another opportunity to go to AA school (any school in the country), I will not screw around this time and will be sure to make the most of the opportunity.

... And what does being "lesser qualified and committed" have to do with recognizing attending pharmacy school to be a mistake in light of multiple corroborative nuclear meltdown job market projections? If someone had several years of pharmacy tech experience and was "passionate" about pharmacy, I guess then they'd be well-equipped to pursue a field with such bleak prospects? And why? Oh, because they'd be an example of a "hustler?"

???????????? What you wrote makes no sense. If a spot opened up it would go to the next, qualified applicant. Why would they have a <2.1 GPA?

You say you didn't intend on failing out yet you admit later on that you studied only the night before by cramming for the most important test of your life?

"I will not screw around this time," I guess 3rd times the charm?

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[steveysmith54]

???????????? What you wrote makes no sense. If a spot opened up it would go to the next, qualified applicant. Why would they have a <2.1 GPA?

You say you didn't intend on failing out yet you admit later on that you studied only the night before by cramming for the most important test of your life?

"I will not screw around this time," I guess 3rd times the charm?

I agree... Unless one is going through tough psychological issues and can not focus, not sufficiently studying for something like that is just inexcusable. I think one of his biggest problems is he doesn't know the value of a dollar. How much federal loan money has he wasted? It it were me, I would never give him another govn't subsidized loan until he paid back his loans for AA/Pharm school. Just too much of a liability.

This topic isn't going anywhere. Notice that everyone is in consensus, expect him. How many more times must the same thing be said? He has an excuse for everything. No matter how much you tell him that jobs will still exists for those who are motivated, hardworking, and are an asset to the company. Yeah if you don't do anything except whine on SDN, don't study hard, don't intern, don't try to get a residency you won't have job. He is right about that. He is looking for someone to hand him a job and thinks that grass is always greener on the other side. Enough is enough

 

[BMBiology]

Family is not rich. All graduate schooling undertaken so far has been paid for via federal student loans and the family hasn't paid for anything, just like most pharmacy students' situations.

This is exactly why our student loan program is just stupid. It let people like you jump from one graduate program to another and to another while you take out money for living cost. Who is going to pay for all of this? Most likely other students and other taxpayers.

I don't care that you are wasting your time but go find yourself. Obviously you still have a long way to go.






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[PAtoPharm]

???????????? What you wrote makes no sense. If a spot opened up it would go to the next, qualified applicant. Why would they have a <2.1 GPA?

You say you didn't intend on failing out yet you admit later on that you studied only the night before by cramming for the most important test of your life?

"I will not screw around this time," I guess 3rd times the charm?

If our country would have been ran the right way, you would have had to first pay off your


I agree... Unless one is going through tough psychological issues and can not focus, not sufficiently studying for something like that is just inexcusable. I think one of his biggest problems is i think he doesn't know the value of a dollar. How much federal loan money has he wasted? It it were me, I would never give him another govn't subsidized loan until he paid back his loans for AA/Pharm school. Just too much of a liability.

This topic isn't going anywhere. Notice that everyone is in consensus, expect him. How many more times must the same thing be said? He has an excuse for everything. No matter how much you tell him that jobs will still exists for those who are motivated, hardworking, and are an asset to the company. Yeah if you don't do anything except whine on SDN, don't study hard, don't intern, don't try to get a residency you won't have job. He is right about that. He is looking for someone to hand him a job and thinks that grass is always greener on the other side. Enough is enough

The AA students who were in the class ahead of the one I was a student in graduated a few months ago. Not one of them did anything other than make "ok" grades (e.g., C+/B-) and show up for clinicals. None of them went "above and beyond" in any way as AA students, and yet they all graduated with job offers. This is the case for most CRNA students as well (I.e., most CRNA students graduate with a job offer from one of their clinical rotation sites, and they aren't expected to hustle). What would happen if an AA, CRNA, PA, or some other student enrolled in a (currently) more in-demand health professions program said the same as me in regards to not wanting to do something that requires them to hustle and put in 250% effort just to land not a good job, but just any job at all? Would that make them lazy and unmotivated and uncommitted? What about the pharmacy students who decided to apply to pharmacy school during the 2004-2007 golden era who specifically chose pharmacy because it was an in-demand profession and you could simply graduate as just another student and have multiple job offers in hand? How many of them wouldn't pick pharmacy in its current (and future) economic/job market state, and would they also be lazy, unmotivated, and uncommitted for having that mindset?

