Top This Story And I'll Send You $100! Please Help!

[limpkitty]

IMO, and I am nowhere near an adcom, the lie is a bigger deal than the MCAT.

It's too bad that admissions committees don't have a magical machine to see how applicants perform under stress and under what degree they start to consider compromising their own ethics.

What is wrong with you people???? The kid is talking about lying to his parents about his mcat score because he's embarrassed. It's not exactly the crime of the century.

Some of you say getting a 16 on the mcat doesn't mean you'll be a bad doctor (imo it means you're dumb as a rock, and that does correlate w/ being a bad doctor), but does lying to your parents about your mcat mean you'll be a terrible physician???

When I was in high school I lied to my parents all the time about drinking, does this mean I shouldn't be allowed into med school??? The lie is a bigger deal than the mcat? What world do you live in???

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[drizzt3117]

Someone with a 16 isn't going to be admitted, so they won't have the chance to kill anyone (at least as a doctor)

 

[lisichka]

geez, you are so cruel, kids...

what if he takes MCAT in a year and gets 45T? give the guy a break, maybe it was a fluke>? c'mon.

 

[limpkitty]

Yeah right, who are you kidding. The dude's obviously a dunce

 

[lisichka]

Yeah right, who are you kidding. The dude's obviously a dunce

limpkitty, go joke in another thread. this is a serious thread. i don;t understand this kind of behavior. it is like laughing at someone funeral (only i believe the guy could be resurrected) stop this.

 

[limpkitty]

limpkitty, go joke in another thread. this is a serious thread. i don;t understand this kind of behavior. it is like laughing at someone funeral (only i believe the guy could be resurrected) stop this.

Lol. What??? I don't know how you can possibly justify using a funeral as a metaphor for this.

Did you read the op's post? Look, I have some sympathy for him, but the kid sounds real immature and obviously is not ready to enter med school. I mean, c'mon, who the hell stresses about talking to their parents enough to post on here about it?

 

[Old Grunt]

What is wrong with you people???? The kid is talking about lying to his parents about his mcat score because he's embarrassed. It's not exactly the crime of the century.

Some of you say getting a 16 on the mcat doesn't mean you'll be a bad doctor (imo it means you're dumb as a rock, and that does correlate w/ being a bad doctor), but does lying to your parents about your mcat mean you'll be a terrible physician???

When I was in high school I lied to my parents all the time about drinking, does this mean I shouldn't be allowed into med school??? The lie is a bigger deal than the mcat? What world do you live in???

Like I said, the way people behave under one type of stress is indicative of how they will behave in others.

Do you think things are going to be any less stressful when lives are on the line?

 

[limpkitty]

Like I said, the way people behave under one type of stress is indicative of how they will behave in others.

Do you think things are going to be any less stressful when lives are on the line?

No, but it is a completely different situation and behavior is very situational-dependant. How the op acts around his parents most likely will not correlate with how he would act in a medical emergency. I'm not making this up, plenty of psychological studies have proven this. I think it's a pretty ridiculous idea that whether one lies to their parents (about their mcat score, for godssake!) will determine how good of a doctor they are.

 

[DocMTL]

hey, the following might be encouraging for you: i found an MD applicant profile who got accepted at DMU with a 17 MCAT!!!!.
So who knows what the outcome may be!! If you eventually decide to apply this cycle (although kinda late in the game)...you might still get in!!

what do we know anyway, we are only premeds

 

[PreMD86]

So...None of you have ever lied to your parents?NO?




LIARS!!!

 

[Orbo]

That's a pretty ridiculous statement IMHO. Nothing on the MCAT correlates at all to saving lives. I know my fair share of people who never really put the book smarts together but are incredible on the wards and quicker on their toes in an emergency then most. That being said, I would echo the sentiments here that a 16 is pretty disconcerting. There's a very clear lack of study skills, effort, or focus with a score that low. That isn't "just not getting it."

You're right! It implies both "just not getting it" AND "a complete and utter void in discipline and study skills."

Yippee!

