Tuition versus location: SUNY Buffalo versus George Washington University

[CaliMD12]

Im sure similar threads exist, but the ones I found had little school-specific information.

I'm trying to decide between SUNY Buffalo and GWU.
After exploring what both schools have to offer academically, I feel that quality of education is not significantly different between them. Their match lists seem comparable.

For me, I've realized its ultimately a battle between tuition and location. The decision is between going to Buffalo and saving 170-200K over 4 years, or living the next 4 years of my life in a more lively city with nightlife/social life. Setting is an important factor for me, as I feel Buffalo's weather is a bit extreme with the heavy snow and it is very suburban (and kinda rundown). I prefer lively cities. On the other hand, DC and the GWU hospital are really nice. DC has great nightlife, restaurants, and the population is very international. GW also offers an opportunity to travel abroad for your 4th year elective to many different countries, which is exciting.

But the question is, am I really going to have time for social life if I go to DC? I feel like I will have time for at least the first 2 years before studying for boards and getting into rotations. I feel like this is important, because if I end up being unhappy in buffalo, it will affect my learning. My friends who went to schools in the boonies tell me not to underestimate location, and say that I have a lifetime to pay the loans. But there are lots of young people (students) in Buffalo because the undergrad is so huge.

So, is the extra 200K to pay for GWU going to change my life in the long term? It most likely will, since I won't be making any real money until about 9-10 years from now, and by that time I will probably have a family and need a house, and also be tired of not having money to spend in the first place. I don't know enough about Buffalo to judge it at this point. The students at both schools seemed cool.

Im definitely leaning towards buffalo. Im just paranoid because Im from California, and I love big lively cities with stuff to do (ie. nice lounges, clubs, bars, restaurants, festivals, and especially diversity).

Advice?

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[nancy0223]

If you're looking to apply to residencies elsewhere other than NY, go for GWU. Ppl graduated from UB and Upstate have a strong reputation for being labeled as " NY upstaters." Furthermore, GWU is in fact better in research although it's not too well known for research compare to the top 20. So going to GWU might win u a better opportunity to get into one of those extremely competitive year-off medical research programs (ie HHMI).
But then again, UB is a lot cheaper and is overall a great school. As someone who did her undergrad in a NY upstate school, I can honestly tell u that nightlife is not that exciting here. But if u're into serenity and nature, Buffalo is the place for u.

 

[Siverhideo1985]

You give me 200k in savings + a school that's not on probation you can shove me off to alaska with nothing but shorts and tshirt and I'll go happily.

 

[searun]

Yes, an extra $200,000 in debt will have a dramatic effect on your life and it will not be good. And it certainly will have a negative impact on your social life and standard of living for years after you graduate.

Forget about GW and DC. Most medical students do not have fantastic social lives anyway - you will be too busy. You can create a decent life for yourself anywhere. You would be crazy to incur this extra debt.

 

[CaliMD12]

If you're looking to apply to residencies elsewhere other than NY, go for GWU. Ppl graduated from UB and Upstate have a strong reputation for being labeled as " NY upstaters."

I feel like most students from Buffalo end up in residencies near the NY area becuase they ARE from the NY area, so they probably WANT to be there. I can probably get away with a residency elsewhere as long as I got good board score and letters of rec.

 

[Wolffman]

I was born and raised in Buffalo, so let me give you my opinion on this. Note that I am still an undergrad so I don't know too much about the Med School itself, but I do know a lot about the city.

Buffalo is a smaller city that has a lot to offer, you just need to find it. The location of UB's South Campus (where the Med School is) is terrible... its not in the best part of town and it honestly isn't the the nicest place to look at. However, a short trip south on Main Street will take you to the Delaware Park region of the city. This is the most urban and lively part of the city. Elmwood Avenue is very cosmopolitan and lined with coffee shops, bars, restaurants and interesting (unique) shops. Delaware Park itself is one of the biggest "inner" city parks in the nation, housing a lake, 2 art galleries, museum of natural history, and an extensive forested area with sports fields and what not. There are 3 colleges in this area, SUNY Buffalo State, Canisius College and UB South. UB North is only a few miles up the road.

