Thoracic Surgery Match

[DO_Surgeon]

Anyone else planning on applying to the upcoming match for 2011 appointment? Despite many of my attendings and mentors discouraging me from applying, I am going through the ERAS application as we speak. Anyone else feel uneasy/uncomfortable about the future of the specialty? I have considered vascular as an alternative field being that I do enjoy vascular surgery, but have had my eye cardiothoracic surgery since starting medical school.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[JackADeli]

...Despite many of my attendings and mentors discouraging me from applying,
...Anyone else feel uneasy/uncomfortable about the future of the specialty? ...have had my eye cardiothoracic surgery since starting medical school.

I have read quite a few other threads throughout on the subject. I also have been reading some postings and references that come up from ACS about healthcare reform...
The gist of what I read on the topic is that CT residents are not having it as bad as predicted. After reading your question, I did a google search for CT jobs.... seems quite a few posted and....

http://health.usnews.com/articles/health/healthday/2009/07/28/heart-surgeon-shortage-predicted.html

http://www.medpagetoday.com/Surgery/ThoracicSurgery/9827

http://www.rwjf.org/humancapital/digest.jsp?id=20586

In the other threads, I have seen Blade respond frequently and maybe will will join with more informed commentary.

Ultimately, I think you should pursue the career that you will find satisfying. Attendings and mentors are great to a point. I heard numerous folks talking about the lack of career of anesthesiologist at one point. The doomsday naysayers of a specialties fure are often uninformed and wrong. Do CT if you want or Plastics or Optho or Ortho or etc.... But do it because you want it.

JAD

 

[DO_Surgeon]

I have read quite a few other threads throughout on the subject. I also have been reading some postings and references that come up from ACS about healthcare reform...
The gist of what I read on the topic is that CT residents are not having it as bad as predicted. After reading your question, I did a google search for CT jobs.... seems quite a few posted and....

http://health.usnews.com/articles/health/healthday/2009/07/28/heart-surgeon-shortage-predicted.html

http://www.medpagetoday.com/Surgery/ThoracicSurgery/9827

http://www.rwjf.org/humancapital/digest.jsp?id=20586

In the other threads, I have seen Blade respond frequently and maybe will will join with more informed commentary.

Ultimately, I think you should pursue the career that you will find satisfying. Attendings and mentors are great to a point. I heard numerous folks talking about the lack of career of anesthesiologist at one point. The doomsday naysayers of a specialties fure are often uninformed and wrong. Do CT if you want or Plastics or Optho or Ortho or etc.... But do it because you want it.

JAD

JAD:

Thanks for the prompt reply. It is funny that one of the articles you reference has my former chief and dean of my medical school, Ken Reed, discussing this very issue. Though I don't think it is complete doom and gloom for the field being that there is a predicted huge shortage in the next 10-15 years, I just wonder if that will help me within the next 5 years.

 

[NEEDLE DRIVER]

Are you referring to the integrated programs? Or are you referring to fellowship appointments? I plan on applying to the integrated programs for appointment in 2012 as a PGY1 so it would be great to get some feedback regarding these programs.

 

[DO_Surgeon]

Are you referring to the integrated programs? Or are you referring to fellowship appointments? I plan on applying to the integrated programs for appointment in 2012 as a PGY1 so it would be great to get some feedback regarding these programs.

I was referring to the fellowship programs. I don't have too much knowledge about the the integrated programs.

 

[JackADeli]

As an observer, I do not see how it can be so dire. It looks like the pendulum has already started correcting itself. A anticipated 40+% shortage does not happen overnight. Thus the prediction of a shortage 5-10 years from now of such magnitude equates a shortage already in existance..... and growing. I can not speak to quality of jobs... but a google search shows numerous postings for CT surgeons. Cejka lists reasonable starting salaries.
http://www.cejkasearch.com/compensation/amga_physician_compensation_survey.htm
So, IMHO, I doubt life is so dire for folks considering the field or graduating.

JAD

 

[DO_Surgeon]

Am I really the only dumb one out there applying this year? I guess that means I should get my pick of programs come next June

 

[ESU_MD]

Am I really the only dumb one out there applying this year?

judging by the applicant pool from last year, you may be one of few who can communicate in the english language.

- and yes, you will have some really good choices in programs.

 

[tjmDO]

I am applying to CT this year as well. I have also run into several people who discourage me from going into it and all of them agree that doing vascular as well would be the way to go. I also enjoy vascular and if the D.O. vascular programs stay one year I may end up doing that as well. Good luck on the application and maybe I will see you on the interview trail, hey by the way do you know what programs are worth applying to as a D.O.?