 

[dd128]

Wow, I just saw this and was reading over some of the responses. It seems like the overwhelming majority says to be honest. Though this thing isn't that big a deal, so I don't really see the point in coming clean as it is really only going to cause excess stress to you and your family. Like if you cheat on your girlfriend with someone else (not the best analogy and I have never done it!), it's not really good to tell her just to clear your conscience, you either break up with her or keep your mouth shut. I'd probably just go with the "I'm disappointed in myself' and tell them you're going to study harder because you went to the top tier school for undergrad and want to get into the top tier medical school. Good luck.

 

[Maxprime]

I finally thought of something constructive to say: The 16 isn't going away unless you wait 3 years, so do other stuff for 3 years. It may give you some time to figure out what you really want to do for the next 50 years of your life.

 

[sawood]

IMO, and I am nowhere near an adcom, the lie is a bigger deal than the MCAT.

It's too bad that admissions committees don't have a magical machine to see how applicants perform under stress and under what degree they start to consider compromising their own ethics.

Amen.

Also, what does IMO mean? I'm obviously not in the loop

What is wrong with you people???? The kid is talking about lying to his parents about his mcat score because he's embarrassed. It's not exactly the crime of the century.

Some of you say getting a 16 on the mcat doesn't mean you'll be a bad doctor (imo it means you're dumb as a rock, and that does correlate w/ being a bad doctor), but does lying to your parents about your mcat mean you'll be a terrible physician???

When I was in high school I lied to my parents all the time about drinking, does this mean I shouldn't be allowed into med school??? The lie is a bigger deal than the mcat? What world do you live in???

Lets see, I really wouldn't want my doctor to start spitting out lies because he's embarassed over an MCAT score. My goodness, what happens if a resident yells, is he going to hide under the bed? And he is not a minor in high school who is trying to sneak around under parent's rules. At the very least he is 22ish and perfectly capable of living on his own without influence from daddy (unless we're talking about a child prodigy whose only 13 years old, in which case - totally acting their age). BUT, chances are he is completely financially dependent upon dad and is choosing to lie to avoid the 'dissapointment' instead of taking the actual physical steps to become an independent adult....meaning moving out, and not letting dad pay the bills.

I don't even know if the OP is reading this anymore. I really do hope he finds a way to face his parents, and study for the MCAT and get into med school.
I don't see how telling him that "lying is okay because you were embarassed" is going to help him attain to his goal of becomming a doctor. It will just make him feel better in the moment.

 

[luv2sd]

I really want to help you but I can't lol

My parents didn't even tell me to go to college.
And when I got into college, they wanted me to major in business because they wanted me to continue their business lol

Now they are like "what? a medical school? uh.. ok all we have to do is pay for your tuition right?"

anyway, you should tell your dad the truth. I wish I had parents who cared about their son going to medical school...

 

[pguin]

this is one of the most bizarre and ridiculous threads i have ever seen. Everyone really needs to get off their "I've never told a lie" high horse. The simple fact is that every single person, or all ages, lies many many times (usually per day). Doctors lie, patients lie, lawyers lie, police lie....everyone does! The OP simply was embarassed by the horrible score and didn't want to tell it to his parents. Thats got to be one of the most understandable lies I've ever seen.

I'm in medical school now and we recently had a pretty rough test (we use block test schedules so it was biochem, histo, and anatomy all in one. Three people in the class failed the test...but I know for sure one of them told their parents they did fine...and I'm guessing the other two did as well. Every single one of them will make good doctors despite that they lied (unless they keep failing tests) This is just a part of life and anyone on here who says they've never lied to their parents recently is either lying themselves or needs to get out and do something to lie about.

To the OP...as far as your question goes...if you want to keep hiding it from your parents than thats fine...its your life and in no way reflects the type of doctor you'll be. However that 16 definately does reflect and you need to spend as much time as possible studying to get that up. If you aren't able to raise it very significantly (8-10+) points it will probably be time to look into a different profession...but tackle that when it comes...just do the best you can and hopefully it will turn out well

 

[PreMD86]