Downtown has Chippewa Street, a strip of a few blocks packed with bars. The Lake Erie Marina, Naval Park, and (the newly built) Erie Canal Harbor offer great views of Lake Erie and are good ways to spend summer days. The Bills (NFL) and Sabres (NHL) play here and have some of the cheapest tickets in their respective leagues... if you're into that type of thing.

Let me say something about the weather here. IT'S NOT THAT BAD. You wont be movinig to the arctic circle. In the summer, the warmest it gets is 90, and if you're in the city you barely ever reach that due to the cold lake. Winters are honestly very warm, except for Jan and some of Feb the temperature barely gets colder than 20 or 30. IT DOESN'T SNOW EVERYDAY. But when it does snow, it really snows. You might think it's aweful, but odds are you won't have to shovel and it's kinda fun to be a part of a major weather outbreak... because snow never really hurt anyone.

I think another thing to think about is the cost of living in Washington. Buffalo is THE CHEAPEST city I've ever visited. You can get a nice apartment on Elmwood for ~$600 a month. DC, as I've heard, is outragously expensive. So not only will the tuition be more, the cost of living will be drastically higher.

Sorry for the essay, but I'm very passionate about Buffalo and want to give you an insider's look at everything. I go to school in Pittsburgh, which is a much bigger and more vibrant city than Buffalo, but I still plan on coming back home after I graduate. From the outside it looks run down and busted, but once you look, you can find it is a really great place to live. The city is entering a rennaisance, new cutting edge buildings are being built downtown, old abandoned buildings are being transformed into luxery apartments, stuff like that. Don't forget that Niagara Falls is 20 minutes away (the Canadian side has some great bars and clubs) and Toronto (one of the biggest cities in North America) is only 2.5 hours away.

If you have any questions about the city, don't hesitate to ask, either by PM or on here.

 

[nancy0223]

I feel like most students from Buffalo end up in residencies near the NY area becuase they ARE from the NY area, so they probably WANT to be there. I can probably get away with a residency elsewhere as long as I got good board score and letters of rec.

To start off, I'm not trying to persuade u away from UB. But it's a lot more likely for ppl who go to NY medical school to wind up in a NY residency, according to all SUNYs' matchlists. Although this is a controversial issue, prestige vs. better residency, it seems like graduates from GWU wind up in more diverse and more well-known programs overall than those from UB.
Having said all that, I should let u know that I'm actually on waitlists of both schools. And I'd go to either one in a heartbeat if offered an acceptance so I'm really not biased towards either way.

 

[Brent8927]

You give me 200k in savings + a school that's not on probation you can shove me off to alaska with nothing but shorts and tshirt and I'll go happily.

Totally! I'd tag along in just boxer shorts.

200K is a lot of money, and unless I had a very compelling reason (knew I wouldn't be happy at the cheaper institution, had a family to consider, etc.) I would go with the cheaper school.

Generally people make the most of wherever they go. If you think you can be happy at Buffalo, I'd say it's got a lot going for it (except the weather, of course!).

 

[ZeusonRoids]

Im sure similar threads exist, but the ones I found had little school-specific information.

I’m trying to decide between SUNY Buffalo and GWU.
After exploring what both schools have to offer academically, I feel that quality of education is not significantly different between them. Their match lists seem comparable.

For me, I’ve realized its ultimately a battle between tuition and location. The decision is between going to Buffalo and saving 170-200K over 4 years, or living the next 4 years of my life in a more lively city with nightlife/social life. Setting is an important factor for me, as I feel Buffalo’s weather is a bit extreme with the heavy snow and it is very suburban (and kinda rundown). I prefer lively cities. On the other hand, DC and the GWU hospital are really nice. DC has great nightlife, restaurants, and the population is very international. GW also offers an opportunity to travel abroad for your 4th year elective to many different countries, which is exciting.

But the question is, am I really going to have time for social life if I go to DC? I feel like I will have time for at least the first 2 years before studying for boards and getting into rotations. I feel like this is important, because if I end up being unhappy in buffalo, it will affect my learning. My friends who went to schools in the boonies tell me not to underestimate location, and say that I have a lifetime to pay the loans. But there are lots of young people (students) in Buffalo because the undergrad is so huge.

