Toughest Decision of my Life! NYU vs. WESTERNU?

[HowCanSheSlap]

Hey whats up everyone,

My room-mate told me I should seek the advice of the SDN community about this issue. I've had a rough time trying to make a decision between NYU and Western. Both schools are good, they both have their benefits, and drawbacks. But if you were in my shoes, where would you go, and if you are kind enough, for what reasons?

Muchos Gracias!

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[blissy07]

Neither of those were top choices for me...but...

Western is cheaper than NYU (notorious for high cost)
I'd rather live in Pomona than NY (i personally wouldn't like living in the city)

The major drawback to Western is that its a brand new program...it does not have a reputation. I'm not really worried about it becoming accredited, but you'll be going in with no real data on how well students fare on the boards, specialty placement rates, if the school is able to fill chairs consistently, etc.

Although that's a pretty major drawback, I'm of the mindset that a student ultimately determines the quality of their dental education...and I think that anyone can succeed literally anywhere.

The pros and cons of NYU vs Western for me personally are almost balanced...but I'd probably do Western based on cost and location.

 

[Mrbubbles]

Neither of those were top choices for me...but...

Western is cheaper than NYU (notorious for high cost)
I'd rather live in Pomona than NY (i personally wouldn't like living in the city)

The major drawback to Western is that its a brand new program...it does not have a reputation. I'm not really worried about it becoming accredited, but you'll be going in with no real data on how well students fare on the boards, specialty placement rates, if the school is able to fill chairs consistently, etc.

Although that's a pretty major drawback, I'm of the mindset that a student ultimately determines the quality of their dental education...and I think that anyone can succeed literally anywhere.

The pros and cons of NYU vs Western for me personally are almost balanced...but I'd probably do Western based on cost and location.

i agree.

 

[WhyNOT111]

Hey whats up everyone,

My room-mate told me I should seek the advice of the SDN community about this issue. I've had a rough time trying to make a decision between NYU and Western. Both schools are good, they both have their benefits, and drawbacks. But if you were in my shoes, where would you go, and if you are kind enough, for what reasons?

Muchos Gracias!

don't think twice about going to NYU.

you'll thank me later

 

[nydds25]

NYU

Living in NY, I see plenty of successful dentists who went to NYU. Plus NYC is the best city in the US. Larger class size = more people to get to know.

 

[JennDDS]

NYU!

I am also California resident but I really liked NYU and the it's environment. It's once in a life time experience to live in a city like NYC. You don't also need to be worry about having patients at NYU's clinic. Western is a new dental school and it takes plenty of time for residents to know about the school and trust to go to western's dental clinic. I would day NYU!

 

[ROSE1010]

I say NYU, because western is not accredited and it will be lots of changes on curriculum.

 

[Ranelar]

I was really unimpressed by Western's campus, seemed like a ghost town. I haven't been to NYU but I assume it's a much more exciting place. Is Western significantly cheaper? That would make a difference for me, combined with Western using brand new equipment. I wouldn't worry about the accreditation thing. Shrug, there are pros and cons.. I would probably find myself at NYU though

 

[blissy07]

NYU

Living in NY, I see plenty of successful dentists who went to NYU. Plus NYC is the best city in the US. Larger class size = more people to get to know.

i wouldn't say a large class size is a plus for dental school though. In my mind, it's one of the cons of NYU

 

[dent2009]

i don't know about you but i didn't like having to be in packed elevators all the time. NYU would be more people's top choice if only it was 100K cheaper. It certainly would be mine.

 

[mamelons]

Do not worry about the accreditation thing... to my knowledge schools cannot get accredited until they have been open for a few years... right before the first class graduates or something like that. If there was any doubt about a school becoming accredited, they wouldn't open it in the first place. Nova, UNLV, and ASDOH all had to go through this when they opened not too long ago.

 

[nydds25]

.

 

[WhyNOT111]

You started a thread about being rejected without interview from NYU and not being cool with it. You obviously have a grudge against them now. Therefore, you opinion means nothing.

What?!! What the hell are you talking about?? What grudge? I told the guy to pick NYU over Western.


