The Investment Thread (stocks, bonds, real estate, retirement, just not gold)

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Exactly so how is he helping these people?

If anything the money will be wasted. Instead of forcing it to go towards housing or food (yes I'm aware people sell their benefits) now it will definitely be wasted.

There's a reason these people are poor and it's foolish to think giving them money instead of benefits will help them out.

1) it encourages them to find meaningful work because now those governments assistance programs are no longer tied to them not working

2) it reduces bureaucracy and inefficiencies.

3) with the rise of automation, we will need basic income

4) our society is in the decline. Life expectancy has dropped every year for the last 3 years. We need to support our own people.

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1) it encourages them to work because now those governments assistance programs are no longer tied to them not working

2) it reduces bureaucracy and inefficiencies.

3) with the rise of automation, we will need basic income

4) our society is in the decline. Life expectancy has dropped every year for the last 3 years. We need to support our own people.

But where is the proof it will be used appropriately? Also where is the proof people will continue to work? You need to understand how these people think. This is the community I grew up in. I understand them. No one is going to start working if their family of four is given 24k plus free health care.

There's a reason we have social security. People do not know how to save nor spend their money appropriately.
 
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But where is the proof it will be used appropriately? Also where is the proof people will continue to work? You need to understand how these people think. This is the community I grew up in. I understand them. No one is going to start working if their family of four is given 24k plus free insurance.

There's a reason we have social security. People do not know how to save nor spend their money appropriately.

And this is coming from a republican who would rather let people suffer if they can't spend wisely then force be to support them.

You can find all of your answers on The Freedom Dividend - Yang2020 - Andrew Yang for President

I think “work” will be redefined with the rise of automation. The jobs just won’t be there for many Americans. Without a basic income, what are these people going to do?

I lived in “poverty” growing up. I still know a lot of those people. Some are lazy. Some made bad decisions. But, the vast majority of them just don’t have what it takes to work in advanced professionals. If automation eliminates their jobs, what the hell are they going to do? They are going to push the government for more and more assistance and then bam, this nation becomes a socialist country. Is that what you want?
 
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You can find all of your answers on The Freedom Dividend - Yang2020 - Andrew Yang for President

I think “work” will be redefined with the rise of automation. The jobs just won’t be there for many Americans. Without a basic income, what are these people going to do?

I lived in “poverty” growing up. I still know a lot of those people. Some are lazy. Some made bad decisions. But, the vast majority of them just don’t have what it takes to work in advanced professionals. If automation eliminates their jobs, what the hell are they going to do? They are going to push the government for more and more assistance and then bam, this nation becomes a socialist country. Is that what you want?

Um Yang is going to make us a socialist country.
 
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"It is capitalism where income does not start at zero"



I'm pretty sure he is doing everything Warren and Sanders want to do.

Just not to their extreme.


Very first article when you Google it.
 
I was listening to a podcast one day and what the guy had to say was so true.

College used to be affordable. Just a couple months of parents pay could cover college.

Once the government got involved, student loans started to explode along with the cost of tuition.

Had the government not got involved only those that could afford college would be going and many wouldn't be wasting their time getting degrees they don't need. They would also be doing more skilled labor that we actually need.

This would have forced tuition to stay low, kept debt in check, and we wouldn't have so many jobs requiring pointless degrees that aren't even needed.

The point? Government only causes problems, it doesn't solve them. Sadly this is the direction we are going.
 
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I did read it, because of taxes prices are going down. In other words, anyone who has bought recently has lost a ton of money.
That's all well and good, but any exogenous pressure on a single market isn't indicative of the market nationally. I bet property values in the Bahamas have tanked, too.
 
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"It is capitalism where income does not start at zero"


TBH, I think this **** is stupid. The United States has and has always had a diverse mixed economy.

Here's what Yang should say "Do you like the military? You do? Socialist."

I think that gets to the point much more easily. And the point is that the socialist-capitalist dichotomy is a false dichotomy used in bad faith arguments by conservatives and libertarians for lower taxes and fewer social safety net programs for the poor.
 
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That's all well and good, but any exogenous pressure on a single market isn't indicative of the market nationally. I bet property values in the Bahamas have tanked, too.
I'm glad you agree with me?
 
You're going on about how real estate everywhere is tanking. This didn't support your argument. There is an exogenous force putting its thumbs on the scale.
But you agree there is risk?

People here keep talking as if this is free money. You never know what could happen. There are many major cities out with prices dropping.

Go on any website and you will see houses for rent that last months plus houses for sale that keep lowering their price.