... You mentioned residency. Are you kidding me? Even when I had a positive outlook on pharmacy last year, I still knew there was no way in hell I would ever consider applying to residencies. If I'm going to spend potentially 2 years (more than that by the time I graduate?) working 60+ hours a week, it will be as a medical resident, not as a pharmacy resident whose additional input of time, effort, and ballooned loan balance would actually result in a LOWER starting salary than I'd make working in retail. How pathetic... even general PA residency graduates (1-year long) are typically offered a starting salary that is equivalent to what a 5th-year employee of the hospital/practice would make, according to what I've read.

BTW, when I was in AA school, one of my classmates had over $400k in debt. He previously failed out of MD school and also had unpaid loans on a private undergrad degree. He's planning on doing IBR when he graduates. I guess the nice thing about AA schools is that most of them are private, so getting in *somewhere* is probably not as much of a stretch as everyone here seems to think it will be.

 

[PAtoPharm]

This is exactly why our student loan program is just stupid. It let people like you jump from one graduate program to another and to another while you take out money for living cost. Who is going to pay for all of this? Most likely other students and other taxpayers.

I don't care that you are wasting your time but go find yourself. Obviously you still have a long way to go.






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[/QUOTE]

What about the MD/DO graduates who are going on REPAYE or IBR as soon as they graduate from medical school and begin residency? Many of them have $400k+ in loans to pay back and realize that they will come out ahead (I.e., repay less money overall) by going on one of the government repayment programs, especially since their monthly payments during residency will be really low.

Just wondering, what's your opinion of the thousands and thousands of undergraduate students who are taking advantage of the Pell Grant? Since it is a grant, it doesn't have to be repaid, and it covers not only tuition, but living expenses as well. Also, it apparently covers a practically unlimited number of credits/semesters until someone has earned a degree, so there are students out there who have spent 5+ years living on taxpayers' dime and they will never have to pay anything back. At least I will have to go on some sort of repayment program at some point.

Of course, what if I actually stick with pharmacy school but graduate without having hustled enough as a student? Then I'll definitely be letting the taxpayers foot a substantial percentage of the bill, since I'm assuming that a community college teacher's salary won't be enough to afford the minimum payments on ~$250k in loans.

 

[steveysmith54]

I am actually hopeful that you drop out. I don't think you deserve to be a pharmacist.

 

[PAtoPharm]

@Amicable Angora -- what I meant in regards to why I think it's BS that I "took" a spot from someone is that there are so many pharmacy programs out there these days relative to the number of applicants that some programs are actually having a hard time filling their seats. If an applicant can't get in SOMEWHERE, then they probably don't even meet the minimum academic qualifications set by most schools. It's not my problem that even with 140+ pharmacy schools out there, there are still students who couldn't pass the pre-pharm classes with a C average.

 

[PAtoPharm]

I am actually hopeful that you drop out. I don't think you deserve to be a pharmacist.

That's like saying someone doesn't deserve to have their eyes gouged out. What about being an AA or a PA? Do I at least deserve to be one of those, since someone can still get a decent job in either of those fields just by being a nothing-special student?

 

[BMBiology]

What about the MD/DO graduates who are going on REPAYE or IBR as soon as they graduate from medical school and begin residency? Many of them have $400k+ in loans to pay back and realize that they will come out ahead (I.e., repay less money overall) by going on one of the government repayment programs, especially since their monthly payments during residency will be really low.

Just wondering, what's your opinion of the thousands and thousands of undergraduate students who are taking advantage of the Pell Grant? Since it is a grant, it doesn't have to be repaid, and it covers not only tuition, but living expenses as well. Also, it apparently covers a practically unlimited number of credits/semesters until someone has earned a degree, so there are students out there who have spent 5+ years living on taxpayers' dime and they will never have to pay anything back. At least I will have to go on some sort of repayment program at some point.