So, is the extra 200K to pay for GWU going to change my life in the long term? It most likely will, since I won’t be making any real money until about 9-10 years from now, and by that time I will probably have a family and need a house, and also be tired of not having money to spend in the first place. I don’t know enough about Buffalo to judge it at this point. The students at both schools seemed cool.

Im definitely leaning towards buffalo. Im just paranoid because Im from California, and I love big lively cities with stuff to do (ie. nice lounges, clubs, bars, restaurants, festivals, and especially diversity).

Advice?

I had a VERY similar situation between SUNY-Buffalo and University of Southern California.
I would have saved like $170k going to Buffalo.

Ultimately I decided on USC because I felt it presented me with greater opportunities both in medical school and in the future (for residency, location...)

USC is a "ranked" school while GW is not and is currently on probation. If I were deciding between the two schools I would save the 170k and go to Buffalo. I mean you could almost literally fly out of buffalo EVERY weekend to Florida during the winters and stay at a nice hotel on the beach and STILL end up saving more by going to buffalo.

For the record if GW were a "Ranked" school and was not on probation I would totally go there over Buffalo.

 

[tkim]

http://www.smbs.buffalo.edu/ome/ome_resources_match.shtml

Not a bad list. Go to the cheaper school.

 

[ZeusonRoids]

Totally! I'd tag along in just boxer shorts.

200K is a lot of money, and unless I had a very compelling reason (knew I wouldn't be happy at the cheaper institution, had a family to consider, etc.) I would go with the cheaper school.

Generally people make the most of wherever they go. If you think you can be happy at Buffalo, I'd say it's got a lot going for it (except the weather, of course!).

WAIT I CHANGED MY MIND!!!!
200k is not a lot of money. Especially considering that might be a year (or likely less of salary). Go to the school you want to go to. It is not like you will actually have the extra money you saved if you go to Buffalo.

I know in my previous post I said that I would go to UB. But that is just because I think the schools are probably on a similar level. It is true that UB has a TON of ppl who end up doing their residency in upstate NY. That was one of the reasons I did not go to UB over USC...I visited Buffalo in November and it was ****ing cold. I would literally be miserable for several months of the year because I love the outdoors. And I would hate to do my residency in a place that really bummed me out and I knew I did not want to live in because during residency (and medical school) you will make a TON of contacts.


In summary

1. In terms of schools there is no big difference (UB wins this round because it is cheaper)
2. Location (Obviously GW...not even a contest)
3. Residency (GW wins because the people get into better programs all across the nation)
4. $200k over a 35 year career is an extra $5714 per year...or roughly equal to working an extra 5 days per year to pay off the extra debt or a total of 175 days OR about 5 months and 25 days extra work over the course of your career.
5. And who knows what opportunities will present themselves when you are at GW. I can say the opportunities will be greater at GW than they will be at UB (I loved the school but I am just speaking the truth).

I VOTE THAT YOU GO TO GW. Many others will be in the same boat financially as you.

 

[mrcmedman]

A $200k difference is too much. I'd go to SUNY Buffalo.

It's really not that bad in the B-Lo. It is a declining city, but it's still big enough that there are plenty of things to do (i.e. bars, clubs, sports venues, etc.) as a medical student. Besides, Niagara Falls (the Canadian side) is a short drive away. And if you ever have the yearning for the big city life, just go to Toronto which is a 1 1/2 hour drive away across the border. Toronto's got an amazing night life.

 

[tkim]

This was hashed out with UB vs USC:

http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=609350

 

[tkim]

.

In summary

1. In terms of schools there is no big difference (UB wins this round because it is cheaper)
2. Location (Obviously GW...not even a contest)
3. Residency (GW wins because the people get into better programs all across the nation)
   
   Match lists change every year. The classes shape the match list, not the school itself.
   
4. $200k over a 35 year career is an extra $5714 per year...or roughly equal to working an extra 5 days per year to pay off the extra debt or a total of 175 days OR about 5 months and 25 days extra work over the course of your career.
   
   Over a *35* year career? How about having 200K less debt allows you to retire 5 years earlier? Where do you get your numbers? What kind of specialties make you $1100/day?
   