Why anyone would want an asset that can be difficult to sell and protect against market forces instead of the ease of stocks is beyond me.

Just know when the market collapses, I'll be here.
 
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But you agree there is risk?

People here keep talking as if this is free money. You never know what could happen. There are many major cities out with prices dropping.
Of course there is risk, there is risk in everything. But you are using an extreme example. It seems silly to me.
 
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Of course there is risk, there is risk in everything. But you are using an extreme example. It seems silly to me.

Have you ever looked up million dollar homes? These places routinely lose money.
 
I love Yang but he doesn't stand a chance, he is only 2% in the democratic polls. He is smart, thinks and speaks logically, drama free, and does not attack other candidates. That's the opposite of who America votes for. The media gives him no air time. Plus the majority of his own people (Asians) don't even vote. You always hear about winning over the Black and Hispanic voters but never the Asians.
 
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I love Yang but he doesn't stand a chance, he is only 2% in the democratic polls. He is smart, thinks and speaks logically, drama free, and does not attack other candidates. That's the opposite of who America votes for. The media gives him no air time. Plus the majority of his own people (Asians) don't even vote. You always hear about winning over the Black and Hispanic voters but never the Asians.

He is polling at 3.5% national wide now. He is even polling 4th in California, beating Harris:


I think his strategy is to win NH and then surprise everyone in California on Super Tuesday (CA moved its primary date up).
 
He is polling at 3.5% national wide now. He is even polling 4th in California, beating Harris:


I think his strategy is to win NH and then surprise everyone in California on Super Tuesday (CA moved its primary date up).

I hate polls so much. 400 people do not even remotely represent the state of California.
 
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I hate polls so much. 400 people do not even remotely represent the state of California.

I actually think polls are under representing support for Yang. His supporters tend to be younger (no landline) and he is bringing out people who usually don't vote. That is his key to winning.
 
I actually think polls are under representing support for Yang. His supporters tend to be younger (no landline) and he is bringing out people who usually don't vote. That is his key to winning.
i can't help but think that yang's proposal's are disingenuous. he says he's trying to address the lack of opportunity due to the rise of automation, which isn't even here yet. plus most people have jobs and unemployment is at a 50-year low. if he wanted to target job loss due to automation, why not just adjust policy where it matters the most (midwest? manufacturing?). instead, while Joe who is living in his mother's basement gets a $1000 monthly check, we have Jeff Bezos the richest man in the world getting an equal monthly amount. with his proposal, the poor get richer, while the richest get richer. seems misguided at best.

warren/sanders address real issues. most younger people cannot buy homes. corruption in the white house. rising income equality due to current policy, healthcare, trade. as much as $1000 is appealing to those of us who have no money but like to spend, that cannot take priority over these other issues. and warren/sanders polling highly thus far reflects this mentality. lots of hype around yang right now, but frankly i'd expect a candidate proposing to give away $1000 a month to every age-eligible citizen to receive far more popularity than just 3.5% nationally.
 
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i can't help but think that yang's proposal's are disingenuous. he says he's trying to address the lack of opportunity due to the rise of automation, which isn't even here yet. plus most people have jobs and unemployment is at a 50-year low. if he wanted to target job loss due to automation, why not just adjust policy where it matters the most (midwest? manufacturing?). instead, while Joe who is living in his mother's basement gets a $1000 monthly check, we have Jeff Bezos the richest man in the world getting an equal monthly amount. with his proposal, the poor get richer, while the richest get richer. seems misguided at best.

warren/sanders address real issues. most younger people cannot buy homes. corruption in the white house. rising income equality due to current policy, healthcare. as much as $1000 is appealing to those of us who have no money but like to spend, that cannot take priority over these other issues. and warren/sanders polling highly thus far reflects this mentality. lots of hype around yang right now, but frankly i'd expect a candidate proposing to give away $1000 a month to every age-eligible citizen to receive far more popularity than just 3.5% nationally.

What are you even talking about? Adjust policy? Adjusting policy will not stop this

Automation is coming whether you like it or not!
 
What are you even talking about? Adjust policy? Adjusting policy will not stop this

Automation is coming whether you like it or not!

where can i find that? Nowhere, USA? hotels here are not as enthusiastic about that kind of technology as more value is placed on customer service, attention, pampering. until this culture changes, not something to worry about.

automation is coming, sure, but why treat it as this this country's most pressing problem, today? the best we've got so far is Alexa, so i'm not that fearful yet. of real concern to the jobs of americans is driverless technology, but that is still years and years away (might i guess 10+ years?) before it gets scaled into the economy in any meaningful away, and that's after it goes thru all loops and regulations.
 