Seriously, why does every person looking for help here with the slightest bit of insecurity gets to have their future career and dreams put into question?
I've been told by people that "I wouldn't want you to be my doctor" for everything from getting a 29 on my first take to deciding to live with my parents if I got into school close to home.
Get this in your heads: no physician is perfect, not even close. None of you have any clue of the past history of your favorite PCC. Everybody lies, everybody makes mistakes, and occasionally they even get into medical school to become fantastic physicians that you would'nt suspect were imperfect otherwise.
Part of a being a physician is being able to put yourself objectively in someone's shoes and empathize- it seems not too many of you have been successful. Luckily you'll still become fantastic physicians

 

[jochi1543]

I really want to help you but I can't lol

My parents didn't even tell me to go to college.
And when I got into college, they wanted me to major in business because they wanted me to continue their business lol

Now they are like "what? a medical school? uh.. ok all we have to do is pay for your tuition right?"

anyway, you should tell your dad the truth. I wish I had parents who cared about their son going to medical school...

Same here. It took me 3 years of getting through my father's yelling fits to tell him you have to have a bachelor's to apply to med school. He kept screaming that I "wasted 4 years of college!"

Then he was freaking about the # of schools I applied to...

Just wait, he hasn't heard about the tuition yet.

 

[limpkitty]

Seriously, why does every person looking for help here with the slightest bit of insecurity gets to have their future career and dreams put into question?
I've been told by people that "I wouldn't want you to be my doctor" for everything from getting a 29 on my first take to deciding to live with my parents if I got into school close to home.
Get this in your heads: no physician is perfect, not even close. None of you have any clue of the past history of your favorite PCC. Everybody lies, everybody makes mistakes, and occasionally they even get into medical school to become fantastic physicians that you would'nt suspect were imperfect otherwise.
Part of a being a physician is being able to put yourself objectively in someone's shoes and empathize- it seems not too many of you have been successful. Luckily you'll still become fantastic physicians

Wait, you don't think that everyone with an MD after their name is the epitome of utter perfection???????

I would never want you to be my doctor, not even if I had terrible acne and you were the last dermatologist on earth. How dare you speak such blasphemy!

I am hereby going to start notifying every medical school in the country that Premd86 is guilty of the horrific crime of doctor bashing and is thereby unsuitable for medical school.

Shame!

 

[pguin]

I really want to help you but I can't lol

My parents didn't even tell me to go to college.
And when I got into college, they wanted me to major in business because they wanted me to continue their business lol

Now they are like "what? a medical school? uh.. ok all we have to do is pay for your tuition right?"

anyway, you should tell your dad the truth. I wish I had parents who cared about their son going to medical school...

I understand the whole thing about your parents not caring that much...but if they are actually willing to pay for medical school than you are instantly removed of your right to complain about them!!!...my 200k+ in debt when i graduate will still be there despite my very caring parents

 

[luv2sd]

I understand the whole thing about your parents not caring that much...but if they are actually willing to pay for medical school than you are instantly removed of your right to complain about them!!!...my 200k+ in debt when i graduate will still be there despite my very caring parents

but I still have to complain because had they been strict about my grades since high school, I would've gotten into a "better" college.

 

[sawood]

Seriously, why does every person looking for help here with the slightest bit of insecurity gets to have their future career and dreams put into question?
I've been told by people that "I wouldn't want you to be my doctor" for everything from getting a 29 on my first take to deciding to live with my parents if I got into school close to home.
Get this in your heads: no physician is perfect, not even close. None of you have any clue of the past history of your favorite PCC. Everybody lies, everybody makes mistakes, and occasionally they even get into medical school to become fantastic physicians that you would'nt suspect were imperfect otherwise.
Part of a being a physician is being able to put yourself objectively in someone's shoes and empathize- it seems not too many of you have been successful. Luckily you'll still become fantastic physicians

I'm not saying the OP isn't ever going to make a good physician. And I'm not saying that I've never lied in my life, I'm not perfect either.

But I firmly believe his life will get easier once he detaches his self-worth from what his dad thinks. I'd imagine med school will be more enjoyable if his dad no longer has that big of an influence on him either. Its obvious that right now the approval and pride from dad is very important to him, and I doubt continuing to lie to his father is going to make him feel happier or calmer......

 

[littlealex]

The solution is simple.
A few things:

1) You cannot apply this year and be successful. 16 MCAT + Late application...
2) You need to study and retake the MCAT.

