Title for the role that deals with devices in OR?

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

Hey guys, do you know the title of the guy in the OR who works for medical device companies (st jude, boston scientific) and helps with the tech portion of the device?
Clarification, they are employed by the device company but are out posted at various hospital locations

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[ndafife]

Medical Device Representative I think

 

[Osteoth]

Medical Device Representative I think

This guy devices.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Yep, device rep

 

[W19]

Some of these guys (which most of them are) make as much as a FM/IM doc...

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

Device reps. Good ones are absolutely invaluable, at least in my line of work. They can make great money if they’re in the right facility (one extreme example is HSS, the top ortho hospital in the country, the reps there can easily make 150K because they get paid every time a doc uses their device). They also frequently feed us, and many are hot (also by design, think Julie from Scrubs).


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

Some of these guys (which most of them are) make as much as a FM/IM doc...

Yup. Its about 80 k base and 70 k based on sales which is usually not an issue.
Im asking because my girlfriend is a surgical tech right now and I would like her to go down this route if she can.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Device reps. Good ones are absolutely invaluable, at least in my line of work. They can make great money if they’re in the right facility (one extreme example is HSS, the top ortho hospital in the country, the reps there can easily make 150K because they get paid every time a doc uses their device). They also frequently feed us, and many are hot (also by design, think Julie from Scrubs).


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

Both hospitals I worked at passed policy that prohibited them from feeding us. They were super helpful during cases though.

 

[Durty-Trixxx]

I saw them on ortho rotation and they would have a cart full of implants and the doctor would select one. they were excessively nice to me, probably to look good in front of the surgeon, and explained a lot of stuff that i didnt want to ask the resident/attending and sound dumb.

Most pharm and med device reps are instructed to be very polite and friendly even to M3's and M4's. They realize in a few years you will be an attending and buying their stuff and making their companies a buttload of money, so they have no financial incentive to treat you like human garbage. It's just basic Sales 101 tactics.

As a med student I was stupid enough to flirt with cute female pharm reps until I wised up and realized they were just playing the money game that we're all slaves to. It's the same thing as giving $150 to a hooker and believing she is honestly attracted to you and loves hearing you talk about your stressful day.

 

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

As a med student I was stupid enough to flirt with cute female pharm reps until I wised up and realized they were just playing the money game that we're all slaves to. It's the same thing as giving $150 to a hooker and believing she is honestly attracted to you and loves hearing you talk about your stressful day.

On second thought maybe my girlfriend shouldnt do this job...

150$, what kind of hookers are u seein?

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

Both hospitals I worked at passed policy that prohibited them from feeding us. They were super helpful during cases though.

They can do it if the feeding happens along with an “education” component.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

They can do it if the feeding happens along with an “education” component.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

Not where I worked. The policy was literally that they were not allowed to bring food. Period. We all thought it was a tad overboard.

 

[Durty-Trixxx]

US prices. Leave the US and you can get top notch for sub 100.

Like the Tijuana strip clubs --- which I heard are basically brothels ?

 

[Kr#36]

Yep I used to be one for a couple years before deciding to go to medical school. A lot of hospitals went with the no food route. I worked specifically with sinus devices and can say that the $150k is on the low end, it was actually kind of ridiculous.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Yep I used to be one for a couple years before deciding to go to medical school. A lot of hospitals went with the no food route. I worked specifically with sinus devices and can say that the $150k is on the low end, it was actually kind of ridiculous.

You want to hear ridiculous? My cousin makes $60k in 2 months on a bad year. Selling Christmas trees. This year it was closer to 80.

 

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

Not where I worked. The policy was literally that they were not allowed to bring food. Period. We all thought it was a tad overboard.

I never made it too far as a student before leaving my program so I dont know too much about these med rep guys, but from the two I shadowed in a cardiology unit, the dr (My uncle) would basically just order a new pacemaker and they would show up at the time for the procedure and help out. I dont think they were ever involved with actually trying to market a pacemaker for Patient XYZ and say he would be a great candidate.

So why the food?

 

[Kr#36]

You want to hear ridiculous? My cousin makes $60k in 2 months on a bad year. Selling Christmas trees. This year it was closer to 80.

Thats the dream. Someday when all this silly medicine business is over I'm going to move to bumf*ck nowhere and sell Christmas trees and fireworks on my front lawn...

 

[Psai]

Not where I worked. The policy was literally that they were not allowed to bring food. Period. We all thought it was a tad overboard.

