U Chicago (Full-tuition Scholarship) vs UCLA (David Geffen Scholarship)

[code46]

What's up everyone!

So not gonna lie, I absolutely never expected to be in this position. I came into the process with both of these schools being very high on my list, but honestly considered each as reach schools and never realistically expected acceptances to both, much less this extent of financial support. For a little bit of context, I'm originally from Wisconsin, so it'd be super nice to be close to friends and family. I haven't really honed in on any specific specialty yet, but am passionate about working in perpetually underserved communities and would like to have all residency options on the table. Have a SO, but she'll likely end up pursuing a masters program at Case Western, so not much overlap there unfortunately (though closer to Pritzker). Also annoying that the second look weekends of both of these schools overlap.

U Chicago

Pros:

• Amazing culture of activism and outreach
• Love the idea of learning in the south side of Chicago
• Closer to home
• Small class - great support system
• Community health focus would be great for research interests
• Love their research-focused curriculum and how I could coincide this with my interest in community outreach - could do tangible community health research and intervention during medical education
• Great match statistics in the upper midwest - would be easier to match closer to home and family
• Was my first choice going into the cycle

Cons:

• More expensive (no stipend) - running the numbers, U Chicago could be ~$150,000 more expensive, so not a negligible difference haha
• Relatively limited clinical experiences compared to UCLA (not substantiated tbh, just from what I've heard)
• Didn't have the BEST time interacting with other interviewees, but the actual med students seemed great
• Cross-town med school competition (Northwestern)
• Not sure how applicable this is to other schools, but their first quarter of anatomy seemed absolutely brutal from some of the med students I talked to during my interview (though I'm never one to shy away from a challenge)

Summary: U Chicago would be more expensive, but would also have a smaller class size and has a mission that is more coincident with my career goals.

UCLA

Pros:

• Full-ride scholarship - I'd be lying if I didn't say this was a massive factor. The thought of graduating nearly debt free (or close to it) is surreal given the fact that I've been mentally preparing to be living in a financial hole through my mid-30s for the past 10+ years
• As a dude who grew up in the midwest, the LA weather and lifestyle sound like a dream
• Higher PD and USNWR rankings (might hold more weight given Step 1 P/F announcement)
• While USC, UCR, UCI, etc. are close geographically, from what I've heard, UCLA is the "dominant" medical institution in the area with strong affiliated centers like Ronald Reagan and Cedars
• I'm a school spirit guy and I'd be lying if I said that D1 sports didn't appeal to me as an escape from academics

Cons:

• Far from home and friends - I honestly have like 2 friends and no family in all of SoCal haha
• While it is certainly more than possible to do good work with underserved communities, I wouldn't say that this is an institutional focus to the extent that it is at UChicago
• Going off of that last point, idk if the Bel Air/Beverly Hills area is exactly where I've seen myself living/learning medicine
• Not sure how large class sizes would impact the quality of Deans' Letters and LoRs given their apparent increased importance in residency matching
• Unsure about the school's general culture - at my interview, my tour guide said he essentially chose UCLA because he got the Geffen and because of rankings, while several other students talked about how they rarely socialize with people within their class that are outside of their core friend group - not sure how valid that is though

Summary: UCLA is a stronger program (strictly rankings-wise) and could conceivably allow me to graduate nearly debt free, but is farther from home and has an environment that (based on limited experiences) would be less of a fit for me.


As you guys could probably see, I'm unsure if there's a clear choice here. If I had to decide this instant, I would likely choose UCLA given the long-term financial implications, but I also have a weird feeling that money should not be the deciding factor. I will say that all in all, I'm extremely grateful for this opportunity and know that at the end of the day, I'll probably be happy regardless of where I end up. With that being said, I don't think I could sleep at night if I didn't thoroughly explore the implications of my options, so any and all help would be greatly appreciated!

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[Rachapkis]

UCLA--Higher ranked; Westwood is a great place to live; the weather in LA is unbeatable; the Geffen Scholarship is the best available (covers tuition, room and board, and living expenses); UCLA is dedicated to underserved communities (See Charles R. Drew SOM); LA is quite diverse ethnically and socioeconomically; and the classes are generally cohesive.

 

[omegalulz]

UCLA for that full ride. Your future self will thank you for it.

 

[TempuraOreos]

Congrats, this is an amazing opportunity. Geffen for the win unless you can get Chicago to match somehow. Obviously, go to their second looks, reach out to current students at both schools, etc. to see if the culture of vibe of the area is what you think it is.

 

[ricardo.wannabedoc]

The key question you need to ask yourself is whether it is worth it to you to take out ~100k in loans to be closer to home. I think the majority of people would choose the debt-free option at the higher-ranked school, but I think what makes this decision complicated for you comes down to personal factors related to distance from home. It would be a good idea to talk to your family/friends/SO to get their thoughts.