Tjmdo

 

[Doctor]

I also enjoy vascular and if the D.O. vascular programs stay one year I may end up doing that as well.

Hmm. Are they thinking of getting rid of them?

 

[SocialistMD]

Hmm. Are they thinking of getting rid of them?

The allopathic vascular fellowships are now all two years.

 

[DO_Surgeon]

I thought I would bump my own thread. Anyone else out there? I am trying to decide on the number of programs to apply to and then go on interviews. Anyone have a "magic number" of interviews one probably needs to go on? Keep in mind I'm from a DO general surgery program, but feel I have a pretty strong application. Thanks

 

[JackADeli]

I thought I would bump my own thread. Anyone else out there? I am trying to decide on the number of programs to apply to and then go on interviews. Anyone have a "magic number" of interviews one probably needs to go on? Keep in mind I'm from a DO general surgery program, but feel I have a pretty strong application. Thanks

When I was a medical student, surgery residents ahead of me applied to over 30 programs. My friends from GSurgery that graduated and went CT all applied to a minimum of 15 programs. Some applied to more depending on the replies once the application system opened, i.e. applied then got some rejections, etc... Over the last few years numerous respectable programs were begging to get more then 8 potential applications!!!

I suspect you can decide based on the areas of USA you are interested in going to and/or what areas specific programs are really strong in .... i.e. endovascular, VATS, cardiac, congenital, transplant, etc... Oh, one more thing, keep in mind 2 vs 3 year program options..... and do your potential programs have structured general thoracic vs cardiac tracks.

JAD

 

[jc7721]

applying this year for CT. There are a handful of elite academic programs that will always be competitive, even if there are only 80 applicants nationwide. For the most part, shouldn't be tough to match.

 

[kirurg]

How realistic is it to do thoracic exclusively?

I'm interested in oncology, but unfortunately don't love huge abdominal wacks and the post-op complications associated with the belly operations. Now, my first two fellowship choices would probably be thoracic or breast. As a PGY-2, I feel pretty confused as where to focus my energy...

 

[JackADeli]

How realistic is it to do thoracic exclusively?

...Now, my first two fellowship choices would probably be thoracic or breast. As a PGY-2, I feel pretty confused as where to focus my energy...

I will respond in reverse order....

1. You should not be excessively focused on what fellowship during your PGY2 year. You need to get as much and as broad an experience and knowledge base... and that means as broad and open level of interest.... Try to convince yourself day to day and rotation to rotation that you are very interested in the topic before you.
2. Throracic vs breast.... fairly different from degree of procedures to extent of clinical/non-operative aspects of practice. I guess you can ask yourself if you want to do superficial thoracic surgery (aka breast) or full depth thoracic surgery....
3. I can not speak to what it is like now. I think practice trends/specialization may begin at University and eventually trickle down. Dedicated breast surgery and/or fellowship is to my understanding a newer phenom. Yet, there are practices arising all the time in the community of primarily/breast only practices that don't take GSurgery calls/cases. The same was true about thoracic while I was in GSurgery residency. The GenThor only phenom seemed more common at the university level. In the community you had GSurgeons doing "Thoracic" cases and cardiac surgeons doing "thoracic". I don't know the numbers.... but, I think it is like 30% cardiac, 30% Gsurge, and 30% General thoracic surgeons actually doing the non-cardiac thoracic cases. The trend to my understanding is moving more and more towards a pure cardiac or General thoracic practice within the community. I believe there are now actual training "tracks" in either/or direction. I think also that the actual amount of hands-on experience in doing major Non-card thoracic cases in GSurgery are limited. I think they say something like average grad from GSurge has only "done" 5 lobectomies.... I know during my GSurgery residency, I had little thoracic and cardiac hands-on/operative experience and thus.... I would NOT be comfortable going out and being the GSurgeon that does major thoracic cases.

IMHO, I think all of that translates to increased employment for subspecialty surgeons even at the community level.

JAD

 

[DO_Surgeon]

Just submitted my ERAS application. Good luck to those that are applying this year. I am not sure if this board is a reflection of the national trend, but it appears there will not be many jockeying for a position.

 

[Black Surgeon]

nvm.

 

[DO_Surgeon]

I know that I keep bumping my own thread, but does anyone have any thoughts on the "top tier" "middle tier" programs, etc. Also if any GS resident has any insight into their own program that would be appreciated. Thanks

 

[ESU_MD]

Judging by the lack of replies to this thread- I have to wonder if you may indeed be the only person left applying for thoracic surgery this year.

 

[rtc]

bump

and just out of curiosity - is the number of osteopathic ct fellowships really as few as the aoa website states?? i guess everyone will be applying to allopathic programs then?