5. And who knows what opportunities will present themselves when you are at GW. I can say the opportunities will be greater at GW than they will be at UB (I loved the school but I am just speaking the truth).
   
   Graduating with 200K more debt will force you to make career decisions as well. Say you like peds, or FP or some other primary care, low reimbursement specialty. You graduate with that much more debt you may find yourself choosing something that pays more but might be less satisfying. Or worse, if you don't match into a high-paying specialty and are forced to match into a lower paying specialty it will take you a lot longer to climb out of debt.
   

I VOTE THAT YOU GO TO GW. Many others will be in the same boat financially as you.

Just because everyone else has high debt, why does that mean this person should have it too?

 

[Siverhideo1985]

just a reminder: $200k debt is not 200k repaid...that's more like $300-$350k

$300k more for a school on probabtion??

 

[Gut Shot]

So, is the extra 200K to pay for GWU going to change my life in the long term?

Yes, absolutely, and it won't be for the better.

Here's how these things play out. The premed crowd, with voluminous hearts and eyes like dinner plates, will tend to say "follow your heart, forget the money..."

The medical students, residents and fellows, on the other hand, who are actually saddled with staggering debt loads, will usually tell you otherwise.

Who you believe is up to you.

 

[Appless]

With interest is GW really worth 300K? A school on probation that is not more "prestigious" or ranked or however you want to call it compared to UB...the choice is so easy its almost not worth discussing. If you feel 300K is nothing then by all mean head to GW. I just cant see GW giving you 300K more in opportunities then UB. Seriously a school on probation that most choose only to go to becuase its their last resort...Even if you hate snow, is not being in snow for 3 months or so worth 300K? I just could never get over that. If you wanted to take more debt becuase you wanted to go to Umich or something over UB well then, its more of a discussion(though id still follow the less debt if its 200k+). But compared ot GW its just not worth it.

 

[Gut Shot]

200k is not a lot of money.

Even if that were true, look at it this way.

Principal: $200,000
Interest rate: 6%
Loan period: 30 years
Total paid: $431,676.38

Total Interest Paid: $231,676.38

Mind you, if your top marginal tax rate (including state and payroll taxes) is 45%, you'll actually have to earn $784,866.15 in order to clear the $432,676.38 needed to pay off the loan.

So now we're up to 784k. Startling how quickly it adds up, eh?

 

[MegaProjectile]

With interest is GW really worth 300K? A school on probation that is not more "prestigious" or ranked or however you want to call it compared to UB...the choice is so easy its almost not worth discussing. If you feel 300K is nothing then by all mean head to GW. I just cant see GW giving you 300K more in opportunities then UB. Seriously a school on probation that most choose only to go to becuase its their last resort...Even if you hate snow, is not being in snow for 3 months or so worth 300K? I just could never get over that. If you wanted to take more debt becuase you wanted to go to Umich or something over UB well then, its more of a discussion(though id still follow the less debt if its 200k+). But compared ot GW its just not worth it.

While it may not be a good financial decision I think we should all take a step back for a second. If I remember correctly I think SUNY Buffalo was also on probation a couple of years too and had to clean up its act.

Secondly, GWU carries more name than SUNY Buffalo stemming from its competitive undergraduate and law programs that has produced US Senators. The medical program has a strong international reputation and its graduates are placed in top US residencies each year. Lastly, and more importantly, GWU provides a far better overall clinical experience due the diversity and vastness of its hospital in patient variety and specialty departments.

Basically, the only good reason for the OP to attend SUNY Buffalo is due to its cheap tuition. I can't really think of any other edge it has over GWU. I've criticized GWU in the past due to its probation issue but I think it's still a much better choice than SUNY Buffalo if not for the price tag.

 

[ZeusonRoids]

I say **** it. You only have one life to live. If the world ended in 20 years would you want to say you spent 4 of them (or more likely 8 of them) in Buffalo or Western NY?

I know I would not. That is why I picked USC over Buffalo (and USC has a similar price tag as GW)

 

[Siverhideo1985]

...did we forget that GW is on probation? this isn't deciding between Harvard and a state school....this is like good school +300k in savings vs. school with some serious issues....