Solution:
1) Tell your father that you're just not ready to apply, and that it is too late right now to try. Explain to him that you will work hard this year and put together a stronger application for next year.

2) Tell him the truth that you failed to perform up to your standards on the MCAT, and will need a year to study and retake it.

I vote for the second solution. As a former habitual lier, I must advise you that having to keep up a lie for the rest of your life is just too tiring and stressful.

 

[Old Grunt]

Amen.

Also, what does IMO mean? I'm obviously not in the loop

In my opinion.

I am old, so I guess this whole phenomenum of "it's okay to lie to your parents" is kind of lost on me. My parents stopped bugging me about my life when I left the house. I can understand blurting something out, but to perpetuate that and be resolved to maintain a deception is immature.

At any rate, coming out of another profession where lives and limbs have been lost as a result of peoples "little white lies", I personally have a dim view of such things. I imagine the many people on here will develop the same mentality after they are left holding the bag after one of their esteemed colleagues pulls a fast one as well.

 

[87138]

but I still have to complain because had they been strict about my grades since high school, I would've gotten into a "better" college.

That's a pretty stupid excuse, to put it bluntly. If you can't take responsibility for your own work, that's a problem.

My parents have always cared about me, but have never been particularly involved in what I'm doing. As long as I wasn't going around murdering people or selling drugs, they were happy. It turns out that instead of killing and selling dope, I was out getting good grades and scoring well on the SAT, on top of a ridiculous amount of extracurriculars in high school (perhaps even too many).

My parents are happy for me, but they don't try to interfere with things, thankfully. They'd be happy as long as I was happy with what I chose to do.

 

[PreMD86]

In my opinion.

I am old, so I guess this whole phenomenum of "it's okay to lie to your parents" is kind of lost on me. My parents stopped bugging me about my life when I left the house. I can understand blurting something out, but to perpetuate that and be resolved to maintain a deception is immature.

At any rate, coming out of another profession where lives and limbs have been lost as a result of peoples "little white lies", I personally have a dim view of such things. I imagine the many people on here will develop the same mentality after they are left holding the bag after one of their esteemed colleagues pulls a fast one as well.

Ohh right...your generation has NEVER lied to their parents. Don't try to fool me, I watch that 70's show on a regular basis (If you're older than that I hope you're here to gather information for your grandchildren).

You were obviously in the military, we get it, but kindly check your ego at the door. We all maintain deceptions in one way or another, and we all lie, yourself included. To insist that lying to your parents about your MCAT score somehow affects one's ability to practice medicine is absurd.
The saddest part is, I bet this thread would look entirely differently had the OP lied about getting a 40 if he scored a 35.

 

[Old Grunt]

Ohh right...your generation has NEVER lied to their parents. Don't try to fool me, I watch that 70's show on a regular basis (If you're older than that I hope you're here to gather information for your grandchildren).

Not that old! At any rate, of course I lied to my parents. Then I grew up.

Do old people like myself lie all the time? Of course. Does it ever improve things? Hardly.

You were obviously in the military, we get it, but kindly check your ego at the door. We all maintain deceptions in one way or another, and we all lie, yourself included. To insist that lying to your parents about your MCAT score somehow affects one's ability to practice medicine is absurd.
The saddest part is, I bet this thread would look entirely differently had the OP lied about getting a 40 if he scored a 35.

It was the military. I don't have an ego about it, just the perspective of being in a situation where life and limb (as opposed to money) where on the line as a result of mistakes made. After getting my MCAT score back, all semblance of an ego flew right out the door. At any rate, I am sure eventually that everyone here will have the pleasure of being part of something that should have been simple that got turned into a giant cluster **** because someone fudged something here or there. In the military (if you care), the classic case is an officer fudging his readiness reports so that he or she will not get a bad efficiency report. Then his unit deploys to combat with insufficient equipment, ammunition, armor, etc, and someone else suffers for it. Is this analogous? Not really, but my point was really about ethics.

I never said lying to your parents about your MCAT score would make someone a bad physician. That is absurd. What I did say is that the way people behave under one type of stressful situation is indicative of how they will behave under other types of pressure and it's not going to get any easier. So maybe, in some obtuse way, the system really has worked here.