Of course, what if I actually stick with pharmacy school but graduate without having hustled enough as a student? Then I'll definitely be letting the taxpayers foot a substantial percentage of the bill, since I'm assuming that a community college teacher's salary won't be enough to afford the minimum payments on ~$250k in loans.

That is why I said our student loan program is stupid.

You don't need to be a genius to figure this out:

Hard to get accepted = good job prospects
Easy to get accepted = poor job prospects

That is your formula to success.


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[BMBiology]

^ yes, it is that simple

 

[PAtoPharm]

That is why I said our student loan program is stupid.

You don't need to be a genius to figure this out:

Hard to get accepted = good job prospects
Easy to get accepted = poor job prospects

That is your formula to success.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile app

I think there is also the "loophole" exception that I could get accepted to an AA school again, which is typically a fairly competitive program to gain admission to, if I could make a convincing case that I learned from my past mistakes during my first AA school attempt, and considering that I'll also have a favorable LOR from my previous PD. I forgot to mention that my former PD told me that he wrote a favorable LOR for a previous AA school fail-out who ended up getting accepted to another AA program, so it's happened before. (Ironically enough and unfortunately for the student, he also said that they failed out of their second chance/attempt at AA school)

 

[Muse600]

I wouldn't go back to school anymore...I'd take a trade that would help me get into real estate investing...own a few multi-family units and just retire

 

[BMBiology]

I think there is also the "loophole" exception that I could get accepted to an AA school again, which is typically a fairly competitive program to gain admission to, if I could make a convincing case that I learned from my past mistakes during my first AA school attempt, and considering that I'll also have a favorable LOR from my previous PD. I forgot to mention that my former PD told me that he wrote a favorable LOR for a previous AA school fail-out who ended up getting accepted to another AA program, so it's happened before. (Ironically enough and unfortunately for the student, he also said that they failed out of their second chance/attempt at AA school)

Don't talk. Don't post. Just do it.


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[PharmtoCS]

I wouldn't go back to school anymore...I'd take a trade that would help me get into real estate investing...own a few multi-family units and just retire

This is what I have been trying to tell him. Do something with a fairly low barrier to entry (i.e. trades, computer programming, real estate investing, etc.) and stop jumping from health profession to health profession while wasting tens of thousands of dollars in loans each time.

 

[PAtoPharm]

Don't talk. Don't post. Just do it.


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If a pharmacy-relevant article is published by some source (e.g., Pharmacy Times, etc.), then me or anyone else posting about it is fair game. It's not my fault that the job market is what it is.

 

[PAtoPharm]

This is what I have been trying to tell him. Do something with a fairly low barrier to entry (i.e. trades, computer programming, real estate investing, etc.) and stop jumping from health profession to health profession while wasting tens of thousands of dollars in loans each time.

Taking up a trade would still most likely require me attending a local technical school/community college for at least a couple semesters, which is why I mentioned doing a 3-semester accelerated RN program for <$5k (learning a trade would take just as long). A programming bootcamp could be a good idea but I'd have to do a lot more research on it. Because of the financial requirements (must have a decent amount of money to get started), real estate investing isn't an option right now, unless I use my loan refund money that BMBiology is helping to pay for to buy some dirt-cheap shotgun property.

 

[BMBiology]

If a pharmacy-relevant article is published by some source (e.g., Pharmacy Times, etc.), then me or anyone else posting about it is fair game. It's not my fault that the job market is what it is.

Nobody cares about it. But please stop the whining. You are almost 30 already. Get your act together. Spend more time doing. Spend less time posting.


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[PAtoPharm]

Nobody cares about it. But please stop the whining. You are almost 30 already. Get your act together. Spend more time doing. Spend less time posting.


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Nobody cares about it? If that's the case, then why are experienced pharmacists planning their "exit strategies," as some of the posters here refer to them?

 

[Dalteparin]

Nobody cares about it? If that's the case, then why are experienced pharmacists planning their "exit strategies," as some of the posters here refer to them?