It really sucks that their second looks overlap. I think you should go to UCLA's second look and see if it helps eliminate any doubt. That might also help assuage your concerns about their culture and commitment to underserved communities.

I am struggling with a similar choice (different schools), and I personally have decided that although leaving my support system will be hard, it is also only temporary, and the amount of money I would save is hard to ignore.

Congrats on your success!

 

[lanzhou_lamian]

Going into the cycle, these are the two schools I had hoped for ( got Rs from both haha.) Congrats on living the dream!

From what you’ve written, I’d take UCLA. The weight that a Geffen scholarship lifts from your shoulders can’t be overstated. Not only does it set you up for a much easier time as a resident and attending, but it gives you a certain peace of mind as a med student too. Med school is stressful enough without having to worry about money.

Secondly, I wouldn’t worry too much about Westwood/Beverly Hills. While these two towns are rich areas, LA as a whole is super diverse and UCLA has affiliations with hospitals throughout the area. There is no shortage of underserved communities, and likewise no shortage of ways to engage with them.

 

[deleted972488]

Save your self $150,000. Congratulations on your success!

 

[Icebird]

I love Chicago but save yourself some COIN and go to UCLA

 

[IDapplicant]

Having 0 debt will give you a lot of options for community outreach and helping the underserved. I would pick UCLA, the scholarship is going to set you up to follow your interests.

 

[capriccio]

To go a bit against the grain, I was a similar-ish situation in which I turned down a full-ride and took UChicago's full tuition offer instead, mainly for the location and school culture/mission. I'm happy to talk more about my experience so far at UChicago and respond to your pros/cons over PMs!

 

[bones-n-sconez]

UCLA

You just can’t beat full COA + LA.

 

[kjunen]

UCLA. The weightiest factors on both sides of the aisle for you are: the air of social activism and monetary factors--speaking about UChicago and UCLA respectively. If your future aspirations are rooted in social activism, then you may very well have already had some meaningful exposure to the unfortunate circumstances in which many Americans find themselves. If not, and your passion for social activism is true, then you will likely have future opportunities to show the world your passion for social equity. Take the money, take the weather, take all that makes LA astronomically beautiful and enjoy it while you can. You will have years and years and years after your residency and possible fellowship to show your community how much you care about social activism after you earn your MD at UCLA, a highly ranked institution that has committed itself financially to your education.

 

[Dream of the Endless]

To me, the clear choice is UCLA here. Cost: 4 years of living in high CoL Chicago is erased and is mitigated with the Geffen scholarship in LA. Your career: There are plenty of under-served areas in the LA area, don't let the glitz and glamour fool you. The poster above me definitely hit the nail on the head there. Clinical: You already said UCLA is better, with some of the changes going on for matching, a higher emphasis on quality clinical exposure is the move. Dean's letter: I wouldn't worry about this. Big programs typically subdivide you all into more manageable smaller groups and assign you someone who will more or less follow you through your career as a student. It seems ludicrous to me that a T10 wouldn't invest in something so important to your matching experience. Social connections: Sounds more appealing to me to fly out from Cleveland weather to LA weather for your SO lol. You'll make new friends, LA climate is pretty laid-back. Finally someone mentioned sports! I cannot overemphasize how much of a juggernaut UCLA is in sports. Them and Stanford are among the most dominant colleges across every sporting event in college history. It's a bit of a shame to me that students here don't recognize that lmao. Match: Yes, it'll be easier to match back into the midwest from Chicago. But a T10 wouldn't exactly limit you, either.

Go to UCLA, friend. Congratulations on the offers!

Note**: I am biased, I turned down the same offer from Chicago for California living myself. I'll be a couple hours northwest of you, though.

 

[code46]

Congrats, this is an amazing opportunity. Geffen for the win unless you can get Chicago to match somehow. Obviously, go to their second looks, reach out to current students at both schools, etc. to see if the culture of vibe of the area is what you think it is.

Wish I could go to both second looks, but they’re on the same weekend. And I’m honestly not even sure how it would come off if I went back to UChicago after they already offered such a stellar offer asking for more. But now that the dust of the app cycle is settling for the most part, I’ll definitely be reaching out to students from both schools to get a better feel as to what the culture is like there


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[code46]

UCLA--Higher ranked; Westwood is a great place to live; the weather in LA is unbeatable; the Geffen Scholarship is the best available (covers tuition, room and board, and living expenses); UCLA is dedicated to underserved communities (See Charles R. Drew SOM); LA is quite diverse ethnically and socioeconomically; and the classes are generally cohesive.

Definitely appreciate the insight. If I’m not mistaken, the Charles Drew SOM students take didactics alongside UCLA students, but they’re ultimately separate programs right? And could you elaborate a little bit more on the classes being “generally cohesive?”


