The negativety expressed at websites

[GibbsDuhem]

You know I was once so sold on becoming a podiatrist. I happened to be doing landscaping while finishing my undergrad degree and one of the properties I worked at was the house of a local podiatrist. I wouldnt call it a house because it is so big and has 100+ acres with it. Well one day I had a good long talk with the Dr. that owned the house. He talked to me about what I was studying in my school etc. and my future plans. He offered me an opportunity to shadow him. He does surgery primarily. It was awesome. The man is like art in motion when he is doing surgery. I feel in love with it and was hooked. I went to the web to see if there were any web sites for podiatry and to my dismay everyone of them I found spewed negativety like nothing I had ever seen. It was all negative...a possitive remark was hard to find. I told the Dr. one day while we were having lunch after shadowing him about what I had found and asked him plenty of questions about the future of the profession. He stated that most of the negativety is brought about by HMO's and them getting Pod grads by the balls to say and it makes them very disgruntled. He told me he thinks I should be a podiatrist. I know id be accepted..to a podiatry school...it isnt very competitive. But still the negativety I see really makes me back off. If I could be half as sucessful as this man Id be well off needless to say. It is still something I am pondering but still the posistive flow of comments from those thinking or persuing the proffesion and those already in it is as scarce as can be. Marry X-mas

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[efs]

Merry Christmas.

I have found a similar thing as far as the posting. It is not the same if you actually talk to podiatrists out in practice though. Yes there is some negativity, but nothing close to what you might find on the internet. And the focus is different. Those you might talk to are probably more likely to discuss problems with insurance, etc.

I am still a student, and don't have a good clear answer as to why this is. I can only speculate.

Most of the successful people I have talked with are busy, and don't have time to spend posting to forums on the internet. They have better things to do with their time. (Probably my #1 thought.)

Podiatry does have some splits/rifts/cliques, whatever you want to call them. The most prominent is surgical vs. non-surgical. This might also be further divided by training. Some do rearfoot, otehrs don't. Where any individual falls among these groups may color their perspective. (Big area, but probably #2 in my opinion).

It is certainly easier to be accepted to podiatry than to a DO or DPM program, though many people in podiatry would easily have the numbers to be competetive for anything else. Some don't. Because of this, I think that podiatry tends to draw in a larger number of people who probably don't have any business being in any area of health care. (Again, this is only speculation and opinion.) I further think that many of these people might not do very well in any of their endeavors. As they are "doctors" I think they may have higher expectations than are reasonable. Graduating from a course of education is not a guarantee of success, however you might measure it. I think there are more than a few peope that expect to earn high salaries simply because they are accepted to, and complete a degree. (This is true of DOs and MDs as well as any number of other "professional" degrees. Lots of lawyers out there sturggling to make ends meet too.) This could be a huge topic for discussion, and I would probably put this as my #3 reason.

None of the above was in any particular order (other than what came as I was typing). I think there might be varying degrees of each involved in any given situation. Lots of variables.

I do think podiatry can be a very rewarding profession. The potential to earn some money is there. The potential to help people is there. It is a relatively small profession, so the potential to make a name for yourself (and make some advances) within the profession is definately there.

Others might disagree with me, but those are my thoughts.

Best wishes, And happy holidays.

 

[GibbsDuhem]

Those are the thoughts of the DPM I talked to. He was once the head of the podiatry association in my state. One of his big things was also that some people are becoming podiatrists because they got excepted there and they were never meant to be n any kind of health field.. so needless to say they are not sucessful...as they probably never would be. As he stated to me it is who you souround yourself with and learn from ..he has told me that many times. If i could go to podiatry school and get a residency with him trust me I would. But we have yet to discuss that. What podiatry school are you at efs ? I might have some questions for you. Thanks

 

[efs]

Fourth year at Des Moines University.

 

[Toejam]

Only one thing to add to efs' comments.

One reason there might be an underlying negativity permeating podiatry today vs. MD's and DO's is because it is significantly harder to find work after you're finished and difficult to get established. When an MD or DO finishes their residency, they have a lot of options in terms of employment. Podiatrists have very few options. Unless you trained in one of the top residencies, you might find yourself unemployed for a few months after residency and the financial pressure may cause you to accept something that is less than glamorous. I feel that this, in itself, breeds contempt since most pod students have much higher expectations after their education and training. Most pod students picture themselves doing a mixture of basic podiatry and surgery and working in a nice clean office. The reality is often different. Most that I know who have finished recently are pretty much just doing nails and calluses with little to no surgery thrown their way. I think in this situation, DPM's begin to feel less like physicians and more like ancillary health providers.

Among other characteristics crucial to survival for a DPM, you'll need surgical training (which, not everyone gets), patience, tenacity and a very good business sense. Nothing's going to be handed to you (as is generally true in life) and you're going to have to do more work to achieve your goals compared to MD's and DO's.

 

[Ctrhu]

I am a radiologist and can tell you from a medical staff point of view podiatrists are treated like physicians at all the hospitals that I have been affiliated with. They have full admitting privileges, attend all medical staff meetings, chair committees and vote. In fact, the head of a rather large Multispecialty group in Temple, Texas (King's Daughters Clinic) is a DPM.
The podiatrists are treated like surgeons in the ORs (my wife is an anesthesiologist) and get plenty of referrals. I believe unless you find an orthopod who specializes in the Feet, podiatrists are far superior and I would rather go to one for the non-trauma problem. I had a patient who almost lost his foot, had a podiatrist not stepped in to take over the care.
The point is, we MDs think of the DPMs as colleagues. Chiropractors on the other hand, are considered quacks and I have never seen one given staff privilege.