I dont get how my other thread has to do with me picking NYU over Western U if I had the choice?


work on that IQ when u get a chance. it'll do you good

 

[A8]

In my opinion NYU is a better choice! Western dental school is not established yet and I am sure curriculum will go under a lot of changes for first couple of years. NYU clinic is great and I personally know number of dentists who graduated from NYU, currently work at bay area, and they are doing really good! They said to me that they paid back their loans in 5-6 years. It's your choice and I think you can submit deposit for both schools and take more time to make a right decision. Everyone has a different point of view and at the end of the day, it is your decision and you should take as much time as you want to make sure that you will be happy in dental school for next four years.

 

[HowCanSheSlap]

Thanks everyone for your input

I'm not really worried about westerns curriculum, since the majority of the first two years will be classes with the DO students, an already established curriculum. Plus, Dr. Koelbl, and Dr. Trombly had built/maintained great curriculums at WVU, and Colorado, respectively.

My main concerns about western, would be the accreditation issue. I'm a bit worried about deciding to go to western, and then if western doesn't get accredited I would have to go through this dreaded application process all over again.

With NYU, I'm only hesitant because of the cost of attendance, anyone know how many scholarships they give out? and the amount(range)?

ASAM10, those dentists who paid back their loans in ~6 years, do they own their own practices?

Thanks guys, would like to get more feedback.

P.S the difference between NYU and WesternU's cost of attendance is ~ $15,000, over 4 years thats 60K+

 

[A8]

Thanks everyone for your input

I'm not really worried about westerns curriculum, since the majority of the first two years will be classes with the DO students, an already established curriculum. Plus, Dr. Koelbl, and Dr. Trombly had built/maintained great curriculums at WVU, and Colorado, respectively.

My main concerns about western, would be the accreditation issue. I'm a bit worried about deciding to go to western, and then if western doesn't get accredited I would have to go through this dreaded application process all over again.

With NYU, I'm only hesitant because of the cost of attendance, anyone know how many scholarships they give out? and the amount(range)?

NYU gives scholarships once you submit your deposit. It seems they mail you a packet including all the information needed for registration after you submit your first deposit. I am sure NYU students have more information about the amount (range) of scholarships.

ASAM10, those dentists who paid back their loans in ~6 years, do they own their own practices?

Thanks guys, would like to get more feedback.

P.S the difference between NYU and WesternU's cost of attendance is ~ $15,000, over 4 years thats 60K+

Yes, they have their own private practice and they do implant restorations in their private practice, and work over weekends.

 

[Livineasi]

You've got a tough decision to make. I'm kind of in the same boat - deciding between Michigan and Western.

It turns out that the Dean is the Chairman of the Accreditation Board so my worries about that have been really diminished. Western's campus does kind of suck, but I like that there will be less than 70 students and that we would basically be Seniors for an entire 4 years with the first pick at everything. I think that even if they don't get hoards of people in their Dental clinic that since we would be the only class working on them without any Post-Docs or upperclassman trying to get experience in that we'd get plenty of practice.
I'm also thinking of getting married and starting a family during dental school -- so since my family is from California, I think being close to them would be helpful.

But, Michigan is definitely well established and their program seems terrific. And the campus is beautiful. Uggh -- I hate these life making decisions.

As far as NYU - I lived in NYC for 7 years. It was fantastic!! If you like cities than I definitely wouldn't pass up the chance to live there. However, the cost of living is easily 4 times that of living in Pomona. Dental school will keep you busy - but trust me, with a bar on every corner and the whole city constantly buzzing - you'll definitely get distracted and go out = more money.

Another NYU worry is that I've heard they accept a ton of people to their Freshman class and then really weed out a bunch of people. That's too much competition for me. I'd like to be at a school that wants 100% of the class to finish.

In my opinion - if you are between the age of 21 and 28 -- I would highly recommend NYU - it's an experience of a lifetime even if its more expensive. It would be more of a life experience rather than just a dental school experience.

Sorry for the crazy long post -- guess I had a lot on my mind.

 

[JennDDS]

You've got a tough decision to make. I'm kind of in the same boat - deciding between Michigan and Western.