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i can't help but think that yang's proposal's are disingenuous. he says he's trying to address the lack of opportunity due to the rise of automation, which isn't even here yet. plus most people have jobs and unemployment is at a 50-year low. if he wanted to target job loss due to automation, why not just adjust policy where it matters the most (midwest? manufacturing?). instead, while Joe who is living in his mother's basement gets a $1000 monthly check, we have Jeff Bezos the richest man in the world getting an equal monthly amount. with his proposal, the poor get richer, while the richest get richer. seems misguided at best.

warren/sanders address real issues. most younger people cannot buy homes. corruption in the white house. rising income equality due to current policy, healthcare. as much as $1000 is appealing to those of us who have no money but like to spend, that cannot take priority over these other issues. and warren/sanders polling highly thus far reflects this mentality. lots of hype around yang right now, but frankly i'd expect a candidate proposing to give away $1000 a month to every age-eligible citizen to receive far more popularity than just 3.5% nationally.

Because in order to get that $1k you have to drop your other benefits.

The poor benefit way less then the middle class and most importantly FIRE people.

where can i find that? Nowhere, USA? hotels here are not as enthusiastic about that kind of technology as more value is placed on customer service, attention, pampering. until this culture changes, not something to worry about.

automation is coming, sure, but why treat it as this this country's most pressing problem, today? the best we've got so far is Alexa, so i'm not that fearful yet. of real concern to the jobs of americans is driverless technology, but that is still years and years away (might i guess 10+ years?) before it gets scaled into the economy in any meaningful away, and that's after it goes thru all loops and regulations.

Yangs fear is we will be too late to the AI movement.

Personally I don't see job loss, I see job openings as new jobs form.
 
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The level of irony in this post is over 9000.
We've had AI improvements throughout our lives at what point did it cause job loss?

Like I just posted today, people really need to look at things from different perspectives.
 
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Because in order to get that $1k you have to drop your other benefits.

The poor benefit way less then the middle class and most importantly FIRE people.



Yangs fear is we will be too late to the AI movement.

Personally I don't see job loss, I see job openings as new jobs form.

Robert Shiller talks about the current employment and automation here:

Low jobless rate is a boost to confidence, but it's a 'fuzzy number,' says Yale's Robert Shiller
 
We've had AI improvements throughout our lives at what point did it cause job loss?

Like I just posted today, people really need to look at things from different perspectives.

Hmmm let’s think. Is cooper still a profession? When was the last time you saw a milkman? Seen any newspaper delivery boys lately?

There are literally COUNTLESS jobs that have been lost to automation. I don’t even believe you can be so short sighted. What do you think the point of automation is if not to do more with less?
 
where can i find that? Nowhere, USA? hotels here are not as enthusiastic about that kind of technology as more value is placed on customer service, attention, pampering. until this culture changes, not something to worry about.

automation is coming, sure, but why treat it as this this country's most pressing problem, today? the best we've got so far is Alexa, so i'm not that fearful yet. of real concern to the jobs of americans is driverless technology, but that is still years and years away (might i guess 10+ years?) before it gets scaled into the economy in any meaningful away, and that's after it goes thru all loops and regulations.
Actually you can find a new Sheraton like that in Los Angeles. Not to this extent yet, but robots are already incorporated. The robots greet you when you first walk in, help you with directions, and take your bags up to your room. You really need to rethink the type of world you will be living in...
 
Actually you can find a new Sheraton like that in Los Angeles. Not to this extent yet, but robots are already incorporated. The robots greet you when you first walk in, help you with directions, and take your bags up to your room. You really need to rethink the type of world you will be living in...
how many people do you know personally that live in this country that have lost jobs directly due to automation? i know zero and when i think of the biggest challenges that face ordinary americans today, job loss due to a robot doesn't come to mind. neither do i see anyone crying about losing their job to Alexa. affordable and accessible healthcare, affordable education, debt, corruption in the white house, social issues on race and identity, immigration, trade -- these are the sources of today's unrest. look no further than this forum to hear all the cries you don't want to hear about people being crippled with student debt. peep a bit further out and people are complaining of high drug prices. step outside the front door of your home and people are marching on the streets calling for the freedom to choose one's own gender, gender equality, police brutality and race equality. we can be cognizant of the damaging prospects to employment that automation can have without sounding the ear-popping decibel-topping fire alarm to an emergency that is not even here yet. and so far i think current society is doing just that.
 