 

[Handy388]

GWU for 200k more? you gotta be out of your mind.go to buffalo, you'll thank me later.

 

[scarletgirl777]

I say **** it. You only have one life to live. If the world ended in 20 years would you want to say you spent 4 of them (or more likely 8 of them) in Buffalo or Western NY?

I know I would not. That is why I picked USC over Buffalo (and USC has a similar price tag as GW)

That's not "more likely" at all. And if the world ended in 20 years I'd probably be upset that I spent 9 of them with a med student's/resident's work hours. This whole doctor game is about sacrificing now for happiness later.

I'm just going to add myself to the chorus of voices saying don't pay 200k plus interest for a medical school education that is CLEARLY equivalent at best.

 

[CaliMD12]

Thanks for everyone's opinion. I will be attending Buffalo.

Every PRACTICING DOCTOR I have spoken to has said that I should go to Buffalo, hands down, because of the cost savings. The friends that told me to go to GW come from wealthy families and they are having their parents pay most of the tuition money, so they wont be worrying about paying off the extra 300-450K to go to GW (adding interest and DC's living expenses).

When adding together tuition, interest, and living expenses, the total cost at GW becomes staggering when compared to Buffalo. One must consider that they won't be making real money until 9-10 years from the start of medical school. By this point in time, one may have a family and need to buy a house, etc. There will be MAJOR expenses, especially after being deprived of making money for so long.

As for making money as a doctor, consider that taxes take off a major portion of your income, as mentioned by someone previously. Who knows how much higher income taxes will be 10 years from now. And with the current instability of healthcare and possible government intervention, who knows how much doctors will be earning.

Im from Los Angeles, so I was desperate to live in a fancy, major city like Washington DC, so I really wanted to go to GW. But I need to be able to adapt to different cities and enjoy whatever comes my way, as this is simply part of life.

Who knows, maybe i'll end up doing residency at GW

 

[GonnaHappen]

Good choice.

 

[Siverhideo1985]

Good choice.

Enjoy the next 4 years and the thousands you just saved!

 

[kac714]

smart choice. looks like we'll be classmates

 

[jcl157]

wow. this convo has been really helpful for me too. I'm deciding between Drexel and SUNY... but am also leaning towards SUNY for the tuition difference. Does anyone have an opinion about Drexel? I've heard that their clinical rotations are pretty good... not sure about SUNY Buffalo though... haven't heard much from this front.

 

[flip26]

Nicely done, OP.

You made an excellent choice.

 

[tkim]

wow. this convo has been really helpful for me too. I'm deciding between Drexel and SUNY... but am also leaning towards SUNY for the tuition difference. Does anyone have an opinion about Drexel? I've heard that their clinical rotations are pretty good... not sure about SUNY Buffalo though... haven't heard much from this front.

I didn't go to UB, but I'm a UB resident. The clinical rotations seem decent. There's Buffalo General - university academic hosp, ECMC - busiest level 1 trauma center in NYS, Roswell Park - onco hosp, Women and Children's - OB/GYN and peds. Do you need more than that?

 

[jcl157]

thanks tkim! yup, pretty good and diverse... just wanted to make sure before i make my final decision. i didn't know how diverse the patient population will be and if the students are exposed to a lot of different illnesses so was a little worried about that.

 

[phospho]

haha, 200K (most likely 300K after interest) vs. GW.

I know people who wouldn't go to GW if someone paid them 200K j/k

You've got an easy decision, good luck!

 

[tkim]

thanks tkim! yup, pretty good and diverse... just wanted to make sure before i make my final decision. i didn't know how diverse the patient population will be and if the students are exposed to a lot of different illnesses so was a little worried about that.

When you lack primary health care or simply don't give a sht about yourself, you get a lot of pathology. We got a lot of pathology. Lot of sicklers, druggies, renal patients, immunosupressed, strange tumors. Not a lot of Asians and Hispanics compared to when I was in Cali for med school, but more sicklers. It all balances out.

I'd be concerned going to a place that has a majority white people with good health coverage. Good for them, bad for your education.