I care about the market. I don't care about your career plan or your angst over it. You've received a lot of good advice on this and the other threads you've posted; are you going to take it? Are you going to grow up, make a decision and stick with it? Or are you going to keep coming back here and whining and wonder why your classmates are so far ahead of you?


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[PAtoPharm]

I care about the market. I don't care about your career plan or your angst over it. You've received a lot of good advice on this and the other threads you've posted; are you going to take it? Are you going to grow up, make a decision and stick with it? Or are you going to keep coming back here and whining and wonder why your classmates are so far ahead of you?


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I agree that some of the advice I've been given is good, if you're talking about the advice that a few posters (such as gwarm01 and bulldog1123) have given to me, which advocates withdrawing from pharmacy school. However, I simply can't agree that staying in pharmacy school could be considered good advice for anyone. I'm not sure that I've ever wondered why my classmates are so far ahead of me, unless you're talking about my former AA school classmates who will be graduating in ~6 months. They truly are ahead of me. But if you're talking about my pharmacy school classmates.... unless someone's dad is a DM for a chain, I don't think any of them are ahead of me in any capacity whatsoever. At the very least, I know for a fact I've never stated as much here.

 

[Amicable Angora]

What were your first semester grades?

 

[PharmDBro2017]

I agree that some of the advice I've been given is good, if you're talking about the advice that a few posters (such as gwarm01 and bulldog1123) have given to me, which advocates withdrawing from pharmacy school. However, I simply can't agree that staying in pharmacy school could be considered good advice for anyone. I'm not sure that I've ever wondered why my classmates are so far ahead of me, unless you're talking about my former AA school classmates who will be graduating in ~6 months. They truly are ahead of me. But if you're talking about my pharmacy school classmates.... unless someone's dad is a DM for a chain, I don't think any of them are ahead of me in any capacity whatsoever. At the very least, I know for a fact I've never stated as much here.

Lol, you sure are smug for someone who in all actuality has zero prospects of any career at the current moment in time. You sir, are truly an idiot.

 

[owlegrad]

Alright no name calling please. I recommend the ignore function if someone is annoying you.

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[WVUPharm2007]

Alright no name calling please. I recommend the ignore function if someone is annoying you.

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You smell bad.

 

[gwarm01]

Pharmacy saved? This article claims a 45% increase in job growth year over year: http://twocents.lifehacker.com/these-jobs-have-the-most-potential-for-growth-in-2017-1791480147

 

[zelman]

Pharmacy saved? This article claims a 45% increase in job growth year over year: http://twocents.lifehacker.com/these-jobs-have-the-most-potential-for-growth-in-2017-1791480147

No. Bad "article".

 

[Amicable Angora]

@Amicable Angora -- what I meant in regards to why I think it's BS that I "took" a spot from someone is that there are so many pharmacy programs out there these days relative to the number of applicants that some programs are actually having a hard time filling their seats. If an applicant can't get in SOMEWHERE, then they probably don't even meet the minimum academic qualifications set by most schools. It's not my problem that even with 140+ pharmacy schools out there, there are still students who couldn't pass the pre-pharm classes with a C average.

Except applicants don't apply globally to every single pharmacy program in 1 application. They could only apply to a few schools. If I recall correctly 5-7 schools seems to be the norm. Then especially for the normal applicant, you just reduced their chances of getting into a program by (1/5 to 1/7 or) 20% to 14.3% by wasting that seat.

What were your first semester grades? Are you still at the school you PMed me a few months ago?

 

[gwarm01]

No. Bad "article".

Nah. I think I'm going to open another pharmacy school to help stave off this upcoming pharmacist shortage.

 

[beautifulrobot]

Pharmacy saved? This article claims a 45% increase in job growth year over year: http://twocents.lifehacker.com/these-jobs-have-the-most-potential-for-growth-in-2017-1791480147

That's still not enough to compensate for the growth in new graduates YoY.

 

[gwarm01]

Guys it was a joke post. I thought my dancing monkey made it clear

I'm quitting my job and going to clown college.

 

[beautifulrobot]

Guys it was a joke post. I thought my dancing monkey made it clear

I'm quitting my job and going to clown college.