You may disagree with that, but I am a believer in it.

 

[keys]

This seems like it could also be emotional - I would write out what you would want to say to your dad - like a letter. Sit him down and say "I want to tell you something about my MCAT score - but to keep my thoughts coherent, I will read you what I wrote". Prefice this by saying - you were trying not to disappoint him too much - but truly don't want to lie to him.

tell him the truth.

 

[inaminute]

here's the plan:

Start coming home with effeminate boys in tow. Ask your mom if you can borrow a scarf or two. Listen to Judy Garland albums. Then, one Sunday at dinner, tell your parents you are gay.* After they calm down, say, "just kidding! Actually, I essentially failed the MCAT and need to take a year to make my application look competitive and to get a better score. I hope you will continue to support my efforts."




*not that there's anything wrong with that!

 

[inaminute]

on a more serious note:


people who are "independent adults" who accept financial support of any kind from their parents have abdicated their right to complain if the parents are "too nosy" or "too bossy" about the dependent kid's life.

if you don't want them to have a say in your life, don't allow them to pay for it---and then there's no need to lie to them, because you can honestly say it's none of their business

the lying is an offshoot of your understanding that they have a right to know what you're doing when they are paying your bills (or even some of your bills)

 

[Blade28]

I understand the whole thing about your parents not caring that much...but if they are actually willing to pay for medical school than you are instantly removed of your right to complain about them!!!...my 200k+ in debt when i graduate will still be there despite my very caring parents

I agree!

My debt from undergrad and med school (over $140k) is mine alone.

 

[BlackSails]

I dont think it really matters that he lied. Applying this late, and with a subpar MCAT score (16 or 25) doesnt give him good odds anyway.

 

[bsax007]

Just email your dad a link to this thread. That way he'll know your fears and the SDN posters will scare him into thinking you'll never get into med school anyway.

 

[mandinca]

I'm reminded of what a professor of mine said last year regarding cheating on exams (a lie is a lie), "Do you really want a doctor who cheated in school treating YOU?"

 

[pguin]

I'm reminded of what a professor of mine said last year regarding cheating on exams (a lie is a lie), "Do you really want a doctor who cheated in school treating YOU?"

Every lie is not equal!!!...thats why they have a term for lies which are meant to help people by not hurting their feelings (white lie)...Also, in your example, its not the act of dishonesty that makes someone not want a doctor who would cheat on a test...its the fact that he either 1) was unable to understand the material and therefore had to cheat or 2) was too lazy to learn the material for himself. I want my doctor to be fully able to pass every exam he takes...but what he tells his parents about his performance is his business

 

[sawood]

I subscribe to the "a lie is a lie" concept. But the fact that the OP lied isn't really what I look at so much as:

1) This does show how important/stressful situations will be handled: with avoidance and lies - which does effect the type of doctor a person will become. If it wasn't a big deal, the post never would have been made. But since it is a big deal to him, the lie is not a 'white' one.

2) There's a strong chance that the OP's MCAT exam fee, undergraduate tuition, rent, food, etc, is mostly or entirely provided by the parents. With that, the OP lost any right to withholding information regarding those things from his parents.

And before anyone jumps all over it: Have I ever in my life lied to my parents? Yes, when I was younger. Was that right or okay? No. Do I ever lie to them now? No, I don't. Its funny what happens when you pay all your own bills.

 

[FloridaSun]

I finally thought of something constructive to say: The 16 isn't going away unless you wait 3 years, so do other stuff for 3 years. It may give you some time to figure out what you really want to do for the next 50 years of your life.

Actually, I'd have to second Maxprime's suggestion.

I'd officially like to retract my former pessimism concerning the nature of this post.

 

[pakbabydoll]

Well I told my teacher I am 18 by mistake when I am really 19. lol

 

[Hyperstudyosis]

Tell your dad the truth. I would just say, "You know, Dad, I really didn't get a 25. I was too ashamed to tell you at first, but I really got a 16 and that's why I don't want to apply." If he blows up, oh well. He'll get over it eventually. And then study for the MCAT and take it again and show him what you're really capable of.