It turns out that the Dean is the Chairman of the Accreditation Board so my worries about that have been really diminished. Western's campus does kind of suck, but I like that there will be less than 70 students and that we would basically be Seniors for an entire 4 years with the first pick at everything. I think that even if they don't get hoards of people in their Dental clinic that since we would be the only class working on them without any Post-Docs or upperclassman trying to get experience in that we'd get plenty of practice.
I'm also thinking of getting married and starting a family during dental school -- so since my family is from California, I think being close to them would be helpful.

But, Michigan is definitely well established and their program seems terrific. And the campus is beautiful. Uggh -- I hate these life making decisions.

As far as NYU - I lived in NYC for 7 years. It was fantastic!! If you like cities than I definitely wouldn't pass up the chance to live there. However, the cost of living is easily 4 times that of living in Pomona. Dental school will keep you busy - but trust me, with a bar on every corner and the whole city constantly buzzing - you'll definitely get distracted and go out = more money.

Another NYU worry is that I've heard they accept a ton of people to their Freshman class and then really weed out a bunch of people. That's too much competition for me. I'd like to be at a school that wants 100% of the class to finish.

In my opinion - if you are between the age of 21 and 28 -- I would highly recommend NYU - it's an experience of a lifetime even if its more expensive. It would be more of a life experience rather than just a dental school experience.

Sorry for the crazy long post -- guess I had a lot on my mind.

Last year 3 students left because they failed the test three or four times. But it seems even this will be diminished because new dean Dr. Bertolami who was former UCSF dean wants 100% of the class to finish. That's what I was told in my interview. By the way thank you for your posts about NYC. And good luck on your decision!

 

[HowCanSheSlap]

You've got a tough decision to make. I'm kind of in the same boat - deciding between Michigan and Western.

It turns out that the Dean is the Chairman of the Accreditation Board so my worries about that have been really diminished. Western's campus does kind of suck, but I like that there will be less than 70 students and that we would basically be Seniors for an entire 4 years with the first pick at everything. I think that even if they don't get hoards of people in their Dental clinic that since we would be the only class working on them without any Post-Docs or upperclassman trying to get experience in that we'd get plenty of practice.
I'm also thinking of getting married and starting a family during dental school -- so since my family is from California, I think being close to them would be helpful.

But, Michigan is definitely well established and their program seems terrific. And the campus is beautiful. Uggh -- I hate these life making decisions.

As far as NYU - I lived in NYC for 7 years. It was fantastic!! If you like cities than I definitely wouldn't pass up the chance to live there. However, the cost of living is easily 4 times that of living in Pomona. Dental school will keep you busy - but trust me, with a bar on every corner and the whole city constantly buzzing - you'll definitely get distracted and go out = more money.

Another NYU worry is that I've heard they accept a ton of people to their Freshman class and then really weed out a bunch of people. That's too much competition for me. I'd like to be at a school that wants 100% of the class to finish.

In my opinion - if you are between the age of 21 and 28 -- I would highly recommend NYU - it's an experience of a lifetime even if its more expensive. It would be more of a life experience rather than just a dental school experience.

Sorry for the crazy long post -- guess I had a lot on my mind.

Thanks for your input, I see that you are in the same shoes as me.

I'm not really worried about the patient base at WesternU, because pomona is an under-served area, with many large cities around it. Plus, the patient care center will include the DO's, OD's, and PO's, so in a way, people who would come to get foot, eye, or general treatment will know that there is dental care available (good exposure/advertisement). Also one thing I like about WesternU, is that you would have to do at least 100 days at different clinics/practices which is great experience.

And, the NYU myth about weeding students out is not true, the dean was asked this question by an interviewee on the day I interviewed there.

 

[IDoWhatIWant]

I had this dilemma too. Luckily, I got into my top choice. I would choose Western because of cost. Every realistic dentist I met told me to go to the cheapest school.

Western: No track record, but you get to be part of the first class! You can potentially have some effect on the school's directions.

