Tufts and Pitt

[T.C.]

Pulled from the Pitt waitlist and simply don't know how to compare the two places (don't know enough about the programs or any students within the schools themselves). On the one hand, I have Boston which is an incredible city, the hub of alot of medical thought. Yet Pitt seemed great because of its being the primary facility for all of Pittsburgh. Is the training vastly superior at Pitt as the "rankings" would lead me to believe? Or are these rankings based upon the significant difference in basic research funding? But, then again, such research can only serve to enhance the medical training, right? I guess the basic question is, in terms of clinical training, which school would provide higher quality and opportunity? I think I can deal with either location and respective differences amongst personalities within the student body. Thanks for any input. Decision has to be made by Wednesday. And for all of you waiting on waitlists, this is the first one I have heard from. Was losing faith in the process, but it really does work... eventually...

T.C.

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[cjt615]

T.C., I was in this exact situation---Accepted at Tufts, got in off the waitlist at Pitt a couple of weeks ago. Pitt became my #1 choice on my interview day, so I made the decision as soon as I got the call and withdrew from Tufts.

For me, rankings and reputation are somewhat important, but not nearly as much as the subjective experience of the interview day. What made Pitt my favorite was the incredible faculty I met when I visited, the students who were so genuinely happy and proud of their school, and not in that "lets put on a show for the interviewees" way that I saw at other schools. The curriculum which seems perfectly designed for my thought processes, innovative and fresh, but not totally overboard with PBL/new medical education philosophies like Harvard. Above all, though, what clinched it was, as another poster puts it, a very strong "this is the right school for me" feeling that I got on my interview day. I just knew it, without a doubt.

Don't get me wrong, Tufts is a wonderful school, and I was really lucky to get accepted there...in fact, I felt almost guilty when I withdrew. I loved the school, and I especially loved Boston.

At the end of the day, you just have to go with 50% gut feeling, 50% carefully thought out decisions.

CJT

 

[T.C.]

Thanks for the input. I did not have that "clinching" feeling at either school, so I just do not have much to go on here. But, in reading some of the posts from the past, there seems to be greater excitement about Pitt than Tufts. I am lucky to have both options, so no real complaints... just thinking out loud... anyone with friends who have experience in either school? Saw matchlists from Pitt and they seem to be impressive, but is it better to be in Boston for four years, a place much more appealing for me to live in the distant future? Though what I am looking for is simply the best training. Would have been so much easier if Harvard just offered me that full ride w/o interview... Think I'm leaning towards Pitt based upon reputation... don't know if that's right so anyone else with advice- it would be welcome

T.C.

 

[driven]

I am considering applying to Tufts. Can you please assist me in your experiences/thougths on the school, program, how competitive, etc.

Thanks in advance

 

[yunfat]

I was choosing between Pitt and Einstein, but I think my thought process was similar to yours. Based on the rankings, I was under the assumption that Pitt would give me a "better" education than Einstein... but location wise, I preferred NY by far...

ultimately, I ended up putting Einstein on top... although Pitt's hospital system is stronger than Einstein's, I realized that for medical students, this makes very little difference. Top hospitals doesn't necessarily equate to better clinical education. It really depends on how much clinical responsibility the school gives to medical students, and what type of patients they have access to. During your four years of medical school, you will also be using the same books that students from other med schools use... what matters most is whether the curriculum will suite your learning style. Instead of looking at the rankings, you should look at their match lists to see if they are comparable (especially in geographic areas and subspecialties you are interested in). For more on why the USNews rankings don't work, check out [McGaughie, WC and Thompson, JA, America's Best Medical Schools: A Critique of the US News and World Report Rankings. Acad. Med. 2001;76:985-992]

Lastly, LOCATION IS IMPORTANT! think about proximity to friends/family... and also overall quality of life. four years is a long time, and I don't think it should just be about school... Besides, the happier you are, the better you will probably do... and that's what counts when you apply for residencies.

ultimately, I'd choose Pitt if location was not a factor and you are into PBL. I'd only place Tufts on top if you really want to be in Boston and can afford the big $$$.