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[code46]

The key question you need to ask yourself is whether it is worth it to you to take out ~100k in loans to be closer to home. I think the majority of people would choose the debt-free option at the higher-ranked school, but I think what makes this decision complicated for you comes down to personal factors related to distance from home. It would be a good idea to talk to your family/friends/SO to get their thoughts.

It really sucks that their second looks overlap. I think you should go to UCLA's second look and see if it helps eliminate any doubt. That might also help assuage your concerns about their culture and commitment to underserved communities.

I am struggling with a similar choice (different schools), and I personally have decided that although leaving my support system will be hard, it is also only temporary, and the amount of money I would save is hard to ignore.

Congrats on your success!

Thanks so much for reaching out and understanding that this isn’t strictly a numbers decision!

I wouldn’t say UCLA doesn’t have a commitment to underserved communities in LA whatsoever, it’s just the fact that UChicago wears that mission on their sleeves. At the interview, Dr. Carter straight up said that if the interviewees weren’t dedicated to reducing healthcare disparities, then they were at the wrong school, which really stuck out to me and was far beyond what I’ve seen at any school I’ve interviewed at (taking into account other factors ofc).

Congrats on your situation! I definitely can see your decision making process there and hope that everything works out for you!


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[code46]

Going into the cycle, these are the two schools I had hoped for ( got Rs from both haha.) Congrats on living the dream!

From what you’ve written, I’d take UCLA. The weight that a Geffen scholarship lifts from your shoulders can’t be overstated. Not only does it set you up for a much easier time as a resident and attending, but it gives you a certain peace of mind as a med student too. Med school is stressful enough without having to worry about money.

Secondly, I wouldn’t worry too much about Westwood/Beverly Hills. While these two towns are rich areas, LA as a whole is super diverse and UCLA has affiliations with hospitals throughout the area. There is no shortage of underserved communities, and likewise no shortage of ways to engage with them.

Thank you! I appreciate it and sincerely hope that you end up at an institution that you love!

What stands out to me about what you said is the fact that a CoA scholarship’s impact on your life can’t be overstated. Sure, it feels just like nebulous numbers atm, but it will have a tangible impact on my student and resident lifestyle in the future.

As for the LA point, I definitely get that it’s a diverse and expansive area. I’m just somewhat worried about the fact that with the stress of med school, it might be difficult to go across LA given it’s traffic and reach some of the communities that I’m interested in learning alongside the most on a consistent basis.


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[code46]

Save your self $150,000. Congratulations on your success!

I appreciate it! Have seen you on the UCLA thread - congrats on your Geffen scholarship as well! Look forward to potentially becoming doctors side by side with you over these next four years


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[camnewton1]

Congrats on acceptances! Isn't UCLA going through a significant curriculum revamping with a potentially messy clerkship year situation? Either way you can't go wrong here between the two schools

 

[Rachapkis]

Definitely appreciate the insight. If I’m not mistaken, the Charles Drew SOM students take didactics alongside UCLA students, but they’re ultimately separate programs right? And could you elaborate a little bit more on the classes being “generally cohesive?”


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You are correct that the Charles Drew students take didactics alongside UCLA students, but the programs are separate. However, Drew's existence is evidence of UCLA's commitment to undeserved communities. Moreover, the presence of the Drew students alongside the UCLA students helps to shape the culture, thinking and feel of the Geffen SOM (as does the surrounding generally liberal outside community). As far as the community of students is concerned, UCLA does not have a cutthroat feel--just the opposite. There are countless clubs and opportunities that bring the class together. That said, I suspect that at most high-ranking schools with a P/F preclinical curriculum (including Pritzker and Geffen), most students understand that they have already arrived, are not really competing directly with their classmates, and can therefore be their authentic selves--some will be social and others won't. Best of luck with your decision. You really can't go wrong if you follow your heart.

 

[deleted972488]

I appreciate it! Have seen you on the UCLA thread - congrats on your Geffen scholarship as well! Look forward to potentially becoming doctors side by side with you over these next four years

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Thanks. To elaborate, my personal, obviously very biased, opinion is that unless you’d be totally miserable in LA, it’s simply not worth paying an extra $150k for a school that felt like it had a better culture based on a small sample size of students. The culture of the school will depend on what you and the rest of the incoming class put into it. With the class size as large as it is, you are bound to find “your people.”

Also, $150,000 is a lot of money. Put yourself in the best position to help others.

 

[deleted1017848]

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[Radiata20]

In the past, we have occasionally been able to organize informal Second Looks on other days for prospective students who were unable to attend the official Second Look. I imagine UChicago has probably done the same.