 

[flip26]

When you lack primary health care or simply don't give a sht about yourself, you get a lot of pathology. We got a lot of pathology. Lot of sicklers, druggies, renal patients, immunosupressed, strange tumors. Not a lot of Asians and Hispanics compared to when I was in Cali for med school, but more sicklers. It all balances out.

I'd be concerned going to a place that has a majority white people with good health coverage. Good for them, bad for your education.

Begs the question of how important is that for med school? I can understand that it could be a real concern during residency, but for med school?

Plus I doubt if it is even the case at very many med schools to begin with - every single med school I have researched has significant clinical rotations exposure to underserved, poorly educated, poor health patients...can you or somebody give me an example of a med school that has clinical exposure limited to majority white population with good health coverage?

 

[sushichopstickz]

stanford

 

[flip26]

stanford

Not true from what I know about it - Stanford med students rotate through 4 (I think) hospitals, and they get a broad exposure. This has been debated ad nauseum on Stanford threads...

Seriously - I would lop one off to get into Stanford Med...

 

[sushichopstickz]

Not true from what I know about it - Stanford med students rotate through 4 (I think) hospitals, and they get a broad exposure. This has been debated ad nauseum on Stanford threads...

Seriously - I would lop one off to get into Stanford Med...

Hmm..guess I was wrong. I had the impression that it was. Oh-well.

Don't you think lopping one off for Stanford is a beat too much? I mean it's a great school, but I rather know that my future progeny is safe, if you know what I mean. Haha, besides I think Stanford is too academic medicine for me.

 

[flip26]

Hmm..guess I was wrong. I had the impression that it was. Oh-well.

Don't you think lopping one off for Stanford is a beat too much? I mean it's a great school, but I rather know that my future progeny is safe, if you know what I mean. Haha, besides I think Stanford is too academic medicine for me.

Freudian slip?

Only need one to propagate, so I would be a loppin'...I don't really care a great deal about the research and academics angle, either, so I don't think I will be losing any body parts this time next year...

 

[tkim]

Begs the question of how important is that for med school? I can understand that it could be a real concern during residency, but for med school?

Plus I doubt if it is even the case at very many med schools to begin with - every single med school I have researched has significant clinical rotations exposure to underserved, poorly educated, poor health patients...can you or somebody give me an example of a med school that has clinical exposure limited to majority white population with good health coverage?

Why would it be less of a concern in med school than in residency? Would you be content to read about sickle cell through med school but wait until residency to encounter or treat a sickler? I mean you do get to see actual patients in med school you know.

I find it funny that you actually are asking for an example of a med school serving a predominantly white population with good health coverage. Extrapolate my statement, man. If you only see white people you won't see diseases that affect other races. If you go to school in an area that has good health coverage, chances are you'll see less severe pathology.

If I went to school in Maine or Vermont, with an African-American population less than 1% of total, my chances of encountering sickle cell, which is uncommon anyway, is reduced that much more because of the smaller pool of people who can have the disease. Hispanics too, but even more rare.

Look, stop taking everything so literally.

I would go to the dirtiest, poorest, most racially diverse area that has a med school.

 

[CaliMD12]

I realized the reason I was debating going to GW is because of the very international population of DC. I really enjoy diverse populations, but I'm worried Buffalo won't be too diverse.

How is Buffalo's diversity?

 

[tkim]

I realized the reason I was debating going to GW is because of the very international population of DC. I really enjoy diverse populations, but I'm worried Buffalo won't be too diverse.

How is Buffalo's diversity?

Lots of white people, lots of black people. Some Asian, some Hispanic. I mean, what are you looking for, a Benneton ad?

 

[scarletgirl777]

Not true from what I know about it - Stanford med students rotate through 4 (I think) hospitals, and they get a broad exposure. This has been debated ad nauseum on Stanford threads...

Seriously - I would lop one off to get into Stanford Med...

But how much of their time is spent at those more "diverse" places? It seems like the main hospital serves a somewhat homogenous population.

 

[flip26]

Why would it be less of a concern in med school than in residency? Would you be content to read about sickle cell through med school but wait until residency to encounter or treat a sickler? I mean you do get to see actual patients in med school you know.