 

[otter]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by cjt615:
•The curriculum which seems perfectly designed for my thought processes, innovative and fresh, but not totally overboard with PBL/new medical education philosophies like Harvard. •••••Actually, what you are describing here is also exactly what Tufts' curriculum is. Tufts' preclinical curriculum is a combination of lectures and PBL, with large inclusion of innovative topics such as nutrition, health care economics and medical ethics included. There's also significant amount of field work in the first two years, such as the preceptorship and the Selective program. Tufts also offers a huge volume of classroom material on an online database.

I didn't apply to Pitt, so I don't have much to say about that school. But it does seem like Pitt gets great reviews here on SDN. One thing I'll say is that it would not surprise me if the students' clinical experiences at Pitt's primary teaching hospital are better than at Tufts' primary teaching hospital (NEMC). But then, only about 30% of Tufts' clinical training will probably end up taking place at NEMC anyways, and I've heard a lot of great things about Tufts' other hospitals (namely Lahey Clinic, St. Elizabeth). As far as students' happiness, Tufts students seemed pretty happy, too.

I may be biased, because I'm most certainly headed to Tufts. But this is what I think...

 

[Nuclearrabbit]

I say Pitt over Tufts.

 

[The Fly]

GO TO PITT!!!!!!!!!!!

Boston is a completely overrated city...after being here a year, I can tell you that it's nearly as expensive as NYC without being even remotely as worthwhile -- everything is costly (MUCH more so that Pittsburgh) and, while it may be a great city to be an undergrad, believe me, when you're a broke medical student (or underpaid research assistant), this city is not nearly as wonderful as it's purported to be.

Furthermore, in the more relevant matter of Pitt vs. Tufts, there's no comparison. . . Pitt is a top-tier medical school and Tufts is not; UPHS is a wonderful and top hospital and New England Medical Ctr. is the most average hospital in the city.

And Tufts is so expensive!!!!!!!

GO TO PITT!!!! It really is a much better school!


Good Luck!

 

[otter]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by The Fly:
•GO TO PITT!!!!!!!!!!!

Boston is a completely overrated city...after being here a year, I can tell you that it's nearly as expensive as NYC without being even remotely as worthwhile -- everything is costly (MUCH more so that Pittsburgh) and, while it may be a great city to be an undergrad, believe me, when you're a broke medical student (or underpaid research assistant), this city is not nearly as wonderful as it's purported to be.

Furthermore, in the more relevant matter of Pitt vs. Tufts, there's no comparison. . . Pitt is a top-tier medical school and Tufts is not; UPHS is a wonderful and top hospital and New England Medical Ctr. is the most average hospital in the city.

And Tufts is so expensive!!!!!!!

GO TO PITT!!!! It really is a much better school!


Good Luck! •••••I can appreciate that Pitt holds certain advantages over Tufts, but I really don't believe that Tufts vs. Pitt is as clear-cut as you make it out to be. Reputation-wise, Tufts is definitely at least among the top 1/3 of US med schools. I realize that your views on Boston is a personal preference, but I think most people would not concur with your statements that Boston is "completely overrated" and "not even remotely as worthwhile as NYC."

Personally, I think Boston's great for both undergrads and grad students. In fact, the graduate students holds a very high percentage among student population in Boston. Harvard and MIT have more graduate students than undergrads, and the graduate student and research community in Boston is truly international. I agree that NEMC is an average hospital and that Tufts is overpriced. But Tufts' hospital network includes some very well-regarded clerkship sites.

To the O.P., if you're unsure, maybe you should go revisit both cities/schools. Honestly, I think you'll be happy with either choice.

 

[T.C.]