Sorry, I couldn't tell if the monkey was a depiction of a hopeful pharmacist or a signal for sarcasm.

 

[qwerty89]

One thing that will keep pharmacy a float, is the fact that 70%+ of graduating classes are now women.

Pharmacy is going to become a lot like nursing, with many practitioners not working a full FTE. Lots of PRN employees a couple days/week.

Yep. The women who marry rich (lots of them) will be fine with this and get benefits from their spouse. Those that expect to be the breadwinner as a PharmD are going to find it much tougher.

Not to mention the more people are willing to work part time the harder it is to get a full time job. Employers would love to hire a bunch of per-diem or part time employees to avoid paying benefits.

 

[PAtoPharm]

Sorry, I couldn't tell if the monkey was a depiction of a hopeful pharmacist or a signal for sarcasm.

Yeah, I was going to say the same thing; 45% annual job growth is nowhere near enough new jobs to accommodate all the new pharmacists that are/will be graduating each year.

 

[Rxed 1996]

This is starting to look like a troll forum, because you're just all over the place.
1) You just want to be a DO b/c you're in it for the money but not willing to work for it. And if you get in the program, you're still going to go into the least competitive field possible without looking into the field? Radiology is one of the hardest ones to get! Most residencies go to MD for those. And considering IF you become a DO, you're going to have to try hard to even match for anything. I'm sure some gunner DOs will take the available residencies before you.
2) No one actually succeeds when they have multiple back-up plans but can't complete any of the back-up plans.
3) You're almost 30. I've seen RN to MD/DO, PharmD to MD/DO, and career switches going at a much faster rate, being done with both before you start with one and drop out...again.
4) It seems like you're not really passionate or unwilling to work hard for an AA/PharmD/RN/PA/DO. Are you even fit for health care?

 

[parjn]

It's actually been a really helpful thread. I'm one of those "yep, I want to go to pharmacy school" students. In fact as it now stands I'll apply to a school in a week. Just one school. I just feel uneasy about the outlook for pharmacists. I have been encouraged by pharmacists, pharmacy students, pre-pharmacy students, family, friends, etc. I've been given the advice that "you do what you gotta do, move wherever you gotta go, work hard, there's always a job somewhere" kind of advice. I just feel uneasy. I really like pharmacy, I'm OK with just getting a part time job even, or floater job. I'm even willing to bust my butt for this. But I can't get rid of my uneasiness quite yet. There's been great discussion in this forum though.

 

[steveysmith54]

It's actually been a really helpful thread. I'm one of those "yep, I want to go to pharmacy school" students. In fact as it now stands I'll apply to a school in a week. Just one school. I just feel uneasy about the outlook for pharmacists. I have been encouraged by pharmacists, pharmacy students, pre-pharmacy students, family, friends, etc. I've been given the advice that "you do what you gotta do, move wherever you gotta go, work hard, there's always a job somewhere" kind of advice. I just feel uneasy. I really like pharmacy, I'm OK with just getting a part time job even, or floater job. I'm even willing to bust my butt for this. But I can't get rid of my uneasiness quite yet. There's been great discussion in this forum though.

How expensive is your school? Problem is a part time gig will make it hard for you to pay off your loans and still have money to live a comfortable life... The future of IBR/PAYE could be uncertain... if you are willing to put in the work, that's a good start... some think PHARMd=guaranteed 130k... unfortunately it no longer is

 

[parjn]

@steveysmith54 My school would cost about $80,000 give or take a couple thousand I'd guess.

 

[Rxed 1996]

@steveysmith54 My school would cost about $80,000 give or take a couple thousand I'd guess.

I hope that is all 4 years. Then it's worth a shot. If that's one year, jump ship.

 

[parjn]

@Rxed 1996 It's all 4 years, and I honestly don't want to go to any other school because it'd definitely be a jump ship situation!

