Tips for the MD program --> physician-scientist career journey

[EmailWatcher]

Hello all,

I have some questions about working towards the 'physician-scientist career' during and after a MD-only program.

I am another unsuccessful Canadian MSTP applicant (2 WL's for great programs... close but no cigar!) who will be doing an MD at one of our top med schools/research universities.

I want my future career to contain a lot of research as I liked it (1.5+ years in 3 labs) and was pretty good at it (3 1st author pubs and another pub in a Nat subjournal) during my undergrad. With a background in math/programming, many of my research interests are on the more 'basic' side of medical research.

I've been searching through this forum a lot, and have some additional questions:

1) Many folks are saying an MD can still do lots of research (though a few say this is becoming outdated as more MSTPs are out there). Lacking the PhD, what are my main disadvantages? Will I be pressured to do more clinical work? Well the lack of the PhD hurt grants? Will lacking the PhD be mitigated by getting a few more pubs?

2.) Should my priories during my MD be something like board scores > good references during clinical years > doing more research? USMLE scores because I'd prefer to do post-MD training in the US (wine's cheaper down there )

3.) Apparently PhD/residency etc programs are rare. Is this due to programs not wanting to offer them, or a lack of demand for them? I hate to throw the 'how competitive are these programs' question out, but I'd love more info on them.

4.) There's a lot on here about choosing a research supervisor as a MSTP student. But, how about in my shoes, a supervisor for part-time research during an MD? Would a MD/PhD or MD faculty be advantageous? Would more clinical research be better? I can continue two of the projects I have ongoing, but both are with PhDs- one is only medically relevant 'down the road' (mathematical biology), while the other is basic medical research (structural electrophys). I was also thinking of looking in to radiology folks, as my math/programming might be useful over there? Ditto for bioinformatics?

5.) I likely can't internally apply to our MD/PhD. I could likely take a year off in between and get a masters in electrophys quite easily. How worth it would this be? Our tuition is only ~$15k/year, and we get interest free student loans, so financially it wouldn't be too too bad.... though I kinda want to just finish my MD.

6.) I've read some suggestions for finding a 'research mentor', someone I'm not doing research for, but who I can talk to about career decisions etc. All the faculty I'm close to are PhDs.... I guess I'll email some folks in the MD program and ask for suggestions as to who'd be friendly?

Thanks in advance, I really appreciate the help/ wisdom!

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[gutonc]

I've been searching through this forum a lot, and have some additional questions:

There will be plenty of others with thoughts, opinions and experiences but I'll offer mine here. YMMV of course.

1) Many folks are saying an MD can still do lots of research (though a few say this is becoming outdated as more MSTPs are out there). Lacking the PhD, what are my main disadvantages? Will I be pressured to do more clinical work? Well the lack of the PhD hurt grants? Will lacking the PhD be mitigated by getting a few more pubs?

As long as you can prove yourself in terms of publications and grants during residency/fellowship, the lack of a PhD won't hurt you that much. I know as many successful (in basic science research) MDs as I do MD/PhDs. It might hurt a little bit here or there but I don't think it will be a huge deal.

2.) Should my priories during my MD be something like board scores > good references during clinical years > doing more research? USMLE scores because I'd prefer to do post-MD training in the US (wine's cheaper down there )

Yes. Even if you're doing MD/PhD this should be your focus. Residency programs don't hire scientists, they hire physicians. While they'll pay lip service to wanting their residents to have research experience and goals, the reality is that they need scut monkeys to do the work in residency. If you happen to learn something and do some research, well, that's a happy bonus for all concerned. You're going to have a bit of a problem in needing a visa so make sure the things people focus on (Steps, LORs, MSPE) are in order before you pursue research.

3.) Apparently PhD/residency etc programs are rare. Is this due to programs not wanting to offer them, or a lack of demand for them? I hate to throw the 'how competitive are these programs' question out, but I'd love more info on them.

PhD/Residency programs are rare for the reasons I pointed out above. But for IM and it's sub-specialties, you have the option of the ABIM Research Pathway (look it up...also available for some other specialties but IM is most common) where, if you can find somebody to pay for it and are willing to put in an extra year or two, you can often get a PhD if you want it. You don't really need it at that point, but it's there if you want it.

4.) There's a lot on here about choosing a research supervisor as a MSTP student. But, how about in my shoes, a supervisor for part-time research during an MD? Would a MD/PhD or MD faculty be advantageous? Would more clinical research be better? I can continue two of the projects I have ongoing, but both are with PhDs- one is only medically relevant 'down the road' (mathematical biology), while the other is basic medical research (structural electrophys). I was also thinking of looking in to radiology folks, as my math/programming might be useful over there? Ditto for bioinformatics?

It's way easier to find time to squeeze in clinical research during med school and residency than it is to do basic science. Not that you can't, just that most clinical research projects can be done while you're sitting on your couch, wearing sweatpants with a beer in your hand...basic science lab work not so much. Since it seems like you do mostly "dry" stuff this may not apply to you as much as someone (like myself) who primarily has a molecular biology focus. You should also look into "-omics" projects which always need more Comp Sci folks.