Know that some are interested in checking out any sort of movement, so to update, accepted at Pitt and will be dropping Tufts (as well as my WL at NYU). Still on other WL's but am happy with what I have discovered about Pitt in the past two days. There are some definite differences- if anyone is interested in hearing my view, let me know. But otherwise I'll spare you all the details. Thank you for all your replies everyone.

Driven, I haven't forgotten about you. Tufts is a wonderful school. Highlights are, first and foremost, that it is in Boston. Simply by being in that city, the home of so many journals and research opportunities and academic institutions, you cannot help but be immersed in a pretty incredible medical culture. Patient base is large and diverse. As far as the academics, it seems to be a nice balance between PBL and traditional (for specifics, see the student handbook on their web page). The other very interesting thing about Tufts is their interest in students pursuing dual degrees. I actually applied for one of their programs but they decided to not implement it this year (joint MD/MA in bioethics). I see this as both a positive as well as a negative. Depends on who you are (definitely a positive if you are interested in a joint MD/MBA because the program, while I am sure difficult, did not seem as rigorous as other such programs). Their tuition is high, especially considering Boston is such an expensive city. Due to this, I am not sure how socioeconomically diverse their students. I won't say anything else negative because it truly is a marvelous school and, especially in the application phase, I would recommend applying to Tufts. As I've learned, this process really is a roll of the dice, so apply everywhere.

Off the soapbox. Again, if you want detail about the decision of Pitt/Tufts, let me know. Otherwise, hope you are all enjoying the summer. NYC better than Boston? uh, no. But to each his/her own. That's a conversation for another day.

T.C.

 

[The Fly]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by T.C.:
• NYC better than Boston? uh, no. But to each his/her own. That's a conversation for another day.•••••Dude. I dare you to find someone else whose lived in both NYC and Boston and prefers the latter (who isn't a Boston/MA area native). The reality is that Boston should NEVER be compared to NYC -- it's just totally and utterly absurd. There's NO other place like New York City.

Boston is remarkably UN-diverse considering it's size and popularity and remarkably socially conservative. . . Even though there's been no reason for me to feel anything but love for Boston, I cannot wait to get out of this overpriced and totally boring city (WTF, the whole city shuts down a 1:30am -- that is such BS!). :wink:

 

[otter]

I actually have lived in both Boston and NYC. Boston for 4 years and NYC for 3 months. And I'd take Boston over NYC anytime. Look, you make it seem like everyone should generally accept the notion that Boston sucks and that one would be crazy to think that Boston even compares to NYC. I think that's far-fetched. I think some would prefer Boston, while others would prefer NYC.

True, NYC has greater diversity in the general population, and the nightlife there goes on till 4am. But Boston/Cambridge area just has an amazingly international population of academics and researchers, and the opportunities to interact with them lie at every corner. The array of world-class hospitals in Boston is unmatched. It is a compact city with endless number of distinct and vibrant hangout spots (Harvard Sqr, North End, Chinatown, Newbury St, Charles St, Coolidge Corner, Lansdowne, Faneuil Hall, ....). The local music scene is incredible and, contrary to what you said, I think Boston's very progressive; there is a large, active gay community there, and the city is overwhelmingly Democrat.

 

[USeF]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by T.C.:
•... am happy with what I have discovered about Pitt in the past two days. There are some definite differences- if anyone is interested in hearing my view, let me know. But otherwise I'll spare you all the details...
T.C.•••••*raising his hand to find out what these discoveries of Pitt and the 'differences' are*

 

[T.C.]

*stepping back onto soapbox*

Pitt has an incredible hospital system and is truly one of the few schools that can call an entire city "it's own." It is financially sound with top-ten research $$$ which I think makes a difference in retaining faculty and enhancing a medical education. Simply put, the educational opportunities and options were greater at Pitt. Tufts ran into financial difficulties a few years back which, while I am not sure whether this made too much of a difference in the teaching, could not have helped a situation.