I find it funny that you actually are asking for an example of a med school serving a predominantly white population with good health coverage. Extrapolate my statement, man. If you only see white people you won't see diseases that affect other races. If you go to school in an area that has good health coverage, chances are you'll see less severe pathology.

If I went to school in Maine or Vermont, with an African-American population less than 1% of total, my chances of encountering sickle cell, which is uncommon anyway, is reduced that much more because of the smaller pool of people who can have the disease. Hispanics too, but even more rare.

Look, stop taking everything so literally.

I would go to the dirtiest, poorest, most racially diverse area that has a med school.

I understand your point, I just don't agree with your assessment of the impact on the education and training received in medical school...and there is always the "away rotation" to go to the "dirtiest, poorest, most racially diverse" med school...

I find it funny that I asked for examples, and all you came up with is Vermont...ever stop to think that people who intend to live and practice in white bread Vermont are interested in seeing and treating the diseases common to that population? Your point may make sense for someone who intends to practice in Detroit - stay away from Vermont for med school! But otherwise, I don't buy it...I think you are overstating the case for med school.

 

[OChemist]

my friend had the same decision, ultimately he choose buffalo.

 

[tkim]

I understand your point, I just don't agree with your assessment of the impact on the education and training received in medical school...and there is always the "away rotation" to go to the "dirtiest, poorest, most racially diverse" med school...

I find it funny that I asked for examples, and all you came up with is Vermont...ever stop to think that people who intend to live and practice in white bread Vermont are interested in seeing and treating the diseases common to that population? Your point may make sense for someone who intends to practice in Detroit - stay away from Vermont for med school! But otherwise, I don't buy it...I think you are overstating the case for med school.

And I think you are reading too far into my words. Vermont, Maine, W. Virginia. All have less than 2% AA population. So now you choose the school for the population it serves?

So if you go to school in lily-white Vermont, you aren't responsible for treating someone with sickle cell? "Sorry, I went to school in Vermont, we don't see sickle cell here, so you're outta luck. Try Detroit."

My point, and it's a pretty simple one, is to go to the school with the greatest range of pathology. Don't wait until residency. Residency is just med school where they pay you. There should be little dividing line between med school and residency. The earlier the exposure to diverse pathology, the quicker you become comfortable with it. Good luck.

 

[StPlayrXtreme]

Great choice!

I was offered an interview at GW after an acceptance at UB...I looked up the graduate debt statistic for GW and canceled my interview.

The average debt of the students coming out of the med program at GW, especially when considering some students do the military program or have family resources.

GW is a good school, but it comes with a really big price tag.

 

[loomis]

But how much of their time is spent at those more "diverse" places? It seems like the main hospital serves a somewhat homogenous population.

sorry to hijack the thread since this has nothing to do about stanford but this came up on a search; briefly, as a med student at stanford you WILL rotate a ton at the community hospitals....you can do almost *all* your rotations there if you like (you have freedom of choice with your site selections such as valley/kaiser). so you can spend the whole month working with a more broad SES/ethnic mix...spending the month practically only speaking spanish. as an aside, while the main stanford hospital is in a rich area (pally), the patient population draws from not just pally but from east pally (much poorer/diverse) and san jose. so you'll see a range of uninsured to international dignitaries coming for treatment.

sorry again for the hijack and good luck c your decision between ub and gw!

 

[iish]

I found this to be a fascinating thread as I was also faced with the same decision between UB and GW, though I chose GW in a heartbeat. I felt that both of those schools were excellent and offered the same level of medical education, though I felt that the location of GW offered more in terms of personal/social/life experiences as well as professional opportunities, the former of which, I don't really think I can put a price tag on (as long as it is in a reasonable range). I think the decision really came down to my desire to get involved with health policy & economics and public service, which made the decision fairly simple. In addition, the option to do 4th year elective rotations at a range of fairly intense hospitals in the DC area is very appealing.

With regard to the probation issue, I spoke with the dean of the medical school last week and it is clear that the school is going above and beyond what was requested of them by the LCME and I highly doubt they will be losing their accreditation in the upcoming review.

I think anyone who made the decision to attend either school will get a great education and made the right choice.