I never understood why it's okay for them to advertise to you for free but once there's a free pen or sandwich, that's suddenly huge deal. Either limit access altogether or don't. This halfway garbage is ridiculous.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

I never made it too far as a student before leaving my program so I dont know too much about these med rep guys, but from the two I shadowed in a cardiology unit, the dr (My uncle) would basically just order a new pacemaker and they would show up at the time for the procedure and help out. I dont think they were ever involved with actually trying to market a pacemaker for Patient XYZ and say he would be a great candidate.

So why the food?

A few studies have shown that physicians are more likely to request products from a particular company if that company provides food and other treats or free stuff. They bring food for the staff and docs, and next time you’re doing a total hip, you use Synthes instead of Stryker.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

I never understood why it's okay for them to advertise to you for free but once there's a free pen or sandwich, that's suddenly huge deal. Either limit access altogether or don't. This halfway garbage is ridiculous.

Agree. Our reps can only give us food off site, not on hospital grounds... and with an "education" program like a presentation etc.

 

[Psai]

A few studies have shown that physicians are more likely to request products from a particular company if that company provides food and other treats or free stuff. They bring food for the staff and docs, and next time you’re doing a total hip, you use Synthes instead of Stryker.

These guys are already in the OR showcasing their products to the surgeons and teaching them how to use them during actual operations. How is that any more ethical than getting a 20 dollar lunch from the same attractive rep?

This is how the world works. Advertising sells products. It makes no sense to do one kind but not another and only in a way that is disadvantageous to physicians.

It's about as ridiculous as politicians taking jobs from companies after leaving office or participating in insider trading while demanding that physicians (but not the hospital ceo, pa, nursing director, np) have their industry links be laid bare.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

These guys are already in the OR showcasing their products to the surgeons and teaching them how to use them during actual operations. How is that any more ethical than getting a 20 dollar lunch from the same attractive rep?

This is how the world works. Advertising sells products. It makes no sense to do one kind but not another and only in a way that is disadvantageous to physicians.

It's about as ridiculous as politicians taking jobs from companies after leaving office or participating in insider trading while demanding that physicians (but not the hospital ceo, pa, nursing director, np) have their industry links be laid bare.

I guess theoretically the surgeon has already picked which company to use by the time they’re in the OR, so at that point the rep being there doesn’t add much in the sales department? I dunno, I always thought it was weird too.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

I guess theoretically the surgeon has already picked which company to use by the time they’re in the OR, so at that point the rep being there doesn’t add much in the sales department? I dunno, I always thought it was weird too.

There is incentive to keep using the company if they are nice to you, just like with any ad. But what makes me use a company is 1) how easy the product is to learn/use, 2) how responsive the reps are. Thinking I will use one company over another because they bring me a pen or a sandwich is an insult to my intelligence. I can afford a f***ing sandwich. This is what happens when bureaucrats make rules instead of physicians. They don’t know what clinical practice is actually like.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

There is incentive to keep using the company if they are nice to you, just like with any ad. But what makes me use a company is 1) how easy the product is to learn/use, 2) how responsive the reps are. Thinking I will use one company over another because they bring me a pen or a sandwich is an insult to my intelligence. I can afford a f***ing sandwich. This is what happens when bureaucrats make rules instead of physicians. They don’t know what clinical practice is actually like.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

Yep. It's really insulting, actually. It's like they think physicians are incapable of viewing things objectively just because someone throws a sandwich at them. I mean, there have been a couple studies showing that physicians are more likely to use or prescribe things when given "treats," but there are a bunch of reasons why there might be that correlation without necessarily having the causation. Also, the two most oft cited studies in that area are from Canada.

 

[OrthoTraumaMD]

Yep. It's really insulting, actually. It's like they think physicians are incapable of viewing things objectively just because someone throws a sandwich at them. I mean, there have been a couple studies showing that physicians are more likely to use or prescribe things when given "treats," but there are a bunch of reasons why there might be that correlation without necessarily having the causation. Also, the two most oft cited studies in that area are from Canada.

Canada, figures. With universal healthcare, physicians are poor, so I can see why they’d be tempted by a sandwich.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN mobile

 

[libertyyne]

Information from Pharmaceutical Companies and the Quality, Quantity, and Cost of Physicians' Prescribing: A Systematic Review

I mean physicans are people too, so sales tricks and tactics work on them as well.