But I think the main thing which clinched it for me was the fact that I believe that my time at Pitt will be more of immersion in medical culture rather than simply medical training. I applied to about 20 medical schools up and down the east coast. I thought that the way to become the best physician was to get into a school in a large city with a vast population base and then go to work. As an afterthought, I applied to Vanderbilt and Michigan, mainly because they were ranked highly. When I went to interview at these two schools I fell in love with them (both WLs), something which took me by suprise. During the time I interviewed at all of these schools I was working in NYC, but I had gone to school up in Ithaca, NY. I loved my undergrad experience and felt a definite sense of community while at the same time receiving a great education. Living in a large city (I've now lived in Chicago, NYC, Philly, and D.C.)you do not get that same sense of community. And, on the interviews within large cities, I simply got the feeling that if I went to medical school in a city I would be trapped in a building amongst other buildings and receive a textbook education rather than a medical experience. I have all my life to work in a city and be a "worker bee," but I think there is just a different feel to the people and an education outside of a large city. Being next to an undergrad campus only enhances the academic feel which I like over the "worker bee" feel. I also like the fact that I can hop in my car and drive an hour to go fishing or just to relax. I do not have the feeling that I'm trapped. So, Pitt just seemed the better fit. I think it will be more of a collective culture rather than an individual education. Again, Tufts is a great school, and I have to admit I was suprised by how incredible their matchlist was (I love Boston and am going to be looking there for residency).

To cover the other stream of thought going in this thread, if I do horrible things in life, the worst punishment the good lord can give me is to send me to NYC. But again, to each his own.

If anyone has any other q's or comments about the thought process, let me know. Maybe I'm wrong about all of this... I'll soon find out.

T.C.

 

[H.E.B.]

•••quote:•••Originally posted by T.C.:
•*stepping back onto soapbox*

Pitt has an incredible hospital system and is truly one of the few schools that can call an entire city "it's own." It is financially sound with top-ten research $$$ which I think makes a difference in retaining faculty and enhancing a medical education. Simply put, the educational opportunities and options were greater at Pitt. Tufts ran into financial difficulties a few years back which, while I am not sure whether this made too much of a difference in the teaching, could not have helped a situation.

But I think the main thing which clinched it for me was the fact that I believe that my time at Pitt will be more of immersion in medical culture rather than simply medical training. I applied to about 20 medical schools up and down the east coast. I thought that the way to become the best physician was to get into a school in a large city with a vast population base and then go to work. As an afterthought, I applied to Vanderbilt and Michigan, mainly because they were ranked highly. When I went to interview at these two schools I fell in love with them (both WLs), something which took me by suprise. During the time I interviewed at all of these schools I was working in NYC, but I had gone to school up in Ithaca, NY. I loved my undergrad experience and felt a definite sense of community while at the same time receiving a great education. Living in a large city (I've now lived in Chicago, NYC, Philly, and D.C.)you do not get that same sense of community. And, on the interviews within large cities, I simply got the feeling that if I went to medical school in a city I would be trapped in a building amongst other buildings and receive a textbook education rather than a medical experience. I have all my life to work in a city and be a "worker bee," but I think there is just a different feel to the people and an education outside of a large city. Being next to an undergrad campus only enhances the academic feel which I like over the "worker bee" feel. I also like the fact that I can hop in my car and drive an hour to go fishing or just to relax. I do not have the feeling that I'm trapped. So, Pitt just seemed the better fit. I think it will be more of a collective culture rather than an individual education. Again, Tufts is a great school, and I have to admit I was suprised by how incredible their matchlist was (I love Boston and am going to be looking there for residency).

To cover the other stream of thought going in this thread, if I do horrible things in life, the worst punishment the good lord can give me is to send me to NYC. But again, to each his own.

If anyone has any other q's or comments about the thought process, let me know. Maybe I'm wrong about all of this... I'll soon find out.

T.C.•••••