 

[Cranial Gavage]

I posted earlier, though perhaps a bit too negatively. The anonymity of SDN makes it easy to become a hater/troll rather than posting constructive advice. (Hey, I'm just the FNG.)

Rather than speaking to the ethics of honesty or analyzing your MCAT score, I would suggest that a fulfilling career in healthcare does not always require a medical degree.

You might consider pursuing one of the many healthcare careers that do not require an MD or DO. A friend of mine realized that he wanted to work in healthcare during his senior year of college but had not completed the prereqs for the MCAT. He is now pursuing a degree of audiology (AuD) and will work with the hearing impaired. Other options include physical therapy, pharmacy, and optometry. Some of these programs will have more stringent requirements than others.

In any case, don't give up on your goal of working in healthcare if that is truly your passion!

Good luck!

 

[Old Grunt]

I posted earlier, though perhaps a bit too negatively. The anonymity of SDN makes it easy to become a hater/troll rather than posting constructive advice. (Hey, I'm just the FNG.)

Rather than speaking to the ethics of honesty or analyzing your MCAT score, I would suggest that a fulfilling career in healthcare does not always require a medical degree.

You might consider pursuing one of the many healthcare careers that do not require an MD or DO. A friend of mine realized that he wanted to work in healthcare during his senior year of college but had not completed the prereqs for the MCAT. He is now pursuing a degree of audiology (AuD) and will work with the hearing impaired. Other options include physical therapy, pharmacy, and optometry. Some of these programs will have more stringent requirements than others.

In any case, don't give up on your goal of working in healthcare if that is truly your passion!

Good luck!

That's probably the most mature post on this thread.

Thanks.

 

[starlight04]

I think that the most absurd part about the original post is the title, which expresses a sense of immaturity and extreme overexaggeration of the situation.

i think i am going to agree with the sentiment that many of you are being unnecessarily harsh and ridiculous to the OP. (S?)he lied to a parent about an MCAT score of 16 by saying that s/he got a 25 instead. So what? Who hasn't told a similar lie to their parents before? A 16 is a bad score, sure, but its not like the poster lied and said he got a 40. He was just trying to get his father off his back about applying for this year, admitting he didn't do well as he could have on the MCAT. This score of 25 served the same "low score" purpose of 16, but just sounded a little better.

Who hasn't exaggerated the truth before? Like a previous med student stated earlier, people do this all the time, in and out of med school. Somebody reassures his or her parents they are doing fine in school to get them off his back while he tries to pull up his grades. Somebody else tells his parents that he is staying in for the night to study knowing he will go out and drink and party later. People lie and hide the fact that they are having sex to their parents. These are daily facts of life, and you can't say that somebody who does this will make a bad doctor, and chances are, you are hippocritical if you say that you have never done something similar before.

I personally think I'm a mature, capable, and intelligent individual who works hard to achieve my goals. However, sometimes when my parents ask me what time i went to bed last night or how my exam went, i stretch the truth a little to make the conversation easier on both of us. I know what I did wrong, and there is no point in hearing the same lecture over and over again. They are paying $40k+ a year for me to be in school, and while they are entitled to know what I do with this money they spend, at 21 years old, I don't feel it necessary to tell my parents every single detail of my life. I have never lied up-front about grades of my MCAT score, but know plenty of people who do--whether its to their parents, their friends, or their peers. Put yourself in his shoes--how would YOU feel if you got a 16 on the MCAT? I think that in more critical situations more important than a single number on a stupid 4 hour test, this judgement call on whether to lie or not may change for many. I don't know that the OP would ever lie to a patient about complications of a surgery or chances for survival. I certainly wouldn't.

I think the OP's main concern at this point should be his motivation toward a career in medicine--a 16 is clearly a bad score and shows either little preparation or clear stupidity (which is probably not the case, seeing as he goes to a top ranked school). If he wanted medicine as badly as he claims, he would have done more to prepare. It seems like the father is putting a lot of pressure on getting an MD. Is this what he really wants?

Everyone jumping on the OP at once, telling him how stupid or immoral he is or how bad of a doctor he would make is not constructive and even arrogant.