 

[efs]

Thanks for the comments.

 

[Toejam]

That's good to hear ctrhu

 

[GibbsDuhem]

Hey efs I was curious what made you choose Des Moines over Chicago, San. Fran or Cleavaland? Those are the four schools that catch my eye. I have'nt visited any of them other than their websites. I know Des Moines is the least exspensive to go to and they seem to be a good school. Seeing as you are in your fourth year I am really curious about your opinion. Thanks happy new year

 

[Toejam]

Gibbs:

I'd like to offer you some more advice.

You really shouldn't gauge the real world of podiatry solely on the apparent success of your friend. There are certainly a few like him, but he's not the norm. From the sound of it, he probably received some good training and did a lot of other things to get where he is today.

If you are really serious about pursuing podiatry as a career, you need to speak to a good number of DPM's. You need to find some who have been out of school for various periods of time. In podiatry, there is a HUGE disparity in incomes when comparing pods who have been out for more than 10 years vs. less than 5 years. This type of disparity isn't as pronounced in the MD and DO world. What exacerbates this fact is that the school debt is the same if not worse. You need to also realize that, as of this year, you will not be guaranteed a residency that will expose you to adequate amounts of podiatric surgery.

If you feel that you are not a "self starter" or lack business sense, I'd give it some more thought. Also, while it may be relatively easy to get into podiatry school these days, it doesn't mean that the course work will be any lighter or more manageable.

Good Luck

Toejam, DPM

 

[efs]

Gibbs,

Good question, but I'm not sure I have a good answer.

I talked to a number of DPMs before I applied, and based my decision on a consensus view. It really doesn't matter too much which school you go to. From my discussions with them some 4+ years ago, they are all about the same. The only school I was told not to look at was Miami, and there may have been some personal reasons there. Otherwise, Nobody spoke out against any school, nor did anyone recommend any school over another. The folks that I talked to were graduates from Iowa, NY, CCPM, and Chicago I think. One was former instructor at Barry. The general consensus at the time was that Temple and Iowa had the best academic reputations.

The decision on which school to attend can cover many areas. Cost, location, and reputation seem to be among the top. Being fromt he East coast, with family in the midwest, it was pretty easy to rule out CCPM and Miami. I don't care for big cities and crowds, so NYCPM and Chicago were off my list. That left 3, which I thought was a reasonable number. I applied tot hose, adn was granted interviews witha ll 3. I scheduled them for about a week apart. That pretty well decided the rest of it.

I interviewed at Temple on a Monday, then drove to Iowa for an interview on Friday. (Stops to see family anong the way.) I was then scheduled to interview at Ohio the following week.

I arrived in Phili on a cold grey rainly day and it stayed that way while I was tehre. The interview itself was OK, but I picked up a few cues from the students that made me feel like it was somewhere to keep an eye on yourself. When I got to Des Moines, it was warm and sunny. Everyone here is friendly and it was an incredible difference in attitude. I have really enjoyed living in Des Moines. It really is a friendly place. If you left your wallet on a desk in the library it would probably still be there if you came back a couple hours later. If it wasn't someone would have either turned it in to the front desk or more likely tried to contact you personally. It's just that type of a place. The stories you might have heard about the midwestern hospitality are not unfounded.

The contrast between Temple and Iowa made my decision for me. I called OCPM to cancel my interview as soon as I got home. They called me back shortly to offer me an acceptance without an interview.

I think one of the other major differences that made my decision was that the 1st year courses at Iowa are the same for the DO and DPM students. Some people may argue about the differences in the education. I feel pretty confident that the basic science education I received is the same as the DOs, since I sat in the same classes, and took the same tests as they did. I don't think any of the other schools offered this. I am also well aware of waht our educations offered inthe second year. Not much of a differnece in quality, thought there is a major difference in focus. The education beyond that may vary.

I was a bit concerend about the differences in clinical education in the third and fourth eyars among the schools. I really don't think at this point that it is much of a concern. Each fo the schools has a different approach to the clinical education, but from waht I have seen and from talking to a few students from the other schools, our educational experiences are similar. There certainly are some differnces in the way it is organized, but overall it ends up being about the same.

There is much more of a difference that can be made by your individual approach to your education than there is by the school that you attend. That's probably my bottom line. I don't think the school makes as much of a difference as the student. You can get a good education at any of the schools as long as you put the effort into it.

Good luck.

 

[pecksmedical]

In my experience I have seen both ends of the financial status. Mainly the bottom end. I have worked for one clinic that was very successful with one DPM who had seven DPM's working for him.

However, most DPM's that I have encountered, while making enough to be "comfortable" still do not make nearly the amount they should be making.

I have one client who practices in a major city with many, many other DPM's and is barely squeaking by due to the competition force. Might be making $50,000 a year.

I have a different client who practices in a rural community who loves his practice, his patients, and the community and is not in it for "the money" Might be making around $90,000 a year.

I have another client who practices in the same rural community but also travels throughout the state to Nursing Homes and probably makes over $160,000 a year.

I agree with the sentiment that I would most defiantly have a DPM working on my foot/ankle vs. an orthopedic surgeon.

Just thought I would throw my two cents worth in!