 

[PAtoPharm]

This is starting to look like a troll forum, because you're just all over the place.
1) You just want to be a DO b/c you're in it for the money but not willing to work for it. And if you get in the program, you're still going to go into the least competitive field possible without looking into the field? Radiology is one of the hardest ones to get! Most residencies go to MD for those. And considering IF you become a DO, you're going to have to try hard to even match for anything. I'm sure some gunner DOs will take the available residencies before you.
2) No one actually succeeds when they have multiple back-up plans but can't complete any of the back-up plans.
3) You're almost 30. I've seen RN to MD/DO, PharmD to MD/DO, and career switches going at a much faster rate, being done with both before you start with one and drop out...again.
4) It seems like you're not really passionate or unwilling to work hard for an AA/PharmD/RN/PA/DO. Are you even fit for health care?

I'm "all over the place" because I'm just brainstorming plan B careers at this point (with the intention of choosing one of them very soon). I just mentioned radiology as a potential residency to pursue if I end up going to DO school because it fits my interests, personality, and preference for not having interaction with patients. Maybe it's still a very competitive residency to gain admission to, but I've read that it has become less competitive in recent years due to Medicare reimbursement cuts. But either way, I'm staying open to considering other potential residencies. I know it's taking me a long time to accomplish anything, but why should anyone obligate themselves to finishing an endeavor like pharmacy school if they're aware of the bleak outlook and if there is even a remote chance they can sidestep into something more promising? Should I finish what I'm doing just to prove a point to random people who could care less? If I actually did finish pharmacy school, couldn't find a job, and then decided to apply to a different health professions program that actually has a viable job market, it would just mean that hard-working taxpayers who actually had the drive and maturity to attain a career for themselves will have to pay more of their money in subsidizing my IBR/REPAYE plan, since there would probably be zero possibility that I'd be able to pay off my current loan balance + pharmacy school loan balance + plan B. I think this would be the case for anyone who finds themselves in this kind of situation, unless they go on to become a neurosurgeon or some other mind-blowing high paid professional.

 

[PAtoPharm]

How expensive is your school? Problem is a part time gig will make it hard for you to pay off your loans and still have money to live a comfortable life... The future of IBR/PAYE could be uncertain... if you are willing to put in the work, that's a good start... some think PHARMd=guaranteed 130k... unfortunately it no longer is

Another question to ask yourself is -- are there any other careers in healthcare that offer a similar financial return as pharmacy, that take approximately just as much time and commitment in school (or less), that you'd enjoy just as much (or more), and that have even remotely promising future job market prospects?

 

[Rxed 1996]

I'm "all over the place" because I'm just brainstorming plan B careers at this point (with the intention of choosing one of them very soon). I just mentioned radiology as a potential residency to pursue if I end up going to DO school because it fits my interests, personality, and preference for not having interaction with patients. Maybe it's still a very competitive residency to gain admission to, but I've read that it has become less competitive in recent years due to Medicare reimbursement cuts. But either way, I'm staying open to considering other potential residencies. I know it's taking me a long time to accomplish anything, but why should anyone obligate themselves to finishing an endeavor like pharmacy school if they're aware of the bleak outlook and if there is even a remote chance they can sidestep into something more promising? Should I finish what I'm doing just to prove a point to random people who could care less? If I actually did finish pharmacy school, couldn't find a job, and then decided to apply to a different health professions program that actually has a viable job market, it would just mean that hard-working taxpayers who actually had the drive and maturity to attain a career for themselves will have to pay more of their money in subsidizing my IBR/REPAYE plan, since there would probably be zero possibility that I'd be able to pay off my current loan balance + pharmacy school loan balance + plan B. I think this would be the case for anyone who finds themselves in this kind of situation, unless they go on to become a neurosurgeon or some other mind-blowing high paid professional.

It seems like you know where you're heading but you're just on here to complain. I get that. Pharmacy is not for you. But good luck convincing adcoms why you dropped out of 2 schools and have that "preference for not having interaction with patients" attitude in medical school. Seriously, if you wanted no patient contact, there are a lot of jobs out there that require less debt, less time, and less contact than ANY health care field. No one is trying to convince you to stay in pharmacy school. We're advising you to think your decisions through and stick to it. To me, you seem like someone who is very knowledgable and can go far. But this situation is like seeing an intelligent guy from college, but he ended up not doing anything, because he had no sense of direction.