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Hmmm let’s think. Is cooper still a profession? When was the last time you saw a milkman? Seen any newspaper delivery boys lately?

There are literally COUNTLESS jobs that have been lost to automation. I don’t even believe you can be so short sighted. What do you think the point of automation is if not to do more with less?

Did you really take what I said that way?

Of course jobs will go away but we will have a surplus of new jobs.
 
how many people do you know personally that live in this country that have lost jobs directly due to automation? i know zero and when i think of the biggest challenges that face ordinary americans today, job loss due to a robot doesn't come to mind. neither do i see anyone crying about losing their job to Alexa. affordable and accessible healthcare, affordable education, debt, corruption in the white house, social issues on race and identity, immigration, trade -- these are the sources of today's unrest. look no further than this forum to hear all the cries you don't want to hear about people being crippled with student debt. peep a bit further out and people are complaining of high drug prices. step outside the front door of your home and people are marching on the streets calling for the freedom to choose one's own gender, gender equality, police brutality and race equality. we can be cognizant of the damaging prospects to employment that automation can have without sounding the ear-popping decibel-topping fire alarm to an emergency that is not even here yet. and so far i think current society is doing just that.

There's no corruption in the White House. Stop listening to the FAKE NEWS.

Did you hear about the stabbing that occurred in Paris? No? I wouldn't why. Could it be because it didn't involve guns?
 
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There's no corruption in the White House. Stop listening to the FAKE NEWS.

Did you hear about the stabbing that occurred in Paris? No? I wouldn't why. Could it be because it didn't involve guns?

and... and... the Newtown school shooting on elementary students was also staged? i know your kind very well...
 
and... and... the Newtown school shooting on elementary students was also staged? i know your kind very well...
Staged?

I'm not into conspiracies, we walked on the moon fyi.
 
Make a prediction with a huge range?

That's not teaching. The chances of me being wrong are slim.

since you insist, the only reason why my target is extended all the way out to around 2021 is because the indices are bound to dip into at least correction territory up to 4 months from now, with some chance of re-entering bear market for the NASDAQ. this will turn out to be bottom and the indices will then reverse vigorously and proceed to re-challenge previous highs sometime in 2020. as for the final psychological level of DOW 30,000, that can possibly be either mid-to-end 2020 or 2021. i don't know that exact timing, but the timing i'm putting forth here is actually impressive even by Wall Street standards. mind you, this scenario i give to you will happen regardless of what happens in politics or economics, and this is possible because the market is already pricing in most probabilities based on current conditions, resulting in a chart that has already revealed its prevailing substructure. within the confines of this mathematical substructure are practically infinite superstructures which are determined by headlines, and their sole purpose is to fool weak-handed traders and amateur short-term investors, you included.

by the way, this is something most analysts don't mention on that CNBC channel you get your market news from, mostly because they simply don't know this, and also because those who do know it would not like you to make money.
 
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since you insist, the only reason why my target is extended all the way out to around 2021 is because the indices are bound to dip into at least correction territory up to 4 months from now, with some chance of re-entering bear market for the NASDAQ. this will turn out to be bottom and the indices will then reverse vigorously and proceed to re-challenge previous highs sometime in 2020. as for the final psychological level of DOW 30,000, that can possibly be either mid-to-end 2020 or 2021. i don't know that exact timing, but the timing i'm putting forth here is actually impressive even by Wall Street standards. mind you, this scenario i give to you will happen regardless of what happens in politics or economics, and this is possible because the market is already pricing in most probabilities based on current conditions, resulting in a chart that has already revealed its prevailing substructure. within the confines of this mathematical substructure are practically infinite superstructures which are determined by headlines, and their sole purpose is to fool weak-handed traders and amateur short-term investors, you included.

by the way, this is something most analysts don't mention on that CNBC channel you get your market news from, mostly because they simply don't know this, and also because those who do know it would not like you to make money.

Yes because everyone predicts when a crash occurs

There's a better chance we are in recession in 2021 then at all time highs. Agree or disagree?

Also if there is this chance of a correction in the next 4 months, why would you be in stocks?

Next time read your response before you post. If you predict a correction, put your money where your mouth is. You are technically agreeing with me that it's better to be in gold right now.

There's a reason why you chart people are always wrong. The unpredictable can't be predicted. I see a new chart every single day predicting what will happen and when that doesn't happen they just move on as if they never said anything.
 
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There's no corruption in the White House. Stop listening to the FAKE NEWS.