Plus it seems to have worked- kinda. at least for medications. I am not sure if there are any device selection based studies.
Association Between Pharmaceutical Detailing Restrictions and Physician Prescribing

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Information from Pharmaceutical Companies and the Quality, Quantity, and Cost of Physicians' Prescribing: A Systematic Review

I mean physicans are people too, so sales tricks and tactics work on them as well.

Plus it seems to have worked- kinda. at least for medications. I am not sure if there are any device selection based studies.
Association Between Pharmaceutical Detailing Restrictions and Physician Prescribing

Right, but the difference between drug reps and device reps is that the drug reps don’t show up every time you prescribe the drug. Just about any time you want to use a prosthetic, the rep has to be there. So they are coming to sell you on using them again whether they bring donuts or not.

 

[Kr#36]

Right, but the difference between drug reps and device reps is that the drug reps don’t show up every time you prescribe the drug. Just about any time you want to use a prosthetic, the rep has to be there. So they are coming to sell you on using them again whether they bring donuts or not.

At my company, we were never taught to use food to sway a physician. The reason we brought food is for the other staff, they tended to make getting access to the facility/higher ups much easier when we brought food regularly and could develop a friendly relationship with them. They were also much more likely to give us the surgery schedule so that we could show up and ensure the doc used our stuff.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

At my company, we were never taught to use food to sway a physician. The reason we brought food is for the other staff, they tended to make getting access to the facility/higher ups much easier when we brought food regularly and could develop a friendly relationship with them. They were also much more likely to give us the surgery schedule so that we could show up and ensure the doc used our stuff.

Yeah, they always told us it was for everyone else too. I dunno about the facilities you covered, but our surgeons always scheduled the rep to come when they scheduled the cases. I can count on one hand the number of times in 7 years we did an ortho case without a rep (scopes and stuff excluded).

 

[Mad Jack]

These guys are already in the OR showcasing their products to the surgeons and teaching them how to use them during actual operations. How is that any more ethical than getting a 20 dollar lunch from the same attractive rep?

This is how the world works. Advertising sells products. It makes no sense to do one kind but not another and only in a way that is disadvantageous to physicians.

It's about as ridiculous as politicians taking jobs from companies after leaving office or participating in insider trading while demanding that physicians (but not the hospital ceo, pa, nursing director, np) have their industry links be laid bare.

Food creates a very strong subconscious bias, per the studies that have been done on the subject. It actually has a stronger effect than expensive or experiential gifts luge watches or golf trips, it literally bribes your brain on a visceral subconscious level.

 

[Kr#36]

Yeah, they always told us it was for everyone else too. I dunno about the facilities you covered, but our surgeons always scheduled the rep to come when they scheduled the cases. I can count on one hand the number of times in 7 years we did an ortho case without a rep (scopes and stuff excluded).

That was the case for docs who were fully on board using my stuff. But when trying to earn new business you’ve got to get them to try it a few times, get the kinks out, and try to show the benefits of one brand vs another. The best way I usuallly did this was to find out their schedule, show up, and ask them to try my stuff on this next case.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

That was the case for docs who were fully on board using my stuff. But when trying to earn new business you’ve got to get them to try it a few times, get the kinks out, and try to show the benefits of one brand vs another. The best way I usuallly did this was to find out their schedule, show up, and ask them to try my stuff on this next case.

Like, on the case they have scheduled for that day? What did they do, tell the company they had scheduled it with to pound sand?

 

[Psai]

Food creates a very strong subconscious bias, per the studies that have been done on the subject. It actually has a stronger effect than expensive or experiential gifts luge watches or golf trips, it literally bribes your brain on a visceral subconscious level.

These guys are already in the OR showcasing their products to the surgeons and teaching them how to use them during actual operations. How is that any more ethical than getting a 20 dollar lunch from the same attractive rep?

 

[Mad Jack]

quotes

It's more ethical because there is actually teaching and other justifications representatives have in the OR. Physicians can't learn about new and exciting products if there is no one talking about them and explaining their use. Food, however, bribes on a subconscious level that can't be replicated with words

 

[Southplains]

I’ve seen reps doing all of the described above, as well as talking about this stent/deployment specifics with vascular surgeons doing endo work. Also recomending this or that for an IVC retrieval.

But how does that differ with cardiac electro phys techs who have gone through a program such as this one? I never saw these guys in the cath lab so don’t really know but they have to take anatomy and physiology in their curriculum. Don’t know the extent of their involvement but I imagine it’s similar?

 

[Kr#36]

P

Like, on the case they have scheduled for that day? What did they do, tell the company they had scheduled it with to pound sand?