If seeing both places again is important to you, I'd recommend reaching out to the student admissions representatives to see if this can be arranged this year. Even though it wouldn't have the same special events as Second Look, and there would also be some restrictions on what classes you could attend (e.g., we, like many other institutions, do not give tours of the anatomy lab because we feel it is most respectful to use our donors' bodies for only education, not recruitment), it would still give you a pretty good look at the day-to-day of preclinical life.

Also worth keeping in mind that preclinical life is pretty different than clinical life, which is hard to expose prospective students to during these events, but perhaps the admissions reps can see if they can arrange a meeting with an upperclassman if this is something you're interested in. I'm happy to meet for an informal chat to provide an MS4 perspective if you revisit UCLA, should the scheduling work out.

Good luck with your decision, and we hope to see you back here soon!

 

[Moko]

informal chat to provide an MS4 perspective

This is the only perspective that should matter to applicants

 

[9blade]

UCLA

 

[RennyB]

What's up everyone!

So not gonna lie, I absolutely never expected to be in this position. I came into the process with both of these schools being very high on my list, but honestly considered each as reach schools and never realistically expected acceptances to both, much less this extent of financial support. For a little bit of context, I'm originally from Wisconsin, so it'd be super nice to be close to friends and family. I haven't really honed in on any specific specialty yet, but am passionate about working in perpetually underserved communities and would like to have all residency options on the table. Have a SO, but she'll likely end up pursuing a masters program at Case Western, so not much overlap there unfortunately (though closer to Pritzker). Also annoying that the second look weekends of both of these schools overlap.

U Chicago

Pros:

• Amazing culture of activism and outreach
• Love the idea of learning in the south side of Chicago
• Closer to home
• Small class - great support system
• Community health focus would be great for research interests
• Love their research-focused curriculum and how I could coincide this with my interest in community outreach - could do tangible community health research and intervention during medical education
• Great match statistics in the upper midwest - would be easier to match closer to home and family
• Was my first choice going into the cycle

Cons:

• More expensive (no stipend) - running the numbers, U Chicago could be ~$150,000 more expensive, so not a negligible difference haha
• Relatively limited clinical experiences compared to UCLA (not substantiated tbh, just from what I've heard)
• Didn't have the BEST time interacting with other interviewees, but the actual med students seemed great
• Cross-town med school competition (Northwestern)
• Not sure how applicable this is to other schools, but their first quarter of anatomy seemed absolutely brutal from some of the med students I talked to during my interview (though I'm never one to shy away from a challenge)

Summary: U Chicago would be more expensive, but would also have a smaller class size and has a mission that is more coincident with my career goals.

UCLA

Pros:

• Full-ride scholarship - I'd be lying if I didn't say this was a massive factor. The thought of graduating nearly debt free (or close to it) is surreal given the fact that I've been mentally preparing to be living in a financial hole through my mid-30s for the past 10+ years
• As a dude who grew up in the midwest, the LA weather and lifestyle sound like a dream
• Higher PD and USNWR rankings (might hold more weight given Step 1 P/F announcement)
• While USC, UCR, UCI, etc. are close geographically, from what I've heard, UCLA is the "dominant" medical institution in the area with strong affiliated centers like Ronald Reagan and Cedars
• I'm a school spirit guy and I'd be lying if I said that D1 sports didn't appeal to me as an escape from academics

Cons:

• Far from home and friends - I honestly have like 2 friends and no family in all of SoCal haha
• While it is certainly more than possible to do good work with underserved communities, I wouldn't say that this is an institutional focus to the extent that it is at UChicago
• Going off of that last point, idk if the Bel Air/Beverly Hills area is exactly where I've seen myself living/learning medicine
• Not sure how large class sizes would impact the quality of Deans' Letters and LoRs given their apparent increased importance in residency matching
• Unsure about the school's general culture - at my interview, my tour guide said he essentially chose UCLA because he got the Geffen and because of rankings, while several other students talked about how they rarely socialize with people within their class that are outside of their core friend group - not sure how valid that is though

Summary: UCLA is a stronger program (strictly rankings-wise) and could conceivably allow me to graduate nearly debt free, but is farther from home and has an environment that (based on limited experiences) would be less of a fit for me.


As you guys could probably see, I'm unsure if there's a clear choice here. If I had to decide this instant, I would likely choose UCLA given the long-term financial implications, but I also have a weird feeling that money should not be the deciding factor. I will say that all in all, I'm extremely grateful for this opportunity and know that at the end of the day, I'll probably be happy regardless of where I end up. With that being said, I don't think I could sleep at night if I didn't thoroughly explore the implications of my options, so any and all help would be greatly appreciated!

Wow, how did you get into UCLA with full-ride scholarship as from what sounds like a Non-trad OOS applicant? Do you Mind sharing your story?