NYU: I dont' think they prepare you well for Board Part II's. In the state of New York, they require dental students to do one year of AEGD or GPR. So they may prepare you well for Board Part I, but I'm not sure how well you'll do on Board Part II.

If you want to be a general practitioner, just go to Western. The tuition is much cheaper, and the living cost would be drastically decreased. Plus, you get to keep your car. Unfortunately, girls will not be as attractive as the ladies in New York.

 

[BakeNeat]

I'd go to Western. It's cheaper... tuition-wise and living costs.

 

[somethinpositiv]

NYU has world class facilities (you know this, you interviewed there) and the best patient base in the country. Yes, it's the most expensive. However, that's the only real drawback.

Western is untested and unproven. They potentially could have awesome facilities LOL aren't they still being built? And is accredation still an issue? What kind of professors do they have they? What kind of clinical training will you get there?

well, if you go to Western, you can take pride in the ability to make history! The reputation of the school and the dentists it trains will literally be in your hands, and how well you do as a dentist after graduating from Western's very first class will determine the national reputation of the university

 

[xtractime]

somethings ppl brought up in this thread
1) i do not believe accreditation should really be a strong factor as Western U will eventually become fully accredited upon graduation of their first class in 2013.

2) style of living would be one of the biggest factors if this was my decision. if you want to experience the bustling feel of a big city, you can't get any better than NYC. but keep in mind you will have to probably do without a car, and walk/take the subway almost everywhere. on top of that think of such things like, where will i get my groceries. i grew up driving everywhere and now i live in downtown of a large city without a car. its a big change but i wanted to experience something different...and its only for 4 years. once in a lifetime!

3) class size? well after being in dental school, i felt that if you are independent and/or went to a large undergrad institution, the large class size will probably not affect you. on the contrary, if you require to have someone provide feedback every second or not used to having all the attention, then maybe u should go to the smaller school. with that said, the smaller school tends to have lesser facilities in terms of gym, computer labs, library, etc.

4) from my friends who do attend NYU, the "fail rate" is more of a myth than anything. are you planning on failing exams multiple times? if you did that at any other school, you would probably fail out there also, so its not just NYU.

5) maybe you could factor in other things such as which is closer to home? where you have family/friends? true NYU costs much more, but you will eventually be able to pay it off. you may not be able to get that BMW fresh out of school, but you WILL still be able to eat! there is always the Health Professions scholarship which will pay for 100% if you so choose to do that route. this may not be a bad option since the country is in a recession and when you come out, you will be guaranteed patients and a salary.

6) at western, there will be no upperclassmen. that means no help, no old tests, no knowledge about how clinics are. to me that is also a huge factor. i believe the student body has an opportunity to change the cirriculum/class/admin wherever you go. at my school, the admin pays a huge amount of attention to the student feedback. maybe not all schools are like that, but if you felt the students were happy at NYU then that should carry a lot of weight. i know my friend is (with the exception of the price!).

 

[robg]

6) at western, there will be no upperclassmen. that means no help, no old tests, no knowledge about how clinics are. to me that is also a huge factor. i believe the student body has an opportunity to change the cirriculum/class/admin wherever you go.

I never even thought about this, great info.

 

[Sephisabin]

NYU: I dont' think they prepare you well for Board Part II's. In the state of New York, they require dental students to do one year of AEGD or GPR. So they may prepare you well for Board Part I, but I'm not sure how well you'll do on Board Part II.

That's actually not correct. You have to take Part II of the boards prior to starting the GPR or AEGD. Part II is heavily clinic based so saying the school with the largest patient base in the country doesn't prepare you for a clinical test... that'd really be saying something. EVERYONE takes Part II of the boards and the school obviously prepares you well for the boards... it reflects directly on the quality of their education!

What NY actually requires is that you do an AEGD or GPR in lieu of a licensing exam. For the record, California now gives you an option: You can either take the licensing exam and go straight into practice or you can do a 1 year AEGD or GPR and not have to take the licensing exam to practice.

After finishing school, you will have to take the Western Regional boards to practice in California rather than the eastern boards. NYU actually has professors give special after school sessions to help prepare you for the Western Regional boards so you shouldn't have to worry about being at a loss for those either.