Did you hear about the stabbing that occurred in Paris? No? I wouldn't why. Could it be because it didn't involve guns?

How many people died from the stabbing? Do you think it is the same number that would have died from a shooting spree?
 
Did you really take what I said that way?

Of course jobs will go away but we will have a surplus of new jobs.

Good goal post moving. You asked for examples of automation eliminating jobs. Can you provide examples of this surplus of new jobs?

Like how many new jobs are created vs how many are eliminated? If automation creates more jobs than it destroys what are the advantages of automation?

I really think you fundamentally misunderstand the concept. I am not actually against automation (if it sounds like I am) because I like cheap stuff and automation makes stuff cheap. But I am not delusional about it’s effects.
 
Good goal post moving. You asked for examples of automation eliminating jobs. Can you provide examples of this surplus of new jobs?

Like how many new jobs are created vs how many are eliminated? If automation creates more jobs than it destroys what are the advantages of automation?

I really think you fundamentally misunderstand the concept. I am not actually against automation (if it sounds like I am) because I like cheap stuff and automation makes stuff cheap. But I am not delusional about it’s effects.
Very first result in a Google search.
 
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How many people died from the stabbing? Do you think it is the same number that would have died from a shooting spree?

Oh I see now it's ok to be stabbed as long as you weren't shot.
 
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Oh I see now it's ok to be stabbed as long as you weren't shot.

How did you get that from what I said?

Can you admit that it is better for a smaller number to be stabbed than a larger number to be shot?

Of course the best scenario is for no one to be murdered at all but if we can’t do that can we at least limit the casualties?
 
Very first result in a Google search.

Wow can you really detect no bias in that ‘article’? It’s from a company that develops AI for goodness sake.

I am curious what your search terms were for that to be the very first google search. I bet it was “will AI create jobs” or something like that. Here is what I got as the first response for “will AI eliminate jobs”. Obviously the more you bias your search terms the more biased your results will be.

 
Wow can you really detect no bias in that ‘article’? It’s from a company that develops AI for goodness sake.

I am curious what your search terms were for that to be the very first google search. I bet it was “will AI create jobs” or something like that. Here is what I got as the first response for “will AI eliminate jobs”. Obviously the more you bias your search terms the more biased your results will be.

My point is we don't know the end result. AI has been occurring throughout our lives. Why is it that now will be the time when it actually destroys more then it creates?

Also let's say it destroys 2 million a year, we constantly over time create over 2 million jobs a year. Is job creation going to stop?
How did you get that from what I said?

Can you admit that it is better for a smaller number to be stabbed than a larger number to be shot?

Of course the best scenario is for no one to be murdered at all but if we can’t do that can we at least limit the casualties?

I'd rather stop then limit and there's only one way to stop.

Hint it's not get rid of guns because criminals won't listen.

The reason I brought up that incident though is stabbings happen all the time but they never get media coverage. I wonder why that is?
 
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Engineering technology is going to see a big boom as AI takes off. These are the guys who went to a 4 year school to become a technician and will be working in the labs that develop this tech, fix it when it breaks, and etc. IMO it is only a matter of time before more schools start offering engineering technology.
 
Good goal post moving. You asked for examples of automation eliminating jobs. Can you provide examples of this surplus of new jobs?

Like how many new jobs are created vs how many are eliminated? If automation creates more jobs than it destroys what are the advantages of automation?

I really think you fundamentally misunderstand the concept. I am not actually against automation (if it sounds like I am) because I like cheap stuff and automation makes stuff cheap. But I am not delusional about it’s effects.

I noticed his reasoning is back ward...he comes to a conclusion then he looks for bit of information to back up his conclusion. Obviously you can always find something online.
 
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I noticed his reasoning is back ward...he comes to a conclusion then he looks for bit of information to back up his conclusion. Obviously you can always find something online.

How's my reasoning backwards?

I posted an article because no matter what I say, it won't be listened to. People are stuck in their mindsets, I choose to be open. You are the one that always says Google it so I post the first article that pops up.

Could I be wrong? Sure but we've been talking about automation for a long time and it's not going to just gang up on us out of no where.

I guess I'll continue to wait until it finally happens?

The guy above you posted one of the many different jobs that will continue to be created.
 
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I posted an article because no matter what I say, it won't be listened to. People are stuck in their mindsets, I choose to be open.

How are you open minded? You just have an alternative facts opinion. You think automation will create more jobs than it destroys, which is pretty much the opposite of the entire point of automation. That doesn’t make you open it just makes you have a different outlook than others.
 
 
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