Radiologists have said many times on different blogs and various forums that if you are into that field for money and to avoid patients, you are in it for the wrong reasons, and you will hate it. I advise you to shadow one before you continue on further, accumulating debt.

It's very easy at this point. If you hate it and don't think anything good can come out of it, JUMP SHIP.

 

[steveysmith54]

Another question to ask yourself is -- are there any other careers in healthcare that offer a similar financial return as pharmacy, that take approximately just as much time and commitment in school (or less), that you'd enjoy just as much (or more), and that have even remotely promising future job market prospects?

irrelevant question. I have a secure job at a top 100 hospital. I've established connections with chains, independents, an LTC. I slaved for 6 yrs working 20 days in a row, haven't said a no once to anyone.... I made the most of every opportunity presented...

 

[parjn]

Maybe I will take the chance, yeah 80k is a lot of debt for 4 years. But maybe I can make it. (sigh) don't you just hate not really knowing what the future holds for sure?

 

[Dalteparin]

Maybe I will take the chance, yeah 80k is a lot of debt for 4 years. But maybe I can make it. (sigh) don't you just hate not really knowing what the future holds for sure?

$80K isn't that bad for a PharmD. Some folks wind up with $100K+.


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[PAtoPharm]

irrelevant question. I have a secure job at a top 100 hospital. I've established connections with chains, independents, an LTC. I slaved for 6 yrs working 20 days in a row, haven't said a no once to anyone.... I made the most of every opportunity presented...

My mistake -- I meant to quote parjn's post and make that statement to him. I think it's telling that when someone posts on the forums and asks for opinions on whether they should go to pharmacy school or "X" school, the other posters always recommend going to "X" school, regardless of what the program actually is. Ironically enough, someone made a recent thread where they asked if they should go to AA school or pharmacy school, and people didn't hesitate to tell them to apply to AA school and not look back. I understand where people are coming from with the advice they've given me in this thread, but I just wanted to make the observation. It's kind of an interesting paradox... for someone in my situation, it might be the objective "right thing to do" for me to finally stick with and finish a program I started, but subjectively, it might actually be the worst thing to do. Again, I'm just making a general observation because I like to point out the irony in things, even if it means I'm the butt of the joke.

 

[trailerpark]

$80K isn't that bad for a PharmD. Some folks wind up with $100K+.


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I'd say most have WELL over 100k.

 

[genesis09]

If you went to a private school, total tuition and fees can easily be over $250k. I went to a public school and only had $40k in debt.

 

[Dalteparin]

I agree that some of the advice I've been given is good, if you're talking about the advice that a few posters (such as gwarm01 and bulldog1123) have given to me, which advocates withdrawing from pharmacy school. However, I simply can't agree that staying in pharmacy school could be considered good advice for anyone. I'm not sure that I've ever wondered why my classmates are so far ahead of me, unless you're talking about my former AA school classmates who will be graduating in ~6 months. They truly are ahead of me. But if you're talking about my pharmacy school classmates.... unless someone's dad is a DM for a chain, I don't think any of them are ahead of me in any capacity whatsoever. At the very least, I know for a fact I've never stated as much here.

If I had to guess, I'd say at least some of your classmates are out working in pharmacies, which gives them valuable experience and will help them make contacts for later. Many of them are probably also getting involved in student organizations, which is networking and resume padding if nothing else. But hey, keep coming on SDN every day and making all these posts. I'm sure it's helping you...

And yes, to be fair you haven't wondered why they're all ahead of you, but I suspect you will if you ever start looking for a pharmacy job (intern or RPh).


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[PAtoPharm]

If I had to guess, I'd say at least some of your classmates are out working in pharmacies, which gives them valuable experience and will help them make contacts for later. Many of them are probably also getting involved in student organizations, which is networking and resume padding if nothing else. But hey, keep coming on SDN every day and making all these posts. I'm sure it's helping you...

And yes, to be fair you haven't wondered why they're all ahead of you, but I suspect you will if you ever start looking for a pharmacy job (intern or RPh).


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I'm curious.... how/why am I going to run into issues when I go to get an intern job? Isn't that the kind of job pharmacy students get in the first place when they try to get experience?