 

[JennDDS]

That's actually not correct. You have to take Part II of the boards prior to starting the GPR or AEGD. Part II is heavily clinic based so saying the school with the largest patient base in the country doesn't prepare you for a clinical test... that'd really be saying something. EVERYONE takes Part II of the boards and the school obviously prepares you well for the boards... it reflects directly on the quality of their education!

What NY actually requires is that you do an AEGD or GPR in lieu of a licensing exam. For the record, California now gives you an option: You can either take the licensing exam and go straight into practice or you can do a 1 year AEGD or GPR and not have to take the licensing exam to practice.

After finishing school, you will have to take the Western Regional boards to practice in California rather than the eastern boards. NYU actually has professors give special after school sessions to help prepare you for the Western Regional boards so you shouldn't have to worry about being at a loss for those either.

That's interesting...It was one of my concerns, but I think these special after school sessions make the transition easier for California residents.

 

[Mackchops]

Just for the record, but we have a >98% part 2 pass rate.

 

[montag925]

I actually know very little about each school, but I just flipped a coin..
heads= western
tails = nyu
and you should go to nyu. congradualtions.

 

[RDAtoDDS]

I am in the same situation as you(deciding b/w NYU and Western). Where are you from. Cali? I am. There are a few things to consider; 1- tuition, 2- education, 3- living standard. Tuition wise, I think someone already counted that, and it came out to 60k over 4 years in favor of Western. Education, NYU is established and popular, Western, neither of those things. This brings me to the most important part, the standard of living. Remember this, you are not going to jail, and by that I mean your are not going to be locked up at the school for 4 years. These are going to be the most memorable time of your life, think about what you want to remember, Pomona or New York.
I hope hearing an opinion of someone who is in your shoes helped, and if you decide to go to NYU I will see you there.

 

[Hysteria24]

After finishing school, you will have to take the Western Regional boards to practice in California rather than the eastern boards. NYU actually has professors give special after school sessions to help prepare you for the Western Regional boards so you shouldn't have to worry about being at a loss for those either.

The WREB is also administered right at NYU. This makes it easier to find your own patients and take it right in the very same clinic you have been working in already.
http://www.wreb.org/Candidates/Dental/dentalPDFs/2009DentalExamSchedule.pdf

I actually know very little about each school, but I just flipped a coin..
heads= western
tails = nyu
and you should go to nyu. congradualtions.

That's how I chose my undergrad school. It won 5 flips in a row!

 

[Livineasi]

I finally decided on Michigan instead of Western. I've got four years to become go into insane debt and become the best dentist I can be - and I decided to go with a school that's already established with a good track record.

The economy is crazy right now and while I think that Western will definitely get accreditation, I'm a bit worried about buildings not being finished on time or at all. I live near Beverly Hills and it's frightening how many buildings have just been halted in mid-build. I'm sure Western has all their finances in order. But, I'm not ready to take a chance on such a major thing of my life.

 

[Ehhhh]

Do you want and small class or a HUGE class... I would go with Western... I like small classes... you learn more and I believe western will be providing patients while I'm not sure if NYU does

 

[JessD]

Do you want and small class or a HUGE class... I would go with Western... I like small classes... you learn more and I believe western will be providing patients while I'm not sure if NYU does

NYU has one of the largest patient base in the country!

 

[Oracle DMD]

western. especially if you wanna practice on the best coast...i mean west coast.

 

[Riley1]

I am from LA and I also wanted to stay on west coast, but I agree with majority of predents that NYU is a better choice.

Good luck on your decision.

 

[mikeable]

i am on the same boat as you. here is some good news though regarding the accreditation issue:

We have submitted our initial application for accreditation to the Commission of Dental Accreditation (CODA) and anticipate a site visit October, 2008 and a decision regarding initial accreditation in February 2009. Students who enter and graduate from a dental program with "initial accreditation" status are eligible for licensure in all states and US territories, and can apply to specialty programs. To learn more, visit our accreditation page.


So basically, by February we will know whether or not coming here will guarantee us a valid, accredited degree.

Hope this helps.