Yea sometimes. Other times I was in there with a rep from another company, essentially competing with them face to face. Other times the current rep wouldn’t show up for cases because they were with other customers and I could sneak in and steal the business.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

P


Yea sometimes. Other times I was in there with a rep from another company, essentially competing with them face to face. Other times the current rep wouldn’t show up for cases because they were with other customers and I could sneak in and steal the business.

Wow, that’s some Mad Max ****.

 

[Psai]

P


Yea sometimes. Other times I was in there with a rep from another company, essentially competing with them face to face. Other times the current rep wouldn’t show up for cases because they were with other customers and I could sneak in and steal the business.

And you got to do it for free, without spending a single cent on a sandwich for the hardworking doctors.

 

[Kr#36]

And you got to do it for free, without spending a single cent on a sandwich for the hardworking doctors.

Any good rep makes sure he takes care of the docs.

Note: I don't mean the above statement in a weird way. It sounds weird. Get your mind out of the gutter.

 

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

Are reps you guys meet always hot girls?
I kind of wanted to apply for one of these jobs since I feel I meet the qualificaitons better than some people but I was kind of discouraged when someone told me they would rather take a hot sorority girl.

 

[mimelim]

Are reps you guys meet always hot girls?
I kind of wanted to apply for one of these jobs since I feel I meet the qualificaitons better than some people but I was kind of discouraged when someone told me they would rather take a hot sorority girl.

Maybe it is just my locale, but the guys are better looking than the girls. And I say that as a heterosexual male. I swear they just hire ex-male models...

 

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

Maybe it is just my locale, but the guys are better looking than the girls. And I say that as a heterosexual male. I swear they just hire ex-male models...

I should clarify I am an average looking dude.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Are reps you guys meet always hot girls?
I kind of wanted to apply for one of these jobs since I feel I meet the qualificaitons better than some people but I was kind of discouraged when someone told me they would rather take a hot sorority girl.

Most of the ortho reps I’ve met were men.

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Thank goodness. I say this as a female orthopod, who very much appreciates a constant stream of hot dudes to admire.

I actually can't think of a single ortho rep I've worked with who was female, but I could be forgetting. I have met several female reps, but they always work for ethicon or medtronic or something.

 

[Neopolymath]

Everyone knows they are just there to hang on the c-arm and tease the scrubs techs the whole case and talk **** with the surgeon at the sink before the case. The spine reps got it best though at my old job. They would sit in the lounge and just come back every 30 minutes or so for each level. They brought food for everyone but the surgeons at my past jobs. I always thought that was funny.

 

[Neopolymath]

I actually can't think of a single ortho rep I've worked with who was female, but I could be forgetting. I have met several female reps, but they always work for ethicon or medtronic or something.

Boston Scientific seems to have a lot of ladies

 

[Matthew9Thirtyfive]

Boston Scientific seems to have a lot of ladies

That they do.

 

[neusu]

Yeah, they always told us it was for everyone else too. I dunno about the facilities you covered, but our surgeons always scheduled the rep to come when they scheduled the cases. I can count on one hand the number of times in 7 years we did an ortho case without a rep (scopes and stuff excluded).

I generally have a company in mind for a case and book it as such (e.g. what hardware for spine, navigation system, etc.). It does get interesting though, if I either do not book a specific vendor, or have a preference for a case.

Maybe it is just my locale, but the guys are better looking than the girls. And I say that as a heterosexual male. I swear they just hire ex-male models...

Agreed. These guys are very personable. Also, it seems the majority of them are former professional athletes.

 

[IDontHaveAnyFeet]

I generally have a company in mind for a case and book it as such (e.g. what hardware for spine, navigation system, etc.). It does get interesting though, if I either do not book a specific vendor, or have a preference for a case.



Agreed. These guys are very personable. Also, it seems the majority of them are former professional athletes.

When you see these guys and girls, are you buying the product because they are simply attractive?
Are the usually able to answer all your questions about the product?
Do some medical devices sell themselves?

 

[Neopolymath]

When you see these guys and girls, are you buying the product because they are simply attractive?
Are the usually able to answer all your questions about the product?
Do some medical devices sell themselves?

I'm obviously not a neurosurgeon, but when the facility has Brainlabs vs Stealth you kind of use what they have there. It's not like one of these people is going to sell you on which to use. The people in the OR are there for technical support more than anything these days. They are mostly helping the newer techs set up the case, especially for ortho/neuro.